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Sack or Back ???  

114 members have voted

  1. 1. Sack or Back Frank ?

    • Sack now.
      34
    • Back until the end of the season, unless relegation dooms, then evaluate.
      80


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36 minutes ago, M.M.B said:

Yeah, and he still needs to self isolate for 10 days. So he's not doing anything until the 4th of feb at the earliest. 

If that self-isolation rule is confirmed we will know more by Wednesday. Some suggestions that the club took action after the Fulham game in which case Tuchel could be on the sidelines for Wolves.

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1 hour ago, Imran_CFC said:

Our set piece issue has as much to do with Kepa's inability to command his box as it does with Lampard's tactics, with Kepa in goal teams were able to play the ball closer to our 6 yard box increasing the possibility of any deviation resulting in a goal whereas with Mendy they need to be more accurate as he collects anything in & around the 6 yard box.

Werner was used as a winger because we only have 3 natural wingers in the squad (Ziyech, Pulisic and CHO), with Ziyech out injured followed by Pulisic soon after he had no choice but to play Werner on the wing. He had to play Kai Havertz and look to integrate him into the first 11 considering he is our record signing, he played him in a few positions in order to establish where he can be best utilised, had he not given Kai time even that would've been used against Lampard for not giving our record signing time to integrate.

Believe it or not but we do not have any natural CDM's in our squad hence he was pushing for the signing of Rice, he tried playing Kante in the CDM role because one of our biggest weaknesses from last season was our inability to defend on the transition, Kante has predominantly played as a CDM this season with the exception of a handful of games. People question our slow buildup but fail to realize we are having to integrate 6 new first team signings into the first 11 without a pre-season so there will be some issues in buildup play etc. Our best attacking players play wide and Frank was trying to buildup play in the wide areas via Pulisic, CHO, Ziyech Reece etc. because we didnt have any creativity centrally.

Tammy's performance levels have been good at the start of last season and this season therefore dropping him from the outset did not make sense especially considering he is more likely to be our long term number 9 in comparison to Giroud. However every time Giroud has impressed in the cup competition Frank has rewarded him with starts in the league not sure how you can criticize him for that, it wasnt the threat of Giroud leaving that got Giroud minutes but his performance levels.

I agree with your counter points and understand why Lamps had to try certain things, perhaps I phrased wrongly that he didn't change things, rather he persisted too long with certain choices when it was clear that it was costing us in performance.

I would say that he was baited into being confident in his tactics though, largely through that unbeaten run that made it seem like he has a working formula, and Timo on the wing despite being bad in general performance, he was still able to break through and get in scoring positions. From there it was stick or twist and hoping for Timo to start scoring but it just didn't happen.

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1 hour ago, Saaladin said:

Well I haven't had a chance to read much on the board for a while but just thought I would give my 2 cents:

 

First, I hate seeing Lampard go - probably my favorite player ever. Was thrilled to see him hired as Manager of Chelsea and as most of you was hopeful his success as a player and club legend would transfer to his managerial career. I don't think I ever considered his time at Derby as evidence of his possible success as it was only one year and I also never watched Derby to know anything about his tactics or philosophy. So basically, my whole opinion was based on faith.

Watching Chelsea this season Lampard had two major flaws. First, his insistence on trusting youth a bit too much, he put his Chelsea career on the line to develop players. Tammy Abraham and Reece James are the main culprits as they at times had no business being on the field. Tammy most of all had no business being in the starting 11 for Chelsea in any match outside of a domestic cup.

He may score a goal here or there but he is not a player to be depended on in tough premier league matches or european matches. That is what Giroud and Werner are are there for. Frank really got this wrong -I mean really, starting Tammy Abraham against Leicester? It's almost naïve. 

As for Reece, fantastic talent but has a long way to go to develop as a RB. His positional awareness is lacking and can be lazy tracking back. Azpi can still do a job and should be depended on in big matches.

Frank's second flaw and main reason for his demise was his lack of identity and ability to stick to a starting 11. Are we playing with a lone 6 and 2 number 8's? Or is it a six, eight, ten? Two holding mids and an attacking mid? Frank never decided on that and to make it worse he mixes and matches EVERY game. You cannot do that and expect results.  To compound the problem he tinkers with his striker and wingers constantly. So now you have a midfield with no visible identity, no consistency in selection passing to a forward line that is different each time. Tammy doesn't play like Werner does, and Giroud doesn't play like either. So which identity to we play with? Playing through lines to Werner? Or to feet to Tammy? Or wide to Chilwell and James so they can play 26 crosses in while Giroud is on the bench (Arsenal). 

Lampard may become a fantastic manager but it was never going to be at Chelsea. He needed to learn this lesson as a manager and he will need to identify his style of play. The only manager I don' really see a style of play for that is succeeding is Solsjkaer and even he, at least, is known to play defensive and on the counter. He also has established players all throughout the team that have multiple years of premier league experience to draw from. De Gea, Macguire, Wan Bissaka, Pogba, Fernandes (only 1 year but hes 26) Martial, Rashford etc. 

So, as much as I am saddened that Lampard is gone - it was necessary and inevitable. 

On a final note, he completely misused his new signings Werner and Havertz. Werner is not a winger to be used as such game after game. He's a central striker and he showed his speed and quality doing so earlier in the season. Once Pulisic got injured he moved Werner wide to accommodate Tammy which should have never happened.

