Sorry for being blunt here...But, how many red cards does he need to get in order for him to understand that you cannot tackle people with two legs from behind (referring to West Ham game)???

He should have been sent off...no question about that!!! He was doing the same thing when he first arrived and JM disciplined him for that strongly and he understood the message. Now, he is back at it again! And, I don't think AG has any authority in that mater.

Don't get me wrong. He is a great player, and the 2nd half he played extremely well...but, someone has to put him on the ground and let him know he cannot behave like a mongoloid moron on the pitch!!

Again, sorry...but he really pissed me of with that tackle!!

Sorry for being blunt here...But, how many red cards does he need to get in order for him to understand that you cannot tackle people with two legs from behind (referring to West Ham game)???

He should have been sent off...no question about that!!! He was doing the same thing when he first arrived and JM disciplined him for that strongly and he understood the message. Now, he is back at it again! And, I don't think AG has any authority in that mater.

Don't get me wrong. He is a great player, and the 2nd half he played extremely well...but, someone has to put him on the ground and let him know he cannot behave like a mongoloid moron on the pitch!!

Again, sorry...but he really pissed me of with that tackle!!

I never thought it was that bad a tackle, a Yellow was the right punishment, no intent to hurt and if you looked at the way the Spammers were going in (and often getting away with it) you could see what got his back up.

Definately Grants fault then as when he done it in the Man Utd game he hadn't even taken a training session

Definately Grants fault then as when he done it in the Man Utd game he hadn't even taken a training session

Due to the Jewish sabbath of passover!!

Definately Grants fault then as when he done it in the Man Utd game he hadn't even taken a training session

Due to the Jewish sabbath of passover!!

Yes mate the mans religion should take a Backseat now he's manager here not really importent to him I dont suppose.

Definately Grants fault then as when he done it in the Man Utd game he hadn't even taken a training session

Due to the Jewish sabbath of passover!!

Yes mate the mans religion should take a Backseat now he's manager here not really importent to him I dont suppose.

Nor was turning up for your 1st day as manager of one of the biggest club's in the world, who were meeting their biggest rivals the next day.

Due to the Jewish sabbath of passover!!

Yes mate the mans religion should take a Backseat now he's manager here not really importent to him I dont suppose.

Nor was turning up for your 1st day as manager of one of the biggest club's in the world, who were meeting their biggest rivals the next day.

I dont know much about religion but I do know that people that take it seriously take it very seriously, I dont suppose he's ever worked on that period in his life and whatever your own faith, (or lack of)that deserves respect.

I would not expect 1 training session to have made much impact anyway as you dont think 15 games and the training in between has.

Mikel should not have been sent off against Wet Spam but I thought that he would see the red card to be honest.

I do agree that Mikel have to learn not to make stupid tackles and he has to learn it fast. He has already got three red cards and God knows how many yellow ones. And he's only 20 years old. Must be some kind of a record.

He needs to sort this out. He was getting better but now he's back at it again.

He's a liability and if he can't fix this little problem then I would like us to sell him even though he's a huge talent and a potential future star.

Mikel should not have been sent off against Wet Spam but I thought that he would see the red card to be honest.

I do agree that Mikel have to learn not to make stupid tackles and he has to learn it fast. He has already got three red cards and God knows how many yellow ones. And he's only 20 years old. Must be some kind of a record.

He needs to sort this out. He was getting better but now he's back at it again.

He's a liability and if he can't fix this little problem then I would like us to sell him even though he's a huge talent and a potential future star.

I think it would be a very big mistake to let Mikel go,

He is so young and yet looks so composed on the Ball you just know he is going to get better and better,

getting better will include growing up a bit as everyone does between 20 and 25 so I am sure he will calm down a bit,

I used to think Carvalho was a bit prone to lunging in and pulling shirts and in fact I used to call him Redcardo Carvalho because he worried me so much,

he never had age as an excuse and has settled down to be one of the best CBs in the League.

Selling him would be insane! He is one of the most gifted youngsters in football (notice I said 'one of' not 'the most gifted') and he is still very young and also doesn't have the benefit of years and years of top drawer coaching that some of the other 'top youngsters' have had.

The boy has a very very bright future.

Selling him would be insane! He is one of the most gifted youngsters in football (notice I said 'one of' not 'the most gifted') and he is still very young and also doesn't have the benefit of years and years of top drawer coaching that some of the other 'top youngsters' have had.

The boy has a very very bright future.[/quote]

Which is why we'll sell him to Arsenal for less than £1m in about 2 years time

Which is why we'll sell him to Arsenal for less than £1m in about 2 years time

Nah the current manager is a savvy fella, not like that last bloke, talk about a loose cannon!

Some of you got off the topic here!

I never said we should sell him, he has a great potential!

But, a proper slap or two from someone should do the trick!

Which is why we'll sell him to Arsenal for less than £1m in about 2 years time

Nah the current manager is a savvy fella, not like that last bloke, talk about a loose cannon!

If he had that much savvy he'd have left the dug-out when it got a bit overheated and told his players to keep their heads. About a minute before the Mikel tackle I said 'someone's gonna lose it soon' and it was Mikel who nearly got sent off. West Ham were frustrating us at this point and Mikel lost it. I was expecting a stern look or bollocking from the manager but it never came.

I was expecting a stern look or bollocking from the manager but it never came.

What makes you think he could see you

seriously I expect he made himself clear in the half time talk, Mikel was much better second half.

