BelgradeCFC Posted March 28, 2013 Posted March 28, 2013 As another turbulent season at Stamford Bridge reaches its climax, the blame game is starting to play out over who is responsible for such a disappointing campaign.Chelsea began the season targeting seven trophies and while they could still win the FA Cup and Europa League, nothing will make up for their efforts in the Champions League and title race.The finger has been pointed at many people, from interim coach Rafael Benitez for his unconvincing methods to owner Roman Abramovich because of his compulsion to interfere.However, one man who deserves to come under great scrutiny, Frank Arnesen, has escaped all of the criticism. The former chief scout and director of youth development at Stamford Bridge may have been at Hamburg for the past two years but, as Chelsea struggle to cope with the busiest fixture list in their history, the lack of Academy players sharing the workload has been evident.It was not supposed to be like this. When Chelsea paid Tottenham £5million compensation in 2005 for the Dane’s services, he was expected to find young, inexpensive talent to compete for a first-team place and ensure Abramovich’s chequebook wouldn’t be heavily relied upon.As it turned out, Arnesen, who brought Aaron Lennon to Tottenham, spent in the region of £62m on many gifted teenagers in his first four years before being made technical director and Chelsea have still had little to show for his outlay in terms of players who have made the grade from the Academy.Only Ryan Bertrand, who he acquired from Gillingham for an initial £125,000 eight years ago, has broken into the senior side, while many have flopped and never been heard of again.Granted, the Under 18s have won the FA Youth Cup twice in the last three years and the Under 19s have reached the semi-finals this season of the NextGen Series — a competition involving the top clubs in Europe — but the first team have yet to benefit.Unlike Benitez, Arnesen has not had to answer any awkward questions over his time at the Bridge, that is until Standard Sport travelled to Germany.When asked how his time at Chelsea is viewed by many as a failure, Arnesen was defiant. He said: “I am very proud of what I did. I did a fantastic job. I made the club a lot of money. I bought players for small amounts and they were sold for a lot of money.“I’m talking about players like [Daniel] Sturridge, [Fabio] Borini and [Miroslav] Stoch — they ended up being sold for about £30m and that pays for the Academy.“The policy at Chelsea was to win a lot of games. When I started at Tottenham, we didn’t have the money (to make massive signings like Chelsea were able to do under Abramovich). I went for Tom Huddlestone, Aaron Lennon, Michael Dawson and Andy Reid — all players we could get who didn’t have a high salary. They had ambition and wanted to be better and they got the chance to play.“But if I had done it with Chelsea they would not have played for two years, so this is the difference. I am happy with many of the players I signed for Chelsea. Just think, Borini and Sturridge are now at Liverpool, Stoch scored the Fifa goal of the year for Fenerbahce, Nemanja Matic is the star man at Benfica.“Then you have Jeffrey Bruma [Hamburg], Gael Kakuta and Patrick van Aanholt [both Vitesse Arnhem], who are doing very well on loan.“There is Josh McEachran and Ryan Bertrand, too. Some don’t get the chance for the Chelsea first team now but they will.â€Actually, Kakuta has just moaned that he would prefer not to be at Chelsea next season because of the likely lack of playing time.Arnesen claims that the strain on a Chelsea coach to win trophies is the main reason why many of his signings have not been given a chance to make an impact, negating any criticism that is being aimed in his direction.It is something he has particularly come to appreciate now he is experiencing a different attitude throughout the Bundesliga when it comes to giving youth an opportunity. He added: “Germany has been very good in developing players but also in putting them in the teams.“That is the problem in England. At Chelsea, we had fantastic talent, we built up marvellous players, but they needed to be given a chance and they never were. The pressure is so big.“Managers in England are going out and buying players, the level is high, and it is difficult for them because if they lose two or three games, they’re gone.â€Arnesen still has a great affection for Chelsea and, like many connected to the club, he argues that the 10 major trophies won over the past decade shows that the Abramovich era has been a success.As for the troubles Chelsea have experienced this term, the Dane has seen enough of new signings such as Eden Hazard and Oscar to urge everyone to be patient.“Chelsea signed more technical players last summer and it will always take time because they don’t know the League,†he said. “When you buy young players from Brazil and Belgium, they’re not used to playing 60 games with the tempo of the Premier League and international games as well. They have to learn and be given a year to adapt.“It is a fantastic club and I loved to be involved there. It is the first result I always look for.â€The problem for Arnesen, however, is that it looks as though he won’t be able to take much credit for any of their results in the future. http://www.standard.co.uk/sport/football/chelsea-never-gave-my-young-players-an-opportunity-8551282.html
Maksimov Posted March 28, 2013 Posted March 28, 2013 ...one man who deserves to come under great scrutiny, Frank Arnesen, has escaped all of the criticism. Never mind that he hasn't been at the club for some time now and his job wasn't to manage the first team anyway. Ok, so how have our academy teams done? Under 18s have won the FA Youth Cup twice in the last three years and the Under 19s have reached the semi-finals this season of the NextGen Series — a competition involving the top clubs in Europe Yeah, that's right! Our youth teams are doing better than ever, so whose fault is it that no youngsters are coming through to the first team? The first team manager? Well, he does pick who play for the first team. Ok, to be fair, our managers are under pressure to win straight away, so it's not a surprise that many of them have played it safe and used the more established players. Also... We seem to loan our most promising youngsters away, so there may not be that many players to pick from. So to make a long story short, to say any of what has been happening this season is Arnesen's fault, is daft to say the least.
