RedRobMol

i missed you. BULL ::sh*t:: Your on here to wind up Lofty. i'm not. If i wanted to wind up lofty i'd say something controversial or insulting and watch him go. i havent. basically i disagree with lofty's stance of 'how dare the fa charge us when the ref was sh*t' stance. thats paraphasing by the way lofty, i'm not twisting your words. The fact that the ref was sh*te does not give your players and staff free run to act in an inappropriate manner without the subsequent punishment. oh and lofty, the character assassination continues, find a post on any forum on earth where i have called terry a 'spikey haired c**t' and i'll give you a medal mate. I also referred to his stature within the game, not as a man, because i have never had anything but contempt for his actings as a man for the last 5 years. He is everything i dislike about your club, but nothing i like about it. Plus, roll your f**king socks down man, you look like a tit.

i missed you.

what is wrong with the word acceptable? There are rules, without them there would be no game. Someone has to administer those rules, without them there would be no game. we all know the officials are rubbish at what they do quite often, which is why we had a reasonable right to whinge about your penalty and why you can reasonably bleat about the goal against blackburn and the sending off of Mikel. But something that is fundamental to the game keeping its respect is the thought that the referees decision is final. referees are shown too little respect in general, by all teams, and i beleive it is something that should be stopped and is a plague of the modern day game. To me, Terry's actions were as bad as Di Canio pushing over whoever it was, it is a blatant lack of respect and arrogance by a player towards a referee who dares to do something he disagrees with. remember, JT is England captain and as such shoulders extra responsibility to set a good 'sporting' example. I dont understand how i am being self pitying by making that statement, i just personally beleive your golden boy should be in the dock over it, rather than the FA taking the easy way out and charging the club. A man of Terry's stature in the game should not have to be kept under control by his club.

it was a poor decision, although it was also a foul in my opinion, there was no need for a card of any colour. Having said that, Joe Cole should probably have walked for his lunge on ronaldo.

i said in my post, you did have some shocking decisions go against you, and i doubt they would have been given against you anywhere other than Old Trafford, and i can understand you all feeling aggrieved, i would too. It doesnt excuse Terry's (along with other players) behaviour. I notice you declined to argue Terry's corner as well Lofty. what's to defend? As Moos said, he didn't do anything that was worthy of a further, individual disciplinary charge. Do me one favour though. Drop the act. Whilst you may like to believe that I am alone in my attidude towards you, this pretence of yours that you are that mythical creature, a reasonable Scouser, fools nobody. so you think it is acceptable for players to attempt to prevent a referee from showing someone a red card? If you do i think that is astonishing. If it Ronaldo that was being red carded and it was Rooney who had done the same thing, would you still think it was acceptable? I don't and neither would I if it was gerrard or carragher or torres or any other of our players.

i said in my post, you did have some shocking decisions go against you, and i doubt they would have been given against you anywhere other than Old Trafford, and i can understand you all feeling aggrieved, i would too. It doesnt excuse Terry's (along with other players) behaviour. I notice you declined to argue Terry's corner as well Lofty.

couldnt give a toss who's england captain (edit), i dont support england all that often. I just think the decision not to suspoend him for his actions was a bad one, and feel pretty much anyone else in the league would have been punished for it. thats all. Go on Lofty, defend John Terry's actions last sunday, see how you get on.

what dive? he didnt even go down? dont let your distate for the man cloud our memory. It could be argued he wouldnt have been able to get to the ball, it can't be argues that he wasnt fouled.

if Gerrard had done what Terry did on the field, he would have had the book trown at him, if Terry had any self control and had made his remonstrations after the game, i would have no problem if the FA didnt act against him. His actions on the field, in this as well as many other games, is utterly deplorable and if that was anyone other than the england captain they'd be banned right now. similar to when Shearer got away scott free with kicking someone in the head when he was Ingurland's chosen one. he's been doing it for years and he should stop, thats my opinion Loz.

there were obvioudly terrible decisions against you in that game, all of which you should feel agreived about, but your players must take responsibility for their actions. Terry should have been suspended for trying to grab the card out of the refs hand

O0o....00o...oo...o........o.... blp, blp, blp <<<<---- sounds of me drowning in the canal. Bye.

Now let's look at that little lot. "Generally intelligent enough" means you question my intelligence. "I'll leave that up to them, rather than you." meaning that as far as you're concerned, my opinions are irrelevant to you. Not that this comes as a surprise. You're continued presence on this forum is a continued source of irritation, and not only to me. Stop acting the innocent you sly c***. It doesn't wash. your response suggests that you question your own intelligence to be honest. It meant what it said, generally, the people on this forum are intelligent. The word generally suggesting i am making a generalisation, which i am, a positive one. Leaving that up to them, and not you, means again what it says, I will not take your voice as the voice of the forum, but let others decide whether or not they feel like answering my question. There really is no hidden agenda Lofty, beleive me or not. I'm not going to get into a lagging match Lofty. I have explained myself clearly enough. anyway, moving past this quite frankly irritating argument, I would genuinely be interested to read any thoughts you all may have. EDIT: I'll check back in a couple of days to see if there are any responses, that way any flare ups will be avoided.

lofty, the people of this forum are generally intelligent enough to know whether they want to post a response to my question or not. If they dont want to, this thread will fade into the depths of time, if they do, we can enjoy a sensible debate. I'll leave that up to them, rather than you. its a serious question by the way.

