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Tiémoué Bakayoko

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22 minutes ago, Ernie_blue said:

Yeah Fernandinho is a top player and vital for City, they really miss him when his not playing. Will be interesting to see how they replace him as his 34 now.

All the talk seems to be about Rodri or Saul from Atletico or Ndombele from Lyon. I think they might be conservative this sunmer with an FFP ban hanging over them.

If they signed Saul I'd be devastated. He has been played out position this season, but he is almost tailored made for English football. All action, big moment player. If there is a sniff of us not being banned this season he's the one player I'd be happy to spend Hazard's fee on. Frank could turn him into a left footed version of himself.

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45 minutes ago, Ernie_blue said:

Well we dont know that, Kovacic was absolutely awful last season, Drinkwater nearly had a bigger impact :laugh2:

I think that’s a bit extreme.  I’ve found that most people who think Kovacic was really bad seemed to think he was going to come in and bang in goals left and right from midfield.  Perhaps the stigma of coming from RM played into that too.

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I know i wasn't expecting lots of goals or assists from him, just some average level of end product and positive play would have been enough. Sadly, there was next to nothing. Cowardly displays of giving nothing and expecting others to take the responsibility of actually doing something. My most disliked player i'vee seen in the EPL.

Edited by Dixons

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18 minutes ago, mwblue10 said:

I think that’s a bit extreme.  I’ve found that most people who think Kovacic was really bad seemed to think he was going to come in and bang in goals left and right from midfield.  Perhaps the stigma of coming from RM played into that too.

I never really expected lots of goals but he literally did nothing in the majority of games.

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Agree to disagree then. I cannot subscribe to the idea that Bakayoko offers more than Kovacic until Bakayoko is proven to have a stellar season with us next season.

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Talk of not fighting for Ndombele, Saul, Rodri or Tielemans is a slight disappointment for me. Having multiple competent midfielders used to be a highlight of Chelsea, we used to have Lamps, Ballack, Makalele, Obi Mikel, Essien and Lassana Diarra all competing with each other just to get on the starting 11

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13 minutes ago, Deino said:

Agree to disagree then. I cannot subscribe to the idea that Bakayoko offers more than Kovacic until Bakayoko is proven to have a stellar season with us next season.

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Talk of not fighting for Ndombele, Saul, Rodri or Tielemans is a slight disappointment for me. Having multiple competent midfielders used to be a highlight of Chelsea, we used to have Lamps, Ballack, Makalele, Obi Mikel, Essien and Lassana Diarra all competing with each other just to get on the starting 11

Now we have Jorginho, Kante, RLC, Stinkwater, Barkley and Bakayoko! 

Throw in the likes of Mount, Ampadu and Pasalic and Van Ginkel coming back from loan.. And thats plenty. 

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7 minutes ago, Deino said:

Agree to disagree then. I cannot subscribe to the idea that Bakayoko offers more than Kovacic until Bakayoko is proven to have a stellar season with us next season.

--

Talk of not fighting for Ndombele, Saul, Rodri or Tielemans is a slight disappointment for me. Having multiple competent midfielders used to be a highlight of Chelsea, we used to have Lamps, Ballack, Makalele, Obi Mikel, Essien and Lassana Diarra all competing with each other just to get on the starting 11

It's both a blessing and a curse at how much RLC transforms our midfield.  With him healthy, I think our midfield is one of the best in the PL.  When he's injured or not in the lineup, it's average.  If he's healthy, we don't really need to sign another attacking midfielder - but that's the million dollar question:  will he stay healthy?  The back issues shouldn't be a huge concern but obviously will trouble him from time to time and cause him to miss a few games.  The Achilles was a fluky injury, but a very serious one.  I think it's safe to guess that he will be one of those players that always misses some games due to injury every season, but we can't be sure.  There's plenty of pitch time to go around.

