ethicalstrategy

Safari all the way for me.

A point well made!

It is'nt painfull to have optimism in fact it's pretty useful What you seem to miss out on in the message of the post is that suprisingly we hav'nt done too bad, You can keep coming back to the losses in the big games and I can keep quoting the dire circumstances involved in 2 and the lack of spirit involved in the other 2 and these will be our opinions so we will argue them for ever, what you surely cant argue is that we are in a better position and have done better in competitions than many of us would have imagined in September. Good to see you still stamp the end of your post with the point taken As you know, I couldn't disagree with you more. But it passes the time of day. And "not doing as badly as you thought we might" is a philosophy of sorts I suppose. I doubt it is the bedrock for success though. You may be surprised to learn that I am an optimist by nature, but if I am going to be optimistic I need something to fuel that optimism. At the moment the tank is empty.

Well let me be the first to answer your question Chippy No, we haven't done that bad. Or rather, I think you are asking has Grant done that bad. Still the answer is no. Overall he has done pretty well. Unfortunately for him and for us too, he hasn't been able to win the big matches. The one's that really matter. The one's that result in silverware. We are still in with a shout of two competitions - the two which, given a choice, I would take over the FA and Carling Cups. If we can go on to win those then I will be so very happy and more than happy to back Grant as manager for the longer term. In the meantime I shall continue to support the team and any doubts about Grant will be restricted to this forum. If we end up trophyless this season then I will want a change of manager. To sum up. As it stands Grant is 0 for 2 in the two best chances for silverware this season. He has a lot of hard work to do to pull that back. Oh, and my glass seems to have a hole in the bottom of it!

Damn right... Even if Grant had a record of 0 wins, 0 draws and 30 odd losses, i'd still expect every damn player on the park to be trying their very best. I always have a problem with this question of trying or otherwise. There are cases, obviously, where an individual player, for whatever reason, is not trying hard. It usually comes from some kind of fallout with the manager or club. But I don't really get the idea that a whole team of players isn't trying. They may have played crap - as was the case against Barnsley - but I see it more as a symptom of a team that is not really understanding what is required of them on the pitch. You see it a lot. A team has a change of manager and all of a sudden the same players seem to improve. Or in this case, a change of manager and the same players get worse. In a team everyone has a role to play. If the role of the leader is not being performed well then the team will drift. It needs that leadership to make it function to the best of it's ability. Even a 5% slip and the difference can be marked.

I absolutely agree that the team selected ought to have been able to beat Barnsley. (and that Grant should stay until the end of the season) But you see what can happen if you don't take these matches seriously. Leadership comes from the top. Any sense that this wasn't a crucial game takes the edge off the team - you might argue that it is wrong that it should happen, but it is the reality. We saw it happen. The comparison is with the team that Barnsley beat in the last round. Benitez is a master at either underestimating or not caring about the FA Cup and CC Cup. The result is they get knocked out by smaller teams on a regular basis. If you want to make changes then that's fine, but you keep the spine of your first team and you keep a strong bench to give you options if it isn't going well. I don't think any of the above is rocket science.

I never like these statements that claim "it would never have happened under Jose". People can argue over them. It's just an opinion and there is no way to prove it one way or the other. I much prefer to say: "In three years as manager, it NEVER DID happen under Jose" That's a fact. No-one can argue it.

Assuming that they were able to play if needed, and that's just my guess, I have no firm facts to back it up, then I'd have had them on the bench as insurance. I don't say that with hindsight, I thought it at the time. I agree that we ought to be able to win against Barnsley without them, but I would have been happier bringing Lamps and Drogba on to help win/save the game than Pizarro and Kalou. All goes well they can stay on the bench so no harm done. I hear that Frank will be "fit" for Derby on Wednesday. I hope that isn't saying we don't care about the FA Cup, let's concentrate on the league.

Same here ES. I'd bet my mortgage neither is actually "injured". I seem to remember Grant saying in his pre match interview that they were both "a little bit injured" or something similar. Smacks of arse covering to me.

I wonder exactly how injured Frank and Drogba are. I'm guessing if it had been a CL match that both would have been fit to play. When the team was first announced on the official website there was no mention of any injury to either.

Damn! I just can't get anything by you Chippy

You may well be right Loz and perhaps I am being too harsh on Joe on this occasion as a reaction to that. But I really didn't feel that anyone came out of the match with any credit and so it is hard to read so many comments saying everyone was crap apart from Joe. Then again, we all see things differently. There are even those who think that Grant is doing a decent job! I know, you can hardly believe it!

You just can't bring yourself to praise him can you ES? Didn't do anything with the ball? Did you have your eyes shut or something? On a day when he was head and shoulders above everyone else and created a number of scoring chances that others f****d up, you still have to have a little dig. Very Sad. I didn't have my eyes shut. I saw plenty of effort but precious little substance. A number of scoring opportunities? Really? That's funny, because I don't recall us have many scoring opportunities. I can think of lots of good little bits of play from him. I saw lots of little flicky tricks, but nothing came at the end of any of it. The guy is an England international and whenever he got in a good position he didn't produce. I'm not singling him out. Far from it. But he was just as crap as the rest of them yesterday. Man of the Match is not a title that he deserved - and nor did any of the Chelsea players.

I'll have a pint of that too please Loz

But neither of those teams was coming off the back of any success. In Man U's case they hadn't won the league for many years. And Fergie very nearly did get the push. He was certainly under a lot of pressure. In our case we had just won two league titles and 3 cups. Grant and Abramovich have taken us backwards. That's why many are unhappy. We had success, unprecedented success and somehow the club have managed to f**k it all up. I don't want us to continue going backwards which is what will continue to happen under the current management regime. No point in changing now, but in the summer we have to.

No-one. It would be an insult to the fans to even suggest one in my view. And you might want to change the Joe Cole entry to Joe " I might think the FA Cup matters and run around a lot, but I still didn't do anything with the ball even though I had more of it than anyone else" Cole

Give it a rest duckie. You are getting boring. The good thing about this forum is that people can have different opinions without it descending into personal abuse or vendettas.

It amazes me that people still want to be apologists for Grant. I agree there is no point in sacking him now, but he has to go in the summer.

This is a wind-up, right? Only the FA Cup? Priorities elsewhere? We have run out of priorities, mate, by the way we have been playing. We stand no chance in hell of winning either the league or the CL, with the Arse, the Scousers and Manure out, the FA Cup was our only chance of winning silverware this season, IMO. And you bet your arse Grant is to blame, but I'll give you that the players are to blame as well. But Grant couldn't mould a paper maché glob of nothing in a decade, let alone a completely new team in a couple of years. Val, I was just about to explain about irony/sarcasm to someone else!

Except that these were the same players that won the FA Cup and Carling Cup last year (give or take) The variable is? Answers on a postcard err well actually three of the starting eleven didn't feature last year - Belletti, Anelka, and Malouda - all three of which appalling today. I did say give or take. And none of those three had to play. Drogba could have played, as could Ferreira and Kalou or Mikel. But my point still stands. What we are missing might manifest itself on the pitch, but it comes from the top - the man who runs the team.

Except that these were the same players that won the FA Cup and Carling Cup last year (give or take) The variable is? Answers on a postcard

I can go with that as a strategy!

Don't forget, it's only the FA Cup. Our priorities are elsewhere. Anyway, you can't blame Grant, he hasn't had the opportunity to scrap this team and buy a whole new one and then mould it for a couple of years. Still, he'll get us all fired up for a famous win against Derby on Wednesday - which will be nice.

Just a pity Bridge ran off and let their player have a free cross for the goal.

Not unless they are giving out 4 points for win these days.