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Jose Mourinho thread


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Exactly. it's like a hidden message, imagine the media storm if he said 'Yeah it's Fabregas.' IMO Pat Nevin has slipped, and tried to cover up mistake.

I disagree if it was a slip he would have tried to cover it up. It's all there if people just actually read what he said.

Well you must really hate Hazard, Costa, Matic and a few others as they have been the exact same.

If you think this is all about one player being a rat or whatever you are mental, the dressing room was against Jose and that's never down to 1 player.

Exactly Chelsbear, tbh think I'm gonna take your advice, wasting my time. Like you said there are others who have been just as bad on the pitch.

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I hope all the players you mention are drummed out of the club, together with a few more. However, Fabregas has been the worst of a bad bunch.

Statically he's been as good as Hazard has so how has he been the worst? It wasn't long ago pitchdorks were out for Ivanovic, how poor has Matic been? It's to easy to blame the ex Arsenal player

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Still can't quite believe Jose is gone. We all knew it was coming, but doesn't make it any easier.

 

The right decision? Probably, yes, being as pragmatic as possible.. But what can we salvage from this season? An FA Cup at the absolute best?

 

Makes no difference if you finish 8th or 16th; top 4 was, and is, gone. The players are the underlying problem at this club. A temporary shift in form will not ever redeem what they did to Jose, and will not get us back to the top of the prem.

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Didn't the old Chelsea have mutiny's too?

 

The old Chelsea had Mutiny based on media reports - But the players did not play so badly that the team came close to relegation. They did their jobs on the pitch and also fought with the manager (Scolari and AVB is who you are referring to, right ?).  

 

AVB could have continued to be the Chelsea manager with the mutiny and we would still make top 4. The players while not linking the manager wanted to win trophies, they were driven (Which is why we need leaders). Any manager would want to work with them as he knows that despite a mutiny the players will get on the field and execute his game plan. 

 

But with this lot any manager will be worried. I find it interesting that both Guardiola and Simone, both have said Chelsea need upto 10 signings:

 

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/football/482120/Pep-Guardiola-Chelsea-job  Pep Guardiola tells Chelsea they need to buy 10 new players

 

 

>http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/627964/Diego-Simeone-Chelsea-Atletico-Madrid-Jose-Mourinho-replacement-transfer-news-gossip Diego Simeone wants the Chelsea job – on this one condition

Isn't it interesting that both our #1 candidates want to make major additions ? This to me seems like signs that other managers are worried about player mutiny and how much power the manager has in Chelsea.

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 I have to agree that you clearly haven't played any sports to any decent level.

 

Normal Jobs (such as drywalling) can be done by going through the motions day in day out. There is no mental or physical pressure to be constantly doing a perfect job. To compare the two is complete lunacy.

 

At the top level, you cannot afford to lose 5, even 2% of your edge. JM has exhausted the players. They played and scraped through the second half of last season. Now they have boiled over. Players not even playing to 75% of their maximum. Yet he STILL refused to make wholesale changes. Love the guy but time to move on.

Did you just compare being a professional footballer with delivering drywall? Not trying to be rude, but its pretty clear you never played sports at a higher level.

 

Oh, Scolari got sacked less than half a season after winning the double?  AVB won 3 BPL titles and smashed a record each time with CFC?

 

 

Ya, I guess the standards are different for managers who are our most successful ever and just tasted great success versus managers who acheived nothing.  I suppose that difference also translates to players who have won everything under the sun with this club and have a firm bond with the fans versus players who've (comparatively)  barely tasted success with the club and some of which have been here not much longer than a season....and sold out the manager who brought huge success to them and the club.

 

This is bullsh*t.  If I could deliver drywall for an average of 12 hours a day for a year and a half and "not be run into the ground" then how the f**k can a footballer cry about their work load being too much?  Never mind I didnt make in that year in a half what they did in a week,  This is bullsh*t and shows nothing more than the lack of mental toughness from some of these players.  Boo hoo, I have to train a few hours a day and its all diddums.

 

You never hear it from serial winners.  You never hear it from players grateful to make a living playing the game.  I can't recall ever hearing a player with genuine affection for any club citing this BS while playing for them.

