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Man Utd vs Chelsea (PL) Sun 28th Apr 16:30 GMT


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7 minutes ago, Dean said:

My interpretation of the second half is that we were set up to contain them and essentially play for a draw, hopefully nick it and we could have (though they could too admittedly). That was the sensible course of action in my view as they had to win while a draw was good enough for us . It was never going to spell lots of chances. Or would you rather we went out guns blazing to risk going for the win, had 5 more shots on target and got caught on the break by a Rashford or Lukaku?

I would like us to create more than 1 chance in 97mins, something which we struggle to do in the majority of games and the football has been pretty bad.

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2 minutes ago, Sexyfootball said:

After the start we had in the first three months of the season, we really ought to be well ahead of a team that has lost 12 of their PL games ...

Sounds like you don't think much of Tottenham then either :)? but they've had their coach for 5 years. You don't think that makes a difference?

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7 minutes ago, Petworth Chelsea Fan said:


Actually watch it in real time and the ball is travelling in front of Piguain. Picture is deceptive.

Granted that it's a bit deceptive, but Higuain still took a shot, he still touched the ball. 

He should've either 

A. Scored

B. looked to his left for a squared ball, as many players do in that position. 

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4 minutes ago, Ernie_blue said:

I would like us to create more than 1 chance in 97mins, something which we struggle to do in the majority of games and the football has been pretty bad.

i understand where you're coming from. I was v disappointed at HT and i posted about it. I just think that today shoring up the "defensive phase" (as Sarri calls it) for the second half (we looked really shaky in the first) was the right course of action, and showed some pragmatism from Sarri (maybe it wasn't Sarri, who knows, but it was welcome nonetheless). 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Dean said:

Sounds like you don't think much of Tottenham then either :)? but they've had their coach for 5 years. You don't think that makes a difference?

Quite a few people make a deal out of the manager needing 5 years or more before we can expect to see results or judge him fairly. Jose, Anceloti and Conte didn't need 5 seasons to create a competitive side. They just seemed to work with what they had and made it work. John Neal and Ian Porterfield didn't need five years either. Just because Klopp has been at Liverpool a few seasons doesn't mean that giving managers five seasons should be the new standard. Just think of all the trophies we've amassed whilst hiring and firing every five minutes. And after 5 years, both Spurs and Liverpool have still won f**k all.

 

edited to say; granted, they're both a lot easier on the eye than we've been this season.

Edited by Snedger

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42 minutes ago, Snedger said:

Quite a few people make a deal out of the manager needing 5 years or more before we can expect to see results or judge him fairly. Jose, Anceloti and Conte didn't need 5 seasons to create a competitive side. They just seemed to work with what they had and made it work. John Neal and Ian Porterfield didn't need five years either. Just because Klopp has been at Liverpool a few seasons doesn't mean that giving managers five seasons should be the new standard. Just think of all the trophies we've amassed whilst hiring and firing every five minutes. And after 5 years, both Spurs and Liverpool have still won f**k all.

 

edited to say; granted, they're both a lot easier on the eye than we've been this season.

I never said anything about a new standard, but i definitely think one season without a preseason is harsh. The relative standing of our club (financial, management quality etc) and strength of our squad vs the competition was notably lower when Sarri came in than when Mourinho and Ancelotti came in, and also lower than when Conte came as Liverpool and Man City were yet to become the two outstanding teams. We amassed trophies not because we hired and fired every five minutes but despite it. We amassed trophies because we had the most money and the most spendthrift owner. It’s very simple. And Klopp WILL win trophies.

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2 hours ago, Ray_Cfc said:

On paper Higuains scoring record was phenomenal with Madrid and Napoli nobody could predict he was gonna be such a miss here.Not Sarri's fault

Yes they could, I and many others on here predicted it. From the moment the rumours started of him joining us in the summer, I was desperate for us not to sign him. Thankfully, he went to AC Milan, but even when he was sh*t with them, we still went out and got him on loan. Do our scouts even check on players before we sign them anymore? One look at him for Milan should have been enough to put us off.

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6 hours ago, Slojo said:

D5QedhBW4AAEriy.jpg

Try not to cry, try not to cry

On one hand one look up easy tap in on the other no number 9, one on one with the keeper,  who got played in at speed would pass that, there would be just one thing in his mind.

