Not saying our board is the best but seeing the results today just shows you how not one top team in the league have a board that are doing everything right.

You have City fans now calling for the head of this supposed football man they have called Txi Belugstein (Sorry 0qI don't know how to spell his name) who other than Kdb has made average signings.=

My point is, despite some bad decision making from our board I'm proud of what we have achieved and wouldn't trade our hierarchy for that of Liverpool city utd arsenal or Spurs.

None of these clubs have natural leaders or a tried and tested successful identity and other than Spurs none have improved from last season.

Edited March 20, 201610 yr by KonaKai Blue

So what happens if Pep gets the best out of Navas, Sterling, Bony, Delph who's been injured a lot, same with KDB.

Makes them like Barcelona where poor CBs don't matter.

Have the board made poor signings then?

What if we win the league next season, Baba becomes a vital and important left back and Pedro helps us win the league?

Are the board forgiven for making what initially looked like poor signings?

Point is it's all it's and buts.

That's the point, you call city signings average where I wouldn't call them all average. I actually think they improved there squad but have massively underachieved.

That's the point, you call city signings average where I wouldn't call them all average. I actually think they improved there squad but have massively underachieved.

Couldn't same logic be applied to Chelsea?

Exactly Lesblues.

Couldn't same logic be applied to Chelsea?

Could be, if City don't get champions league football next year which could happen I would say there performance in the league is nearly as bad as Chelsea.

I still think buying Sterling, KDB, Delph, Sagna, Otamendi is improving a already good squad. City have had loads of injuries this year. Has Nasri kicked a football this year, then injuries to Silva, Aguero, Kompany, Delph, KDB and now Hart and Sterling.

Exactly Lesblues.

So you think Chelsea improved there squad in the summer?

Of course the squad hadn't improved from last season apart from the addition of pedro who has been decent at times the summer transfers have been a disaster. The squad is terribly unbalanced. Fans keep talking about Baba getting more games but the two mangers who have been at the club this season haven't played him and from what I have seen myself we have a better left back on loan at Watford in Ake. It's been a complete waste of a reported fee of 21 million. I would like to see us try and get a good fee for Oscar in the summer I honestly thought after his first rest over the summer he would have had a real good season but he is very inconsistent and for me is defiantly not a number 10 he doesn't have that killer pass to play in the role. What we should be doing now is give RLC Kennedy and Bernard full games until the end of the season as well as the young right back Aina. Matic has been very poor this season by his own standards but he should be used in front of the back 4 with RLC beside him I don't know what mangers see in Mikel apart from a few good games over the years he is one of the worst DM I have ever seen. He slows play down only passes side wards players consistently run off him and I don't think I have ever seen the guy sprint. He should def go in the summer.

Edited March 20, 201610 yr by Belfast_blue5

So what happens if Pep gets the best out of Navas, Sterling, Bony, Delph who's been injured a lot, same with KDB.

Makes them like Barcelona where poor CBs don't matter.

Have the board made poor signings then?

 

Just playing devil's advocate here but how funny would it be for City to get Pep with all these finances and these players that he could possibly get the best out of...............and they fail to qualify for the CL this season!!

I think peps in for a shock in England. As this season has shown there is no easy games plus he will need to rebuild that whole team over the next few years

Of course the squad hadn't improved from last season apart from the addition of pedro who has been decent at times the summer transfers have been a disaster. The squad is terribly unbalanced. Fans keep talking about Baba getting more games but the two mangers who have been at the club this season haven't played him and from what I have seen myself we have a better left back on loan at Watford in Ake. It's been a complete waste of a reported fee of 21 million. I would like to see us try and get a good fee for Oscar in the summer I honestly thought after his first rest over the summer he would have had a real good season but he is very inconsistent and for me is defiantly not a number 10 he doesn't have that killer pass to play in the role. What we should be doing now is give RLC Kennedy and Bernard full games until the end of the season as well as the young right back Aina. Matic has been very poor this season by his own standards but he should be used in front of the back 4 with RLC beside him I don't know what mangers see in Mikel apart from a few good games over the years he is one of the worst DM I have ever seen. He slows play down only passes side wards players consistently run off him and I don't think I have ever seen the guy sprint. He should def go in the summer.

