loz Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 Thought I may as well kick off the build up to this game very early as it is now a huge game and one which could see England become the laughing stock of European football. Capello has stated that he can change things (shame it was only talk rather than action yesterday against Algeria) and so it will be interesting to see how big his balls are come team selection. My 11 would be ........................................James............................................... .Johnson...................Dawson.....................Terry...................A Cole .....................................Barry.................................................... ..........Milner...................Gerrard....................................Joe Cole..... ........................Crouch......................................................... ..........................................Defoe........................................... The Gerrard vs Lampard debate rumbles on but for me Gerrard has been marginally better than Frank in the two games (mind you I think Ihave contributed more than Frank in the two games) and gerrard is utterly incapable of playing anywhere bar in the centre. ON the left hand side, call me unorthodox, we need a player who plays on the left hand side! Rooney looks as likely to score as Peter Beardsley at the Miss World competition and should be sitting alongside Lamps on the bench. JOhnson is only in there because we don't hve another right back. JT needs to be reminded that he is not playing in the Premiership and that every time he touches a centre forward he is going to have a foul awarded against him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zola Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 (edited) Slovenia are scoring goals... I think unless there are huge changes to the lineup and team selection England could be done. If Capello sticks to the same lineup and tactics I can actually see England having another 0-0. Or they could even get one put past them. Johnson is a liability. Last night they looked like a Saturday morning team that had been on the piss for two days. Capello needs to make big changes and stop this secrecy of team lineups 2 hours before a game. Edited June 19, 2010 by Zola Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibs Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 Thought I may as well kick off the build up to this game very early as it is now a huge game and one which could see England become the laughing stock of European football. My 11 would be ........................................James............................................... .Johnson...................Dawson.....................Terry...................A Cole .....................................Barry.................................................... ..........Milner...................Gerrard....................................Joe Cole..... ........................Crouch......................................................... ..........................................Defoe........................................... That looks a good line up to me Loz. To be honest you could drop about 8 or 9 of the starting 11 last night, they were that poor. But Rooney, Heskey and sorry to say Lamps were the pick of the worst, along with Lennon, SWP and Gerrard. Can't see Capello being brave enough to start with that line up and as he's just been given a new contract it's not as if his job's on the line anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arq Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 Slovenia are scoring goals... I think unless there are huge changes to the lineup and team selection England could be done. If Capello sticks to the same lineup and tactics I can actually see England having another 0-0. Or they could even get one put past them. Johnson is a liability. Last night they looked like a Saturday morning team that had been on the piss for two days. Capello needs to make big changes and stop this secrecy of team lineups 2 hours before a game. I think you're right Zola. Watching Slovenia play the US, this team can score if they need to. I'm not sure they'll need to score with how England looks. They had a defensive breakdown in the second half, but I would expect that to be fixed. This could very well be another 0-0 match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pauly Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 I'd agree with all that Loz, milner should play and SWP should be 19th choice. Carragher is too slow and something psychological is happening with Rooney and Gerrard. I don't really believe in Barry as a holding midfielder, but Carrick isn't much better. If Rooney plays in this form he'll probably have more chance as a pure striker rather than what he's playing now. Alternatively you could go with: ................................James...................................... .............Carragher.......Terry.........Cole....................... ................................Carrick..................................... Milner.............Gerrard..............Lampard...............Barry .............................................................................. ..........................Crouch........Rooney........................ you know it makes sense ;) Don Fabio said he could change things- he should! He's actually from a place just around the corner from me and within a few kilometers of the Slovenian Border so maybe he'll have some spies in the camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loz Posted June 19, 2010 Author Share Posted June 19, 2010 Carragher is suspended and can't play - I would have dropped him anyway. And no team wiwth Barry playing there makes sense! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigIzz Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 Is their actually anyway that Rooney doesn't start? As much as I'm enjoying watching him fail (ah the joys of not being an English fan and forced to root for him for a month - I pity you guys), he is still the only player on England that has that special quality. I'd definitely play him up top and alone though, smilier to the way United use him. As for Lampard, he should be benched. If we learned anything about Lampard this season, he really only excels in one role. He is not a very versatile player and he has to be used a certain way. If that role doesn't fit your system, then you won't get the best out of him. So either England needs to design their system around Lampards role and bench Gerrard because he doesn't fit in that team. Or just bench Lampard and play Gerrard, whose form is much better and is a more versatile and well rounded player. I think in the end, England and the US will advance like most of us thought. I'd expect both sides quality to show through and to win their next