He lifted it over nicely the keeper hit it with his elbow or it was in but such a tough angle, having said all that still stings when you see hazard.

If we win our next 2 won’t matter anyway....😬

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On 26/04/2019 at 12:39, wallosh said:
On 24/04/2019 at 10:03, axman2526 said:
No width so we may as well surprise them
 
Kepa
 
Azpi
rudiger/Christensen 
Luiz
emerson 
 
Jorginho 
kante 
RLC 
 
Hazard
 
Giroud 
Higuain 
 
Or a real curveball 
 
Kepa
 
Azpi 
rudiger/Christensen 
Luiz 
emerson 
 
Jorginho 
kante 
RLC 
 
Hazard 
Giroud 
Alonso

It was funny at first when I saw Alonso as a winger there, but on second thought, know we are not favourite for this and being an away game, I think it could work in our favour, the only problem is, it will force Hazard to play on the Right Wing where you can't get the best out of him.

 

On 26/04/2019 at 13:01, robdog said:

your idea could work but put Emerson up higher - Emerson has played role & supported Alonso when he went forward

Think we can agree lads Alonso has the goal scoring quality to play the wide forward role pretty well. His Goal showed that.

Certainly a better option that Willian or Pedro in terms of scoring or making goals.

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16 minutes ago, axman2526 said:

 

Think we can agree lads Alonso has the goal scoring quality to play the wide forward role pretty well. His Goal showed that.

Certainly a better option that Willian or Pedro in terms of scoring or making goals.

Reason he would struggle as a winger is he can’t run at players and has no pace, overlapping is easy when a tricky player has carried the ball forward and taken their fullback allowing room to bomb past them, different story when you’re the guy penetrating the defence he would be awful 

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9 hours ago, Ray_Cfc said:

Ronaldo and Salah scoring record outside of Serie A is much higher so competitiveness is hardly a problem in Italy.

On paper Higuains scoring record was phenomenal with Madrid and Napoli nobody could predict he was gonna be such a miss here.Not Sarri's fault

Jorginho was also wanted by City last summer so obviously Guardiola thought he could of been a decent player in the Premier League too.

I'm not Sarri's biggest fan,but I think he's done ok with what he had to work with,and would be interesting to see what he could do if it all came together next year.

 

 

You can't be serious. Higuain was struggling for Milan when we got him on loan in the middle of the season. That was the biggest reason he was available in the first place. Milan realized their risky move didn't work, he was costing them a fortune so they're happily unloaded him and his massive wages and replaced him with Piatek.

Why Sarri thought an old and slow striker who couldn't hack it in a weaker league would be an answer to our problems up front is a different matter.

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Think we can agree lads Alonso has the goal scoring quality to play the wide forward role pretty well. His Goal showed that.
Certainly a better option that Willian or Pedro in terms of scoring or making goals.
Yeah, but only when we are playing away to the top teams.

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5 hours ago, The Brit said:

Congratulations martin Atkinson for another woeful performance as referee...your consistency at stinking the place out every time you're in charge of a chelsea game is impressive 

I am still shock that nothing was given to Rojo on the Willian challenge & that was immediately after taking out Higuain

M-Rojo-640x300.jpg

:huh2:

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7 hours ago, The Brit said:

Congratulations martin Atkinson for another woeful performance as referee...your consistency at stinking the place out every time you're in charge of a chelsea game is impressive 

Incompetent twat.

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9 hours ago, Dean said:

But he’s adjusted quite well. You accuse Sarri of not changing and yet you persist with the same rants over and over again with zero willingness to incorporate new evidence in your view. It’s like you’ve been programmed. The way you talk you’d think we’re in a relegation battle, not in fourth place and in the Europa semis. It made sense a couple of months ago but things just aren’t as bad now. Sorry. You accuse those of us supporters that think Sarri should be given time of revelling in mediocrity. Well you seem almost disappointed we didn’t get thumped today and aren’t doing worse. It’s as though you’d rather have your negative view on Sarri vindicated than anything else. He’s doing quite well on any objective measures. I’m sorry if that upsets you. And I ask you again - which of Tottenham, City and Liverpool should we be above?

