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Keep Carlo and bring back Ray Wilkins (again) and get Zola to be the strikers coach, teaching DD and Torres how to play together.
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POLL: Do you think Ancelotti should stay or go?
Started by
PloKoon13
, May 10 2011 11:24 AM
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#22
Posted 10 May 2011 - 02:07 PM
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First Team Squad
Let him at least see the last year of his contract out, with Zola as his assistant, spend wisely on the area's we need new blood in, ie, RB and a couple of wingers to give Torres the supply he needs...if he fails then bye-bye....
#23
Posted 10 May 2011 - 02:20 PM
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On the Bench
I too voted for Carlo staying.
My only doubt would be if were really did have a chance of bringing back Guus as Manager, not Director of football. If the MANAGER is good enough to manage, we will not need a Director of football.
My only doubt would be if were really did have a chance of bringing back Guus as Manager, not Director of football. If the MANAGER is good enough to manage, we will not need a Director of football.
#25
Posted 10 May 2011 - 02:39 PM
Voted for him to stay. Would love for him to have Zola as his assistant. I think that would work well.
#26
Posted 10 May 2011 - 02:57 PM
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I would be dissapointed if the club let a man with the class and ability of Carlo go, based on one mediocre season (where for me, at least a majority of blame is at the feet of the players, who far too often were made to look like sub-standard compared to lesser teams). I'm not saying Carlo has no blame...he made some average team selections...but you've got to think the players took too much for granted, especially in the middle of the season, and got done by teams of lower calibre players.
I don't think any Chelsea manager can enjoy sustained success at the club, while they are being frequently overruled to such an extent that they can't complete their job to the best of their ability.
Carlo is a fine manager. Any manager will make the odd mistake, that's why no team will win every game. Carlo should stay, and be given some leeway with choosing perhaps a list of potential transfer fees which he feel could add to the team, and ask Roman to look into them, instead of having no say in the matter. What's more, he needs to be given the chance to integrate Torres succesfully into the team, which could just be a case of a good off-season, but in all likelihood means recruiting more suitable players to his game.
So yes, he should stay, and at least be given one more year to prove himself. I'm not confident a new manager will do any better anyhow...the league is at it's most competitive at the moment with 6 high quality teams, 4 of which could have a realistic shot at winning. Carlo has always exhibited class and dignity, and has never attempted to steal the limelight with outlandish or arrogant behaviour. He's a proven winner, who only a season ago, delivered Chelsea the double. If he's not treated respectfully by the club, no top managers will want to come to the club, with the knowledge that their job is on the line at all times (I understand for a team as driven to succeed as ours there will always be high accountability, but the sheer difficulty in completing the job with interference, and no room for errors simply isn't a model for success over a long period). The only good managers we'll draw if managers are continually treated in such way, will just be those chasing a pay check (knowing that they will get they innevitable massive payout if they fail like the others), and those managers wouldn't be right for the club anyway.
We need to allow the manager enough control over proceedings, backroom staff, signings etc., so that they are contented in their job and able to complete it to the best of their abilities, so the accountability process is profoundly fairer. We don't have to forsake our new winning culture, but it's completely unrealistic to expect to win every year, and letting a manager of the callibre of Ancelotti go would certainly send the wrong message for future applicants. Maybe not in the short term, but if for the forseeable future we continue to sacrifice a manager to the footballing gods every time we have a trophyless season, the reputation will spread like a virus and our management options will be reduced to candidates that are just looking to make a quick buck.
I don't think any Chelsea manager can enjoy sustained success at the club, while they are being frequently overruled to such an extent that they can't complete their job to the best of their ability.
Carlo is a fine manager. Any manager will make the odd mistake, that's why no team will win every game. Carlo should stay, and be given some leeway with choosing perhaps a list of potential transfer fees which he feel could add to the team, and ask Roman to look into them, instead of having no say in the matter. What's more, he needs to be given the chance to integrate Torres succesfully into the team, which could just be a case of a good off-season, but in all likelihood means recruiting more suitable players to his game.
