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Torres - The "Groundhog Day" Thread

Torres: stay or go?  

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  1. 1. Torres: stay or go?

    • Stay
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    • Go
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Let's be honest with ourselves, he'll never be the player he was at Liverpool, it's quite clear now.

At first, it was £50m price tag, that put him under huge pressure and wouldn't let him do what he was brought here for. Then it was lack of service, the team wasn't playing to his strengths. Then it was Drogba's big shadow that wouldn't allow him to come out of his shell, they'd say he needs to be "the man".

It's a few months short of two years since Fernando has arrived and he still looks lost. Only the most blind optimist can still maintain it's not his fault. Like Burt Reynolds said in Boogie Nights ":If it looks like sh*t and sounds like sh*t, then it must be sh*t." It's not the team, it's not the fee, it's not Drogba or lack of service. It's him.

The causes for that sad turn of fate could be various but the most obvious is the combination of injuries that robbed him of his mobility before he even got to CFC and a tough case of confidence shot to hell. I remember that Torres from years ago that used to tear our defense apart and it's evident that that Torres isn't there anymore.

It's irritating to watch him fall over at every contact and moan at the referees for help, or running into blind alleys and lose the ball time and time again. Walking down the tunnel at QPR after being subbed instead of joining others on the bench was absolutely infuriating. After all the support from the club, three different managers and fans with seemingly endless patience he has the cheek to throw his toys out of the pram after being substituted at the end of what looked like another failure of a performance.

Now, mind you, I'm not saying he isn't trying, in fact at times he looks like he's trying too hard. The point is, it's not working and we've waited long enough to erase any doubt. I don't know whether Sturridge has it him to be come our new target man upfront, but I'm fully convinced now Torres will never be that.

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Guest RFC_CFC

He may become better, he may not.

For the duration of time he wears the blue of Chelsea he will get my full support.

I feel for any player who has to take over from Drogba because like it or not there is no other striker in the world who could do for Chelsea what Didier did time and time again.

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How many threads now, are you f**king serious?

Hes Chelsea, he praised us the fans for backing him up and now hes had a good start to the season with 2 games not scoring and all these threads start popping up again, embarassing.

He didnt even have a bad game yesterday, far from it.

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Let's be honest with ourselves, he'll never be the player he was at Liverpool, it's quite clear now.

At first, it was £50m price tag, that put him under huge pressure and wouldn't let him do what he was brought here for. Then it was lack of service, the team wasn't playing to his strengths. Then it was Drogba's big shadow that wouldn't allow him to come out of his shell, they'd say he needs to be "the man".

It's a few months short of two years since Fernando has arrived and he still looks lost. Only the most blind optimist can still maintain it's not his fault. Like Burt Reynolds said in Boogie Nights ":If it looks like sh*t and sounds like sh*t, then it must be sh*t." It's not the team, it's not the fee, it's not Drogba or lack of service. It's him.

The causes for that sad turn of fate could be various but the most obvious is the combination of injuries that robbed him of his mobility before he even got to CFC and a tough case of confidence shot to hell. I remember that Torres from years ago that used to tear our defense apart and it's evident that that Torres isn't there anymore.

It's irritating to watch him fall over at every contact and moan at the referees for help, or running into blind alleys and lose the ball time and time again. Walking down the tunnel at QPR after being subbed instead of joining others on the bench was absolutely infuriating. After all the support from the club, three different managers and fans with seemingly endless patience he has the cheek to throw his toys out of the pram after being substituted at the end of what looked like another failure of a performance.

Now, mind you, I'm not saying he isn't trying, in fact at times he looks like he's trying too hard. The point is, it's not working and we've waited long enough to erase any doubt. I don't know whether Sturridge has it him to be come our new target man upfront, but I'm fully convinced now Torres will never be that.

Also should of said, there's your problem right there, Torres was never ever, ever going to be a a target man,

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Let's be honest with ourselves, he'll never be the player he was at Liverpool, it's quite clear now.

