The Injuries Predicament

Players are returning to fitness now so medical department gets some well deserved time off this summer. 

They’ll be ready to open their doors come August! Probably have Reece doing a ribbon cutting 

 
What an absolute joke these people are. Almost as bad as the complete cretins who hired them.

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52 minutes ago, Gordon Bennett said:

Holy sh*t, didn't realise this is what we'd done to the medical department... Sacked them all and hired an outside company who's highest profile client was... Dave Grohl...??!!


This video lost credibility almost as soon as it started. 

He insinuates that all of the changes with the clubs medical team is the reason, but if he had done a bit more research before making this video, he would have found that the injury issues started long before the forced change of ownership and before the medical team was replaced. Even on this forum we had calls for a changes to the medical team before any changes were ever made.

Another thing I disagree with is him saying we have overused players. He specifically mentions Gallagher, Enzo, Caicedo and Gallagher, but none of them have been overplayed.

Enzo, 40 games.

Caicedo, 44 games

Gallagher, 47 games

Gusto, 33 games.

I do believe burnout in young players is real, and I believe that is happening with Mason Mount, but I also don't see anything abnormal about the amount of games our players have been playing this season. I think Enzo is a small risk because of the amount of football he has played since the world cup, but the others are fine. Gallagher is playing a lot of games, but he's 24 now and he wasn't playing 50 games a season between the age of 18-23. So I think his numbers are totally normal.

I think this video has a lot of holes in it.

 
This video lost credibility almost as soon as it started. 

He insinuates that all of the changes with the clubs medical team is the reason, but if he had done a bit more research before making this video, he would have found that the injury issues started long before the forced change of ownership and before the medical team was replaced. Even on this forum we had calls for a changes to the medical team before any changes were ever made.

Another thing I disagree with is him saying we have overused players. He specifically mentions Gallagher, Enzo, Caicedo and Gallagher, but none of them have been overplayed.

Enzo, 40 games.

Caicedo, 44 games

Gallagher, 47 games

Gusto, 33 games.

I do believe burnout in young players is real, and I believe that is happening with Mason Mount, but I also don't see anything abnormal about the amount of games our players have been playing this season. I think Enzo is a small risk because of the amount of football he has played since the world cup, but the others are fine. Gallagher is playing a lot of games, but he's 24 now and he wasn't playing 50 games a season between the age of 18-23. So I think his numbers are totally normal.

I think this video has a lot of holes in it.
Salient point of the post being we replaced long standing members of the medical dept with an outsourced business who's biggest client was Dave Grohl. Absolutely beggars belief.

 
Whilst we are no strangers to injuries the past few years, the amount of training ground injuries and player set backs have been overwhelming. 

 
The below is pretty damning. Although, considering how far ahead of everyone you are, it feels like the media have only every made a story out of Newcastle and United's woes. 

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/arsenal-10th-man-utd-4th-where-do-clubs-rank-in-the-premier-league-injury-table-this-season-/view/news/437159

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West Ham just 6 injuries and only 22 games missed.

Chelsea 54 injuries, over 300 games missed.

And West Ham were in Europe too .

WTF ??

 
The below is pretty damning. Although, considering how far ahead of everyone you are, it feels like the media have only every made a story out of Newcastle and United's woes. 

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/arsenal-10th-man-utd-4th-where-do-clubs-rank-in-the-premier-league-injury-table-this-season-/view/news/437159

Christ almighty! Even in that photo Nkunku has a broken arm. When did that happen?

Seriously, not surprised at that table at all. 100% certain we would have topped it last season as well. I seem to remember Potter also had a period where 14 players were unavailable too. 

 
Andy Goldstein getting in a state about United's injury " crisis"

On being told Chelsea and Newcastle have had loads more injuries, he said

" Well it doesn't matter about Chelsea, if they have 15 out injured they've got another 40 out there to replace them "

🤣😜😜🤣

 
At what point do the medical team sign the players off and put them back in training. I am assuming if they break down "whilst undergoing rehabilitation" then that has to be on the medics.

