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Super Frank Lampard *Officially our Manager*


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5 hours ago, Davey Baby said:

It's an interesting question that @Brutos poses and I haven't seen anyone attempt to answer it yet. Why are we conceding so much more than last season? We have the same players, apart from Luiz, who was much maligned and wasn't wanted by Lampard. People talk about the loss of Hazard in terms of our attack being blunted but defending is the far bigger issue and Hazard was never asked to do much defending and possession hasn't been the problem this season, as we've seen much more of the ball in all our games than our opponents. Why are we conceding so many? What's changed? Was Luiz a lot better than some thought? He hasn't exactly done well at Arsenal. Is it the manager?

Last season we had Luiz and Rudiger, and Christensen in reserve, and Cahill was never used. Basically it was Luiz and Rudiger the entire season, apart from right at the end, when Rudiger got injured. This season we've added Tomori and Zouma. This season, as last season, we're playing Jorginho in front of our defence. It doesn't really seem to be about personnel. 

Maybe we're playing a more open, less structured style, but when you need points and you're shipping goals for fun, you need to tighten up, especially when injuries have ensured your attack has been blunted, but Frank seems incapable of tightening us up, much as we saw at Derby last season. Derby were also very bad at set-pieces. There is obviously a pattern emerging, albeit a very short one, given Frank's inexperience in the role.

Under Sarri we had Barkley and Kovacic sitting in midfield and not venturing any further forward and always close to the defenders so if an attacker got past the midfield they would run straight into the defenders. This was boring to watch and so we have gone more open meaning when we lose the ball often it is only Jorginho sitting in front of the CBs and he can be easily by-passed.

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4 hours ago, bisright1 said:

People may never want to admit it, but we lost a world class player but significantly also a world class coach in the summer. 

Our team has progressively got worse as they have unlearnt the lessons Sarri drilled into them. The players "hated" his training sessions, but they worked. This stage last year we had 11 more points, conceded 10 less and scored 2 less (so we are still able to score goals without Hazard).  

Lampard isn't a world class manager. Maybe he can become one. But it's going to take time. Until then, we just have to be patient because lampard isn't sarri or Conte. 

 

If your stats are correct, that is surprising, the fact we've scored more than at this stage last season. It really highlights the fact that our major issue is defending. We've conceded 10 more according to your stats, but it's worth remembering that at this stage last season, we had just come off the back of two big thumpings, at Bournemouth and City, in which we conceded a combined total of 10 goals, at a point in the season where we were struggling and just before we went on a decent run.

 

We're not really getting beat 5 and 6 this season, we're conceding 1s and 2s, every game, so we're consistently putting in poor defensive displays. Saturday was a case in point. 2 goals should be enough to beat Bournemouth, a team that are really struggling, but we're just so bloody easy to score against.

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5 hours ago, Davey Baby said:

It's an interesting question that @Brutos poses and I haven't seen anyone attempt to answer it yet. Why are we conceding so much more than last season?

Gary Cahill got MOTM for Palace this weekend. Maybe we’re missing more than just David Luiz?

I didn’t read the rest of your post mind, I’ve spent 12 hours at work I haven’t got the energy to read a f**king novel :laugh2:

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1 minute ago, Munkworth said:

Gary Cahill got MOTM for Palace this weekend. Maybe we’re missing more than just David Luiz?

I didn’t read the rest of your post mind, I’ve spent 12 hours at work I haven’t got the energy to read a f**king novel :laugh2:

 

We're definitely missing Cahill at set pieces, but bear in mind he didn't play at all last season, so his departure doesn't account for the fact we're conceding more goals.

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8 minutes ago, Davey Baby said:

 

If your stats are correct, that is surprising, the fact we've scored more than at this stage last season. It really highlights the fact that our major issue is defending. We've conceded 10 more according to your stats, but it's worth remembering that at this stage last season, we had just come off the back of two big thumpings, at Bournemouth and City, in which we conceded a combined total of 10 goals, at a point in the season where we were struggling and just before we went on a decent run.

 

We're not really getting beat 5 and 6 this season, we're conceding 1s and 2s, every game, so we're consistently putting in poor defensive displays. Saturday was a case in point. 2 goals should be enough to beat Bournemouth, a team that are really struggling, but we're just so bloody easy to score against.

