Was sacking Tuchel for Potter a good decision?

[coco]

I am in the pro Potter camp but I answered with 'no', because objectively at this point in time there seems to be no progression in our performances which would indicate that Tuchel was not 'the problem' or that Potter is better suited to manage this group of players.

Your post doesn't make sense. Did you leave the word 'not' out ?

 

[Blue2]

Your post doesn't make sense. Did you leave the word 'not' out ?

Was my sentence grammatically wrong?

I meant it like this 'Based on the lack of progression in our performances(under Potter), I see no indication that Tuchel was the problem for the bad performances (under himself) and no indication that Potter is better suited to managing this group of players than Tuchel was either.'

Sorry I made a mistake, goodnight.

 

[big blue]

Think its been close to a year I haven't enjoyed our football. Seems like the Juve game was the last game we completely dominated in every aspect. 

yeah not much to shout about, although I thought we were excellent in madrid, and both cup finals too. I just felt with Tuchel, at least we could beat anyone on our day. I'm not convinced by Potter yet. He needs a big win or 2 to win me over. We did well against an injury ravaged milan side, but 2 home games against United and Arsenal and it's not been pretty.

He was never going to be the type of manager that would have a massive impact immediately though, so I'll give it time, and hope we get it right in the transfer market for once.

 

[coco]

Was my sentence grammatically wrong?

I meant it like this 'Based on the lack of progression in our performances(under Potter), I see no indication that Tuchel was the problem for the bad performances (under himself) and no indication that Potter is better suited to managing this group of players than Tuchel was either.'

Sorry I made a mistake, goodnight.

I get you now.

 

[WhiteWall]

I come back to the same issue every time. These are elite players that play to an elite level...until they join us. We overhype the talent from our youth set up and blame the manager, tactics, formation for the groundhog performances that we have seen for what appears seasons now. 

Yes the purchasing strategy is all wrong and we have owners currently totally unsuited to the market they are trading in and therefore being mugged off.

But it all has to have a solid foundation and that basis is pretty simple. Its all about running, fitness and effort. The formations, tactics, patterns of play and individual talent surely sits on top of that basic principle.

I don't see that effort, tempo, desire and will to run and run and run. To sprint to shut down the oposition, to swarm over them with a pack mentality in order to regain posession and then to burst upon the opposition. We look lazy, slow and frankly spineless in numerous areas.

Is Ziyech a better player than McTominay. Hell yes. What do we really think the outcome would be though. Mctominay would own Ziyech. Easily. And i think McTominay is cr@p. Just one example.  There are numerous others.

So therefore i think Potter can get it right. I think Tuchel could have got it right. Providing the players get fitter and work harder, or at least as hard as our rivals. If the players are not prepared to do that then they need to go and if it means being replaced by Johnny Nobodies that can put in the hard yards and work for the team ethic then so be it.

We have to be patient and get it right. We can't keep making covetous glances at Arteta, Howe etc. Potter was highly regarded and a creative coach. Whether that was hype is questionable but it was widely accepted by the very pundits and media that are now questioning him. We have no option but to hang in there and wait for him to get it right. It could mean two years of no european football at all. We could easily struggle to make the Europa this year, unless there is a major change.

 

[coco]

The first image is Tuchels worst run over 6 league games, from Apr 2nd to 1st May....

The second image is Tuchels 6 league games at the start of the season up to his sacking....

The third image is our last 4 games, and next 2 games.???

 

[BlueMonk]

Hi All, 

I'm new here. Been a fan since 96-97, just never ever bothered posting.

I never thought I'd say this, but BRING BACK JOSE?

Hear me out. I think that Jose would thrive in the current structure, or the lack of a structure. He'd be given full control, which is what he craves. He wouldn't need to fight with anyone in the hierarchy, because it would just be him and Boehly....unless he starts a fight with Boehly. Third time could be the charm!

Obviously, this will never happen. Potter has a 5 year contract?  Potter seems out of his depth. Granted, there have been plenty of injuries, but some of his tactics have been quite questionable. There seems to be a huge hole in midfield. I'm sorry to say this, but Ruben isn't good enough. I really want him to succeed, but he isn't up to the mark to start for Chelsea.

Once again, Jorginho's primary strengths aren't being utilized. He is arguably one of the best deep lying playmaker's in the world, and yet he's been relegated to a holding role that he isn't suited to. With the pace we have upfront, we should be playing a tight backline, sitting deeper and playing on the break. If Jorginho is given the opportunity, he can spray the ball around, find the ball over the top. The pace is there, we just aren't using it. In Auba we have a target man who can hold the ball up and bring the likes of Sterling, Havertz, Pulisic into play.