Fully agree with all this. One of Mourinhos downfalls was not giving some players a chance. We had perfectly good LBs at the club in Bertand and Luiz, even Ake but none was given a good chance. Tbh Baba has never been given a good chance but he should be given 8 games to prove himself. Chelsea are really better off doing that than playing Iva every game.

It's also a chance for Matic to try and get some form back, he was excellent last season and with the pressure off this could be a good opportunity to get his confidence back.

Like you say I think it's a perfect time to play some youngsters, will Grandad do it, I doubt it he has his draw record to protect.

Your right about Mikel, I don't think he has a go fast. He just seems to jog round the pitch never near the ball. For a DM he doesn't exactly give much protection.

Just playing devil's advocate here but how funny would it be for City to get Pep with all these finances and these players that he could possibly get the best out of...............and they fail to qualify for the CL this season!!

Like they said on MOTD I wounder if Pep has a clause in his contract lol. West Ham are in some good form and Utd could pick up. If I was City I would be worried specially still with Europe as a distraction.

Fully agree with all this. One of Mourinhos downfalls was not giving some players a chance. We had perfectly good LBs at the club in Bertand and Luiz, even Ake but none was given a good chance. Tbh Baba has never been given a good chance but he should be given 8 games to prove himself. Chelsea are really better off doing that than playing Iva every game.

It's also a chance for Matic to try and get some form back, he was excellent last season and with the pressure off this could be a good opportunity to get his confidence back.

Like you say I think it's a perfect time to play some youngsters, will Grandad do it, I doubt it he has his draw record to protect.

Your right about Mikel, I don't think he has a go fast. He just seems to jog round the pitch never near the ball. For a DM he doesn't exactly give much protection.

I don't think Jose signed Luiz why would you sign someone and not give them a far crack at making the LB slot his own. If the club see Baba as the new long term LB he should be given the rest of the season to show what he has but up to now for someone who cost 21 million you would expect him to come straight into the team. Far to many players have been signed and never played which tells me that the manager isn't signing the players. I think the manager must sign the players and be held accountable for the signings he makes as well as introducing some of the younger lads into the team. Some of the fringe players don't even look fully fit because they get no game time what so ever. I watched RLC play against MK Dons in the FA cup and he looked off the pace he seemed to be saving himself instead of being fully fit and able to get about the pitch for the full 90 minutes.

Edited March 21, 201610 yr by Belfast_blue5

I think he meant Luis ... Not Luiz

So you think Chelsea improved there squad in the summer?

 

I honesty think we stood still.

 

Luis is better than Baba I guess, but that's irrelevant as Luis got no game time anyway.

Cech is better than Bergovic, but Bergs didn't put a foot wrong behind an awful defence.

Drogs is better than Falcao but both were on their last legs.

Pedro I don't know who he replaced but he is an improvment to the squad.

 

Just because you spend it doesn't necessarily mean you improve. Yeah City have signed Bony, Delph, Sterling, Ottamendi and KDB in the last 14 months but only KDB has been a success. You could say that they have just wasted a shedload of money as opposed to improving their squad which is why they might not even finish in the top 4.

I honesty think we stood still.

 

Luis is better than Baba I guess, but that's irrelevant as Luis got no game time anyway.

Cech is better than Bergovic, but Bergs didn't put a foot wrong behind an awful defence.

Drogs is better than Falcao but both were on their last legs.

Pedro I don't know who he replaced but he is an improvment to the squad.

 

Just because you spend it doesn't necessarily mean you improve. Yeah City have signed Bony, Delph, Sterling, Ottamendi and KDB in the last 14 months but only KDB has been a success. You could say that they have just wasted a shedload of money as opposed to improving their squad which is why they might not even finish in the top 4.

But City didn't know how those signings would work out. The board went out to improve the squad. The better way to look at it is who has played well for City this season. Only KDB, Aguero in bits and pieces but in the league City have been awful. With City I don't actually rate the manager that highly. The difference is City went that extra bit to improve the squad. They paid the extra money for Sterling which Chelsea wasn't prepared to pay. They went out and payed the big bucks for KDB because they wanted him.

Chelsea wanted Stones but wouldn't pay the money but English players are always inflated in price. Looking at Stones now he don't know get in the Everton team but it's all about ifs and buts. Stones might of been the making of him at Chelsea.