Havertz is not a winger yet Lampard started him there on multiple occasions. He is a #10 or attacking midfielder and again he showed his quality early on with his runs from midfield carrying the team into the final third. Yet he gets relegated to the bench. I'm not saying he was brilliant, but if you give him a simple role behind the striker and protect him with your 2 other mids he would have been fine and could have been on track by now. Mason Mount could play a little deeper and Kante sits in front of the back four. 

Anyway, its unfortunate. Hopefully Tuechel brings an identity and doesn't tinker with the setup for the next few weeks. Choose a starting 11 and stick with it until they form a consistency as a group. 

 

I could not have put it any better, loved Lampard as player but he lacked experience as a manager. Chelsea can only get better from here as we have world class squad.

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23 minutes ago, DarkMata said:

If this is true then the board and Roman would 100% know about this, and for me there is no way the owner would except this from any players.  This whole narrative seems to be making out some players went to the board moaning cause they weren't playing and the board believed everything they said and sacked Frank.  This isn't the first time this story has been written when one of our managers is sacked, I'm starting to think its just a made up narrative that the media like to make Chelsea into some sort of player power driven club with a clueless owner.  

Maybe there was some players that weren't happy and disrupted the camp, but the idea that they could rat off to the owner and he couldn't see what the journos have just come up with is beyond idiotic.  I mean if Rüdiger did clash with Azpi for those reasons Roman and the board would know 100% what happened, and what they'd take Rudigers side?  It was kind of believable that players like Lampard, Drogba, and Cech had the power to remove a manager, but Rüdiger! It wouldn't make a difference if he never played for us again.  We know Roman is ruthless and maybe he made Lampard responsible for this problem, but surely the players to blame would also be sold off to the Siberia league and definitely not be playing for us next week.  I'm not sure I believe it, most of it sounds like its been written this morning in a rush, I mean have the media have only just decided to release this information now rather than when it happened.

Same thing happened after Jose second spell ended remember fans had signs at the bridge calling Cesc and Costa a snake these stories always come out when a manager gets sacked. 

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Just now, Brutos said:

Same thing happened after Jose second spell ended remember fans had signs at the bridge calling Cesc and Costa a snake these stories always come out when a manager gets sacked. 

Only at Chelsea it seems

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Mendy on Instagram

"You called me to Chelsea to be part of your team. As a Chelsea fan, I had a special feeling being managed by you.
I want to thank you and your team for the trust you showed me and all the things you taught me.

Thank You 🔵🙏🏼"

 

EsmYUWKXIAA68i8?format=jpg&name=large

Edited by abramovich
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Tuchel does have good experience

Tuchel has a good win record even if not many trophies he has 10 years experience as a coach and earned his jobs by being noticed as a coach at Mainz 

Tuchel will be able to work with Werner, havertz, Pulisic and Rudigier and Silva and if he speaks English ok that’s french, German and English. 
Tuchel has style and man magement background. 
obviously Mount, Gilmour Reece James will feel a bit more insecure. 
The team still won’t have enough solid defensive midfielders. 
And statistically Lampard had worse points per game if any abramovitch era manager and just about worst win %. 
‘in the end he just got the role too early. Should have done a minimum 3 seasons at derby, got them promoted, then let’s talk. 

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57 minutes ago, cfcforeverfan said:

i just want a city board, hiring football people like Txiki Begiristain, and then work closed with the manager, not buying random ass player out of thier mind and force the manager to play them

Will never happen. There’s a reason Pep told us to f**k off and it’s exactly this reason. You have a slump and you’re out the door. People don’t like to hear it and will harp on about Roman being the best owner in football and while I’m grateful for all he’s given us. City are an example of a much better run club. They knew what they wanted and put the structure in place in all departments from the owner down that suited the style and outcome they wanted in order to get the benefit on the park. As good a negotiator as Marina is, she’s got no previous football pedigree as far as I’m aware. Not replacing Emenalo was a mistake in my opinion.

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7 hours ago, The Swan said:

Speechless to be honest.

This season needed to be completed with Frank in charge.

Such a short-term outlook by the board.

Remember when West Ham used to sing ‘you’re not Chelsea anymore’

Well times have moved on and this was very Chelsea. Gutted.

Gutting but totally unsurprising given our owner. As everyone is quick to remind us, we should always be grateful for his wallet. Until the end of eternity. Without him we would be Brentford or Leyton Orient, apparently. 

And those yearning for a long term vision for the club, for a sense of footballing identity. Please, please stop with the yearning. This IS Roman's long term vision, this is his sense of club identity. We can't complain. We pick up trophies every few years. That's what it's all about. Tottenham, West Ham and Arsenal fans would all swap places with us in a heartbeat, apparently. Hire, fire, bring in the next big name, European flavour of the moment, contender please. If it is a "name" who doesn't stand on the side lines in a track suit with a face like a slapped arse, is all we should hope for really. To expect our owner to give time to a young, not "big name" manager who has never managed in Italy/Germany/Spain or utilised a "regista" is completely unrealistic. Even if that young manager was one of our greatest ever players, loves the club, understands the club, understands the fans, understands the history, understands the rivalries, understands the passions involved, understands the importance of being one of our own. Because Roman never has, and never will, feel all those things, like we do and Frank does.

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1 hour ago, cfcforeverfan said:

just wonder when will the board and Roman ever f**king learn to let the manager to decide who he wants to buy instead of throwing players in who arent in the manager's list?

 

what is the point of asking someone to coach when you giving him players that he doesnt want?

So you're on the board when Scolari knocks on your door and says he wants Drogba out and Adriano in, you're honestly telling me you would grant that wish?

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