At first, it was £50m price tag, that put him under huge pressure and wouldn't let him do what he was brought here for. Then it was lack of service, the team wasn't playing to his strengths. Then it was Drogba's big shadow that wouldn't allow him to come out of his shell, they'd say he needs to be "the man".

It's a few months short of two years since Fernando has arrived and he still looks lost. Only the most blind optimist can still maintain it's not his fault. Like Burt Reynolds said in Boogie Nights ":If it looks like sh*t and sounds like sh*t, then it must be sh*t." It's not the team, it's not the fee, it's not Drogba or lack of service. It's him.

The causes for that sad turn of fate could be various but the most obvious is the combination of injuries that robbed him of his mobility before he even got to CFC and a tough case of confidence shot to hell. I remember that Torres from years ago that used to tear our defense apart and it's evident that that Torres isn't there anymore.

It's irritating to watch him fall over at every contact and moan at the referees for help, or running into blind alleys and lose the ball time and time again. Walking down the tunnel at QPR after being subbed instead of joining others on the bench was absolutely infuriating. After all the support from the club, three different managers and fans with seemingly endless patience he has the cheek to throw his toys out of the pram after being substituted at the end of what looked like another failure of a performance.

Now, mind you, I'm not saying he isn't trying, in fact at times he looks like he's trying too hard. The point is, it's not working and we've waited long enough to erase any doubt. I don't know whether Sturridge has it him to be come our new target man upfront, but I'm fully convinced now Torres will never be that.

Your post is 100% correct.

You say you're now fully convinced Torres can't be "the man". Unfortunately I was fully convinced of that a long time ago, before we signed him in fact.

You'll get flak for this post but that's just the way it goes.

Some people are deluded where our Mr Torres is concerned.

Apparently, the problem is service. That's right, whereas before it was Malouda's fault, or Kalou's, or Danny's, now that they've been replaced by Oscar, Mata and Hazard, the fault still lies with his teammates not the man himself. Could it possibly be that Torres is the reason we can't create chances, even a teensy weensy bit? Of course not. What an outrageous suggestion.

It's all well and good praising Torres when he plays well, credit where it's due and all that, but when he plays poorly, there are those who can't bring themselves to say it (see above). They'll never admit to a bad game, they'll just say everyone else was bad instead.

A world-class striker is always a threat, no matter what the circumstances. More often that not, Torres is not a threat. Simple as.

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he does seem a yard off the pace and clueless how to keep a ball at his feet in teh box and take any chances against the top sides Chelsea play

against lesser opposition he sometimes looks the part

enough said really

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I'm not tired of Torres, I'm tired him playing so bad when he's capable of so much more. I'll always back him 100% at Chelsea. Yes the excuses do get old but the fact is he's just off form.

My big issue is with the folks that panicked and paid 50 mill to buy him in the first place.

Come on Nando !

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Oh great - another Torres bashing thread to accompany the all encompassing "all you want to say about Torres" thread.

There is not more to say, other than what has been said countless times, by most other regular posters on this forum. If your Pro Torres, then you are accused of being a member of the Taliban, if you are against Torres then you are accused of knee jerk reactions.

What will be will be, however i would stick with my initial predicition that he will get 15 + goals this year. If he can score that many, as well as keeping up the assists role that he has played in a large amount of our goals in the recent past, then i will be happy.

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6 games and he gets a roasting! RDM will get the best out of him because he is in charge and he will eventually complete the jigsaw. i mean he knows mata's worth, the match winning abilities of hazard and now oscar has shown what he can do against a juventus that went unbeaten last season in the league. RDM's will also have seen that a certain DM was nowhere to be seen when juve scored twice and that the blue kenyon showed his energy in breaking up play, tackling and driving the team on!

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Your post is 100% correct.

You say you're now fully convinced Torres can't be "the man". Unfortunately I was fully convinced of that a long time ago, before we signed him in fact.

You'll get flak for this post but that's just the way it goes.