That Boy Brandinho Posted March 28, 2013 Posted March 28, 2013 He said: “I am very proud of what I did. I did a fantastic job. I made the club a lot of money. I bought players for small amounts and they were sold for a lot of money. “I’m talking about players like [Daniel] Sturridge, [Fabio] Borini and [Miroslav] Stoch — they ended up being sold for about £30m and that pays for the Academy. What reality is he living in? Sturridge, Borini and Stoch did not even come close to being sold for £30m. Sturridge was bought for £6.5m and sold for £12m. However, 15 percent of that second figure went to Citeh, so we only got £10.2m from that sale. I'm not sure what the initial fees for Stoch and Borini were, but I knew we were only awarded a pittance (around £500k) for the loss of Borini and Stoch returned about £4.5m. Even if we, for the sake of simplicity, count that entire £5m as profit, it still only adds up to £8.7m total from the three players. £8.7m will not finance our Academy.
Spiller86 Posted March 28, 2013 Posted March 28, 2013 His basic point stands though. Our youth teams have done exceedingly well. The problem has been that aside from Bertrand, none have ever been given a chance.
Fast Eddie Posted March 28, 2013 Posted March 28, 2013 It's crazy to be looking backwards and historically yes young players may not have been given enough chances, however it's a learning curve of a top class academy which is still developing. A couple of weeks ago our ten man U19's youth beat Barcelona 2-0 away in a terrific game and has some very talented players in its ranks, whether some of them breakthrough is academic and they'll have some job competing against the likes of Mata, Hazard, Oscar, Chalobah, Luiz et al but through their development they'll be mixing it with these players to different degrees all adding to their experience and could end playing at any top club in the future if not Chelsea.
bluegraham Posted March 28, 2013 Posted March 28, 2013 What reality is he living in? Sturridge, Borini and Stoch did not even come close to being sold for £30m. Sturridge was bought for £6.5m and sold for £12m. However, 15 percent of that second figure went to Citeh, so we only got £10.2m from that sale. I'm not sure what the initial fees for Stoch and Borini were, but I knew we were only awarded a pittance (around £500k) for the loss of uBorini and Stoch returned about £4.5m. Even if we, for the sake of simplicity, count that entire £5m as profit, it still only adds up to £8.7m total from the three players. £8.7m will not finance our Academy. Yeah bang on and surely he can't include sturidge as a academy player. Would have liked to see stoch make it.
Jonty Posted March 28, 2013 Posted March 28, 2013 The main problem as he said, is that coaches are under too much pressure to win, and that means they aren't willing to take risks on integrating younger players into the team.