 

 You hear it from whiners who need an excuse for why they shouldn't have to try their hardest every time.  You certainly don't hear it from "our boyfriends" mentioned above, all of whom have put in more of those "grueling" seasons and often staying on the pitch and influencing the game while carrying injuries. 

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Statically he's been as good as Hazard has so how has he been the worst? It wasn't long ago pitchdorks were out for Ivanovic, how poor has Matic been? It's to easy to blame the ex Arsenal player

Pitchdorks. Top quality Bobbie. You have invented a new word.

We have had way too many pitchdorks this season. Fabregas being one of the biggest.

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The old Chelsea had Mutiny based on media reports - But the players did not play so badly that the team came close to relegation. They did their jobs on the pitch and also fought with the manager (Scolari and AVB is who you are referring to, right ?).

AVB could have continued to be the Chelsea manager with the mutiny and we would still make top 4. The players while not linking the manager wanted to win trophies, they were driven (Which is why we need leaders). Any manager would want to work with them as he knows that despite a mutiny the players will get on the field and execute his game plan.

But with this lot any manager will be worried. I find it interesting that both Guardiola and Simone, both have said Chelsea need upto 10 signings:

> http://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/football/482120/Pep-Guardiola-Chelsea-job Pep Guardiola tells Chelsea they need to buy 10 new players

>http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/627964/Diego-Simeone-Chelsea-Atletico-Madrid-Jose-Mourinho-replacement-transfer-news-gossip Diego Simeone wants the Chelsea job – on this one condition

Isn't it interesting that both our #1 candidates want to make major additions ? This to me seems like signs that other managers are worried about player mutiny and how much power the manager has in Chelsea.

I wouldn't rely on the Daily Star as a reliable source of information
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The coaches we lost due to player mutiny is increasing - This is ridiculous. I hope when we get the next coach, we get him the players he wants and also sell some of our prima-donna's.

 

The old Chelsea team had in then Leaders - Drogba, Cech, Terry, CArvahlio. Lampard, Makalele, Essien, Ballack. The current team hardly has any leaders. Great athletes who are divas but not leaders. We need to invest on more well rounded professionals with leadership capabilities.

Completely agree with this and its gonna go to a whole different level when John Terry leaves, and were probably stupid enough to not give him a 1 year contract extension, for his leadership alone hes worth his weight in gold, or possibly he'll offer him the managers job at the end of the season and sack him after a month disgracing another chelsea legend. I really really fear for where we are going at the moment particularly because of the lack of leadership as you said and the lack of determination in the team, next full time manager will be run over aswell

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Mourinho is a true legend and stand up bloke. He trusted and played his best squad every game. I would have preferred he singled out any disruptive influences or so called bad apples, brought in our loanees to replace them and see us through until the end of the season. Unfortunately Mourinho has too much pride and integrity to single out individuals and we're left with a possibly divided dressing room without arguably the worlds best manager...

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Completely agree with this and its gonna go to a whole different level when John Terry leaves, and were probably stupid enough to not give him a 1 year contract extension, for his leadership alone hes worth his weight in gold, or possibly he'll offer him the managers job at the end of the season and sack him after a month disgracing another chelsea legend. I really really fear for where we are going at the moment particularly because of the lack of leadership as you said and the lack of determination in the team, next full time manager will be run over aswell

 

Spot on - It is shocking to look at it in hindsight and wonder. We need players who can take charge and hold other accountable. And the one thing that this whole experience has proved is that our players simply are not good enough together. Last year the dressing room influence of Drogba and Cech must be another huge reason why we won the title. 

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Drogba, Cech, Terry, Lampard...these are players that respected Mourinho and had a positive influence in the dressing room. I believe any doubtful managerial decisions wouldn't get questioned as these players would convey the managers strategy and generate belief in his decisions. The landscape has since changed and it seems respect has also diminished...very sad to see

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Im convinced Drogba played a huge part last year, my big fear at the moment is relegation and I am serious, some of these teams are improving and playing decent football, depending on the number of players who apparently were against Mourinho there could be considerable unrest between certain players,

 

Its all been a really really puzzling state of affairs really, so much talk of Cesc being a bad apple but yet he plays almost every game and constantly backing mourinho, I personally dont think there was a personal agenda from anyone against mourinho, still think they all respected him but I think he planted seeds of doubt in players minds about his methods, wins league last year feels like God, makes bizarre and arrogant decisions because he feels he can and ruins players confidence, remember this is the prem and the particular group of players we have at the moment arent mentally strong like 2005-2011. 

