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A Topic About Refs, VAR and PGMOL.


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I am about as sick of them all as I can be at this point. 

Liverpool kicked up a massive stink about VAR after the Everton game, and now the PGMOL (w**kers) are going to review things. We should be doing the same. We shouldn't have to do it, but surely enough is enough.

How many times have we been on the end of a really poor decision against United now? It seems to be happening almost every time we play them. It was bad enough when VAR wasn't around, refs could just say "I didn't see it" and we just had to take their word for it, but now that we have VAR, it should change everything. With VAR, there is no excuse, they can't hide, they are seeing what we are seeing, but somehow, the bad decisions are worse than ever and things just continue like nothing happened a few days later. 

Coaches and players aren't even allowed to call out refs when they make bad errors. If they do, it's a fine and suspension......why? What is wrong with calling out bad decisions? Also, why can't refs come out and speak? Why are they being protected so much? do they have something to hide?

As for the PGMOL, they are a laughing stock. How can they possibly come to the conclusion that Maguire's wrestling isn't a clear and obvious error from their ref today? It's written in the f**king rule book that you can't do that. I'll put my conspiracy head on for a minute and say that if that was the other way around, they would have the opposite opinion. Seriously though, after they have said that, how can we not think of them as anything but incompetent? They aren't fit to be in charge of the rules of the game. The only people that don't think that is a penalty is the PGMOL......doesn't anybody think that is just a little bit messed up?

Every weekend I see football pundits and fans say the same things but nothing changes. It's a day or two of moaning, but then it's forgotten about until the next round of fixtures and it happens all over again. Something has to change, it's demoralising watching this happening again and again.

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It is Barca so I've no sympathy.....

The turning point was a lengthy VAR decision for the Ramos penalty. Referee Juan Martínez Munuera did not spot Clement Lenglet's pull on Ramos' shirt but eventually gave a penalty after viewing it on the screen.

Barca had two penalty appeals turned down - for a Raphael Varane challenge on Lionel Messi and a possible Varane handball.

"I don't understand VAR, I think it is only used to make decisions against Barca," said Koeman, whose side have only picked up seven points from five games.

"You always get shirt tugs like that in the area and I think Ramos makes a foul on Lenglet first. There's a tug of the shirt, but not enough to make him fall behind as he did. For me it's not a penalty.

"We have had five matches and [VAR] has only been used to go against Barca. It's never gone our way.

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There is clear United-bias from VAR. There is a reason they get away with the the stuff they do and the amount of penalties they get.

Just against us Maguire have gotten away with kicking Batshuayi in the nuts and chokeslamming Azpilicueta. Both with VAR and both nothing given. 

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4 minutes ago, Sindre said:

There is clear United-bias from VAR. There is a reason they get away with the the stuff they do and the amount of penalties they get.

Just against us Maguire have gotten away with kicking Batshuayi in the nuts and chokeslamming Azpilicueta. Both with VAR and both nothing given. 

In that same match last season, we had a goal disallowed after Azpilicueta was pushed by United player into another United player..........I have no idea how they came to the conclusion that Azpilicueta was the one in the wrong.

Azpilicueta is probably the unluckiest person when it comes to VAR, he has had so many decisions go against him. I don't think a single one of those decisions were correct. I'm amazed he has let it slide so much, I would have lost my sh*t by now.

Edited by Scott Harris
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Redcafe: on the Maguire incident.

Couldnt have complained too much if he had gotten a penalty called against him though. If an opponent hugged one of our players like that during a corner, we would have been screaming for a penalty and calling the ref and var crap.

He was very lucky to not concede a penalty, and may be even a red card.

He had him in a headlock... it was a blatant pen tbf.

So lucky.

Meh was a penalty, 

lucky not to penalised for that clear penalty

should have lost to that penalty in which case he would get crucified.

The penalty incident was very poor and was lucky to escape unpunished in it. 

Very lucky not to give away a penalty.

 

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I thought VAR was pretty good when it was used in the World Cup finals. To be honest I think now they've just tried to be too clever. Offside - the absolutist millimetre measurement has created a farce - football is a game of movement; question should be did the attacker clearly gain an advantage from being offside, not was his elbow a centimetre closer to goal than the defender

Also think they've made a real mess of handball. 

