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Callum Hudson-Odoi


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17 minutes ago, Jangz said:

 

i saw this clip of Ansu Fati.. i didnt see anything special here but he is supposedly a 70mil player.. If anything CHO seems to have a better passing .. both players are very similar IMO, both like to switch play and come inside.. if these are the expectations of a young player I am fairly confident on CHO at 18 he was better than this.. It seems he has lost a year because of injury but clearly has a higher ceiling..

Ansu Fati played 776 min in a struggling Barca team. The guy he initially replaced - Ousmane Dembele - is the perfect example of why you need to wrap these players in cotton wool in order to stop injury ruining their career.

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6 hours ago, Jangz said:

 

i saw this clip of Ansu Fati.. i didnt see anything special here but he is supposedly a 70mil player.. If anything CHO seems to have a better passing .. both players are very similar IMO, both like to switch play and come inside.. if these are the expectations of a young player I am fairly confident on CHO at 18 he was better than this.. It seems he has lost a year because of injury but clearly has a higher ceiling..

Main difference i see there is the variety. Fati likes to cut in on his right, as we saw for the goal, but he mixes up better, slipping in through balls, little give and goes, occasionally goes on the outside. 

Cho seems trys to cut inside on his right foot a little too much when he plays on the left, which why i actually prefer him on the right tbh. 

Both good players with big futures though, just hope Cho gets back to looking like that player we saw before the injury.

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On 07/09/2020 at 08:14, SydneyChelsea said:

Ansu Fati played 776 min in a struggling Barca team. The guy he initially replaced - Ousmane Dembele - is the perfect example of why you need to wrap these players in cotton wool in order to stop injury ruining their career.

Hi @SydneyChelsea sorry my bad but could you just elaborate on what you are implying. Is it about injury or player development or CHO vs Fati?

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On 07/09/2020 at 14:02, big blue said:

Main difference i see there is the variety. Fati likes to cut in on his right, as we saw for the goal, but he mixes up better, slipping in through balls, little give and goes, occasionally goes on the outside. 

Cho seems trys to cut inside on his right foot a little too much when he plays on the left, which why i actually prefer him on the right tbh. 

Both good players with big futures though, just hope Cho gets back to looking like that player we saw before the injury.

Before injury he was electric .. haven’t seen that post injury unfortunately 😞

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With the other key English players of his generation - Foden and Sancho and Greenwood - scoring goals and assisting regularly, feels like a big season for CHO. If he gets a few goals early in season he could really make a big jump. We need him while pulisic is out 

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On 08/09/2020 at 23:39, Jangz said:

Hi @SydneyChelsea sorry my bad but could you just elaborate on what you are implying. Is it about injury or player development or CHO vs Fati?

Injury. The rate of injury in promising young players is explodingly, largely in part due to the massive intensity difference between top division and youth football. It means that young players are training and playing at an intensity that their bodies are physically unsuited to and also unlikely to have the discipline in recovery as an older player. 

Arsenal make for a great case study in this regard as they have a long history of promoting extremely young players who then go on to have career-altering injury records, Aaron Ramsey and Jack Wilshere being the prime examples. Germany's last 'golden generation' included Schurrle, Gotze, Marin, Boateng etc who have undoubtedly had success but also have had their time at the absolute top level curtailed by injury. As much as we want Hudson-Odoi to develop quickly, there's no point in developing him if he's only going to be able to play at the very top for a couple of seasons.

 

 

Edited by SydneyChelsea
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2 hours ago, SydneyChelsea said:

Injury. The rate of injury in promising young players is explodingly, largely in part due to the massive intensity difference between top division and youth football. It means that young players are training and playing at an intensity that their bodies are physically unsuited to and also unlikely to have the discipline in recovery as an older player. 

Arsenal make for a great case study in this regard as they have a long history of promoting extremely young players who then go on to have career-altering injury records, Aaron Ramsey and Jack Wilshere being the prime examples. Germany's last 'golden generation' included Schurrle, Gotze, Marin, Boateng etc who have undoubtedly had success but also have had their time at the absolute top level curtailed by injury. As much as we want Hudson-Odoi to develop quickly, there's no point in developing him if he's only going to be able to play at the very top for a couple of seasons.

 

 

Teams with world class youth potentials tend to overplay them which also increases the chances of injuring them.