He hasn't adjusted, that's the problem. We still have trouble creating anything going forward or scoring goals. We're still struggling at the back, we were all over the place last night, especially in the first half. His signings are still sh*t. The buildup is still slow, there's no penetration into the 18-yard box, we rarely even have shots on goal. Our set pieces/corners are terrible and ineffective, our defence against set pieces/corners is non-existent. We don't press the opposition well and we have trouble passing our way out of trouble in our own half when being pressed by the opponent. Those issues have been transparent for many months and I haven't noticed any improvements. I can't think of a single player Sarri has made better but I can name quite a few who regressed considerably.

There are two reasons we're still in the top four race: Hazard's factor and contribution over the season and the first couple of months of the season when the opponents were still figuring Sarri out and gave us too much respect. That gave us a bit of a cushion, without it we'd be floating around midtable by now. If we did finish in the top four or win the EL, I'd agree that Sarri has earned the opportunity to stay on his post because it's fair but my opinion of him still won't change. I've seen enough.

We shouldn't be above City and Pool, they're clearly better sides at this moment in time. Spurs are clearly overachieving. Pochettino has done very well, given his limited resources and injuries to some key players he's had to deal with throughout the season. United would have probably claimed the top four spot but they're still paying the price for Mourinho's poor start. If Sarri's fans cite short preseason as a reason for some of our problems, surely Solskjaer who took over with season already underway and inheriting somebody else's team should be given credit for his work under the circumstances. Emery has been disappointing recently, I'd say his stock is about the same value as Sarri's at the moment. If Arsenal manage to get into the CL, I' d say he's done as well as he possibly could, the same for Sarri, because both squads are a work in progress. The difference is, I couldn't give two sh*ts about Arse and their problems, while Sarri hasn't convinced me at all that he's the man to take this club forward, regardless of whether we reach the top four/win the EL or not. While it would be unfair to sack him, if those goals are reached and I realize this is just my opinion, I still stand by it.

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9 hours ago, Scott Harris said:

Yes they could, I and many others on here predicted it. From the moment the rumours started of him joining us in the summer, I was desperate for us not to sign him. Thankfully, he went to AC Milan, but even when he was sh*t with them, we still went out and got him on loan. Do our scouts even check on players before we sign them anymore? One look at him for Milan should have been enough to put us off.

That still doesn't take away from his scoring record.Sarri wanted him because he knew his system previously at Napoli and probably hoped it would work at Chelsea too.

It hasn't he's only on loan so we can still get rid.

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1 hour ago, abramovich said:

He hasn't adjusted, that's the problem. We still have trouble creating anything going forward or scoring goals. We're still struggling at the back, we were all over the place last night, especially in the first half. His signings are still sh*t. The buildup is still slow, there's no penetration into the 18-yard box, we rarely even have shots on goal. Our set pieces/corners are terrible and ineffective, our defence against set pieces/corners is non-existent. We don't press the opposition well and we have trouble passing our way out of trouble in our own half when being pressed by the opponent. Those issues have been transparent for many months and I haven't noticed any improvements. I can't think of a single player Sarri has made better but I can name quite a few who regressed considerably.

There are two reasons we're still in the top four race: Hazard's factor and contribution over the season and the first couple of months of the season when the opponents were still figuring Sarri out and gave us too much respect. That gave us a bit of a cushion, without it we'd be floating around midtable by now. If we did finish in the top four or win the EL, I'd agree that Sarri has earned the opportunity to stay on his post because it's fair but my opinion of him still won't change. I've seen enough.

We shouldn't be above City and Pool, they're clearly better sides at this moment in time. Spurs are clearly overachieving. Pochettino has done very well, given his limited resources and injuries to some key players he's had to deal with throughout the season. United would have probably claimed the top four spot but they're still paying the price for Mourinho's poor start. If Sarri's fans cite short preseason as a reason for some of our problems, surely Solskjaer who took over with season already underway and inheriting somebody else's team should be given credit for his work under the circumstances. Emery has been disappointing recently, I'd say his stock is about the same value as Sarri's at the moment. If Arsenal manage to get into the CL, I' d say he's done as well as he possibly could, the same for Sarri, because both squads are a work in progress. The difference is, I couldn't give two sh*ts about Arse and their problems, while Sarri hasn't convinced me at all that he's the man to take this club forward, regardless of whether we reach the top four/win the EL or not. While it would be unfair to sack him, if those goals are reached and I realize this is just my opinion, I still stand by it.