1. really public harassing of Hazard, Jose had his reasons but Hazard is not a type of player that will react positively to criticism its clearly affecting his confidence, he pissed off jose big time on Monday though but from what Id seen before that in spurs game and porto game he was quite unlucky not to score and it is chipping away at him

2. Costa still played big games when he was available 

3. Matic being put on and subbed was humiliating for the player and not fair imo

4. Eva Carneiro case was a farce from the start 

 

Im disappointed he hasnt given the likes of Kenedy more playing time, he obviously rates him if hes keeping him in the squad, hes an exciting player, also agree with poster earlier about RLC, I think hes a little overated and Lewis Baker is a better player, idiotic english footballing mentality though(Im irish btw so same mentality here) where the bigger a player is heightwise and physically the better

 

All in all, Jose chopped around a bit with the team breaking the confidence of players and planting seeds of doubt in their mind. I dont believe that a group of more than 2/3 were personally against him and unwilling to try, I still saw a will there since Mid october but the confidence is too fragile for our mentally weak players but feel he went way too arrogant thinking he could do what he liked starting with the Eva Carneiro shambles. If these players were so against him he wouldnt have kept playing them. Obviously our pre season was a joke and cost us early on but our players arent strong enough metally to overcome this form right now in my eyes. Regardless of who is in charge we need wins ASAP and hopefully a confidence boosting win at some point

 

Really stressed to the max over everything atm, Jose has not been himself though in interviews for quite a while and he was embarassing himself especially after Southampton game, my heart breaks for him I hope he recharges his batteries and gets a breaks and then doesnt end up at United

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Great video

So hard to watch, I remember that excitement when he came  back, 1st game of the season at the Bridge, I don't think I'll ever be as satisfied as I was that day to see him sit back on that bench. Sickening we'll never feel that bond again that we had with Jose with any future manager

 

Heres to the future anyway, we cant change anything now apart from getting behind the team, refrain from booing anyone going tomorrow, we need the points if u really care then get behind the team, plus were speculating about the rumours

 

KTBFFH

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You have made some good points here.

1. Harrassing Hazard - can't take the heat then stay out the kitchen. Willian seems to have responded well to Mourinhos advice and support. If he's being that disruptive we should have swapped him with Bale.

2. I think Costa was allowed to play because Mourinho gave him the opportunity. It wasnt Costas decision to be available.

3. Matic should have performed better, he has the ability proven last season. If he improves now it would imply he played poorly to get Mourinho out.

4. Eva was brought in by AVB...should have left with him.

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saw a bit of the interview where the title of the video was "mourinho explains his love for chelsea" or something similar, where claire balding asks him which club means the most to him. he goes on to say because he spent more time at chelsea he has a deeper love, however he also mentions inter milan too, then porto and real madrid to a lesser extent but still all important. I am always dubious of the claims he made mentioning love for chelsea and that bit of the interview kind of confirmed that he doesn't have a particular "love" for any club he's managed. 

 

That was my interpretation as well ...

 

 

Mourinho is very good at telling supporters what they want to hear ... he's as mercenary as anyone else in modern sport when it comes down to it. He only came back to us because he wasn't offered the United job - people tend to forget that ... if he does now turn up at Old Trafford then all the rhetoric about "Chelsea in my heart" "One of us"  "I will never go to a rival club in the same country" will all be shown up to be empty words.

 

Club legend Frank Lampard got a load of sh*t from elements of the Chelsea fanbase for being "Judas" and turning out for Man City last year.

 

Jose going to Manchester United ought to be be a far worse "betrayal" (the word of the week it seems), but my bet is it will still be a JM love-fest and Roman's fault for driving him away ...

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That was my interpretation as well ...

Mourinho is very good at telling supporters what they want to hear ... he's as mercenary as anyone else in modern sport when it comes down to it. He only came back to us because he wasn't offered the United job - people tend to forget that ... if he does now turn up at Old Trafford then all the rhetoric about "Chelsea in my heart" "One of us" "I will never go to a rival club in the same country" will all be shown up to be empty words.

Club legend Frank Lampard got a load of sh*t from elements of the Chelsea fanbase for being "Judas" and turning out for Man City last year.

Jose going to Manchester United ought to be be a far worse "betrayal" (the word of the week it seems), but my bet is it will still be a JM love-fest and Roman's fault for driving him away ...

This is a complete different situation. Lamps was already at the end of his career, he could've easily avoided that City spell and ending up as a "clean" Chelsea legend.

Cech was already a different situation, he was forced out but still in the prime of his career.

But Jose is 52, he has like 20 years left in his managerial career. He was sacked in 2007, but came back because he loves this club, and now after winning the title + league cup and committing his future to Chelsea, he got sacked AGAIN.

I lost the count how many times he said things like:" I want to stay forever" or "I stay as long as the owner and board wants me to".

His family and him love England, so If he wants to stay in England, Chelsea is not an option anymore. What do you expect him to do? Reject offers from big clubs and coach in the championship?

We just wasted the chance to create a dynasty with a fully committed world class manager who loves us. You can't blame him to go for his professional career when he already gave us a second chance.

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 I have to agree that you clearly haven't played any sports to any decent level.

 

Normal Jobs (such as drywalling) can be done by going through the motions day in day out. There is no mental or physical pressure to be constantly doing a perfect job. To compare the two is complete lunacy.

 

At the top level, you cannot afford to lose 5, even 2% of your edge. JM has exhausted the players. They played and scraped through the second half of last season. Now they have boiled over. Players not even playing to 75% of their maximum. Yet he STILL refused to make wholesale changes. Love the guy but time to move on.

Define decent.  Not pro (and never had a chance to be pro), but about as decent as you can before making it pro.  More below.  Now I have to ask, have you ever worked a physically demanding job over long hours?  Or do you imagine that pro-athletes are the only ones with physically demanding jobs?

 

First, not dry walling (done that, walk in the park compared to delivering it.  Well atleast the company i worked for).  No mental pressure?  Clearly never worked the trades mate.  They got deadlines, actual worries of job security and I can guarantee you that you don't want to compare work injuries because a broken leg is a good turnout for a bad situation, and often a worst case in football.  Seen injuries that make Cech's life threatening accident look like a minor issue.  Fun wondering if the guy(s) around you are  sobered up from his nightly binge drinking because if they f**k up it could mean someones spending a long time in the hospital or worse. Then many wondering how the bills will get paid despite working 12 hours a day.  Putting in those twelve hours because if you complain, you'll be watching the next guy in line take your pay cheque...but ya, that stress in football LOLOL  Oh, and Im Canadian.  So do all that on ice in freezing temperatures for over half the year.

 

That stress of a bad performance when locked into a contract that guarantees you million regardless of performance....wow, thats killer stuff right there.  Now that you mention, amazed we dont see weekly heart attacks or mental collapses from all the stress.  Wondering how you're going to budget your assistants annual salary (you know, one of the many guys that does all the non-football work in life for many of these footballers, many of said people the club employs and pays for them) when it's a fraction of your weekly wages, my mind crumbles just thinking about it.  Poor guys.

 

Take your pick of Chelsea players who prove your "cannot afford to lose 5% theory" to be the joke it is.  Many of them have dropped 50% or more.  All are getting paid their full contract value. 

 

So maybe you'll explain exactly why a Chelsea player can't afford those drops in performance that normal people usually pay for their jobs with, because I'm not seeing a single thing to substantiate that claim.

 

But if you're referring to why the players have been poor, because of how hard they worked, then I would direct your attention to the many BPL teams/ whose players have to go harder physically than Chelsea because they possesses less talent.  Dont hear many of them complaining about it being too much...   well Sterling aside.  Plus certain other players thrived under Mourinho's "too much" methods.  Won multiple league titles and cups.  Absolutely dominated all before them.  No one complained about it being too much, too demanding, and making them boil over.  Funny how that works.  Either their bodies work a lot differently OR perhaps they have different mentalities, just a possibility

 

Just from watching the games you can tell that Chelsea player's dont have the most grueling training regimes in the league.  You think Leicester plays the way they do because they take it easy in training?

 

You think all the other BPL teams take it easy compared to Chelsea under Mourinho?  You're deluding yourself and falling for the weak excuses of some sad excuses of professional athletes.

Did you just compare being a professional footballer with delivering drywall? Not trying to be rude, but its pretty clear you never played sports at a higher level.

In terms of physical demands over a period of time, yes I did. Obviously Im not saying the tasks are the same, but physically demanding work is physically demanding work.  I too would scoff at comparing the work of a pro-athlete with that of a manual laborer, thing is I know the manual labor route is often a lot more grueling.  

 

Yes a pro-athlete is likely in better shape and able to perform better at sports.  I'll freely admit that Hazard and maybe even Fabregas can do some physical feats I couldnt.... but I'd love to see Hazard of Fabregas spend a 12-14 hour day carrying loads of drywall that weigh over 100 lbs.  Had a guy training to be a pro-westler quit after 2 days because it was too hard, he was twice my size in terms of muscle and Im not small guy.  

 

And just like with the wrestler who couldn't carry drywall, when it comes to certain Chelsea players cries of too much demands, I know its a issue of mentality and not physical ability.  It's not that they can't, its that they dont want too.  Last season proved they were capable.  It was too much and carried over to this season?  LOL, Im no medical expert but I'm pretty confident that a body that's had time to get three stones over weight is a body thats had time to recover from the rigors of the previous season.  

 

Again, how come the vast majority of players under Mourinho never had this issue?  How, when its clear that most BPL clubs will train to a similar level if not more (again, teams with less talent tend to make up for it with extra phsyical work/rigorous team training), is it that only Chelsea has such a high rate of players who cant cope?

 

Never played pro, played at a university level and won what would be termed "state championships" and city championships at high school levels.  I have, however, talked about this topic with professional athletes, relating to jobs on the farm in there youth or construction/manual labour jobs they had previous, and to a man they all were quite happy for the switch even if the pay inequalities were taken out of the equation.  Now it was hockey and american football players (one of the people I am mentioning might be known to some here, Dwayne Johnson), don't know if their job is more of a physical demand than that of a european footballer lol (average NFL career is about 3 yeras long ladies and gentlemen.  Thats proof of something being too much for the body)

 

But feel free to prove me wrong about where I said you rarely ear this from footballers who are serial winners or from players who genuinely are affectionate to the club/fans they play for.

 

My point is that anyone who actually believes that training under Mourinho was too much work is falling for the pathetic excuses of a professional who doesn't want to have to earn their living. That or they are just physically weaker than most of the players to succeed under Moruinho.  I guess that is a possibility.

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oh, and this last season's work load was too much is complete bullsh*t also because the work load last season is exactly what it took to win the league and especially the double.

If that's too much then clearly these are not players capable of repeating the feat.

So why the f**k did we just fire our best ever manager to appease them?

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  'Fun wondering if the guy(s) around you are  sobered up from his nightly binge drinking'.

 

The sentence that sums up the comparison in one.

 

Define decent.  Not pro (and never had a chance to be pro), but about as decent as you can before making it pro.  More below.  Now I have to ask, have you ever worked a physically demanding job over long hours?  Or do you imagine that pro-athletes are the only ones with physically demanding jobs?

 

First, not dry walling (done that, walk in the park compared to delivering it.  Well atleast the company i worked for).  No mental pressure?  Clearly never worked the trades mate.  They got deadlines, actual worries of job security and I can guarantee you that you don't want to compare work injuries because a broken leg is a good turnout for a bad situation, and often a worst case in football.  Seen injuries that make Cech's life threatening accident look like a minor issue.  Fun wondering if the guy(s) around you are  sobered up from his nightly binge drinking because if they f**k up it could mean someones spending a long time in the hospital or worse. Then many wondering how the bills will get paid despite working 12 hours a day.  Putting in those twelve hours because if you complain, you'll be watching the next guy in line take your pay cheque...but ya, that stress in football LOLOL  Oh, and Im Canadian.  So do all that on ice in freezing temperatures for over half the year.