If I remember correctly it all happened within a 1-2 minute period after Sidwell's hard, but fair, tackle on Parker was wrongly penalised. Within no team Mikel steamed in and got his booking and then Kalou took out Boa Morte. It definitely came across as a case of two young heads losing the plot amongst fairly constant provocation hwoever if I was to lay any blame anywhere for that not being dealt with by a figure in authority then that would rest with JT not Grant. JT is the captain on the park and the man in the field of play and he has direct access to his plaeyrs to tell them to keep the head.

If I remember correctly it all happened within a 1-2 minute period after Sidwell's hard, but fair, tackle on Parker was wrongly penalised. Within no team Mikel steamed in and got his booking and then Kalou took out Boa Morte. It definitely came across as a case of two young heads losing the plot amongst fairly constant provocation hwoever if I was to lay any blame anywhere for that not being dealt with by a figure in authority then that would rest with JT not Grant. JT is the captain on the park and the man in the field of play and he has direct access to his plaeyrs to tell them to keep the head.

Agree, but Mikel tackle did happen right near the bench, nowhere near JT

Did it? I thought it happened in more of a central position - only saw the game on a stream though and didn't see MOTD so I bow to the fact you were at the game. However by the time the tackle happened a glare or a bollocking was a little bit of bolting the stable door after the horse had bolted. He was already in the book by then (and judging by his reaction he knew he was lucky not to be red carded) and that should be sufficient to make him wise up - at least until half time.

All I'm saying is (no dig at Grant) that you could see someone was about to go into the book, it was getting heated, WH fans were shouting 'Ole' to their every pass and you could see it was getting to us. Just needed someone telling them to keep their heads.

When it came there was an 'OOooohhh' as soon as Mikel went in because we could all see it coming.

I must have watched a different game than some of you.

I thought Mikel was one of our best players, certainly the best in the middle of the park.

He does have to sort out his temper and realize he is being targeted by the opposition with a view to rattle him and force him into some rash tackles. He needs to grow up and start learning from his mistakes.

The worst part about it that he, like Essien now has a reputation of being a dirty player which makes them marked men in any match.

Abe

Quite a few people thi8nk he had a good all round game. The whole issue of being a marked man is sadly inevitable if you are prone to the odd rush of blood to the head in the way Mikel and Essien are (unless your name is Gerrard that is). Whether it is right or wrong that refs pick those players out is another argument however it is a reality. Mikel should take a good hard long look at how Makelele plays and he will quickly learn that you rarely need to commit yourself to full blooded tackles when playing in the holding role. Not doing that means you save your bookings for those 'tactical fouls' that Maka is the master of.

Selling him would be insane! He is one of the most gifted youngsters in football (notice I said 'one of' not 'the most gifted') and he is still very young and also doesn't have the benefit of years and years of top drawer coaching that some of the other 'top youngsters' have had.

The boy has a very very bright future.

If he can control his temper and stop making stupid tackles then, yes, he will have a very, very bright future.

I don't want us to sell him but if he can't improve mentaly within the next 2-3 years or so then I actually wont mind selling him.

However, I think he will get better so we probably won't have to sell him

The frustration comes from the fact that the english game doesn't allow you time on the ball and because refs generally will let little niggles go more often than not. I seem to remember Fabregas getting sent of a couple of times in a similar fashion.

He will learn over time.

He could certainly learn from Maka how to break up the play and foul without getting penalised, but I hope we see a much more rounded game from him. Just because he starts in place of Maka doesn't mean he has to play the same game.

He could certainly learn from Maka how to break up the play and foul without getting penalised,

IN fairness to him that is a lot harder to do when you stand head and shoulders above just about everyone else on the pitch. As soon as a player bounves off him refs assume it is a foul whereas Maka gets away with a bit of 'subtle' angling of the body weight.

I think the main thing he can learn from Maka is that 99.9% of the time he doesn't need to tackle like there is a steam train up his rear end. Simply sticking with the player and making life difficult for him is often more than enough to either slow the game down thus allowing your defenders to get into position or to force him into a slack ball or a bit of mis control which then would allow Mikel to get his foot in and win the ball.

Mikels main problem is born out of his classy style. He hardly rushe's a pass, and is learning to choose the right option. He does have a certain 'lethargic' technique to him, and when teams press quickly, and high up the pitch against us, he isnt given that extra second. Alot of the time he was getting caught on the ball, rather than releasing it faster, to compensate for West Ham's game plan.

It was frustrating to watch, let alone play in.

Mikel did loose it, and it's something that he will grow out of, to a certain extent. To let the boy leave us due to his attitude at 20 would be ludicrous. Barring Fabregas or maybe Anderson, no-one comes close to his quality for such a young age.

All the senior players had a word with him, right after the incident occurred. (Drogba, Terry & Lamps). Which is what you would expect.

I think the main thing he can learn from Maka is that 99.9% of the time he doesn't need to tackle like there is a steam train up his rear end. Simply sticking with the player and making life difficult for him is often more than enough to either slow the game down thus allowing your defenders to get into position or to force him into a slack ball or a bit of mis control which then would allow Mikel to get his foot in and win the ball.

You see, I thought that was pretty much how he played for most of the match. The bad tackle came from frustration at being constantly nipped at by the West Ham midfield. If you look back at where he has got himself in to trouble it has either been from cynical fouls (shirts tugs etc), or frustration, either at himself when he loses the ball or with the opponent.

Hopefully he will be able to get a grip of that aspect of his game. He is clearly capable.