But regardless of that,  today's incident with Azpi should be what VAR is for - foul play, not picked up by the match officials 

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2 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

In that same match last season, we had a goal disallowed after Azpilicueta was pushed by United player into another United player..........I have no idea how they came to the conclusion that Azpilicueta was the one in the wrong.

Azpilicueta is probably the unluckiest person when it comes to VAR, he has had so many decisions go against him. I don't think a single one of those decisions were correct. I'm amazed he has let it slide so much, I would have lost my sh*t by now.

Forgot all about that.

 

Add it too the list. Can you even believe it? 

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2 minutes ago, coco said:

Redcafe: on the Maguire incident.

Couldnt have complained too much if he had gotten a penalty called against him though. If an opponent hugged one of our players like that during a corner, we would have been screaming for a penalty and calling the ref and var crap.

He was very lucky to not concede a penalty, and may be even a red card.

He had him in a headlock... it was a blatant pen tbf.

So lucky.

Meh was a penalty, 

lucky not to penalised for that clear penalty

should have lost to that penalty in which case he would get crucified.

The penalty incident was very poor and was lucky to escape unpunished in it. 

Very lucky not to give away a penalty.

 

Even they know, and half of the time they struggle to notice how many favours go their way in this league. The PGMOL though, nah, no penalty 😐

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I disagree about the luck part. There is no luck there involved, it's a clear intent to just brush it off.

Same with Bruno slapping Jorginho, had Jorginho done that Bruno would have gone down and then the ref would have made a surprised face and VAR would have said that's a red for Jorginho...

They spent 5 minutes talking about how Rashford should have been given a penalty, nothing for Azpilicueta just moments before. Then during half time they commented about that incident but the intent was clear, at the very moment when something has happened they don't want to deal with it.

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I've watched it again on different sites and it makes me very angry, every pundit reporter and rival fans can see it is a blatant penalty. What the f**k can be done. Before var the ref would have beed slaughtered and he would maybe apologise or say he didn't see it. But how the f**k can that be ignored by the 'experts' who watched it in slow mo. and from multiple angles.

This basically f**king stinks.

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Yes, it does stink of blatant bias. The technology is fine, but the people in charge of it are beyond incompetent. For var to ignore the choke slam and then review the slightest of contact a few seconds later just beggars belief.

We saw this last season at the Bridge, when we had to put up with Anthony Taylor's bias and ineptitude on the pitch, and then on top we had utterly scandalous decision-making by Var.

We suffered it again in the farce against Spuds but at least bad reffing and biased var didn't cost us points that night.

And another thing that winds me up about Var? You know those tables that show who's benefited most and suffered most from Var? They only show part of the story. Today's non-intervention for the Maguire foul won't show up in any of them. In reality Manure benefit more than the figures suggest, and we get shafted more, because incidents like today's do not register in the recorded stats.

 

Edited by Backbiter
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I read a comment in the match thread that VAR is not the issue, but the implementation/application of it by referees.  It amazes me that such inept application does not happen in other countries.  Frankly, even before VAR, referees from leagues around Europe seemed so far ahead.

We do seem to be on the receiving end a little too often.  But you don't have to look far to see the mistakes - Liverpool last week was frankly a joke (a red card for Pickford or Mane's goal).  Happens every week.

My biggest issue with it is referees are not accountable.  They make a decision and never have to speak about it.  If a player or manager wants to talk to them they wave it away like a child on a playground.  And if a manager offers an opinion after the game they are often fined - its such a joke.  The referees should be put in front of the camera after the match also and asked why.

I wish it was more like the NFL.  They have review a lot of plays (separate issue); but consistently come to a quick and right decision.  The best part is they then have to announce the decision - I love the transparency of that.  PL referees are nothing short of an embarrassment.  

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Corruption is the only possible explanation ... simply not feasible for an official to display such a ridiculous level of incompetence.

Serious questions also about how the match officials on the pitch can possibly get that one wrong in the first place. So blatant that a VAR check shouldn't even have been necessary.