So yes, he should stay, and at least be given one more year to prove himself. I'm not confident a new manager will do any better anyhow...the league is at it's most competitive at the moment with 6 high quality teams, 4 of which could have a realistic shot at winning. Carlo has always exhibited class and dignity, and has never attempted to steal the limelight with outlandish or arrogant behaviour. He's a proven winner, who only a season ago, delivered Chelsea the double. If he's not treated respectfully by the club, no top managers will want to come to the club, with the knowledge that their job is on the line at all times (I understand for a team as driven to succeed as ours there will always be high accountability, but the sheer difficulty in completing the job with interference, and no room for errors simply isn't a model for success over a long period). The only good managers we'll draw if managers are continually treated in such way, will just be those chasing a pay check (knowing that they will get they innevitable massive payout if they fail like the others), and those managers wouldn't be right for the club anyway.
We need to allow the manager enough control over proceedings, backroom staff, signings etc., so that they are contented in their job and able to complete it to the best of their abilities, so the accountability process is profoundly fairer. We don't have to forsake our new winning culture, but it's completely unrealistic to expect to win every year, and letting a manager of the callibre of Ancelotti go would certainly send the wrong message for future applicants. Maybe not in the short term, but if for the forseeable future we continue to sacrifice a manager to the footballing gods every time we have a trophyless season, the reputation will spread like a virus and our management options will be reduced to candidates that are just looking to make a quick buck.
#27
Posted 10 May 2011 - 03:13 PM
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In the Ressies
I would like to see him stay, bring in Zola, and some fresh players. I feel that there has been a massive lack of commitment from our players this season and Carlo is not to blame.
#28
Posted 10 May 2011 - 04:51 PM
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First Team Squad
I want Carlo to stay.
I don't believe he'll be sacked. Apparently Kaka's mother stated he's coming to London. If true, I assume it's to Stamford Bridge. I can't see him coming to the Bridge if Carlo is to be sacked. I believe Kaka would really do well when playing for his mentor, Ancelotti.
I would love to see Carlo build his own team.
I don't believe he'll be sacked. Apparently Kaka's mother stated he's coming to London. If true, I assume it's to Stamford Bridge. I can't see him coming to the Bridge if Carlo is to be sacked. I believe Kaka would really do well when playing for his mentor, Ancelotti.
I would love to see Carlo build his own team.
#29
Posted 10 May 2011 - 04:51 PM
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It’s a recurring theme, I know, but quite frankly what’s not to like about Carlo? If likeability was the only requirement, he’d have won the Abramovich heart over by now and be looking at another five years in charge. Except that it isn’t and we can all be fairly certain that the ’to do’ list he was given had things like ‘winning the Champions League a must’ and ‘get those youngsters in quick-sharp-ish’ right at the top, with a PS along the lines of ’oh, and don’t forget the domestic trophies’. Tall orders all of them, but we can be certain Roman’s ticking them off right now, as the end of term report is compiled, and this season there isn’t a great deal of ticking to do.
My view is that, after nigh on eight years, the leopard leading our pack is unlikely to change his spots and in almost every instance his managerial appointments have been shrewd in choice (notable exception Big Phil - I blame Kenyon influence) and pretty much spot on in termination timing (notable exception Jose - I blame media influence). Put bluntly, Carlo’s been given three years to achieve certain aims and, achievable or not, nice or ugly, it appears to be the law of this particular jungle that only the big beast survives. Despite a CV to die for, he may not be big enough and all the media effrontery in the world wont change this Russian decision-maker’s mind.
Not that you’d know it from the reporting in this country, but the same managerial survival rate applies everywhere else too, other than at Old Trafford and the Emirates and wherever Dario Gradi’s been grazing for the last fifty years - Crewe isn’t it? These incumbents remain in situ like old stags who have managed to rut away undisturbed for years on end, regardless of challengers, each one a credit to continuity in their own special way. They are a dying breed, every club knows it, but, when comparisons with others less fortunate [than these three] are made by a haughty press pack, nobody expects Chairmans’ hearts to melt en masse and jobs to be saved . What’s more, Carlo knows it, I know it, and most of you do too.
The key to which way Roman goes probably hinges on who is Arnesen’s replacement and which direction he is going to take us. Should Guus make a welcome return in some sort of Director of Football capacity, well I’m not sure that’s a good sign for Carlo either and talk of an assistant is, for me, a surprisingly late development should it happen - Franco is nothing if not a God, but why could he not have arrived earlier to help Carlo out when the help was really needed? As I mentioned above, I like the guy, but that’s where I came in and another twelve months of bonhomie, even alongside Zola, could prove both comfy-cosy and costly… so I’m going to lean towards BlueBeard on this one.