matches. So much for this being an "EASY" group though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randy36 Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------James---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Johnson ---------------------------------------------Dawson-------------------------------------------------------Terry------------------------------------------A.Cole -----------------------------Joe Cole-------------------------------------------------Barry----------------------------------------Gerrard---------------------------------- ------------------------------Defoe--------------------------------------------------Rooney--------------------------------------Couch----------------------------------- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruh Buh Juh Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 (edited) I actually feel glad for England that Carjacker won't be playing, he was an unbelievable liability yesterday. I strongly doubt he'll change much, but the general consensus on phone-ins and forums are that they need Joe Cole. I'd go with this: ..........................James ...Johnson....Dawson.....Terry....A Cole ...........................Barry .........Lennon.....Lampard.....Joe Cole .................Gerrard ..............................Rooney Or something like that. Edited June 19, 2010 by Ruh Buh Juh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ethicalstrategy Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 It has to be 4-3-3 for me. My starting 11 would be: --------------------------------Hart Johnson---------Dawson------Terry-----------Cole --------------------------------Barry ---------Gerrard-------------------------Lampard -----Lennon--------------------------------------Cole ----------------------------Rooney I don't agree with dropping our best players. I'm not arguing that they haven't been pants but on that basis all 11 would have to be dropped. Any formation will mean nothing if Capello can't get them to play with a degree of confidence and self belief. I don't expect him to change all that much and we will probably persevere with the 4-2-3-1 that was such a disaster last night. I'm very unimpressed that he hasn't been able to get the best out of his players. I'd like to see how we fared with Jose at the helm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikstaw Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 Lampard shouldn't play this match... He was very weak against Algeria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkw Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 Lampard shouldn't play this match... He was very weak against Algeria. If we drop all the players that were weak against Algeria it will mean 9 changes at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibs Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 It has to be 4-3-3 for me. My starting 11 would be: --------------------------------Hart Johnson---------Dawson------Terry-----------Cole --------------------------------Barry ---------Gerrard-------------------------Lampard -----Lennon--------------------------------------Cole ----------------------------Rooney I don't agree with dropping our best players. I'm not arguing that they haven't been pants but on that basis all 11 would have to be dropped. Any formation will mean nothing if Capello can't get them to play with a degree of confidence and self belief. I don't expect him to change all that much and we will probably persevere with the 4-2-3-1 that was such a disaster last night. I'm very unimpressed that he hasn't been able to get the best out of his players. I'd like to see how we fared with Jose at the helm. I rate Hart highly but why woulld you throw him in now and have three different keepers in three games? And fair play to you for sticking by Lamps - I guess you haven't got it in you to drop him no matter how bad he plays!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loz Posted June 19, 2010 Author Share Posted June 19, 2010 I rate Hart highly but why woulld you throw him in now and have three different keepers in three games? And fair play to you for sticking by Lamps - I guess you haven't got it in you to drop him no matter how bad he plays!! He did pick Joe though, just for you Nibs! Personally I have no problem dropping the 'best' players. You take a squad to deal with injuries, fatigue and form issues. If you don't use it when your team is playing as poorly as England is then you may as well let them stay in the hotel playing backgammon. When the like of Rooney and Lampard are playing as badly as this they are not your best players anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ws6blue Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 we have to win, but we cant go gunho cos slovenia have proved they are quite talented going forwards......................so we should see this as top 6PL team against top 4 Championship team, so we should pick a system which is fluid, allows us to break fast but not get caught out, so 433/451 is best system - with barry holding - lamps & gerard ahead on either side & milner (if fit) & joey out wide, and stay wide - copy the dutch and make sure plenty room for lamps/stevie to break into..................and play rooney on his own capello's body language last night was awful...........so he has to pick his game up to, and tell the players tomorrow who is playing, then rest of week bedding them in capello fotgotten the best national teams have club team ethics, we looked like strangers yesterday 3-0 england (just like '86 when we had similar problems) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack h Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 I rate Hart highly but why woulld you throw him in now and have three different keepers in three games? And fair play to you for sticking by Lamps - I guess you haven't got it in you to drop him no matter how bad he plays!! I genuinly dont understand all the stick directed Lampards way, Rooney has been our worst player so far and Gerrard has been just as bad as Frank yet why are they still in everyones teams? For once it should be Gerrard who gets the critisiscm, the whole team seems to have been built around him since capello came in yet he still plays sh*t. Lampard should be given the chance to play in the role that suits him rather than being forced into a defensive role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ethicalstrategy Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 I genuinly dont understand all the stick directed Lampards way, Rooney has been our worst player so far and Gerrard has been just as bad as Frank yet why are they still in everyones teams? For once it should be Gerrard who gets the critisiscm, the whole team seems to have been built around him since capello came in yet he still plays sh*t. Lampard should be given the chance to