We seem to be doing it right with our newest youth prospects like Mount, Tammy and Tomori though. 

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1 minute ago, Deino said:

Teams with world class youth potentials tend to overplay them which also increases the chances of injuring them.

We seem to be doing it right with our newest youth prospects like Mount, Tammy and Tomori though. 

I think so too, it's more pointing out that starting every game is not always in a young player's long-term best interest. We want them to be in starting condition by the time they are 22-23, but not necessarily before then. At CHO's age, 20-25 games is ample; we don't need him to be doing a Mason Mount (50+ games) because his playstyle puts him at risk of injury.

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3 minutes ago, SydneyChelsea said:

I think so too, it's more pointing out that starting every game is not always in a young player's long-term best interest. We want them to be in starting condition by the time they are 22-23, but not necessarily before then. At CHO's age, 20-25 games is ample; we don't need him to be doing a Mason Mount (50+ games) because his playstyle puts him at risk of injury.

Agreed. Mount has also experienced various levels of football which I think gives his body the experience to handle the intensity. 

RLC and CHO was always thrown into the deep end which cannot be too good for a growing body.

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13 hours ago, SydneyChelsea said:

Injury. The rate of injury in promising young players is explodingly, largely in part due to the massive intensity difference between top division and youth football. It means that young players are training and playing at an intensity that their bodies are physically unsuited to and also unlikely to have the discipline in recovery as an older player. 

Arsenal make for a great case study in this regard as they have a long history of promoting extremely young players who then go on to have career-altering injury records, Aaron Ramsey and Jack Wilshere being the prime examples. Germany's last 'golden generation' included Schurrle, Gotze, Marin, Boateng etc who have undoubtedly had success but also have had their time at the absolute top level curtailed by injury. As much as we want Hudson-Odoi to develop quickly, there's no point in developing him if he's only going to be able to play at the very top for a couple of seasons.

Foreign clubs (Dortmund aside) tend to take more staggered approach with young players anyway, the desperation to make teenagers starters so soon is more an English thing, that's why people think Pep is "ruining" Foden and couldn't grasp the context when Sarri said CHO needs a few years to make bonafide starter level.

Barcelona are an example, they got praised to high heaven for creating the best team of all time largely with academy products but what doesn't get mentioned is out of all of them that destroyed United in the 11 final only Messi became a regular in his teens and even he had to wait till 18. Xavi, Iniesta, Busquets, Valdes, Puyol, Pique and Pedro didn't fully break through till their 20's infact all bar the first two they were still awaiting their Barcelona debut on their 20th birthdays.

Edited by Argo
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12 minutes ago, Argo said:

couldn't grasp the context when Sarri said CHO needs a few years to make bonafide starter level.

Sarri screwed it up though. Hudson Odoi had all the momentum in the world after pre-season and CS and yet Sarri straight up refused to play him for several months. When he got an opportunity he was almost always on of our most dangerous players only to be benched for weeks on end after.

Which eventually led to CHO getting unsettled and asked for a transfer as we all know. Then obviously the injury happened but he's never looked quite as good as he did then. Yet at least.

 

 

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23 minutes ago, Sindre said:

Sarri screwed it up though. Hudson Odoi had all the momentum in the world after pre-season and CS and yet Sarri straight up refused to play him for several months. When he got an opportunity he was almost always on of our most dangerous players only to be benched for weeks on end after.

Which eventually led to CHO getting unsettled and asked for a transfer as we all know. Then obviously the injury happened but he's never looked quite as good as he did then. Yet at least.

Sarri annoyed the hell out of me with his handing of Bulka as well ... who looked superb in pre-season and then never got a look in ... even ending up behind 39 year old Robert Green in the pecking order ffs ..

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17 minutes ago, Sexyfootball said:

Sarri annoyed the hell out of me with his handing of Bulka as well ... who looked superb in pre-season and then never got a look in ... even ending up behind 39 year old Robert Green in the pecking order ffs ..

That wasn't true!

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I wonder if Lampard will give him the chance now that Ziyech is still injured. Pulisic just came back from injury so this would be a chance for him to start.

If he doesn't get a chance but we still play the 4-3-3 with wingers it could be a sign that he isn't at the required level.

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43 minutes ago, Sindre said:

Sarri screwed it up though. Hudson Odoi had all the momentum in the world after pre-season and CS and yet Sarri straight up refused to play him for several months. When he got an opportunity he was almost always on of our most dangerous players only to be benched for weeks on end after.