My view is that, after nigh on eight years, the leopard leading our pack is unlikely to change his spots and in almost every instance his managerial appointments have been shrewd in choice (notable exception Big Phil - I blame Kenyon influence) and pretty much spot on in termination timing (notable exception Jose - I blame media influence). Put bluntly, Carlo’s been given three years to achieve certain aims and, achievable or not, nice or ugly, it appears to be the law of this particular jungle that only the big beast survives. Despite a CV to die for, he may not be big enough and all the media effrontery in the world wont change this Russian decision-maker’s mind.
Not that you’d know it from the reporting in this country, but the same managerial survival rate applies everywhere else too, other than at Old Trafford and the Emirates and wherever Dario Gradi’s been grazing for the last fifty years - Crewe isn’t it? These incumbents remain in situ like old stags who have managed to rut away undisturbed for years on end, regardless of challengers, each one a credit to continuity in their own special way. They are a dying breed, every club knows it, but, when comparisons with others less fortunate [than these three] are made by a haughty press pack, nobody expects Chairmans’ hearts to melt en masse and jobs to be saved . What’s more, Carlo knows it, I know it, and most of you do too.
The key to which way Roman goes probably hinges on who is Arnesen’s replacement and which direction he is going to take us. Should Guus make a welcome return in some sort of Director of Football capacity, well I’m not sure that’s a good sign for Carlo either and talk of an assistant is, for me, a surprisingly late development should it happen - Franco is nothing if not a God, but why could he not have arrived earlier to help Carlo out when the help was really needed? As I mentioned above, I like the guy, but that’s where I came in and another twelve months of bonhomie, even alongside Zola, could prove both comfy-cosy and costly… so I’m going to lean towards BlueBeard on this one.
Edited by Dorset, 10 May 2011 - 04:51 PM.
#30
Posted 10 May 2011 - 04:52 PM
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just, on 10 May 2011 - 11:51 AM, said:
To make this poll valid I really think there should be a "depends" option included.
I would be in the "depends" camp.
If we can get someone in who I believe is a better manager then obviously it wouldn't bother me to see Carlo go. Better managers in my humble opinion are - Hiddink, Ferguson, 'arry (yes, Mr Rednapp) and of course, Jose. For purely romantic purposes I have always secretly hankered for the return of Ruud and "Sexy" football. he would be coming home.
On the other hand, if we were in the hunt for a Rijkaard, Benitez or Deschamps then I would rather we kept with Ancelotti as I believe he is better than them.
Simple really.
I would be in the "depends" camp.
If we can get someone in who I believe is a better manager then obviously it wouldn't bother me to see Carlo go. Better managers in my humble opinion are - Hiddink, Ferguson, 'arry (yes, Mr Rednapp) and of course, Jose. For purely romantic purposes I have always secretly hankered for the return of Ruud and "Sexy" football. he would be coming home.
On the other hand, if we were in the hunt for a Rijkaard, Benitez or Deschamps then I would rather we kept with Ancelotti as I believe he is better than them.
Simple really.
This. (apart from the bit about Redknapp)
Of all the possible replacements I've heard mentioned, Hiddink is one of the top managers on the planet, Villas Boas might be better than Ancelotti (hard to tell based off of one season not in the CL, but Porto have been brilliant this year), and there's nobody else who I'd see as an improvement even ignoring the stability issue & the fact that Carlo's a classier person than most of the alternatives. Rijkaard, Van Basten, Benitez . . . that's really not an impressive list.
Given that Hiddink's contracted to Turkey for another year and Boas has said he wants to manage Porto in the CL, it's not clear either of them would be available if we did sack Carlo, so I'd lean towards giving him one more season; still, if we got one of those two in instead, or in the very unlikely event that Jose decided to leave Real, I wouldn't mind too much.
Your list of managers who're clearly better than Carlo also highlights why it's a bit unfair to call him out on our CL results, as we've been knocked out by Jose's Inter team and Ferguson's United - both squads just as talented as ours, under two of the top three or four club managers on the planet. He's never lost a tie against opposition even as weak as Benitez' Liverpool (though at the same time he's never had a result to match Jose dumping out Barca).
#31
Posted 10 May 2011 - 05:11 PM
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Here's a question......in your own world,in what ever job you do,is it for the money only?,to pay the bills?,only here for the beer?.
Or are you the type that whatever you do,you want to give it your best?,irrespective of what 'status' that job may have.