It's why I've advocated for a signing like Bruno Fernandes or somebody similar, who is versatile enough to play further ahead in an attacking role, or further back and pull strings.  If we are going to sign an attacking midfielder, let's go all in and sign a potential world beater.  I think the 4 you listed are pretty good options too.  With the manager change, Jorginho will still play I'm sure, but he won't be such a nailed on starter.  Kante obviously will be, but it would be nice to give the man a rest occasionally.  If RLC goes down, it's Kovacic or Barkley in the AM role - not great options.  Hopefully Mount can help us there but I don't think he's quite ready - perhaps he will be in a years time.

Either way, it's tough to have too many really good midfielders, notably when we likely will have 3 CMs on the field at almost all times.  Good quality depth is important.

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18 minutes ago, Deino said:

Agree to disagree then. I cannot subscribe to the idea that Bakayoko offers more than Kovacic until Bakayoko is proven to have a stellar season with us next season.

--

Talk of not fighting for Ndombele, Saul, Rodri or Tielemans is a slight disappointment for me. Having multiple competent midfielders used to be a highlight of Chelsea, we used to have Lamps, Ballack, Makalele, Obi Mikel, Essien and Lassana Diarra all competing with each other just to get on the starting 11

Fact is, if we're ever going to get back to competing with City, we need far better players than Bakayoko and Kovacic, so arguing which one is the worst is pointless!

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I've not watched any games of him playing in Milan, his season highlights seem pretty average.

I have read the (negative) stories along the way of him arguing with the coach and taking the piss out of another player holding his shirt after the game and I have to say I don't mind that, it probably shows he has more confidence/arrogance which is an attitude far from what he had here when he was literally playing like a useless pussy.

I don't think there is a top player in him but he is still a physical presence in midfield and if he is to join the squad next season, there probably is a bit of hope he can do a job in rotation or coming off the bench.

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2 minutes ago, sonic90 said:

I've not watched any games of him playing in Milan, his season highlights seem pretty average

I watched a lot of him this year. He was an old fashioned stopper. Not a lot of glamorous highlights in putting in a tackle or interception and fishing it tov a midfielder, but he was very, very good in that role for Milan. Was also very good in the air in the middle of the park. 

 

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9 hours ago, Skinnedy said:

I watched a lot of him this year. He was an old fashioned stopper. Not a lot of glamorous highlights in putting in a tackle or interception and fishing it tov a midfielder, but he was very, very good in that role for Milan. Was also very good in the air in the middle of the park. 

 

But we already have a Kante for that right?

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Just now, RIP Mourinho said:

No. Kante is box to box, Bakayoko will sit infront of the back line.

Not sure how that would work with our current formation as thats where Jorg will be, in the Pirlo role

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48 minutes ago, ENygma said:

Not sure how that would work with our current formation as thats where Jorg will be, in the Pirlo role

I doubt we keep playing like this under any other manager though. I was just stating that's where he played for Milan. TBH, he isn't suited for how we currently play football at all.

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3 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

I doubt we keep playing like this under any other manager though. I was just stating that's where he played for Milan. TBH, he isn't suited for how we currently play football at all.

Fair point, 

Would be wise to get Kante back to do what he does best and play in front of the defence. I think Bakayoko could possibly play as a Kante replacement.

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15 hours ago, Skinnedy said:

I watched a lot of him this year. He was an old fashioned stopper. Not a lot of glamorous highlights in putting in a tackle or interception and fishing it tov a midfielder, but he was very, very good in that role for Milan. Was also very good in the air in the middle of the park. 

 

As long as he has some kind of contribution and not a complete waste of a spot I'd be fine with him, sounds like there is a bit of promise there. I'll keep an eye out on him in pre season next month

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"I do not have a choice", really chomping at the bit to get back here and fight for a starting place isn't he?

 

Asked by L'Equipe if he will return to Chelsea for the new season, Bakayoko replied: 'Yes, I have three years left on my contract. I do not have a choice.

'What will happen next, I'm not sure, but I have to go back to Chelsea, that's the only thing we know.'

'For sure, one day I would like to play in Paris,' he explained. 'I cannot lie about it. It's big for me and my loved ones. We are real Parisians.'

