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Chelsea vs Benfica SL (UCL) Tuesday 30th September 20:00 GMT

Not specific to this actual thread but more as a general question.

Do you guys think that when they show the passes made and passes completed stats that they take the two yard goal kick sideways to the keeper into account?
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m2-res_480p.mp4

They must get a bonus for moments like this 😐

 

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Not specific to this actual thread but more as a general question.

Do you guys think that when they show the passes made and passes completed stats that they take the two yard goal kick sideways to the keeper into account?
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They do, a pass is a pass no matter what type, how far etc. Its nonsense that gabe Jorginho a 98% pass rate, even though they total 18 yards.

Same as some assists which are nonsense, whoever gave Hazard the ball when he beat half the Arsenal team got an assist for it.

 
Its a nonsense statement, passing is entirely down to the individual. Having options is a different thing all together, but he didnt misplace incredible defence splitting efforts, these were often just simple passes to open players, which is pretty much how his time at Chelsea has gone. Ive said in the past I like him for the effort he puts in, he obviously has a passion to win on the pitch and fights for the team, but he simply isnt good enough to play where Maresca puts him, or to try the things he does.
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Ah I see, I did not know you were one of "them." 😁
Well, we will strongly disagree on this one then. Especially these days with most teams pressing high even short passing is affected. Suppose we will find out, but my prediction is that we will miss him big time.

I also see a contradiction here; on one hand there is no system, no teamwork, and (the so important) passing is entirely down to the individual, but on the other hand it's all Maresca's fault... so which one is it?

 
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Ah I see, I did not know you were one of "them." 😁
Well, we will strongly disagree on this one then. Especially these days with most teams pressing high even short passing is affected. Suppose we will find out, but my prediction is that we will miss him big time.

I also see a contradiction here; on one hand there is no system, no teamwork, and (the so important) passing is entirely down to the individual, but on the other hand it's all Maresca's fault... so which one is it?
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I didn't know that DKW was one of "them" . I must be blind, how did you figure it out ?

 
I didn't know that DKW was one of "them" . I must be blind, how did you figure it out ?
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very easy "passing is entirely down to the individual" which is absolute nonsense. Put prime Jorginho in a championship team and his passing success ratio would go down quite a bit. Watch United play today... do you remember Casemiro passing at Real Madrid? do you think he forgot how to pass the football?!

Passing is a skill no doubt: good passers being it, long or short, have precision in their passing. That still demands players to get into positions where they can receive that pass. It's also harder when you are facing teams which press high and give your passers less time on the ball and blocking passing lines. So, both are important: passing ability of players and teamwork/movement of the players.

and it's still very odd to read "passing is entirely down to the individual" and at the same time, it's all Maresca's fault. 🤷‍♂️

 
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very easy "passing is entirely down to the individual" which is absolute nonsense. Put prime Jorginho in a championship team and his passing success ratio would go down quite a bit. Watch United play today... do you remember Casemiro passing at Real Madrid? do you think he forgot how to pass the football?!

Passing is a skill no doubt: good passers being it, long or short, have precision in their passing. That still demands players to get into positions where they can receive that pass. It's also harder when you are facing teams which press high and give your passers less time on the ball and blocking passing lines. So, both are important: passing ability of players and teamwork/movement of the players.

and it's still very odd to read "passing is entirely down to the individual" and at the same time, it's all Maresca's fault. 🤷‍♂️
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Thanks mate. I should have picked up on that bit about " passing is entirely down to the individual"... he's definitely one of "them" ...good spot .

 
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Don’t assume everybody even kicked a ball around here 😉

Thanks for taking it out of context tho.
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Thanks mate. I should have picked up on that bit about " passing is entirely down to the individual"... he's definitely one of "them" ...good spot .
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No, that was specifically in reference to the "never kicked a ball" group, which was a slight joke nothing else--reading way too much into it.

Regarding the case in question, I have an opinion based on the knowledge and experience I’ve acquired over time, and it won’t change. So, it's likely time to agree to disagree on this one and move on.
Seen countless times (at all levels) when the player on the ball spreads his arms in frustration because no one's making a run or showing for a pass.

 
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Passing is a skill no doubt: good passers being it, long or short, have precision in their passing. That still demands players to get into positions where they can receive that pass. It's also harder when you are facing teams which press high and give your passers less time on the ball and blocking passing lines. So, both are important: passing ability of players and teamwork/movement of the players.
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I agree on both counts, but I think this actually shows why Fernandez is so poor.

I think Fernandez is a good passer in the sense that he has precision in his passing, and I also think his creativity is limited by Maresca's tactics. I don't think these are mutually exclusive issues but actually an interaction that makes everything worse. In a system that is not designed to give players creative options, because its structure requires set patterns of play and rigid roles for players, Fernandez is limited, nor is his precision in passing ability used to full effect.

I also think there are certain issues Fernandez has that make the problem worse. Firstly and foremost, he is energetic without being athletic, and he is increasingly becoming clumsy on the ball as well. It means that he is unable to break the press at PL level, nor does he have the quickness to create moments within a set defence, nor is he a particularly good finisher or aerial threat or off-the-ball runner that justifies him being used as a box threat. Fernandez's role seems to be to get the ball out wide or back to defenders and then run forward to be a body in the box. The team is crying out for a ball carrier through the centre, which is simply a role he cannot provide, and he is not good enough at any of the other duties that warrants his inclusion.

This is in stark contrast to players in other top teams that play the same role as a deep AM/attacking CM. Fabian Ruiz, Pedri, Tijani Reinjders, Szobozlai/MacAllister, Camavinga/Valverde can all pass, press and most crucially, carry the ball and cover ground at pace.

Were Fernandez inclined to continue to hone his craft in the deeper central role he initially starred in, I think he would be a valuable player, but he has no interest and neither Poch nor Maresca were willing to take a stand.

As for transfer interest, we're stuck with him. Real Madrid aren't actually interested, that is just internet nonsense peddled by people like me and @Sconnie Blue in the vain hope that something happens. Fede Valverde is the exact midfielder that would improve Maresca's system, but his athleticism and finishing is just a level beyond Fernandez. Madrid will need a defensive midfielder soon, and they will turn their eyes to Caicedo, not Fernandez.

 
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