talkofthetownsend

you asked...i provided. moving the goalposts is unbecoming. i am of the opinion that neither torres nor vertonghen should have been booked...however, in the context of the game (given the townsend booking) vertonghen "could easily" have been booked (as it was a more obvious dive) & torres really shouldn't have been...no other foul on a fullback was a booking & there were a couple...oscar did one on the near side & cole won a few freekicks without anyone getting booked.

according to whom? i posted a video of a defender getting booked for diving anyway. where's my cookie? he was booked for "the trip".

1. jason shackell. hull barnsley. 15/1/2011. i deserve a cookie. 2. my point being that vertonghen was a few strides away...it was a blatant dive...torres wasn't even near him & even if he was near him then you don't often see a booking for an innocuous trip there.

says more about you than anything tbh. agree or disagree my opinion is perfectly clear.

my response to this is 2 fold... 1. he couldn't really dive as he was already in the process of pushing torres when torres touched his face...in fact, it was this push that made the incident what it was. 2. "rolling around" clutching his face? like he did for the sending off? where he wasn't touched anywhere near his face? a dive is a dive...townsend had just been booked for a far less blatant dive...mike dean is one referee you expect to be consistent right or wrong. and booking torres is what made that incident truly disgraceful tbh. you don't often see strikers getting booked for being near a defender when he falls over a couple of strides away from any sort of contact just outside his own box either.

i was thinking the same thing of you. accuse others of what you're doing yourself seems to be a theme with you. number attained i think. it was this one apparently. you claim the decisions evened themselves out. "no complaints about the refereeing". "just desserts". imo they do not...even if i accept your opinion that torres "could easily" have seen red for the scratch...as vertonghen should have been booked for the dive before that..."could easily" been booked for pushing torres later on..."could easily" have seen a straight red for the tackle on ramires...& then the red itself. 1-4 is not even. and again...it was impossible for the ref to send torres off anyway...as even if it is a red card...he couldn't have seen it and neither could the lino. that actually makes it 0-4 in terms of decisions that went spurs way involving vertonghen. i am not saying that there was a conspiracy, or an agenda...i am saying dean made a lot of mistakes (maybe mistakes is wrong...the sending off is the only clear "mistake" he made...although booking torres for vertonghen's dive could also be considered a mistake as torres was nowhere bloody near him) in the second half and they tended to impact us far more than the impacted spurs. cue you repeating your old posts? yeah whatever. take your own advice.

*cough* rubber. glue. pot. kettle. etc. you want me to repeat myself? or you want the last word?

"win some lose many" would be a more accurate reflection imo. nice to see you repeating yourself pretty much verboten in a post where you criticise me for repeating myself. you are clearly a quality poster. there was no "cynical trip" it was an appalling dive while torres was nowhere near him. seemed that way to me too. actually got slagged off for saying it. i doubt there will be any retrospective action cos no-one seems to give a toss other than a handful of overcompensating chelsea fans...who may or may not have an axe to grind.

i agree the ref was sh*t...especially 2nd half. i believe that impacted us more tho. i also believe that, watching it in real time, no referee is likely to send off torres for that incident. you are free to disagree of course...but from my perspective it was a bout of handbags where both were equally at fault & the "scratch" was on the blindside of the ref & the lino anyway. i don't believe that incident in anyway justifies the actual sending off...which was ludicrous.

what the F*ck i am on about is that you claimed to have "no complaints about the refereeing" even tho you have "complaints about the refereeIng" which you have even taken the trouble to point out in your own post. the fact that torres "could easily" (your words) have seen red for an incident that "could easily" also have been a yellow & also "could easily" have just been a word from the ref for both of them to cut out the handbags...and also could have seen both players punished rather than one...which followed a dive by vertonghen which (you admit) "could easily" have been a yellow for vertonghen (given the yellow in townsend)...and a push in the face by vertonghen on torres which by your own criteria "could easily" have been a yellow (or even a red) for vertoghen...and an actual yellow for vertonghen that "could easily" have been a red for vertonghen... which, according to you is all balanced out by a yellow (that led to torres' red) that (we agree) was nonsense. in that context i don't understand your opinion...even if we disagree over the incident involving torres. i have nowhere claimed or even suggested a conspiracy or agenda. that is you trying to construct a strawman. as for the personal stuff...that's on you. i'm just pointing it out.