To give your best and be under attack from all sides is soul destroying,the way its going Carlo is up sh*t creek,whatever is to happen.The thing is,whoever may replace him,will, sooner or later find himself in the same boat.
Personally,all i can say that one of the best things you can give someone.............. is your faith in them,it can make one hell of a difference.
Or are you the type that whatever you do,you want to give it your best?,irrespective of what 'status' that job may have.
To give your best and be under attack from all sides is soul destroying,the way its going Carlo is up sh*t creek,whatever is to happen.The thing is,whoever may replace him,will, sooner or later find himself in the same boat.
Personally,all i can say that one of the best things you can give someone.............. is your faith in them,it can make one hell of a difference.
#32
Posted 10 May 2011 - 06:25 PM
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First Team Squad
I agree with the majority here. The fact we had a poor season doesn't mean Carlo is a poor manager. His achievements outweigh his failures. He is capable of fullfilling Roman's burning desire and that is to win the Champions League. He has four Champions League medals which attest to that. We were without a winning manager after Mourinho left until Hiddink arrived and won the F.A. Cup. Under Carlo we became the first top division side to score more than 100 goals since Spurs in the '60s. I think it was Fergie who stated the league was the most difficult trophy to win. Carlo did it in his first season with our club. He achieved it by getting the best out of Drogba, Lamps and Malouda. Managers are expected to get instant success and Carlo obliged.
Wholesale changes starting with sacking the manager are not the way to go. Carlo should have complete control over transfers as Mourinho had in his first season. We need an injection of young blood. Roman should realise that we need Carlo to get the team back on track and win the Champions League.
Wholesale changes starting with sacking the manager are not the way to go. Carlo should have complete control over transfers as Mourinho had in his first season. We need an injection of young blood. Roman should realise that we need Carlo to get the team back on track and win the Champions League.
Edited by Randy36, 10 May 2011 - 06:26 PM.
#33
Posted 10 May 2011 - 08:03 PM
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Abramovich and his revolving door to the managers office,with his endless search and constant craving for immediate success ,puts me in the "Au revoir" Carlo camp,he seems a good guy,but i have stated b4,what i think would stilll happen if he stays..
#34
Posted 10 May 2011 - 08:23 PM
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Youth Team
He should stay, we need a bit more continuity and I think the players like him. It's ridiculous just to keep sacking managers. Give him one more season at least.
And the post earlier suggesting Redknapp as an alternative is totally bonkers.
And the post earlier suggesting Redknapp as an alternative is totally bonkers.
#35
Posted 10 May 2011 - 08:41 PM
ethicalstrategy, on 10 May 2011 - 12:58 PM, said:
So what did you actually say?
Nothing much at all - just a fairly neutral introductory comment with something about how it would be interesting to see which way the poll swings.
#36
Posted 10 May 2011 - 09:41 PM
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Youth Team
I am hoping that he stays.
He deserves to have a proper crack at building his own team and bringing in the personell to play the system he wants to play. Clearly our players are all programmed to play the Mourinho way and they havn't settled at all playing how Carlo would have liked them to.
It doesn't help that this season has been one of massive transition (5 experienced first team players left in the summer remember- combined they made over 130 appearances last season) and we didnt really strengthen the side. Injuries to key players didn't help and and we were showed up for the lack of depth we have in the squad. Sure it would have been great to see Josh play alot more games than he has, but he needs to be phased in not just thrown in at the deep end during an injury crisis.
Give him a full season, a transfer window with full backing from Roman and a chance to create his own side. Also can we please bring in a decent no.2!?
He deserves to have a proper crack at building his own team and bringing in the personell to play the system he wants to play. Clearly our players are all programmed to play the Mourinho way and they havn't settled at all playing how Carlo would have liked them to.
It doesn't help that this season has been one of massive transition (5 experienced first team players left in the summer remember- combined they made over 130 appearances last season) and we didnt really strengthen the side. Injuries to key players didn't help and and we were showed up for the lack of depth we have in the squad. Sure it would have been great to see Josh play alot more games than he has, but he needs to be phased in not just thrown in at the deep end during an injury crisis.
Give him a full season, a transfer window with full backing from Roman and a chance to create his own side. Also can we please bring in a decent no.2!?
#37
Posted 10 May 2011 - 09:49 PM
Souwf Londoner, on 10 May 2011 - 08:23 PM, said:
He should stay, we need a bit more continuity and I think the players like him. It's ridiculous just to keep sacking managers. Give him one more season at least.