Apologies to those who arent keen on my return, but i have a question to ask. as you may have read, Pako Ayesteran, our coach and Rafa's right hand man for 11 years is in the process of severing his ties with the club. It has been mooted in various reports that both yourselves and man united are sniffing around in the hope of obtaining his services as soon as he formally leaves us. I am interested in seeing your thoughts on the possiblity of it happening. Obviously from a Liverpool perspective i think it would be a real blow for us if he went to either one of you as he knows everything about the way rafa works, about our tactical plans, about specific player strenghts and weaknesses, and on top of that is a terrific football coach and world renowned fitness coach. would you want him?

not my decision pal.

hope you dont mind me offering my two pennies worth, I shalln't bang on about it... it is funny reading these forums how polarised opinions are and how blinkered we all are as fans. My view (from the game, not on TV, so some of the memories might not be spot on and i havent had replays) I thought we were better than you first half and we were both pretty poor second half, either side only creating two or three chances. I think we deserved to win, mainly because aside from the penalty (which was at the opposite end, but i beleive was a nonsense) i cant remember Reina making a save of any note, even though you did go close a few times. It looked clear to me that Essien received a second yellow, and i will have to see it later but i am/was bemused. Torres' goal was class, great pass, great finish and hopefully the first of many. He was excellent in the first half and did cause you countless problems, but second half was very quiet. I thought you lot looked very ordinary and as most occasions that you vist anfield relied far to heavily on high hanging balls up to drogba and then Pizzaro (who are both allowed to get away with throwing defenders out of the way and pushing them in the back constantly) I have read a most of your comments on here and the ones i mostly disagree with are that the ref gave us everything, to me that is a joke. Every time one of your players went down he gave the free kick, yet Terry and Mikel were allowed to kick anyone anywhere near them. I though the yellow card for Pennant was a joke, not because he didnt deserve it but because every single time we got a free kick, Terry, Mikel and normally one or two others were hounding the ref without charge. Terry sets a disgusting example as England captain. I also disagree that your fans outsang us, and this is only from personal viewpoint, but sat on the Kop, i only heard you singing twice, and one of those times you were singing about England, which confused me. I didnt even hear you singing after your goal. I do think torres dived when cole went in on him (was it cole?) but dont think arbeloa dived. I do think Mikel should have been booked for kicking Gerrard when stevie fouled him. I do think the free kick Risse wasted was given incorrectly as it looked like torres tripped over pennants feet. I do malouda was sh*te. I do think A. Cole was sh*te, i do think lampard was sh*te. I do think Alonso was sh*te, and i do think that Riise was sh*te. thats it really, in a nutshell.

right, except for the very first thing i said, which was (let me repeat it, i know you are a pool supporter): "If one was because Rafa didn't rate Florent and didn't think he'd hack it in the Prem, well, I think the first few games have shoved that theory up his @ss." where does that say money? what about that has to do with cost? it doesn't -- it's all about how good of a player he is. and maybe you'd have known what i was saying if you had actually watched the lad. don't come on here talking sh*t about Malouda without having all the facts at your disposal, son. (and i know, i know what your response will be. "i wasn't talking about Malouda's skill, I was defending Rafa's criticism of Malouda's greed," blah blah balh. but inherent in any argument about worth is how skillful a player is. and if Malouda is integral to our style of play, and helps us win the league (you remember what that is, right??), then Roman can sell off one of his eight yachts to buy him and i couldn't give a f-ck all. of course you do; because you're myopic and so are your enture group of supporters. well, of course, you wouldn't think that. but deep down inside, the rest of the Premiership nodded knowingly when Mourinho called out Arsene Wegner for being a hypocrite a few years ago, and when he railed against UEFA for their patronizing attitude and favoritism towards some of the more established clubs, and when he mocked the referees for playing with a different set of rules with Man United. please - an establishment obtuse yes-man like 90% of the other managers (yours included) don't have the b@lls to state the obvious like Jose did. he's criticized for it, because the media are used to going along with whatever SAF says, but the average person on the street knows that he speaks the truth. i dont know where this is coming from... I havent criticised Malouda a single time, not once, read back and check. I havent questioned his worth either, not his worth to you, nor his worth in terms of contract, not once. My opinion of Jose is from a non chelsea perspective, much like your view of rafa is from a non liverpool view. Personally there a very few things i have heard from Jose that i have thought are anything other than self promotion and stirring the pot or mind games. there is the odd good point, but i dont think its a high percentage, but thats opinion. i wont mention malouda again, because you seem to think i am saying something i am not and it will only go round in circles and piss other people off. and FAO lofty, whatever, I.ve tried being reasonable, the reason i sent pm's was to not let it be other peoples business and to not bother everyone with what i was saying. what is the point when you post parts of my pm's (which were not offensive unlike some of the replies) into more than one public post. Just ignore me or keep it private.

it is obvious the two of them have a great deal of respect for one anothers abilities, even if you and i dont. you have to remember these are games to both of them, and the rpess lap it up and slap it onto the back pages.

that won't do you any favours. i know, but you can't blame me surely! in case it was not obvious, that was tongue in cheek.