 

That stress of a bad performance when locked into a contract that guarantees you million regardless of performance....wow, thats killer stuff right there.  Now that you mention, amazed we dont see weekly heart attacks or mental collapses from all the stress.  Wondering how you're going to budget your assistants annual salary (you know, one of the many guys that does all the non-football work in life for many of these footballers, many of said people the club employs and pays for them) when it's a fraction of your weekly wages, my mind crumbles just thinking about it.  Poor guys.

 

Take your pick of Chelsea players who prove your "cannot afford to lose 5% theory" to be the joke it is.  Many of them have dropped 50% or more.  All are getting paid their full contract value. 

 

So maybe you'll explain exactly why a Chelsea player can't afford those drops in performance that normal people usually pay for their jobs with, because I'm not seeing a single thing to substantiate that claim.

 

But if you're referring to why the players have been poor, because of how hard they worked, then I would direct your attention to the many BPL teams/ whose players have to go harder physically than Chelsea because they possesses less talent.  Dont hear many of them complaining about it being too much...   well Sterling aside.  Plus certain other players thrived under Mourinho's "too much" methods.  Won multiple league titles and cups.  Absolutely dominated all before them.  No one complained about it being too much, too demanding, and making them boil over.  Funny how that works.  Either their bodies work a lot differently OR perhaps they have different mentalities, just a possibility

 

Just from watching the games you can tell that Chelsea player's dont have the most grueling training regimes in the league.  You think Leicester plays the way they do because they take it easy in training?

 

You think all the other BPL teams take it easy compared to Chelsea under Mourinho?  You're deluding yourself and falling for the weak excuses of some sad excuses of professional athletes.

In terms of physical demands over a period of time, yes I did. Obviously Im not saying the tasks are the same, but physically demanding work is physically demanding work.  I too would scoff at comparing the work of a pro-athlete with that of a manual laborer, thing is I know the manual labor route is often a lot more grueling.  

 

Yes a pro-athlete is likely in better shape and able to perform better at sports.  I'll freely admit that Hazard and maybe even Fabregas can do some physical feats I couldnt.... but I'd love to see Hazard of Fabregas spend a 12-14 hour day carrying loads of drywall that weigh over 100 lbs.  Had a guy training to be a pro-westler quit after 2 days because it was too hard, he was twice my size in terms of muscle and Im not small guy.  

 

And just like with the wrestler who couldn't carry drywall, when it comes to certain Chelsea players cries of too much demands, I know its a issue of mentality and not physical ability.  It's not that they can't, its that they dont want too.  Last season proved they were capable.  It was too much and carried over to this season?  LOL, Im no medical expert but I'm pretty confident that a body that's had time to get three stones over weight is a body thats had time to recover from the rigors of the previous season.  

 

Again, how come the vast majority of players under Mourinho never had this issue?  How, when its clear that most BPL clubs will train to a similar level if not more (again, teams with less talent tend to make up for it with extra phsyical work/rigorous team training), is it that only Chelsea has such a high rate of players who cant cope?

 

Never played pro, played at a university level and won what would be termed "state championships" and city championships at high school levels.  I have, however, talked about this topic with professional athletes, relating to jobs on the farm in there youth or construction/manual labour jobs they had previous, and to a man they all were quite happy for the switch even if the pay inequalities were taken out of the equation.  Now it was hockey and american football players (one of the people I am mentioning might be known to some here, Dwayne Johnson), don't know if their job is more of a physical demand than that of a european footballer lol (average NFL career is about 3 yeras long ladies and gentlemen.  Thats proof of something being too much for the body)

 

But feel free to prove me wrong about where I said you rarely ear this from footballers who are serial winners or from players who genuinely are affectionate to the club/fans they play for.

 

My point is that anyone who actually believes that training under Mourinho was too much work is falling for the pathetic excuses of a professional who doesn't want to have to earn their living. That or they are just physically weaker than most of the players to succeed under Moruinho.  I guess that is a possibility.

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