The Brit Posted March 29, 2013 Posted March 29, 2013 (edited) Never mind that he hasn't been at the club for some time now and his job wasn't to manage the first team anyway. Ok, so how have our academy teams done? Yeah, that's right! Our youth teams are doing better than ever, so whose fault is it that no youngsters are coming through to the first team? The first team manager? Well, he does pick who play for the first team. Ok, to be fair, our managers are under pressure to win straight away, so it's not a surprise that many of them have played it safe and used the more established players. Also... We seem to loan our most promising youngsters away, so there may not be that many players to pick from. So to make a long story short, to say any of what has been happening this season is Arnesen's fault, is daft to say the least. arnesen started at Chelsea in 2005, cost a fortune, spent a fortune...it is eight years later now, we should be seeing the fruits of his labours...but only Bertrand has come through and as much as I like him, he is only a squad player... I think given we have used so few players this season, its right Arnesen be questioned...there has to be a reason why so many managers have not given his signings a chance...Chelsea have been doing better at youth level but the gulf between winning a kids cup and playing for Chelsea is massive...if the players he signed were good enough, more than Bertrand would have broken through by now... bloody hell, remember the £5m spent on woods and Taiwo, they're nowhere to be seen now, di santo - still can't hit a barn door and is at lowly wigan...then who can forget kakuta - the way that was handled got us a transfer ban from fifa, although that was overturned on appeal - but all that fuss and he's on loan at vitesse having failed to do anything at Fulham and wigan in similar spells...most of his signings are now with him at hamburg! Edited March 29, 2013 by The Brit
Zola Posted March 29, 2013 Posted March 29, 2013 The main problem as he said, is that coaches are under too much pressure to win, and that means they aren't willing to take risks on integrating younger players into the team. Yep, nail on the head for me. Love him or hate him Frank did a reasonable job I think and we could hardly expect miracles from him. The coaches are under too much pressure and if they take risks by playing young guys in big matches and it goes wrong then they are booted out. Sooner or later we will have someone diamonds come through who command places, just have to be patient.
Maksimov Posted March 29, 2013 Posted March 29, 2013 arnesen started at Chelsea in 2005, cost a fortune, spent a fortune...it is eight years later now, we should be seeing the fruits of his labours... We have. When it comes to results, our academy teams have been one the strongest in England. ...if the players he signed were good enough, more than Bertrand would have broken through by now... Fergie manages to bring in kids at a pretty regular rate. Are their kids so much better than ours or should our first team management team(s) look in the mirror?
Zola Posted March 29, 2013 Posted March 29, 2013 (edited) We have. When it comes to results, our academy teams have been one the strongest in England. Fergie manages to bring in kids at a pretty regular rate. Are their kids so much better than ours or should our first team management team(s) look in the mirror? Interesting question, I think Ferguson puts fire in the belly of youngsters better than anyone else. He usually also puts more fire in his overall team better than anyone else as we know. Edited March 29, 2013 by Zola
The Brit Posted March 29, 2013 Posted March 29, 2013 (edited) We have. When it comes to results, our academy teams have been one the strongest in England. Fergie manages to bring in kids at a pretty regular rate. Are their kids so much better than ours or should our first team management team(s) look in the mirror? considering he spent a supposed £62m, a few youth cups is the least we should expect...he was hired to provide first team players, not youth cup wins... even if the players were or not good enough, the club should think about what they want to do more...if they're not going to play youngsters, then that money should just be used on getting the finished article...that £62m could have bought three top class players Edited March 29, 2013 by The Brit
Maksimov Posted March 29, 2013 Posted March 29, 2013 considering he spent a supposed £62m, a few youth cups is the least we should expect...he was hired to provide first team players, not youth cup wins Considering he doesn't decide who gets to play in the first team, I'm not sure how much more he could do. I repeat my question: are ManU's youngsters so much better than ours or should our first team management team take a long hard look in the mirror? Then again, they usually don't have a long time to do anything before they get sacked. If our managers don't last a season, how are they suppose to have time to build a team and bring in youth players? Apparently AVB solved the problem by never going to see the youngsters train or play. Hopefully the other recent managers weren't like that.
ForeverCarefree Posted March 29, 2013 Posted March 29, 2013 None of his signings have left the club and moved onto better things.... They weren't good enough.
Samdwich Posted March 29, 2013 Posted March 29, 2013 Agree with Maksimov and Jonty here. Our last crop of youth looked very promising, with players like McEachran, Kakuta and Bruma. All 3 featured regularly on the bench and got game time under Ancelotti, but no manager since has done anything with them. Can't help but feel that may be what happens to all but Chalobah and Piazon of this current crop, only because those two are so outrageous that they will push their way into the first team.
Damo810 Posted March 29, 2013 Posted March 29, 2013 What reality is he living in? Sturridge, Borini and Stoch did not even come close to being sold for £30m. Sturridge was bought for £6.5m and sold for £12m. However, 15 percent of that second figure went to Citeh, so we only got £10.2m from that sale. I'm not sure what the initial fees for Stoch and Borini were, but I knew we were only awarded a pittance (around £500k) for the loss of Borini and Stoch returned about £4.5m. Even if we, for the sake of simplicity, count that entire £5m as profit, it still only adds up to £8.7m total from the three players. £8.7m will not finance our Academy. Minus wages for those three and I we're just about breaking even. Stuck in the clouds.