I'm just saying City went out and improved the squad, Chelsea didn't. Looking at how City's signings have worked out is not the point because nearly every City player has been awful.

But City didn't know how those signings would work out. The board went out to improve the squad. The better way to look at it is who has played well for City this season. Only KDB, Aguero in bits and pieces but in the league City have been awful. With City I don't actually rate the manager that highly. The difference is City went that extra bit to improve the squad. They paid the extra money for Sterling which Chelsea wasn't prepared to pay. They went out and payed the big bucks for KDB because they wanted him.

Chelsea wanted Stones but wouldn't pay the money but English players are always inflated in price. Looking at Stones now he don't know get in the Everton team but it's all about ifs and buts. Stones might of been the making of him at Chelsea.

I'm just saying City went out and improved the squad, Chelsea didn't. Looking at how City's signings have worked out is not the point because nearly every City player has been awful.

You made very good points mate but they can be related with our situation. We also didn't know how the signings would work out, most of our players were/are also out of form, city paid extra like KB said doesn't mean they improved, we could as well have brought in Stones/Pogba for over a 100mil as still struggle. Nothing is ever certain.

But City didn't know how those signings would work out. The board went out to improve the squad. The better way to look at it is who has played well for City this season. Only KDB, Aguero in bits and pieces but in the league City have been awful. With City I don't actually rate the manager that highly. The difference is City went that extra bit to improve the squad. They paid the extra money for Sterling which Chelsea wasn't prepared to pay. They went out and payed the big bucks for KDB because they wanted him.

Chelsea wanted Stones but wouldn't pay the money but English players are always inflated in price. Looking at Stones now he don't know get in the Everton team but it's all about ifs and buts. Stones might of been the making of him at Chelsea.

I'm just saying City went out and improved the squad, Chelsea didn't. Looking at how City's signings have worked out is not the point because nearly every City player has been awful.

This is the problem though. You just expect the board to bank roll the club and spend mega money on signings who like City are not guaranteed of success. Like City nearly every Chelsea player has been awful.

Stones for the money Everton were asking for is ridiculous and I'm glad we didn't sign him.

As I keep on saying, champions shouldn't need to improve the squad to avoid the position we were in under Jose. It shouldn't get to such a low level. If we're talking about retaining the league then you would have a point but it was far worse than that.

At this moment you have an abundance of so called big clubs but not an abundance of top players in the market. Just like we have no divine right to win every week, the same applies to signing elite players in the transfer market. Pogba for one is clearly happy at Juve and his first choice looks to be Barca

As I keep on saying, champions shouldn't need to improve the squad to avoid the position we were in under Jose. It shouldn't get to such a low level. If we're talking about retaining the league then you would have a point but it was far worse than that.

 

 

This runs contrary to the things Ferguson used to say about improving a squad when you win the title. It's interesting though to see you say we stagnated this summer rather than weakened the squad. I personally think it's the latter but it doesn't matter. If you stand still in this league you get overtaken and that's because it all comes down to one thing - Ambition.

 

Ambition is what makes talented players into great players. It's what lights the fire in the bellies of those who would be champions. It's what gets fans excited.

 

It's also what we didn't show last summer and it's disappointing to see some supporters condoning that. You appear to defend it by saying that the squad might not have been strong enough to retain the title but we shouldn't have been in 16th spot. 

 

I say that when you start settling for second-best then you have no control over how steep you will fall. The summer before we had a good squad, and we brought in excellent players. What was the message we sent to our players? That we wanted to win and we wanted to win now. 

 

This summer we did the opposite. We let winners leave the squad and we didn't replace them. We didn't sign a single player that other players could see as a threat to their place or as that guy who was going to take us to the next level. We saw the flaws in our squad on full display and did nothing to address them.

 

That is the textbook definition of a lack of ambition and it seems to infect this club from time to time. Either it's by drastically reducing spending so we sign a Sidwell or a Benayoun or a Djilobodgi - half-measures when full measures are needed. Or it's by appointing people to positions of power not because they've earned it, not because they've proven themselves but because they're the boss's mate. Or it's simply by having the best Academy in Europe and not taking a chance on it. Instead we take risks with Patos and Falcaos and Shevchenkos.