Some people are deluded where our Mr Torres is concerned.

Apparently, the problem is service. That's right, whereas before it was Malouda's fault, or Kalou's, or Danny's, now that they've been replaced by Oscar, Mata and Hazard, the fault still lies with his teammates not the man himself. Could it possibly be that Torres is the reason we can't create chances, even a teensy weensy bit? Of course not. What an outrageous suggestion.

It's all well and good praising Torres when he plays well, credit where it's due and all that, but when he plays poorly, there are those who can't bring themselves to say it (see above). They'll never admit to a bad game, they'll just say everyone else was bad instead.

A world-class striker is always a threat, no matter what the circumstances. More often that not, Torres is not a threat. Simple as.

I have to say,unlike you I was ecstatic when we bought him. The fee was ridiculous, but I did love the idea of Torres in CFC lineup. I just hated the sight of him terrorizing our backline every time we faced scousers and the thought of Fernando doing the same in a blue shirt was so tempting I was fully on board with his arrival.

I must have watched him little in his last half season with Liverpool, but apparently he was slowing down and struggling with form already. But after the previous three seasons when he was probably PL's best striker I'm sure I'd have convinced myself that in a better team he'll do at least as well.

It just seems the biggest waste of transfer money. For those questioning my take on Torres because he's a Chelsea player now, criticizing a player doesn't make you any less of a supporter, I do that because I care, not because I feel like having a rant just for the sake of it. I will support Torres as long as he plays for us, that goes without saying. That doesn't mean I still believe he's the player he used to be, and that's putting it mildly.

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This is a f**king joke now!

Torres works his balls off every game, he runs his heart out for every min he'son the pitch. He has been unlucky because he's played upfront on his own which means defenders can double up on him, which frees up our attacking midfield players. if you watch the games and Torres's movement and runs they are world class only problem is we never look to him and he makes these runs in vein!! i'd get pissed off too if i was making good runs and never get the ball. People on this forum are f**king with my melon!!

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I think hes best when we play counter attack, he needs to be able to run at speed, with our style of play he has at least 2 attacking mf behind him forcing him too close to opposition defenders, thats y some of his best displays towards the end of last season were when he took himself wide.

I hate stationary attacking players anyway but i think sometimes he should drop deeper and allow mata and hazard to move forward therefore giving him a few extra yards to start his runs

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I have to say,unlike you I was ecstatic when we bought him. The fee was ridiculous, but I did love the idea of Torres in CFC lineup. I just hated the sight of him terrorizing our backline every time we faced scousers and the thought of Fernando doing the same in a blue shirt was so tempting I was fully on board with his arrival.

I must have watched him little in his last half season with Liverpool, but apparently he was slowing down and struggling with form already. But after the previous three seasons when he was probably PL's best striker, after Drogba, I'm sure I'd have convinced myself that in a better team he'll do at least as well.

It just seems the biggest waste of transfer money. For those questioning my take on Torres because he's a Chelsea player now, criticizing a player doesn't make you any less of a supporter, I do that because I care, not because I feel like having a rant just for the sake of it. I will support Torres as long as he plays for us, that goes without saying. That doesn't mean I still believe he's the player he used to be, and that's putting it mildly.

Hope you don't mind the little bolded and underlined correction to your post there Roman. Torres at his best and Drogba at his best hhmmmm. As strikers capable of putting the ball into the back of the net there was little to choose between them, but, as all-round complete players and in what they gave overall to their respective teams,Torres was never in the same league as Drogba. No disgrace there though. Few will have that complete influence on a side that Drogba had. I keep thinking back to the Carragher interview that he gave to the Daily Mail just before the CL Final in May. His assessment of Drogba as being unplayable at times is spot on IMO.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2146013/Didier-Drogba-The-Chelsea-striker-unplayable.html

Like Davey and a couple of others on here, yes, I was one of those that voiced doubts when we were rumoured to be signing him for mega-bucks. He had been playing inconsistently for Liverpoo for a substantial period of time and if you listened to any radio phone-in at the time it is a fact that whilst the majority of their fans seemed to want to stick by him, there was also a large proportion of mousers who felt he was past his best, (for whatever reason), and that they wouldn't be disappointed if he was moved on for big money. There were concerns, genuine concerns, about his fitness, his pace, his effort, his body language. Some Liverpoo fans voiced the opinion that he was playing like he had lost his love of the game. In other words, his heart wasn't in it.