Edited by Sexyfootball
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There’s not a person who watches football, fan or pundit, who has said Maguire didn’t blatantly foul Azpilicueta. 

As above, United fans were amazed they didn’t concede the penalty. 
 

Yet the referee and the VAR still didn’t believe it required a second look. It’s cheating. There is absolutely nothing else to call it. It’s blatant cheating and once again, to favour Man Utd. Other clubs will complain too and we have all have one or two in our favour but Man Utd stand alone where it generally goes their way regardless of opposition and has become a laughing stock. 
 

Then to rub salt in the wounds, they review an innocuous coming together in our box 30 seconds later. I was half expecting it to be given, again because of the opposition as opposed to the incident. It shouldn’t be that way. 

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12 hours ago, carrickblue said:

I thought VAR was pretty good when it was used in the World Cup finals. To be honest I think now they've just tried to be too clever. Offside - the absolutist millimetre measurement has created a farce - football is a game of movement; question should be did the attacker clearly gain an advantage from being offside, not was his elbow a centimetre closer to goal than the defender

Also think they've made a real mess of handball. 

But regardless of that,  today's incident with Azpi should be what VAR is for - foul play, not picked up by the match officials 

Football has become the slave of the statisticians, technology, high def resolution tv etc than can document everything and anything down to the nth degree and from several angles.

I’ve absolutely no doubt that the musha’s who reviewed the Maguire penalty incident it at Stockley park will have every justification as to why it wasn’t a penalty because page 77, clause 6, sub clause a, says some sh*te about something blah blah, but come on ffs, there can’t be too many football fans, even the mancs themselves, that won’t put their hand up for that FOUL on Azpi being a pen !

Statistics and analysis definitely has its place but I wonder sometimes if the lunatics aren’t taking over the asylum ?

Trying to be too clever - your dead right.

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I think there is more than one thing going on, don't think it is corruption though bias at occasions.

Stephen Warnock said yesterday refs are frightened to make a wrong decision because of the VAR team watching and so wait to see if VAR flags it.

I also could also understand if the ref did not want to send off England's first choice CB fighting back over his own demons over the Greek incident and this would not be the first time either, recall Clattenburg's later remarks over that Spurs matched dubbed the battle of Stamford Bridge,

 

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I hate VAR fundamentally because it sucks the life out of the game. Enjoying or for that despairing a goal going in is no longer the same. Could you imagine the Aguero goal happening now? Maybe it would be given after a 10 minute check but who knows. Football is now a bland and complicated experience with a lot of games tainted by an awful VAR decision or two. The cons outweigh the pros for me by far. Yes, we all enjoy seeing our rivals get f**ked over by it but that’s not football. You might as well have a Tottenham fan operate it for Chelsea games and vice versa and it wouldn’t be much worse.
There are the head in the sand crowd who say it’s here to stay and it will get better. But will it? Not in England where we have the most incompetent and arrogant group of refs in the world. 
Before VAR, if a referee had a sh*t game you were pissed off for a day or two but got over it. Now you feel cheated and a whole new level of injustice and anger when there’s of whole team of these useless c**ts ruining your football experience. They’re so desperate to take goals away and award penalties for ridiculous hand balls but decline to judge potentially career changing tackles and fouls in the box like yesterday. 
What’s more, the refs basically have zero accountability and operate with absolute impunity. How can it be the case that managers and players can’t speak out without receiving a fine? And how do terrible referees continue in their job game after game, year after year? 
With all the talk about European super leagues and greed in the game, surely the top clubs are talking about the shambles that is VAR as it is going to cost someone a lot of money someday. I just hope there is a massive f**k up in a champions league final and someone finally says enough is enough.
 

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16 hours ago, Sindre said:

There is clear United-bias from VAR. There is a reason they get away with the the stuff they do and the amount of penalties they get.

Just against us Maguire have gotten away with kicking Batshuayi in the nuts and chokeslamming Azpilicueta. Both with VAR and both nothing given

Both with the same person behind VAR and both nothing given

Stuart Attwell

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It's not the VAR or technology itself, its the same stupid corrupted faces behind it controlling VAR. As long as the final decisions are being called by these clown pushers  even if they install chips up the players ass there will be bias. 

Edited by Droopy
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