Fast Eddie Posted March 29, 2013 Posted March 29, 2013 Agree with Maksimov and Jonty here. Our last crop of youth looked very promising, with players like McEachran, Kakuta and Bruma. All 3 featured regularly on the bench and got game time under Ancelotti, but no manager since has done anything with them. Can't help but feel that may be what happens to all but Chalobah and Piazon of this current crop, only because those two are so outrageous that they will push their way into the first team. Not Feruz?
Fast Eddie Posted March 29, 2013 Posted March 29, 2013 Agree with Maksimov and Jonty here. Our last crop of youth looked very promising, with players like McEachran, Kakuta and Bruma. All 3 featured regularly on the bench and got game time under Ancelotti, but no manager since has done anything with them. Can't help but feel that may be what happens to all but Chalobah and Piazon of this current crop, only because those two are so outrageous that they will push their way into the first team. Or Ake?
MelbourneBlue Posted March 29, 2013 Posted March 29, 2013 I disagree with the point about our managers not picking them - if they were top notch they would have got into the team. Fact is that we still had Kalou in our CL winning side, and none of the youth had gone past him. And as for Arnesen's pathetic mathematics in defining his success in the financial aspects of the acadamy.....
Damo810 Posted March 29, 2013 Posted March 29, 2013 I disagree with the point about our managers not picking them - if they were top notch they would have got into the team. Fact is that we still had Kalou in our CL winning side, and none of the youth had gone past him. And as for Arnesen's pathetic mathematics in defining his success in the financial aspects of the acadamy..... I don't think thats fair tbh. Our board kindly granted us the likes of Benayoun and Marin, when in fact we had players like KDB and Kakuta. They aren't the only examples either in the last 5 or 6 years. We've kept loaning out players and buying in experienced pros, hoping that a youth player would suddenly explode and be good enough to start in our first team. You also cannot deny that KDB would have gotten game time this year.
Kun Aguero Posted March 30, 2013 Posted March 30, 2013 I don't think thats fair tbh. Our board kindly granted us the likes of Benayoun and Marin, when in fact we had players like KDB and Kakuta. They aren't the only examples either in the last 5 or 6 years. We've kept loaning out players and buying in experienced pros, hoping that a youth player would suddenly explode and be good enough to start in our first team. You also cannot deny that KDB would have gotten game time this year. Kakuta is just not good enough and probably never will be, The Dutch league is bad and Kalou lit it up and thats what Kakuta should be aiming to do if he wants a future at Chelsea. I think Chelsea have been very good with the younger players in allowing them to get guaranteed quality playing time on loan rather than being a part time player here like Yossi and Marin are. KdB is a success story(along with Lukaku/Courtois/Piazon) so although they could be helping us here, Im glad they are getting lots of quality starts elsewhere.
Damo810 Posted March 30, 2013 Posted March 30, 2013 Kakuta is just not good enough and probably never will be, The Dutch league is bad and Kalou lit it up and thats what Kakuta should be aiming to do if he wants a future at Chelsea. I think Chelsea have been very good with the younger players in allowing them to get guaranteed quality playing time on loan rather than being a part time player here like Yossi and Marin are. KdB is a success story(along with Lukaku/Courtois/Piazon) so although they could be helping us here, Im glad they are getting lots of quality starts elsewhere. Benayoun and Marin have been a glaring success. If you take them out of the squad and possibly Moses you have plenty of games for them. Not to mention all the games we should have played Aké and played Piazon too.
Samdwich Posted March 30, 2013 Posted March 30, 2013 Not Feruz? Or Ake? Both great young players with fantastic potential, but the other two are just a cut above (Chalobah being one of Watford's key players at the age of 17, and Piazon being special enough for us to spend £5-10m) and with the way we're currently managed it wouldn't surprise me that only players of that talent/ability are given the opportunity, even though the others will make fine footballers. Look at Sturridge - huge talent, went out on loan and literally banged the door into the first team down. Played out of position for the first half of the next season and was one of our brightest players, and joint top PL scorer despite only playing for half the season. Got barely any minutes before being sold this season. The way we handled him was ridiculous considering the promise he showed whilst with us.
The Brit Posted March 30, 2013 Posted March 30, 2013 arnesen's hamburg lost 9-2 today against a Bayern side resting some of their big players for champs lge...in hamburg side was bruma, Rajkovic came on as a sub and sala was unused sub
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