 

And that's the issue for me. When it's the same mis-steps occurring time and time again, when the same cycle is repeated over and over and when we come to accept that it won't change, that there won't be accountability at the end of it then you have a major problem and it's at the very top. It's time to stop ignoring that.

The difference I am trying to say is regarding Chelsea's position before Jose left I blame the board, players and manager and not just the manager like some people on this forum have.

Players performance hasn't really picked up since Jose left apart from a couple of players. The board never improved the squad. And Jose lost the dressing room and kept playing the same players.

With City I would actually blame the manager more. The board did back the squad/manager with signings. They spent the extra money for the players they wanted. If pep was manager of city this year I would see the premier league already over.

I look at Chelsea's squad and whoever is manager I can't see that squad alone having a chance of winning the league next year. Where as with City Pep will get them in the hunt without signings.

This runs contrary to the things Ferguson used to say about improving a squad when you win the title. It's interesting though to see you say we stagnated this summer rather than weakened the squad. I personally think it's the latter but it doesn't matter. If you stand still in this league you get overtaken and that's because it all comes down to one thing - Ambition.

Ambition is what makes talented players into great players. It's what lights the fire in the bellies of those who would be champions. It's what gets fans excited.

It's also what we didn't show last summer and it's disappointing to see some supporters condoning that. You appear to defend it by saying that the squad might not have been strong enough to retain the title but we shouldn't have been in 16th spot.

I say that when you start settling for second-best then you have no control over how steep you will fall. The summer before we had a good squad, and we brought in excellent players. What was the message we sent to our players? That we wanted to win and we wanted to win now.

This summer we did the opposite. We let winners leave the squad and we didn't replace them. We didn't sign a single player that other players could see as a threat to their place or as that guy who was going to take us to the next level. We saw the flaws in our squad on full display and did nothing to address them.

That is the textbook definition of a lack of ambition and it seems to infect this club from time to time. Either it's by drastically reducing spending so we sign a Sidwell or a Benayoun or a Djilobodgi - half-measures when full measures are needed. Or it's by appointing people to positions of power not because they've earned it, not because they've proven themselves but because they're the boss's mate. Or it's simply by having the best Academy in Europe and not taking a chance on it. Instead we take risks with Patos and Falcaos and Shevchenkos.

And that's the issue for me. When it's the same mis-steps occurring time and time again, when the same cycle is repeated over and over and when we come to accept that it won't change, that there won't be accountability at the end of it then you have a major problem and it's at the very top. It's time to stop ignoring that.

I understand that you have to improve the squad but it doesn't mean always out spending your rivals. We outspent and showed way more ambition in the market than UTD in 2007 and they still won the league.

Also everyone had us down to retain the title in August, so it's not about settling for second best. When you look at how this season has gone, with a manager of Jose's ability and the squad we had, without the self destruction and lack of so called ambitious signings, no one would've been surprised if we retained the league.

Tottenham are another example this season that you don't have to outspend your rivals to challenge. They have a manager who doesn't whinge, gives youth a chance and just gets on with it.

I'm just not buying all this praise for Pep that he can challenge without signings yet excuses are made for an elite manager in Jose who couldn't even get close to the top 10 with the same squad and a couple of additions who are not bad footballers.

You talking about the 2006/07 season? That's a very poor example without looking at the season as a whole.

I understand that you have to improve the squad but it doesn't mean always out spending your rivals. We outspent and showed way more ambition in the market than UTD in 2007 and they still won the league.

 

You're going to have to show me the figures you're working from and what year. In both 06/07 and 07/08 I have United outspending both in gross and net terms.

 

Also everyone had us down to retain the title in August, so it's not about settling for second best. When you look at how this season has gone, with a manager of Jose's ability and the squad we had, without the self destruction and lack of so called ambitious signings, no one would've been surprised if we retained the league.

 

Who is everyone? Again you're pinning this on Jose and saying we were good enough to retain? Really?

 

Tell me the one signing to make us better. Tell me the one action this club took to go further in Europe. The best you can say is that we stagnated and that's if you take players purely on their technical ability and not on their character. How many European Finals did we lose from that squad? How many league Championship medals? 

 

Who was the one guy who walked into Cobham that made everyone turn to one another and say 'this is the guy'? No-one.