Now I have been critical of Torres for the majority of his time with us for many of the same reasons that those Liverpoo fans were then, but, and this is a big BUT, I think he has made a decent enough start to this campaign. IMO he is playing with effort, he is playing with heart. I was at the game last night and against Newcastle and he worked tirelessly in both. Is there room for further improvement? Yes, of course there is, he still has a lot to do to silence the critics and justify the money spent on him, but he most definately was not the problem last night against Juventus. The major problem last night was, yet again, the central midfield pairing of Mikel and Lamps.

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Funny how an average couple of games and suddenly we are back to this.....

After the Newcastle victory and Torres goal there was genuine promise- his best goal in a Chelsea shirt on the back of notching against Man City and Reading, probably his best spell of games in a Chelsea shirt (granted the bar is set low). Remember that (trick shot) cross? The one that only a player oozing with confidence would even consider attempting? With the new attacking players providing new flair to our attack I couldn't help but wonder 'could this be the season for Torres....'

A few frustrating games (two of which are against genuine high quality teams in Athletico & Juve) with no goals we seem to have given up.

I still have my doubts and can't help but agree with a ot of the original post but rewind back to how you felt after the Newcastle game and remember that was only a few weeks ago.

Edited by mclovin83

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Wow it couldn't of went in the other Torres thread? I'm tired of the amount of stick he gets on here. Some people on this forum would love nothing more than to watch Torres fail.

People on this site dont wish him failure..These folk had hope and expectation, and rightly so. They feel frustrated thats all

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Hope you don't mind the little bolded and underlined correction to your post there Roman. Torres at his best and Drogba at his best hhmmmm. As strikers capable of putting the ball into the back of the net there was little to choose between them, but, as all-round complete players and in what they gave overall to their respective teams,Torres was never in the same league as Drogba. No disgrace there though. Few will have that complete influence on a side that Drogba had. I keep thinking back to the Carragher interview that he gave to the Daily Mail just before the CL Final in May. His assessment of Drogba as being unplayable at times is spot on IMO.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2146013/Didier-Drogba-The-Chelsea-striker-unplayable.html

Like Davey and a couple of others on here, yes, I was one of those that voiced doubts when we were rumoured to be signing him for mega-bucks. He had been playing inconsistently for Liverpoo for a substantial period of time and if you listened to any radio phone-in at the time it is a fact that whilst the majority of their fans seemed to want to stick by him, there was also a large proportion of mousers who felt he was past his best, (for whatever reason), and that they wouldn't be disappointed if he was moved on for big money. There were concerns, genuine concerns, about his fitness, his pace, his effort, his body language. Some Liverpoo fans voiced the opinion that he was playing like he had lost his love of the game. In other words, his heart wasn't in it.

Now I have been critical of Torres for the majority of his time with us for many of the same reasons that those Liverpoo fans were then, but, and this is a big BUT, I think he has made a decent enough start to this campaign. IMO he is playing with effort, he is playing with heart. I was at the game last night and against Newcastle and he worked tirelessly in both. Is there room for further improvement? Yes, of course there is, he still has a lot to do to silence the critics and justify the money spent on him, but he most definately was not the problem last night against Juventus. The major problem last night was, yet again, the central midfield pairing of Mikel and Lamps.

Fair assessment. I jumped on a post of yours during the euros when I thought you were focusing overly negative towards Torres after he bagged a couple of goals.