Ok fair response. Just think it does take time to adjust to a new league, build a team etc and maybe you underestimate the difficulty of that task / expect too much?

I think there has been incremental improvement in: team selection (you have to admit he did make changes here, giving RLC and CHO regular places in the first team of late); team spirit (we have now come back from going a goal down in our last two games to get a result - ok, wins would have been better but did you think we’d even get a result after going a goal behind yesterday?); game management (I still think our 2nd half performance yesterday was commendably mature and composed).

ok it’s not super convincing and it’s all off a very low base - the nadir for me was zappacosta for azpi vs Man U at which point I threw in the towel and briefly joined your camp. But still you can’t argue that things don’t look better now than then. 

I agree signings haven’t been good, and I’m no fan of Jorginho, but there have only been 2 and one was partly because there really wasn’t anyone available and Sarri at least knew he could work with him having done so before (Higuain).

As for players not having improved it’s hard to tell as things haven’t really clicked  yet for the team. again id give it a bit more time. Also we can’t really have a full picture without seeing what goes on in training. But I wouldn’t say any player has necessarily regressed coz of Sarri. The ones that have (Pedro? Willian? Azpi?) it may be down to their being past their peaks rather than Sarri.

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I thought we done ok yesterday and would have taken a draw at kick off. Though at the end the game was definitely there to be won when we was pressing during the added on time, but it seemed the players were content for the draw.

I am not a Sarri fan and have been vocal in my criticism of him. But for me he didn't get much wrong yesterday. I was pleased with the reaction to going a goal behind and how defensively solid we were in the second half and like i said we probably could have nicked it at the end.

Also, i thought yesterday was Jorginho's best performance from a defensive point of view.

One thing i thought we was missing yesterday was a quick striker to bring on. There were periods where we were being penned in and thought we could have done with a Batshuayi (or someone similar) as a quick out when we are under the cosh. Higuain just doesn't have the pace to carry out a counter attack. 

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10 hours ago, The Brit said:

Congratulations martin Atkinson for another woeful performance as referee...your consistency at stinking the place out every time you're in charge of a chelsea game is impressive 

He is a disgrace, did we even get a free kick for Matic`s forearm to the face, and how Rojo didnt walk is beyond me, especially when you see some reds given out for nothing.

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34 minutes ago, drjonesy1994 said:

I am not a Sarri fan and have been vocal in my criticism of him. But for me he didn't get much wrong yesterday.

Sarris best sub of the season was bringing Pedro on and minutes later he was on the goal line to clear what otherwise would surely of been a goal and loss, that one point could make all the difference.

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9 minutes ago, coco said:

Sarris best sub of the season was bringing Pedro on and minutes later he was on the goal line to clear what otherwise would surely of been a goal and loss, that one point could make all the difference.

😄

You giving credit to Sarri for a sub he literally HAD to make as Willian could barely walk at that stage?!!!

 

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Higuain can shoot and is good around the box but he is the worst defensive striker I can recall. His work rate is abysmal. He couldn’t press a door closed. 

Since the start of the season we need a luiz replacement a goal scoring midfielder and a striker either big or fast but one of the best in the league one way or another. 

Next season we will need them even more. 

4 points might be enough but we have to play two good sides to get those points. Far from a done deal. 

Id have taken a point yesterday. That point was valuable in this race. Arsenal though could easily improve their goal difference with Brighton game. 

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I thought we deserved the point, disappointing not to win it during Fergi time. The De Gea thing obviously helped, but considering over the years he made an mess of our attackers, it's about time he give something back. Alonso did well, he was the only one tracking the shot and followed it up, that's rare for a left back. We conceded under pressure, but fortunately hold out long enough to tire them out, 2:0 would have been all gone. United ran out of steam after the good 40 minutes, and that's why it's disappointing we couldn't captitalize it in the later stage of the game. If Higuain wanted another year with us, he had to put that last minute chance away. that's what good finishers do, he'd put it in with eyes closed few years ago. Watford game will decide the top 4, if we win it and take the lead to the final day, really believe we are going to beat Leicester ( even they were great yesterday against 10 men). I reckon Brighton will get something against Arsenal this week, so we will eliminate them if we beat Watford.

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