We should play a 4-3-3:

Azpi-Silva-Koulibaly-Cucurella

                  Jorginho

       Kovacic-Mount/Zakaria

           Pulisic- Auba-Pulisic

 

[Mod]

I wanted either Jose or Zidane when Tuchel got the boot, but seems the days of big name managers at the club has ran its course with new ownership.

If GP isn't given long, expect the likes of Gerrard taking over.

 

[Argo]

Without being too critical of the current management in place, put it this way....  

I'll be more surprised than not if 3 years down the line Chelsea is in a two way race (or any kind of title race even) for the title with any other current member of the big 6.

Somehow I've made my peace that we will be a mediocre club that just about threads water. 

Pep, Klopp, Conte, Ten Hag. Those guys should have their clubs jostling for the top 4. Throw in other names like Emery, Moyes, Arteta, and the landscape for glory seems quite bleak with battles for the Europa being a more likely outcome. 

Out of interest what has Ten Hag done so far that shows he's a sure thing in this league?

I mean maybe he turns out that way but so far he's got a worse record than Frank De Boer in Holland, been 4-0 down at half time twice and could very well be going into the world cup with a negative goal difference, any manager of ours would get hell on earth thrown at them in the same situation.

 

[abister1]

Out of interest what has Ten Hag done so far that shows he's a sure thing in this league?

I mean maybe he turns out that way but so far he's got a worse record than Frank De Boer in Holland, been 4-0 down at half time twice and could very well be going into the world cup with a negative goal difference, any manager of ours would get hell on earth thrown at them in the same situation.

I don't regard him as a sure thing. In football nothing is, but on the balance of probability, I'll pick someone that worked closely with Pep in Germany and won a bayern B team the league in their competition followed up by successive wins in the Dutch league and Cup  to be more likely to do better than GP. 

Put it this way, do you think Brighton would hve beaten A**x if they had met in a 2 legged European competition? 

Even Klopp is having a mare of a season and a bit of a double Deja Vu moment. Things fell apart after 7 years at Mainz, after 7 years at Dortmund, this is his 7th at Liverpool. 

But will I pick GP ahead of him because of the swash buckling football his Ostersund, Swansea nd Brighton tems have been known for? 

 

[enigma]

I mean you could ask this question about all of our ex coaches. How many deserved to be fired and how many firings were due to the previous board's trigger finger?

In an ideal world Ancelotti wouldn't have been sacked after winning the double. Mourinho wouldn't have been sacked.

Conte should have been given better players after winning the league the season before. It goes on and on. But we are where we are. 

 

[Dean]

Gosh I think for the first time ever I’m a lot more pessimistic than most. I don’t want to be! I want to be wrong and would be delighted to be made a laughing stock on the forum if I am. 
 

ive said it elsewhere, and will try not to bang on about it too much. I just think the big picture is our bubble has burst. That works a bit like a curse. You enter a period where nothing goes right: I’m thinking maybe a decade. It doesn’t matter which manager or players you get. 
 

I know it sounds a bit nebulous. To attempt to put it into more concrete terms: for all the sackings etc, the Roman era was pretty stable. There was a clear power vertical. The financial backing was never in doubt, players signing kind of knew what they were signing up for… 

now we have a group of owners that between them have less money than the previous owners. It’s all paper wealth. They’ve bought the club with a lot of debt financing too, probably at the top of the economic cycle (why are Liverpool owners selling?). Unlike Roman, who didn’t have to answer to anyone, they presumably have to answer to their other stakeholders? That’s bad! Private equity is a massive bubble that hasn’t burst yet. All this talk about vision etc - it’s just marketing bs. They don’t seem to know what they’re doing. 
 

ok, that’s a lot of my opinion there. But what about the facts on the ground? Owners got rid of a manager with a proven track record after a few weeks, replacing him with a manager with zero track record. It’s not working. Maybe it will. But the reality is he may not have the time.

This instability is here to stay. And it is a real issue.

put yourselves in the shoes of top players. Which players are going to choose us over: Bayern, city, real, arsenal(Welp!), tottenham(double welp!). These last two really say something about how quickly things have changed.  
 

Would hazard have signed up for THIS? not a chance. Would YOU sign for us if you weren’t a fan?

 

[PhilH930]

Based on results and performances, I fully appreciate this question. Stepping back though….

Potter was brought in for the long term. He joined at one of the most turbulent time in the clubs history, fixture congestion beyond levels we have seen, and injuries (which all coaches seem to deal with). It is too early to judge imo. Under TT, there is no denying just how poor and jaded things had become - the atmosphere was borderline toxic and it showed on the pitch. 
 

The bounce under Potter was fun. Players ran harder, with a greater sense of freedom and intent to play the ball forward quickly. I was optimistic seeing this, but we have since regressed to slow dull football, and more alarming is how out of form the players now are and the lack of understanding of their roles. 
 