Which eventually led to CHO getting unsettled and asked for a transfer as we all know. Then obviously the injury happened but he's never looked quite as good as he did then. Yet at least.

He was always keeping his options open which is why he committed to only a short term deal even before Sarri and Chelsea were even mentioned under the same breath.

Lampard lost Lamptey (who you could argue should have been utilized when we played 3atb) was that his fault?

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3 minutes ago, Argo said:

He was always keeping his options open which is why he committed to only a short term deal even before Sarri and Chelsea were even mentioned under the same breath.

Lampard lost Lamptey (who you could argue should have been utilized when we played 3atb) was that his fault?

Lamptey was always an impossible situation as it was a straight choice between him and James. Wasn't room for both of them so we chose James, i think that was the correct choice.

 

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Just now, Sexyfootball said:

So we went to all the trouble of signing Green to be our 4th choice keeper ?

I imagine Green was there to make up the numbers on a matchday for when Bulka was playing development games.

Whenever Kepa wasn't in the 18 it was Bulka not Green on the bench.

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5 minutes ago, Argo said:

I imagine Green was there to make up the numbers on a matchday for when Bulka was playing development games.

Whenever Kepa wasn't in the 18 it was Bulka not Green on the bench.

He was only on the bench 3 times ... the point is that he didn't get a look in on the pitch at any point, despite impressing in pre-season ... just seemed an odd way of handling a promising young player to me ...

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12 hours ago, Argo said:

Foreign clubs (Dortmund aside) tend to take more staggered approach with young players anyway, the desperation to make teenagers starters so soon is more an English thing, that's why people think Pep is "ruining" Foden and couldn't grasp the context when Sarri said CHO needs a few years to make bonafide starter level.

Barcelona are an example, they got praised to high heaven for creating the best team of all time largely with academy products but what doesn't get mentioned is out of all of them that destroyed United in the 11 final only Messi became a regular in his teens and even he had to wait till 18. Xavi, Iniesta, Busquets, Valdes, Puyol, Pique and Pedro didn't fully break through till their 20's infact all bar the first two they were still awaiting their Barcelona debut on their 20th birthdays.

Yeah, that's another good example. Arsenal too: Walcott, Wilshere, Ramsey, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Gibbs, Diaby, Bellerin...the list of athletic Arsenal players who had their careers curtailed or altered due to injury is quite damning. While Messi remains at the top of his game, the likes of Fabregas, Rooney, Obi Mikel are only mid-30s and nowhere near top-flight football, whereas players like Aguero are still performing but have horrendous injury records. 

Closer to home, as much as I have loved seen Ruben Loftus-Cheek break through, you wonder what is happening to him physically that he can't stay fit for a full season at the age of 24.

I think football really needs to revisit it's attitude, because on the one hand while you have clubs who are wholly disinterested in giving youth a chance, others completely mismanage them into injury.

 

 

Edited by SydneyChelsea
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13 hours ago, Argo said:

Foreign clubs (Dortmund aside) tend to take more staggered approach with young players anyway, the desperation to make teenagers starters so soon is more an English thing, that's why people think Pep is "ruining" Foden and couldn't grasp the context when Sarri said CHO needs a few years to make bonafide starter level.

Barcelona are an example, they got praised to high heaven for creating the best team of all time largely with academy products but what doesn't get mentioned is out of all of them that destroyed United in the 11 final only Messi became a regular in his teens and even he had to wait till 18. Xavi, Iniesta, Busquets, Valdes, Puyol, Pique and Pedro didn't fully break through till their 20's infact all bar the first two they were still awaiting their Barcelona debut on their 20th birthdays.

That was also Pep's fault with how much he kept touting him to be the next Silva then never played him. 

When City were over 20 points behind Liverpool, Foden still wasn't playing games, City had nothing to play for at that point the title was well and truly over. So Pep deserves criticism for that, even though granted, Foden was playing a lot more on the restart. 

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https://sport.sky.de/fussball/artikel/fc-bayern-transfer-news-gespraeche-mit-callum-hudson-odoi/12072191/34942

Bayern are interested again. RB Leipzig and Juventus as well.

Could see Hudson Odoi being tempted by the proposition again if its true. Clearly he won't be a starter here this season either and he won't be happy with being on the bench most of the time.

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