play in the role that suits him rather than being forced into a defensive role. I think Frank must have nicked Loz's pocket money or something. If Ancelotti had listened to him Frank would probably not have got a game for us last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loz Posted June 19, 2010 Author Share Posted June 19, 2010 I can't speak for anyone else but I actually think Frank has been worse (that is the Frank that pays my pocket money to ethical) than Gerrard so far. That doesn't mean I think Gerrard has been good, I think he as been poor, I just think Frank has been terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ethicalstrategy Posted June 19, 2010 Share Posted June 19, 2010 Where as Milner was very good against the USA? England played ok against USA but were very poor against Algeria. Playing Gerrard out wide left is a tactical disaster. He needs to either play in support of Rooney or on the right of a midfield three. Frank was no better and no worse than anyone else against Algeria. The alternatives in central midfield are Carrick and I'm not sure sure who else. It looks to me that the players are not happy with what they are being asked to do. I don't know what has gone on but they look scared to make a mistake. I think that Capello's handling of the goalkeeping situation has certainly alienated some of the squad and may be contributing to the general lack of confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loz Posted June 19, 2010 Author Share Posted June 19, 2010 Milner was greadful against the US and rightly hooked. That was one chance. Lamps has had two and been very poor in both. Milner maybe merits another chance but I don't feel Frank does. A matter of opinion I guess - personally I disagee that Frank was no better or worse than anyone else against Algeria. For me the only player who ran him close to being worst on the park was Rooney. I do agree that the player look like they are playing scared. It seems off that Capello is asking them to play a formation that the majority don't play at club level and it also seems off how happy he is to play players out of positition at such a massive event. How Capello handled the goalkeeping situation shouldn't alienate squad players - if they are that precious they should stay home in the summer and watch reruns of 'Last of the Summer Wine' on UK Gold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PloKoon13 Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 ---------------------Hart Johnson--Dawson---JT-----A Cole ---------------------Barry ----------Lampard------Milner Lennon--------------------------J Cole -------------------Rooney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ethicalstrategy Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 Milner was greadful against the US and rightly hooked. That was one chance. Lamps has had two and been very poor in both. Milner maybe merits another chance but I don't feel Frank does. A matter of opinion I guess - personally I disagee that Frank was no better or worse than anyone else against Algeria. For me the only player who ran him close to being worst on the park was Rooney. I do agree that the player look like they are playing scared. It seems off that Capello is asking them to play a formation that the majority don't play at club level and it also seems off how happy he is to play players out of positition at such a massive event. How Capello handled the goalkeeping situation shouldn't alienate squad players - if they are that precious they should stay home in the summer and watch reruns of 'Last of the Summer Wine' on UK Gold. When you have a situation where proven top quality players - Lampard, Gerrard, Rooney - are underperforming then I would be looking to find out why and rectify it rather than thinking about replacing them. None of the other candidates in the squad come near to being able to play at their level. If the problem was one of attitude or effort then that would be different. As for Lampard, he is usually the first person that gets stick in the press after a poor England performance - often unjustly. It's interesting that he hasn't been the focus of any particular criticism after the last two games. Rightly, the attention has been on the two poster boys, Gerrard and Rooney. Of course, you are entitled to your opinion, however wrong it is :P Perhaps alienate was the wrong choice of word. But the way Capello has handled things has left the players edgy and uncertain. How do you prepare for a big match when you don't know if you will be playing or not right up to the last minute? What does it do for team spirit and confidence if the manager doesn't know who he will play in goal until 2 hours before the first match and then gives up on him after one mistake? If JT makes a mistake will he be dropped straightaway? Or Rooney misses a sitter is he out? Managers get the best from their players by getting their commitment and support and their trust. I don't see that with Capello. I see players that are scared of him and consequently inhibited. I don't know how it will go on Wednesday. We might see the team put in a performance and comfortably go past Slovenia. We might see us scrap to a 1-0 win. Or it might all go tits up. It's probably even money on all three. I do know that I wouldn't leave out one of my best players and best goal scorers off the back of a couple of poorish games. I seem to remember the last time we had this discussion was just before he went on a goal spree of epic proportions. That was prompted by the manager changing his tactics to get the best out of him. Let's hope we see the same thing here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikstaw Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 Joe should play in first squad... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ethicalstrategy Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 I rate Hart highly but why woulld you throw him in now and have three different keepers in three games? And fair play to you for sticking by Lamps - I guess you haven't got it in you to drop him no matter how bad he plays!! I was just picking what I thought was the best team. I would have stuck with Green but I would imagine his international career is now well and truly over after the way Capello has treated him. James could have been one of the all time great keepers if he had the temperament. Hart is the best of the three. As for Frank, I quote your good self when we had a similar discussion not so long ago. I guess it's just as well I am not Chelsea manager as I would have rested Lamps today :D Full post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moos Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 Surely England can't be completely rubbish in three games in a row? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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