Bournemouth and city were outliers in the season. Generally we kept clean sheets because teams weren't able to get into the game against us. 

Sarri put up huge points against the bottom half of the table. The team was drilled to dominate games. 

The fact we have conceded ten more this year when the two outlier games of bounremouth and city had already happened at this stage, highlights how awful we've been this year.

Frank is hugely lucky all the other teams have been sh*t this year, last season we would have been 7th and miles off 4th. 

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Just now, Davey Baby said:

We're definitely missing Cahill at set pieces, but bear in mind he didn't play at all last season, so his departure doesn't account for the fact we're conceding more goals.

Best captain we’ve had since JT... :blush2:

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2 hours ago, bisright1 said:

Frank is hugely lucky all the other teams have been sh*t this year,

Those other teams are lucky Frank has had a major injury crisis, transfer ban, and ridiculous VAR decisions going against him. Has a rookie EPL manager had to deal with so much bad luck in his first season ?

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Football has changed especially in the Prem. Majority of the teams try to play with the ball. If we wanted to play compact defence we would probably finish 2-4th every season with the right personnel.

Frank doesn't want that and maybe the club doesn't want that. Conte and Jose were those 1-0 managers but Frank's wants to be the 4-1 manager it seems. He wants us to create as much chances as possible because it is entertaining and by simple maths should convert into goals.

Everyone knows if you don't do that in a controlled way you are exposed to counter attacking. Pep's teams have done this for ages. His first season without City they were as we are now but with great squad.

We need more quality and time. Finishing 4th this season is not that important I feel. Creating identity with the style of play is more important.

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It's actually embarrassing how many of our "fans" on social media seem to think we should or would (without Frank) be challenging for the title. Not wanting to point fingers, but it's generally the foreign fans who are more rabid. I go to their twitter profiles and they are either from Africa or Asia.

People need to realise we have a big rebuild, it's going to take at minimum 2 seasons before we challenge again. It will be pretty incredible if we challenge for big trophies before then. 

Edited by enigma
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Yeah it’s far too early to be blaming Lampard for anything. Our defending has been shocking though, it’s not like we have Ben Haim and Mustafi at the back, we could do so much better.

For me that’s the biggest question mark over Lamps, will he ever be able to sort the defence out?

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16 hours ago, ducavis said:

We all know we need new signings and we will make a few, I am just curious as to how many players would he require to make things work. You can either go the City of pissing £270m on defenders and £50m on goalkeepers with only Laporte & Ederson the standouts, or go the Liverpool route of spending £62m on Allison, £82m on Van Dijk, £9m on Robertson and making use of your youth prospects. We will never know what he wanted, all we will see is what the club signs.

As things stand he probably needs 2GKs, 1-2CBs, 1-2LBs, 1ST, Probably another winger and probably a midfielder. We are talking 4-9 new signings, I just think whatever happens in the summer a selection of fans will blame the board for not backing him enough. 

It's true, although Ziyech did say that he was talking to Lampard on the phone a few times prior to agreeing with the move so maybe Lampard is actually really involved and will be backed properly in the summer.

I think we as fans have all the right to expect 4 new players in the summer, 2 of which could be big signings. The board has no excuse, we are in many ways lucky to be at this point where we can still play CL next season, it just happened that Tammy and James are good players, without them this season would have been really terrible.

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20 hours ago, Ballack & Blu said:

I'd say Frank should Beg beg beg JT to come home next season, we need a defenders input to sort it out, Lamps would of seen thousands of training sessions, but never as a defender.

JT is overseeing the worst defensive record in the league at Villa.

It's one thing organising a defense on the pitch (which was just as much if not more to do with the players he had around him than JT himself) it's another doing it as a coach.

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12 hours ago, coco said:

Those other teams are lucky Frank has had a major injury crisis, transfer ban, and ridiculous VAR decisions going against him. Has a rookie EPL manager had to deal with so much bad luck in his first season ?

No, you know that`s not how it works. When other teams miss we are lucky, when we miss other teams arent lucky it just that were rubbish. Them`s the rules i`m afraid.