yes...opinions differ. i have no problem with that. i am confused about your posts though. you accuse me of wanting the last post...when that is clearly what you want (which your last post clearly illustrates...you actually say nothing). you accuse me of repeating myself...when that is clearly what you are doing (again...look at your last post...tell you what...if you have nothing to say: say nothing...crazy idea, i know). i am confused about how someone can have "no complaints about the refereeing" for the reasons i said. you actually seem to agree with a lot of what i have written (vertonghen was lucky multiple times, torres was unlucky with the red he got...these are clearly "complaints about the refereeing" unless i am missing something) but you seem fixated on either repeating that you believe that torres' "scratch" should have seen him sent off (which i disagree with and have said why...although you don't seem to have a reply for that, just repetition of your initial opinion) or attempting to create an ad hominem reply. but hey...reply to this...say nothing...yay for you.

you have "no complaints about the ref"? i can show you posts where you disagree with yourself...but whatever...i've already pointed that out. reply to this...repeat what you already said...that'll give you the last word. that's what you want, after all. you're the winner. yay for you.

er...no... i was replying to this post: "no complaints about the ref" vertonghen could have gone several times...yellow for the dive...straight red for being last man... none of which smacks of everything "evening itself up". "torres could have gone earlier" we agree that the ref couldn't have seen the torres "scratch"...so no he couldn't. glad we agree on that. i expect you'll post again to tell me that again. again. that makes you smart.

how so?

actually...to sum up... i think vertonghen was lucky not to get a yellow for the dive...i also think he was lucky not to get booked along with torres for the handbags...i also think he was lucky not to get a straight red for taking down ramires when he was the last man...i also think he was lucky to escape a yellow when he pushed torres in the face later on... so your whole opinion of "it evens itself up" is bollocks...

ditto.

that isn't a slap or a push to the face...so your analogy of "what everyone knows" isn't relevant. maybe...although if it was as innocuous as this i doubt it.

i think they were both aggressive. book both...or neither. imo the correct action in the context of this game would be neither. he looked decent second half until the red. please don't think this is coming from the perspective of me being a torres fanboy...you could not be further from the truth. don't show me a still. a still picture can be misleading. i can find you plenty of examples if you like. i've posted the footage...watch it. it's handbags...six of one...plenty of other cliches too. vertonghen is definitely more aggressive tho...& again...the only truly cardable offence is that ridiculous dive. (edit: didn't click your link...that red was bollocks too...& torres' wasn't worse anyway...both him & vertonghen were pushing each other for a start)

nope.

i have never seen a red card given for two players pushing each other just cos one had his hands higher than the other. vertonghen was as much the aggressor as torres...imo it was handbags...they both raised their hands...it's the sort of thing you see all the time. i do not believe torres was lucky not to be sent off for that incident.

from a declaritive "is" to "could easily". seeing the action footage definitely makes people less certain...easy to fall into the trap of buying into the hysterical media coverage i guess. it certainly is no justification for the ridiculous red that ended up changing the game...especially as the really bad decision is the lack of a yellow for vertonghen's dive that would have seen him sent off later on in the game for the challenge on ramires (which "could easily" have been a red in it's own right seeing as how he was the last man).

oh...& immediately before looking at that video again. in fact...it's only a "scratch" cos vertonghen pushes torres while his hand is near his face...mountain/molehill.

then vertonghen should have been sent off too as he pushed torres immediately after? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odyBvydC7UQ the only cardable offence there is the ridiculous dive...the rest is handbags.

torres did it as a wind-up...he did it cos he knew there was no way the ref could see it. tbh it's not a red anyway. or else this is a red: