The Wilkins factor .....

[Star]

As a player here on of my all time favourite's, alongside Vialli as coach no thanks. As a coach at QPR and er was it Watford appauling.

At half time tonight he confidently said Joe Cole off, Malouda off, Belletti on the right and Drogba on.

Was it only me thinking his italian influence may be affecting Scolari ?

Bosingwa off Kalou on , Belletti right back.

Ranieri springs to mind.

RUBBISH from the coaches to those on the pitch.

We tried our best to throw it in my opinion, the worst Chelsea performance in Roman's era.

JT's worst ever game in a blue shirt, Malouda as usual crap (never a chelsea player in a million years)

Alex tried, Bridge woeful and thats being polite, Bosingwa iffy but no way substitution material.

Mikel jesus its obvious to me, get him UP the pitch.

Lamps sorry, poor to his standards, Deco looked past it at this level, not a man for the trenches ha ha, Anelka the hat rick never fooled me.

Star, sober but pissed off

[loz]

Just out of interest Star when did you last post after a Chelsea win?

That aside I am also one who thought bringing Wilkins back was a terrible decision although I am not convinced it had anything to do with today's result. This whole issue of whether or not Scolari has the tactical nous to make the big decisions when the chips are down should not be a surprise to anyone - he, time and time again as Portugal manager, impressed people for a limited period then blew it when it really mattered and, so far at Chelsea, he has done nothing to convince he will be any different with us.

[Barn]

Wilkins was bought in to keep the fans happy nothing more. He's not there to coach the first team, Scolari has bought in his own people to help him do that, and he's certainly not there to decide what substitutions to make, they would have got a proper coach/manager with a track record for that sort of thing.

Last night was crap but it wasn't Butch's fault.

[byatt]

if we'd won the game i'm not sure you'd be making the same argument, about the same tactics

[evissy]

He was brought in to talk to press it is as simple as that.

[BLUENUT]

He was brought in to talk to press it is as simple as that.

He was brought it as a PR exercise after losing Clarke, I doubt Scolari had anything to do with it.

The buck stop with Scolari, and against any decent opposition this season he's been found out. Let's not get too carried away when we slaughter preimer league sides who are there to make up the numbers, we've turned into Arsenal of 3 years ago, thrash the whipping boys with fancy patter-cake football, and seriously lose direction when the opposition don't let us knock it about. In all those games we've resorted to lumping it forward as the game wears on and look bereft of ideas. In all of those games Anelka has proved he cannot play up front on his own, and often goes hiding out on the wings.

There's alot of work to be done.

[midlandblue]

Bluenut, do you consider the draw against Man Utd (decent opposition) a bad result/performance?

[BLUENUT]

Bluenut, do you consider the draw against Man Utd (decent opposition) a bad result/performance?

Result/performance - bad/average considering they were there for the taking!

United came to play for a draw, they'd just lost to Liverpool and you won't find many times under Fergie's reign that they lose 2 league games on the trot. They got the early goal and were content to confine us.Their central midfielders pressurised Lampard and Mikel and didn't let them settle, their wide midfielders pressed Boswinga and Cole reducing the width causing the midfeld to be very tight, similar to Liverpool and Spurs who did the same, and similar to Roma over both games - 2 of their goals last night came from not letting Mikel settle on the ball!

My gripe is our lack of ability to change to outcome. When we equalised against Utd, from a set piece, we should have gone for their throat, but seemed content on lumping it forward when we ran out of idea's, same against Liverppol, Spurs, and again last night. We had a big chance to put some distance between ourselves and old red nose, but never went for the kill, and didn't relly look likely to score.

I just think we're a bit one dimesional at times and it's easy to defend against if you set your stall out right.

In all of these games against a relatively decent opposition, Liverpool, Utd, Roma over 2 games and even Spurs we've played 5 games scoring 4 goals, 2 of which were set pieces, Kalou v Utd and Terry v Roma at home. So only 2 goals in 5 games from open play against sides who knows how to defend!!

I think it needs a bit of work, and we're crying out for another striker!

Edited November 5, 2008 by BLUENUT

[Barn]

One of the commentators mentioned last night that Scolari really wants another attacker, someone to offer something different. You've got to remember this season we've pretty much played without a real striker (Anelka is crap) so to be doing as well as we have is a credit to the team - the truth sill come at the end of the season, when you have to assume you've had the majority of your squad fit for most of the season, if we play most of the season without a striker it means we don't have the right squad (Scolari's fault), if we do have a striker and can't score in the big games then there's a problem with the way we're playing.

It just seems a bit early to be claiming that we're not good enough against the big teams, and even if that is the case we need to give the manager a bit of time to put it right (the summer to buy the players he thinks we need).

[midlandblue]

Result/performance - bad/average considering they were there for the taking!

United came to play for a draw, they'd just lost to Liverpool and you won't find many times under Fergie's reign that they lose 2 league games on the trot. They got the early goal and were content to confine us.Their central midfielders pressurised Lampard and Mikel and didn't let them settle, their wide midfielders pressed Boswinga and Cole reducing the width causing the midfeld to be very tight, similar to Liverpool and Spurs who did the same, and similar to Roma over both games - 2 of their goals last night came from not letting Mikel settle on the ball!

My gripe is our lack of ability to change to outcome. When we equalised against Utd, from a set piece, we should have gone for their throat, but seemed content on lumping it forward when we ran out of idea's, same against Liverppol, Spurs, and again last night. We had a big chance to put some distance between ourselves and old red nose, but never went for the kill, and didn't relly look likely to score.

I just think we're a bit one dimesional at times and it's easy to defend against if you set your stall out right.

In all of these games against a relatively decent opposition, Liverpool, Utd, Roma over 2 games and even Spurs we've played 5 games scoring 4 goals, 2 of which were set pieces, Kalou v Utd and Terry v Roma at home. So only 2 goals in 5 games from open play against sides who knows how to defend!!

I think it needs a bit of work, and we're crying out for another striker!

All valid points Bluenut and believe you me I also agree that there is room for improvement, But I dont see the need for major surgery just the return to form/fitness of the players we have. Drogba, Ballack and Essien not to mention Riccy and Ashley Cole returning would transform any team, for the better I might add.

With regard to your concern over our scoring record against certain opposition, not saying I disagree with your concern but again, the forward line without Drogba is not going to be anywher near as effective so I think they have done well.

On the flip side to our attack, our defence, apart from last night, has been in the main pretty solid.

all in all, I'm a happy bunny.

[BLUENUT]

All valid points Bluenut and believe you me I also agree that there is room for improvement, But I dont see the need for major surgery just the return to form/fitness of the players we have. Drogba, Ballack and Essien not to mention Riccy and Ashley Cole returning would transform any team, for the better I might add.

With regard to your concern over our scoring record against certain opposition, not saying I disagree with your concern but again, the forward line without Drogba is not going to be anywher near as effective so I think they have done well.

On the flip side to our attack, our defence, apart from last night, has been in the main pretty solid.

all in all, I'm a happy bunny.

I'm not to concerned to be honest, this wasn't intended as one of those knee-jerk, toys out the pram posts, I'd just like thing's mixed up a bit when we're chasing the game. How about 2 up-front? Every time Drogba's introduced Anelka winds up on the wing, he's even less effective when pushed out there than he is down the middle on his own. There are things we or the manager can do to change games but we seem intent on plugging away with a system that isn't working or is being dealt with by the opposition.

[ozboy]

the team is generally playing much better this season and scoring lots more goals as a result. However it does lack a bit of steel in the really tough games and to that extent is arsenal like. Personally I don't think Scolari's substitutions are that great and I'm particularly critical of throwing Belletti into the midfield against puddle.

However the team clearly is short on numbers compared to two seasons ago. Anelka has clearly got limitations as a striker not the least of which he is ageing. Compared to Berbatov, Rooney or Ronaldo not in the same class, even Tevez would be well above. Drogba in my opinion will struggle to regain full form, and will certainly take at least half a dozen matches to do it. He is clearly the kind of player that needs lots of work to get his touch going. And he is old as well.

Kalou will never score the goals he should, just like SWP although I see SWP has already scored more goals for Man City than he ever did in a CFC season.

So we just don't have the talent up front to change games, other than perhaps Ballack and Lampard and Deco, none of whom are young themselves. I don't think Scolari can be blamed for that and it is likely that without a top class striker we will come up short against big teams. If we'd had Robinho we would have been well set up but would have, could have and should have won't win any silverware.

I'd prefer to see Bridge played in the midfield on occasions and not Belleti because Bridge is a ratsh** defender but good going forward.

Edited November 7, 2008 by ozboy

[Bridgeboy]

I very much think he is playing a type of footballing director but without too much of the power and absolutely no say in what players come or go and reports to Big Phil and Big Phil only.

He is as many have said a PR man and he knows his football and is very well liked and much respected through out the footballing world. He also offers stability and a sense that CFC and the CFC players do not forget where they are. Without Wilkins CFC would seem less Chelsea and more an Arsenal which is what we NEVER want ! I say you always what some English touch to the team and the managerial staff. I imagine he did the rounds at half time today at Blackburn and just gave everyone a little pep talk because we needed to keep our witts about us today because I doubt Scolari and his forieng staff we understand let a lone have any experience in these Sunday, north and pissing it down games which if you have any thought of winning the EPL you need 3 points at !

I think he is a credit to the team and the club in general, Simon Greenberg is doing a very good job in relation to Chelsea PR and he seems to be making all the right moves. Well done that man ;)

[BLUENUT]

Wilkins appointment could into a PR disaster. He's clashed with Ince already this week and slated Arsenal for disrespecting the League cup by fielding a team of youngsters, ironically, the night we get knocked out of it,

Nice one Ray.

[dkw]

Wilkins appointment could into a PR disaster. He's clashed with Ince already this week and slated Arsenal for disrespecting the League cup by fielding a team of youngsters, ironically, the night we get knocked out of it,

Nice one Ray.

he didnt slate arsenal for disrepecting the comp, he just said arsenal do it differently to how chelsea will. please dont believe everything the media says. they hyped it up as though he was slagging arsenal off, when he did no such thing.

[BLUENUT]

he didnt slate arsenal for disrepecting the comp, he just said arsenal do it differently to how chelsea will. please dont believe everything the media says. they hyped it up as though he was slagging arsenal off, when he did no such thing.

I still think he is nothing more than a glorifed cone distributor in his role at the club

[dkw]

I still think he is nothing more than a glorifed cone distributor in his role at the club

and you base this on what? have you been involved in the training sessions lately? we have no way of knowing what wilkins`s contribution is.

[BLUENUT]

and you base this on what? have you been involved in the training sessions lately? we have no way of knowing what wilkins`s contribution is.

I think if it was upto to LFS he'd have got in another of his mates or trusted associates within the game, not Ray Wilkins, he hasn't even got a moustache :o

When Clarke left for West Ham I just couldn't see Scolari saying, 'Right that's it, I've always wanted to work with Ray Wilkin's - what he upto at the moment? Get him in, I'd value his input etc.....

It may have happened like that, but I just can't see it to be honest.

I just see him as a front man for the camera's to make the club a bit more PR friendly

[Butch]

I do believe it was a Kenyon appointment, probably with input from senior players such as JT and Lamps.

And while I don't believe Scolari had anything to do with it directly, he was most definitely consulted as to the idea and I am certain the response was positive.

Cheers,

Butch

[BLUENUT]

Perhaps 'The Crab' has had more input than I've given him credit for.

Since the loss of Clarke our results have nose-dived and we seem to be over-playing it way too much, the bulid up is slow and the opposition are all behind the ball when we look like going forward.

It won't be the first time Wilkins as a No2 has been accused of overplaying it, and it won't be the first time at Chelsea either, I think it was the same under Vialli sometimes.

Or perhaps it's just a coincidence, but the results don't lie!

[midlandblue]

I dont think Wilkins is to blame for how our team is performing, just as he should take little if any credit when we perform well. The buck stops with Phil, it's his team and his tactics.

Wilkins is a buffer, nothing more nothing less.

[BLUENUT]

I dont think Wilkins is to blame for how our team is performing, just as he should take little if any credit when we perform well. The buck stops with Phil, it's his team and his tactics.

Wilkins is a buffer, nothing more nothing less.

What do you think about our resluts since Clarke left.....has it effected team spirit or are the performances just a coincidence?

[midlandblue]

Since Carke left we are top of the league so I cant realy complain. As for some of the teams performances in some games, yes they have been poor. Would we be more solid if Clarke was still here? I would say yes. But I believe that Clarke was to negative for both Roman and Phil to achieve their "beautiful footbal" style.

[forbzy]

I think it could have taken Clarke time to work well with Scolari too. He had a long time to establish a relationship with Jose and he would have already known Grant for several months when he took the job. I'm pretty sure Clarke was running most of the team matters during Grant's time too.

I do think we may have lost some of our steel with Clarke leaving though. He was the last link to the Jose era on the coaching side.

[ethicalstrategy]

It's interesting that West Ham seem to have tightened things up at the back recently. I'd wager that was Clarke's influence.