If however they are "In partial training" and then suffer a set back or recurrence then surely that is down to the back room staff and the training regimes that they have in place.
Just want to clarify this point because I've seen a lot written about 'medical teams' and I don't think people really understand/appreciate how little say the backroom staff have at a professional club, let alone a Premier League one. All decisions about playing time and injury management ultimately come down to the manager and his staff.

This is because there is a huge power differential between the backroom staff and the manager. At a PL club, the manager will typically earn half the yearly salary of the most senior medical professional in a week. Club doctors are not renumerated more than any other specialist in private practice, and physios/allied health are paid roughly the same as in private practice. Wages are low because the sector is extremely competitive and the expectation is that staff 'do it for the privilege' as much as the wages.

Every manager brings along a bevvy of their own support staff, which usually includes a performance coach; regardless of club structure, this person becomes the defacto head of department because they are the conduit to the manager. One problem at Chelsea is that manager is Pochettino, and his sports scientist of choice so happens to be...his son. The power dynamic is shifted away from medical staff and the ability for medical staff to critique or disagree is at a low. 

What people also may not realise is that players, their agents, and their hangers-on insist they are ready to play. In an era of PL footballers with money and personal trainers and social media etc, this quickly gets out of hand. This is an all-too typical scenario:

Medical staff: We have assessed the data and Johnny Smith is still 4-6 weeks away from playing

Coach: Johnny, the medical team said you can't play, what do you think?

Johnny: Coach, I feel fine and I want to play against Tottenham next week

Johnny's social media: I'll be back soon

Johnny's agent: If he doesn't play soon I'm going to be looking for new clubs + the sponsors are getting restless.

Coach: Okay Johnny, I need you to play and I don't want to cause trouble so you'll play. 

To resist this cycle requires tremendous authority by a manager, and unfortunately most managers will prefer to keep the peace instead of having difficult conversations. Now add to that a team under pressure, a conflict of interest with a family member, and a whole new medical team and you have a very sub-optimal situation. If there is a reason why poor-performing clubs tend to devolve into injury crisis, this is my theory.

Fortunately this is an easy problem to fix with strong leadership. The board could set a few ground rules such as:

  1. Playing decisions are subject to medical advice
  2. Manager must use club medical staff. Club medical staff have authority over managerial hires.
  3. Manager must act on the advice of the medical staff with respect to training
  4. Player input is always weighed against objective medical advice
  5. Agents and associates of players must not influence playing decisions

I had the privilege of interning in such a setup some years ago where the club/board set clear demarcations in the role of manager/managers' staff and club human performance staff. There was an agreement that players belong to the club and are managed as club assets, rather than a manager's to use and abuse, resulting in an excellent injury record.

 
Just want to clarify this point because I've seen a lot written about 'medical teams' and I don't think people really understand/appreciate how little say the backroom staff have at a professional club, let alone a Premier League one. All decisions about playing time and injury management ultimately come down to the manager and his staff.

This is because there is a huge power differential between the backroom staff and the manager. At a PL club, the manager will typically earn half the yearly salary of the most senior medical professional in a week. Club doctors are not renumerated more than any other specialist in private practice, and physios/allied health are paid roughly the same as in private practice. Wages are low because the sector is extremely competitive and the expectation is that staff 'do it for the privilege' as much as the wages.

Every manager brings along a bevvy of their own support staff, which usually includes a performance coach; regardless of club structure, this person becomes the defacto head of department because they are the conduit to the manager. One problem at Chelsea is that manager is Pochettino, and his sports scientist of choice so happens to be...his son. The power dynamic is shifted away from medical staff and the ability for medical staff to critique or disagree is at a low. 

What people also may not realise is that players, their agents, and their hangers-on insist they are ready to play. In an era of PL footballers with money and personal trainers and social media etc, this quickly gets out of hand. This is an all-too typical scenario:

Medical staff: We have assessed the data and Johnny Smith is still 4-6 weeks away from playing

Coach: Johnny, the medical team said you can't play, what do you think?