You don't even realize you just demeaned your own boss, Rob. You say Benitez dropped his interest, and *one* reason was because of money, implying there are other reasons. If one was because Rafa didn't rate Florent and didn't think he'd hack it in the Prem, well, I think the first few games have shoved that theory up his @ss. And if Rafa thought Malouda's price tag was too high, I guess he doesn't understand the value of the current market, because I think every Chelsea supporter thinks he's worth every cent. And every neutral observer (read: not a scum sycophant) who has seen his impact so far thinks he was well worth the cost as well. The difference between Jose and Rafa is that when Jose speaks, other managers and fans get upset because deep down they know he's right, even if they won't admit it. When Rafa speaks, the other managers and fans just laugh because he is delusional. i dont understand where you are coming from. Me saying one of the reasons doesnt undermine rafa in any way shape or form. Typical chelsea fan response though, the two things you think i'm talking about (i say think, i should say guess) are both about money, how about desire to play for the team, ahopw about attitude. Malouda has apparently played well, i havent seen any of your games yet, but no-one can say benitez didnt think he could hack it. Then finally, you say other teams fans laugh when rafa speaks and dont get upset, just take a look at your boards every time we meet. I can promise ours are not filled with upset, we think Mourinho is a tool, and personally i cant remember the last time i heard him say something and thought, yes thats a good point this man talks a lot of sense. Perhaps it was just before he joined you lot and came out with that special one bollocks!

I do realise that this is the point you are making - the point I was making was that it is entirely possible that he did choose us over you because you are possibly making the error of assuming that our interest was only apparent after his move to you fell through. Do you honestly believe that Chelsea went from a postion of having no interest in a player to forking out ?13.5m for him in just a matter of weeks? I very much doubt it - just because our interest was not splashed across the newspapers and there was no formal bid doesn't necessarily mean there was no interest. Maybe he decided against Liverpool because the word came in via his agent that Chelsea were prepared to firm up their offer. Maybe not. It is all speculation on my part, but no more than yours is that there was 'clear air' between Liverpool not signing him and Chelsea signing him. the only thing there i disagree with, Loz, is that "he decided against liverpool". He maybe would have, but we dropped our interest, we decided against him. thats the only thing i want to clear up.

to give an outsiders view, i hope he doesnt learn and continues to be the stroppy, immature, spoilt little kid he seems to be, because when he does mature he is going to be awesome. He is a cracking player and i can only hope he cracks and lets himself down.

Loz, the point i am trying to make, which seems to be missed over and over again, is that he didnt choose you over us, he chose you after we dropped our interest. He didnt turn us down, we stopped trying to sign him, whatever the reasons. I dont think you werent interested at the time, but i do think you hadnt made any progress towards signing him at that time. All i am saying is we decided not to continue our attempts to sign him, you made attempts to sign him, and did sign him. I think it is wrong for benitez to suggest the only reason he is at chelsea is becuase of money, but i think that is the major factor that stopped benitez continuing his efforts to sign him. I also personally doubt that benitez beleives he only went to chelsea for money, but having said that these are the words printed in the newspaper, not necessarily all of the words benitez has said. before every game between us over the last few years, perhaps their first season the only exclusion, the papers have printed all sorts of sh*t from our manager and players, i hate to hear it, but the press undoubtedly know that it is the best way to get a story because on every occassion other than this one Jose has been more than happy to respond.

he didnt choose chelsea because they would pay him more, and there would be no stories, i cannot understand how you are missing this. All it is, is that Benitez dropped his interest, and one of the major factors in him dropping his interest was that malouda wanted too much money. It has F*** all to do with what you were/are willing to pay him, it is to do with what we werent. If we had been willing to pay what he wanted and benitez been encouraged enough that he wanted to join us then he may still have chosen you over us, but as it is we dropped our interest. Listen Rob. Let me tell you something ok. Your mask as the Reasonable Voice of Scouse-Gittery is starting to slip. Here you're saying that Malouda only went to Chelsea because you didn't want him. And here I am saying that as usual, you are well and truly full of sh*t. you need to re-read what I have said lofty. Simple as that. He went to chelsea for a number of reasons, one was drogba (probably), one was that you will be challenging for the title, one will be the money you were willing to pay for him. What I am saying is that we stopped our interest when it was obvious he was after too much money and not wanting to play for us enough. the two are unrelated. If you remember we spoke with him before you did, so removing our interest at that point means that we were never directly vying with one another for his signature.

It's not so much his attitude but the fact that he's a t*at. i was asking BlueBeard to be honest, but as you replied Moos, why do you think he is a twat, is it because of the robeen debacle?