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2 hours ago, fitz said:

"I do not have a choice", really chomping at the bit to get back here and fight for a starting place isn't he?

 

Asked by L'Equipe if he will return to Chelsea for the new season, Bakayoko replied: 'Yes, I have three years left on my contract. I do not have a choice.

'What will happen next, I'm not sure, but I have to go back to Chelsea, that's the only thing we know.'

'For sure, one day I would like to play in Paris,' he explained. 'I cannot lie about it. It's big for me and my loved ones. We are real Parisians.'

I'm willing to pay your ticket on the condition it's one way only

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On ‎10‎/‎06‎/‎2019 at 11:22, Deino said:

Agree to disagree then. I cannot subscribe to the idea that Bakayoko offers more than Kovacic until Bakayoko is proven to have a stellar season with us next season.

 

TBH, neither Bakayoko or Kovacic offered enough for me to be excited about having them in he squad this season.  Both came in with high expectations and failed to deliver on them.  Bakayoko was supposed to be the Matic replacement, and Kovacic turned out to be neither a goal scorer or play maker.  With Kovacic, it meant we had a player wide on both sides that were not a goal threat.  combine that without a credible striker they could play to, and it's not a surprise they couldn't contribute much.  We didn't get enough out of Kovacic's playing twin Barkley either.  

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Bakayoko would certainly suit the 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1 formation better than he did in Contes 3-4-3, hes far too limited and exposed in a strictly 2 man CM than he would be in a 3 man CM.

All things being equal, hes probably our 5th best CM currently on the books behind Kante, RLC, Jorginho and Barkley so I'd have no issue keeping him around but if a decent offer came in for him, i'd equally have no issue leaving him go.

With the trransfer ban, we cant really be choosing his replacement from anyone outside of Chelsea anyway so we can park all that talk unfortunately. ?

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On 11/06/2019 at 01:42, mwblue10 said:

It's both a blessing and a curse at how much RLC transforms our midfield.  With him healthy, I think our midfield is one of the best in the PL.  When he's injured or not in the lineup, it's average.  If he's healthy, we don't really need to sign another attacking midfielder - but that's the million dollar question:  will he stay healthy?  The back issues shouldn't be a huge concern but obviously will trouble him from time to time and cause him to miss a few games.  The Achilles was a fluky injury, but a very serious one.  I think it's safe to guess that he will be one of those players that always misses some games due to injury every season, but we can't be sure.  There's plenty of pitch time to go around.

It's why I've advocated for a signing like Bruno Fernandes or somebody similar, who is versatile enough to play further ahead in an attacking role, or further back and pull strings.  If we are going to sign an attacking midfielder, let's go all in and sign a potential world beater.  I think the 4 you listed are pretty good options too.  With the manager change, Jorginho will still play I'm sure, but he won't be such a nailed on starter.  Kante obviously will be, but it would be nice to give the man a rest occasionally.  If RLC goes down, it's Kovacic or Barkley in the AM role - not great options.  Hopefully Mount can help us there but I don't think he's quite ready - perhaps he will be in a years time.

Either way, it's tough to have too many really good midfielders, notably when we likely will have 3 CMs on the field at almost all times.  Good quality depth is important.

It is the key question isn't it. His fitness this last little while has been a battle. I also think (based on no sports science knowledge whatsoever!) that once you get a bad injury like he has you're more likely to get other related injuries because of the strain it puts on other muscles/tendons in your leg.

On how many midfielders is enough I reckon our best teams had 5 very strong midfielders who covered all the roles (Lampard, Ballack, Essien, Mikel, Maka/Deco). For mine I think the only two who are locked in and close to that quality are Kante and Ruben (I think Jorginho will go with Sarri). What we need next summer I think depends on Ampadu and Mount. If they play and can prove to be at the level then that solves some major issues and provides cover for Kante and Ruben. That leaves us with one midfield spot who we could spend big on next summer on a Fernandes et al. depending of course on who is still available. 

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