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12 hours ago, coco said:

Those other teams are lucky Frank has had a major injury crisis, transfer ban, and ridiculous VAR decisions going against him. Has a rookie EPL manager had to deal with so much bad luck in his first season ?

I don't disagree with this. Frank has been unlucky. But so are all managers. OGS is missing Pogba and Rashford, that's as big an injury crisis as we've had. Tottenham have had a self imposed transfer ban. Arsenal are running out of money. 

A lot of the bad luck has been self imposed. Some of our injuries are overplaying his favourites and he doesn't know how to use Kante anyway. 

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3 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

I don't disagree with this. Frank has been unlucky. But so are all managers. OGS is missing Pogba and Rashford, that's as big an injury crisis as we've had. Tottenham have had a self imposed transfer ban. Arsenal are running out of money. 

A lot of the bad luck has been self imposed. Some of our injuries are overplaying his favourites and he doesn't know how to use Kante anyway. 

Brush the transfer ban under the carpet all you like.

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1 minute ago, coco said:

Brush the transfer ban under the carpet all you like.

Transfer ban? 

We signed Pulisic and Kovacic, brought in Tammy Abraham, Mount and Tomori

We then went into the winter and didn't sign anyone. 

Hardly the end of days. 

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While I am seeing some worrying signs with Frank that he must nip in the bud to ultimately make it here there is also encouraging signs that there is a top coach in there somewhere, atleast for me anyway.

Just past week we totally outplayed Tottenham and some of our movement and combination play was top class. We have had a lot of games like that this season and even in a lot of the poor games we do get the odd 20-30 minute snippet where the potential of the system is there for all to see, for example the first half hour at home to Arsenal.

However there is some fundamental flaws that he MUST iron out to ultimately make it as a manager here. I keep changing my mind on whether the defensive issues are more structural or personnel (if it's the former then he has to look at bringing in a defensive coach, not JT a proper specialist one), until he has more suitable players then I will allow him the benefit of the doubt. Also his squad management needs improving on, he rotates well with the first 14-15 players but then his inexperience shows, how many times now has a player not played for weeks sometimes months and been randomemly chucked into a game? Tomori then most recent example on Saturday.

It's also worth noting that when we last won the title we had FOUR world class players, two have since left and two have declined from their very best level and if that's not a tough enough blow we have been trying to change our entire brand of football and promote several academy players (with probably Ampadu and Gallagher at the minimum still to come in the foreseeable future). This isn't a quick fix to the top like 2004, this was always going to take a great deal of time (even more so now given how good City and Liverpool are). The reality is we could have Fergie and prime Jose working together in perfect harmony and we still wouldn't sniff the title at this moment.

However I don't disagree that after a transfer window then Frank has to deliever, not the title because that's not happening (we will still be that little bit too raw to challenge the top 2) but a more consistent stream of results and performances. If we're still struggling with defending and set pieces with a defender and a keeper of Frank's choice then yes he's going to be under some serious pressure and rightly so. However this season I said from the start I will be happy to have him for a second season aslong as we're in top 7 and show some encouragement along the way so I stick to that.

Edited by Argo
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5 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

Transfer ban? 

We signed Pulisic and Kovacic, brought in Tammy Abraham, Mount and Tomori

We then went into the winter and didn't sign anyone. 

Hardly the end of days. 

No its not an end of days, were in 4th place with 3 points to spare, despite injuries, despite a real transfer ban, despite VAR.

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12 minutes ago, coco said:

No its not an end of days, were in 4th place with 3 points to spare, despite injuries, despite a real transfer ban, despite VAR.

Exactly and I feel Frank is positively tweaking things to try and reach as far as we can go. For example he gave Bats time to take his chances he didn't and then brought in Giroud and changed the attack formation while Tammy is struggling with fitness.

With Giroud included in the league, 1 win and 1 draw in the current sequence.

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Think we need to be careful on here, got a feeling the Sarri cult is rearing it's ugly head again with some of his followers on here. They seem oblivious to the fact of our injuries, losing the best player in the league and a transfer ban last summer, we are still fourth for f**k sake and only 5 points behind 3rd.  

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