Johnny: Coach, I feel fine and I want to play against Tottenham next week

Johnny's social media: I'll be back soon

Johnny's agent: If he doesn't play soon I'm going to be looking for new clubs + the sponsors are getting restless.

Coach: Okay Johnny, I need you to play and I don't want to cause trouble so you'll play. 

To resist this cycle requires tremendous authority by a manager, and unfortunately most managers will prefer to keep the peace instead of having difficult conversations. Now add to that a team under pressure, a conflict of interest with a family member, and a whole new medical team and you have a very sub-optimal situation. If there is a reason why poor-performing clubs tend to devolve into injury crisis, this is my theory.

Fortunately this is an easy problem to fix with strong leadership. The board could set a few ground rules such as:

  1. Playing decisions are subject to medical advice
  2. Manager must use club medical staff. Club medical staff have authority over managerial hires.
  3. Manager must act on the advice of the medical staff with respect to training
  4. Player input is always weighed against objective medical advice
  5. Agents and associates of players must not influence playing decisions

I had the privilege of interning in such a setup some years ago where the club/board set clear demarcations in the role of manager/managers' staff and club human performance staff. There was an agreement that players belong to the club and are managed as club assets, rather than a manager's to use and abuse, resulting in an excellent injury record.
Thanks for this excellent clarification. It kind of underlines the driving factors around my own Poch In Poch Out thoughts. Whilst I have often been underwhelmed by his in game management and our appalling standards of defending I have been somewhat ambivalent at this stage who the manager is. But for me I firmly believe that something behind the scenes is contributing to these ridiculous number of injuries and re-injuries during rehab. I cannot endorse a Poch In if there is a fundamental issue in our ability to maintain a largely fit squad of senior players during the season.

The point about Poch's son is well made and one I myself had overlooked.  Whilst it may have no bearing the opportunity for calls of nepotism during a crisis is never good. 

 
Thanks for this excellent clarification. It kind of underlines the driving factors around my own Poch In Poch Out thoughts. Whilst I have often been underwhelmed by his in game management and our appalling standards of defending I have been somewhat ambivalent at this stage who the manager is. But for me I firmly believe that something behind the scenes is contributing to these ridiculous number of injuries and re-injuries during rehab. I cannot endorse a Poch In if there is a fundamental issue in our ability to maintain a largely fit squad of senior players during the season.

The point about Poch's son is well made and one I myself had overlooked.  Whilst it may have no bearing the opportunity for calls of nepotism during a crisis is never good. 
Whilst I have issues with our coaching staff set up, inc Poch son, I don't think it's fair to accuse us of rushing players back. Players seem to be out for much longer than normal and when they come back play a lot of bench appearances before starting. 

 
Whilst I have issues with our coaching staff set up, inc Poch son, I don't think it's fair to accuse us of rushing players back. Players seem to be out for much longer than normal and when they come back play a lot of bench appearances before starting. 
Agreed. The re-injuries i am talking of are the numerous instances of set backs during rehab, possible due to overloading or or pushing too hard by the back room team on the training ground or in the gym. Its that grey area that nobody really knows about but the sheer volume of injuries and the days sidelined is so wildly out of proportion with the rest of the league that either the statistic being provided is disingenuous or there is something very wrong behind the scenes.

 
Thought I would resurrect this thread but on injuries across the whole of the PL. WTF is going on in the modern game?

Sure, sometimes you just get players who are injury prone and that has always been the case down the years. But why are so many players suffering injuries - especially soft-tissue injuries? We have modern and state of the art facilities, better playing conditions (pitch wise) and yet the injuries are worse than ever. I don't accept it's the number of games as teams in the 1970's played a LOT of football, with cup replays, more teams in the division and only 1 or 2 subs. It must be down to training methods, but why haven't they realised this and been able to address it?  When someone like Havertz get's injured (who isn't injury prone) in a training break in Dubai, you have to seriously question the methods teams are using these days. 

 
Someone made a shout of extra national team games but if you look back in the mid 2000's we essentially had friendlies taking place of National League games so it doesn't make any difference. 

I want to see the data of average distance travelled in today's game vs back then though, as well as sprints. 

 
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