And the post earlier suggesting Redknapp as an alternative is totally bonkers.
And the post earlier suggesting Redknapp as an alternative is totally bonkers.
Some people think I’m bonkers
But I just think I’m free
Man I’m just living my life
There nothing crazy about me
Please don't just make a bald statement. It doesn't add to the debate. State your opposing reasons clearly, logically and with illustrative examples wherever possible.
I feel that if you gave 'arry our squad, our youth team and, even more importantly, our financial resources, he would do a very, very good job. My reasons for that feeling are:
1. A proven man manager/motivator.
2. Pretty good overall in his transfer dealings.
3. Has often brought players who, by general opinion, are well past their prime and gets them to perform. That gift of flogging life from a dead horse may be a real bonus given the age of some of our spine players.
4. English players love him, (find me one who wouldn't want him as the next England manager).
5. The media love him, (find me one who hasn't called for him to be next England manager).
I'm not saying I'm right, it's just my opinion. That's what a forum is all about isn't it? Opinions? As an example, but a few short years ago that were more than a few on here who regularly expressed the opinion that Martin O'Neil would be a decent call as our manager. Whereas I have always felt he is nothing more than a hyperactive, shouty gnome permanently on the verge of a nervous breakdown. You may have liked Martin O'Neil and thought he was up to the job. I don't know. Because you haven't said who you think could possibly do the job better than Ancelotti.
#38
Posted 10 May 2011 - 10:34 PM
I'm with Just...think he should go if someone better is available...eg hiddink...unlikely he will take it, but i just think he is a better coach......i think carlo is a great guy but hasn't shown he is a great coach...yes he won the double, great achievement, but drogba/lamps were on fire and that doesn;t take much mangement...what worries me is carlo has rarely shown he can change things when they're going wrong...our bad moment between october and january is what cost us the league and he just chose the same players/formation every week hoping it would turn, rather than making it so...also four defeats out of four against inter and utd in champs league knock-out ties is very poor...still like just says, if no-one extraordinary is available then give him another year...mind you, you get the feeling he is going anyway so this vote is rather pointless!
#40
Posted 11 May 2011 - 12:37 AM
I find something that Dorset suggested interesting; that it depends on what happens with replacing Arnesen. Which is very true for me. I just think that it's not necessarily Director of Football, but more of Football Development... i.e. the academy which was his original remit. If no one replaces him, it will signal that the academy is no longer the focus and Carlo will be out as a quick fix is on the agenda. If we do replace Arnesen and replace him with quality, then I feel Carlo will stay.
My ideal choice would be to bring in the Barcelona Academy manager as our Director of Football Development, Txiki has done wonders with the Barcelona youth system, and if we keep him here long term, could help us have the same level of success in terms of our youth. Carlo to stay, and a new assistant to be brought in, someone like Zola, or failing that Pet Rescue, or Di Matteo would be lovely.
If Carlo has a poor season next year, then we may have to think long and hard about whether he should be our manager in the long term. I would say after another year, Vilas Boas might well be ready for his first big challenge, which would be a big sign of intent to build for the future in my eyes (and probably mine only). Assuming we'd have Txiki Begisteran (sp?) as our Director of Football Development, and Zola as the assistant, with someone young and enthusiastic like Vilas Boas at the helm it could be the perfect environment for a new era to begin, although Vilas Boas may be the type of manager to want to choose his own staff which would be harsh on Zola, it might be a necessary move.
My ideal choice would be to bring in the Barcelona Academy manager as our Director of Football Development, Txiki has done wonders with the Barcelona youth system, and if we keep him here long term, could help us have the same level of success in terms of our youth. Carlo to stay, and a new assistant to be brought in, someone like Zola, or failing that Pet Rescue, or Di Matteo would be lovely.
If Carlo has a poor season next year, then we may have to think long and hard about whether he should be our manager in the long term. I would say after another year, Vilas Boas might well be ready for his first big challenge, which would be a big sign of intent to build for the future in my eyes (and probably mine only). Assuming we'd have Txiki Begisteran (sp?) as our Director of Football Development, and Zola as the assistant, with someone young and enthusiastic like Vilas Boas at the helm it could be the perfect environment for a new era to begin, although Vilas Boas may be the type of manager to want to choose his own staff which would be harsh on Zola, it might be a necessary move.
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