Valerie

Clearly not good enough to beat Argentina. Even if England had beaten a much more wiley and clever Argentina, I would not have put a single penny on them beating Spain in the final. England haven't been worth a cheeky punt to win the World Cup for ages. As someone said earlier (sorry, can't remember who), England are theTottenham Hotspur of international tournaments.
But.. it's the Euros in 2 years' time, time enough to gather new hope!

And England aren't good enough.

And the twat can still f**k off

Which points do you want me to debate?
If it's about leaving some players behind who are better on the ball, yes, I agree we should have brought some differernt players. I don't watch much beyond CHelsea, so can't comment on players form this year, but I would have brought people like Trent, Foden, maybe Wharton who had a good season I believe. And left people like |Henderson, Chalobah, etc... at home. He could have used Mainoo in the middle as well.
If it's about him failing to change the mindset - yes, he did. But this is something I don't think you can lay entirely on the manager. You can try as hard as you like, but you can't change what's going on inside another man's head, and if 11 of them decide that they are under too much pressure to push forward and naturally retreat, it's very hard to change that. In that scenario where the team is going against instruction and won't do anything but defend, I'm not sure there are many managers who could motivate them out of it.
I agree with a lot of the points in isolation. What I don't agree with is laying 100% of the blame on the manager, when clearly the players were A) either not good enough, or not mentally/physically up for the fight, and B) didn't do what the manager wanted them to do.

I agree he has ultimately failed. I just disagree with the notion that it is all his fault and its as simple as making attacking changes to change the defend first mentaltiy that largely came about cause everyone was fatigued.

Often wondered does a footballer playing for the Netherlands get a Dutch cap ?

Our track record in both the World Cup and the Euros is not winning the competitions, regardless of who the manager is. The players could be part of the reason. Tuchels tactics were poor v Argentina late on given the outcome, but we have hardly been in sparkling form throughout the competition, and indeed in other competitions. Clearly there's something missing. The players are probably as a group not top level. And our expectation is probably too high - mine certainly increases as a competition progresses, right up until reality cuts in.
We had the World Champions in trouble at 1-0 and should have crushed any hope they had of a comeback, a top level team would have done that. Not one player, well maybe Pickford, stood firm in the closing stages they were all overwhelmed.

Sad news for us. He's been a very good, consistent defender. Far better than the French trio we spent megabucks on and now can't sell. I know the club have to raise money - and we've been good at that over the years - but his departure weakens the squad IMO.

I must say, that's quite a nasty over reaction to England getting beaten.

He's a legend in my eyes. Bellingham's a twat.

Great move for him.

Tell us how you really feel...

Side note with all this Falklands talk:
When my family used to run a gite in the Southwest we had a family stay that were really nice.
They even had us over for a barbecue and while chatting we found out the dad was the second in command on the Conqueror during the Falklands war.
He regretted the speed at which they sank the Belgrano, if I recall the conversation (we're talking fifteen plus years ago now) he was very morose about putting three torpedoes into her and giving most sailors no chance...

That’s the trouble all over the globe isn’t it? People wanting to put things back to the state things were at the moment that suits them now.
I wouldn’t like to untangle it all, and I certainly don’t understand enough to even try.
But I detest conflict over it. And I equally detest people who weren’t there, or haven’t been somewhere very similar banging on about conflict. My grandad landed on Sword beach on D-day and fought his way through France before being wounded. Yet he never said much at all about it and definitely never sang about German bombers or anything else like that.
Mini rant over.

Also that Kraut c**t Tuchel can do one. sh*t the bed on the biggest stage.
Give it to Super Sam Allardyce for the Euros.
#BritishJobsForBritishWorkers

I’m glad we torpedoed their ships.
I’m glad we defended our British territories.
The only regret I have is we didn’t carry on and bomb the whole backwater country into oblivion to prevent HGH cheats like Messi and men who leave their kids without a father to go and enjoy the city then come crawling back like the horrible rats they are when they realise the grass isn’t always greener and all their sh*t tattoos get them 0 pussy like Enzo f**king Fernandez.
c**ts the lot of them.

Get out!

World class, yet he always disappears for us and had us finishing 10th. If he was world class, why can't he get us into the top 4? I genuinely would love to hear the excuses as to why he always disappears for us and leaves massive holes in our midfield, why he always gives away cheap possession from being too slow or making poor passes. He scores one goal and it's like the rest of his performance gets ignored. Most importantly, why is nobody bidding high for this world class player?
Also, that goal was not world class. Those shots have been Pickford's weakness for years.

Plays better anywhere else but Chelsea

When I see Pickford and Saka et al, sorry, I just cannot root for Ingerland.

What? You are an England fan now?

What? You are an England fan now?

In hindsight, going so ultra defence was a mistake, yes. It was clear that even with 11 behind the ball, Argentina were finding spaces and chances, so swithcing to an extra defender wasn't really going to help with that. The alternative is we push more players up and try to counter and stop them having so much of the ball. Which on paper sounds fine, but in reality, we would have just lost anyway, because they were out running and out fighting us all over the pitch, and were simply man for man, the better team.
Still don't own the falklands, though.

I thought Stones did well today, overall Spence wasn't bad either.

I thought Stones did well today, overall Spence wasn't bad either.