I think Torres doesn't help himself a lot of the time. Im a striker myself and when u step out onto the pitch you've got to have the mindset that your going to score today. I think he should have more shots, even speculative shots, he doesn't buy enough tickets to win the raffle. He should be gambling on crosses making more incisive runs.

The last 2 matches I don't think he's had a shot and doesn't look like a threat. I think after seeing falcao put on the show he did, we're looking for him to perform to a similar quality.

He needs to stop sulking and feeling sorry for himself, get back to how was playing against newcastle, and the goals will come, and the pressure will ease.

If he doesn't then there has to be a point where Sturridge gets a run of games.

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Spot on.

It was clear to see the injuries Torres had at Liverpool had the same effect on his game as Owen's & Essiens had/have.

Like everyone else I desperately want him to succeed, but I don't think he ever will, I would have cut our losses in the summer as he finished the season in better form. He's post champs league final outburst annoyed me, and the sulk down the tunnel vs QPR also. I wonder if Athletico would like him as a part of a deal for Falcao.

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Hope you don't mind the little bolded and underlined correction to your post there Roman. Torres at his best and Drogba at his best hhmmmm. As strikers capable of putting the ball into the back of the net there was little to choose between them, but, as all-round complete players and in what they gave overall to their respective teams,Torres was never in the same league as Drogba. No disgrace there though. Few will have that complete influence on a side that Drogba had. I keep thinking back to the Carragher interview that he gave to the Daily Mail just before the CL Final in May. His assessment of Drogba as being unplayable at times is spot on IMO.

http://www.dailymail...unplayable.html

Like Davey and a couple of others on here, yes, I was one of those that voiced doubts when we were rumoured to be signing him for mega-bucks. He had been playing inconsistently for Liverpoo for a substantial period of time and if you listened to any radio phone-in at the time it is a fact that whilst the majority of their fans seemed to want to stick by him, there was also a large proportion of mousers who felt he was past his best, (for whatever reason), and that they wouldn't be disappointed if he was moved on for big money. There were concerns, genuine concerns, about his fitness, his pace, his effort, his body language. Some Liverpoo fans voiced the opinion that he was playing like he had lost his love of the game. In other words, his heart wasn't in it.

Now I have been critical of Torres for the majority of his time with us for many of the same reasons that those Liverpoo fans were then, but, and this is a big BUT, I think he has made a decent enough start to this campaign. IMO he is playing with effort, he is playing with heart. I was at the game last night and against Newcastle and he worked tirelessly in both. Is there room for further improvement? Yes, of course there is, he still has a lot to do to silence the critics and justify the money spent on him, but he most definately was not the problem last night against Juventus. The major problem last night was, yet again, the central midfield pairing of Mikel and Lamps.

Problem is, how long do you keep hoping he will make that break through at the cost of a striker, who has more pace, who scored double the goals last season, who is 6 years younger, who i feel one on one with a defender is the better out of the two. (sturridge)

It's clear robbie doesnt fancy sturridge, ill go in to that further in another post but the fact is, if you knew nouthing about this league and you had to pick between sturridge and torres based on last season alone no one in there right mind would pick torres...

PS regarding the midfield, add ramires to that, where was he playing exactly? there is no point in all 3 of them being on the pitch, 2 from 3 and then matta, hazzard, oscar or still marin to come

Edited by barak81

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PS regarding the midfield, add ramires to that, where was he playing exactly? there is no point in all 3 of them being on the pitch, 2 from 3 and then matta, hazzard, oscar or still marin to come

Agree, Lampard should be rotated with Ramires in that position because sadly Frank is not improving and Ramires is not at his best on the right.

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People on this site dont wish him failure..These folk had hope and expectation, and rightly so. They feel frustrated thats all

Fair enough say that but there's no need for the same old threads that pop up all the time, there's a reason there's a thread titled "Everything you want to say about Torres"

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Agree, Lampard should be rotated with Ramires in that position because sadly Frank is not improving and Ramires is not at his best on the right.

I would actually have Romeu instead of mikel, like sturridge he just isnt fancied by RDM

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