Mr Potter - post World Cup you need to nail down 8+ starters and stick with them. This constant personnel and system changes will be the undoing. 

 

[Sconnie Blue]

Mr Potter - post World Cup you need to nail down 8+ starters and stick with them. This constant personnel and system changes will be the undoing. 

I'd argue Potter relying on certain players and sticking with them constantly is a reason our form and football has been so sh*te. 

 

[Argo]

Put it this way, do you think Brighton would hve beaten A**x if they had met in a 2 legged European competition?  

Why not? As critical as I've been of Potter recently at Brighton he competed very well against all the top 6 bar City and not just by playing defensive either. 

Also Ten Hag's record in Europe is very average.

 

[Sconnie Blue]

Why not? As critical as I've been of Potter recently at Brighton he competed very well against all the top 6 bar City and not just by playing defensive either. 

Yeah. 

Biggest worry was that he'd be just another reactionary manager, but you can only hope that changes when he gets his team playing his football. What ever that is. 

 

[axman2526]

Gosh I think for the first time ever I’m a lot more pessimistic than most. I don’t want to be! I want to be wrong and would be delighted to be made a laughing stock on the forum if I am. 
 

ive said it elsewhere, and will try not to bang on about it too much. I just think the big picture is our bubble has burst. That works a bit like a curse. You enter a period where nothing goes right: I’m thinking maybe a decade. It doesn’t matter which manager or players you get. 
 

I know it sounds a bit nebulous. To attempt to put it into more concrete terms: for all the sackings etc, the Roman era was pretty stable. There was a clear power vertical. The financial backing was never in doubt, players signing kind of knew what they were signing up for… 

now we have a group of owners that between them have less money than the previous owners. It’s all paper wealth. They’ve bought the club with a lot of debt financing too, probably at the top of the economic cycle (why are Liverpool owners selling?). Unlike Roman, who didn’t have to answer to anyone, they presumably have to answer to their other stakeholders? That’s bad! Private equity is a massive bubble that hasn’t burst yet. All this talk about vision etc - it’s just marketing bs. They don’t seem to know what they’re doing. 
 

ok, that’s a lot of my opinion there. But what about the facts on the ground? Owners got rid of a manager with a proven track record after a few weeks, replacing him with a manager with zero track record. It’s not working. Maybe it will. But the reality is he may not have the time.

This instability is here to stay. And it is a real issue.

put yourselves in the shoes of top players. Which players are going to choose us over: Bayern, city, real, arsenal(Welp!), tottenham(double welp!). These last two really say something about how quickly things have changed.  
 

Would hazard have signed up for THIS? not a chance. Would YOU sign for us if you weren’t a fan?

Welcome @Dean

 

[axman2526]

To answer the original question not it was not a good decision...it was a great decision.

A great decision to make Chelsea great again!

 

[abister1]

Why not? As critical as I've been of Potter recently at Brighton he competed very well against all the top 6 bar City and not just by playing defensive either. 

Also Ten Hag's record in Europe is very average.

Fair enough. Everyone has their view and perspective. 

I'm not critical of Potter though, because he needs time and not because he's deserved the job according to some (not a view I share) but more because he's still bedding in and my expectation is low. 

All criticism is held for the process that saw him appointed our manager. It was an instinctive decision. Those work well in Business and you'll find a lot of self made successful business men will tell you they go with their instincts when making decisions. Boehly hasn't been thorough enough yet. It's good he's getting stuck in but there may have just been a better way to go about things. 

Any team can be competitive, even City you provide an exception for lost to Brighton so its not about being competitive but going the distance and delivering the goods at the end of it all. 

 

[abramovich]

I think people are just taking out their frustration on a new manager for a lot of things that Potter and Co have nothing to do with. Last season the club was punished for political reasons, the ownership ordeal was completely unjustified and sacking TT was the last straw for many, it seems. Getting rid of Marina and Cech was probably expected once the sale became official but the timing was odd. The whole summer shopping tour by Boehly was a bit of a freakshow and distraction. Sacking of Tuchel a few weeks into a new season was a bit of a shock but once again, even if there were some legit reasons behind it that we didn't know at the time, the way it was handled and the timing of it was just disastrous.

I realize that Boehly is a newcomer and is bound to make mistakes but it;s just the way he goes about it is what rubs people the wrong way, I think. The club under Roman had identity. Yes, we were hated and regularly criticized for many things but we were respected too. I don't feel the same about the curent regime.

Perhaps when the new setup of technical director, sporting director, chief scout etc is firmly in place the feeling will change. Maybe it's due to the transition period  But it just doesn't feel like the same club anymore.