Hopefully he gets enough game time to beat it!

I don't think it's any co-incidence that we're keeping more clean sheets when Cech plays.

I don't think it's any co-incidence that we're keeping more clean sheets when Cech plays.

I think you'll find it is.

I don't think Courtois is worse than Cech, but I can't help but feel more confident when Cech plays.

I don't think it's any co-incidence that we're keeping more clean sheets when Cech plays.

I agree, but then again its never going to be a coincidence that Cech, who had dominated with these players for years in the BPL. is getting more clean sheets than the young man coming in to a brand new league with a defensive team he had never worked with before.  Once Courtois has that familiarity/understanding of his team and the league, I suspect we wont notice much of a difference at all.

I don't think Courtois is worse than Cech, but I can't help but feel more confident when Cech plays.

 

I feel the complete opposite, especially when we play good teams and teams willing to pepper the box with crosses.

 

I agree, but then again its never going to be a coincidence that Cech, who had dominated with these players for years in the BPL. is getting more clean sheets than the young man coming in to a brand new league with a defensive team he had never worked with before.  Once Courtois has that familiarity/understanding of his team and the league, I suspect we wont notice much of a difference at all.

 

And how has this manifested itself on the pitch?

Chec has a clean sheet on average every other game over his premiership career

The nearest to this is shmichale who is commonly regarded as one of the greatest ever keepers. He has 0.42

So statistically at least he is the best ever keeper in the premiership.

Some may argue that he has played behind the best defence but I would argue the United won many more titles and had just as good a defence . And that actually, maybe it was every defence that was lucky to have chec behind them. After all him and JT are the constant...

When you pull all that together you can say with confidence that it's no coincidence that we keep more clean sheets with Cech.

I feel the complete opposite, especially when we play good teams and teams willing to pepper the box with crosses.

 

 

And how has this manifested itself on the pitch?

 I apologize as I'm not sure exactly what you are asking so my response may seem simple and snide but here we go.  It has manifested itself on the pitch by us conceding more goals this season than we were last season, averaging .7 goals against a game last season and .9 goals against a game this season.  We have already conceded more away goals than in all of last season.

Chec has a clean sheet on average every other game over his premiership career

The nearest to this is shmichale who is commonly regarded as one of the greatest ever keepers. He has 0.42

So statistically at least he is the best ever keeper in the premiership.

Some may argue that he has played behind the best defence 

 

 

He has. 

 

but I would argue the United won many more titles and had just as good a defence . 

 

 

Don't think he ever had as good a defence as our 2004-05 team's. 

 

When you pull all that together you can say with confidence that it's no coincidence that we keep more clean sheets with Cech.

 

You have to look at the actual games though surely?

 

Ross Turnball would've had a good chance of keeping a clean sheet today, what with Swansea not having a shot on target? That helps doesn't it?

 I apologize as I'm not sure exactly what you are asking so my response may seem simple and snide but here we go.  It has manifested itself on the pitch by us conceding more goals this season than we were last season, averaging .7 goals against a game last season and .9 goals against a game this season.  We have already conceded more away goals than in all of last season.

 

We've also played a more open game this season, but I was actually looking for specific incidents where Courtois's inexperience has shown on the actual football pitch. 

He has.

Don't think he ever had as good a defence as our 2004-05 team's.

You have to look at the actual games though surely?

Ross Turnball would've had a good chance of keeping a clean sheet today, what with Swansea not having a shot on target? That helps doesn't it?

Over the last decade I think I've watched Cech a fair bit, and admtadly I started with beasent... But Cech is the best chelsea keeper I have ever seen and in the top two to ever play in the prem. . The 2005 team... Ahh, chec making world class save after world class save...

You need a world class keeper mad a great defence.

Over the last decade I think I've watched Cech a fair bit, and admtadly I started with beasent... But Cech is the best chelsea keeper I have ever seen and in the top two to ever play in the prem. . The 2005 team... Ahh, chec making world class save after world class save...

You need a world class keeper mad a great defence.

 

Best I've ever seen by a mile.

 

But JT and Ricci were the best partnership I've seen, Ashley was the best-left back I've seen, Makelele and Matic are two of the best defensive midfielders I've seen, Ferreira was half-decent, Gallas was solid, Azpi and Ivanovic are the two best right-backs I've seen and Jose is the best manager I've ever seen.

 

All that helps.

 

My honest opinion is that Courtois is better than Cech is right now. 2012 Cech was a legend, but I'll take 2015 Courtois.

Courtois is better when it comes to dealing with crosses and corners, when it comes to shot stopping there is very little in it, but as I've mentioned before, I still think that ?ech is a tad better. It isn't a coincidence that we concede less goals with ?ech in goal though, the defenders are more familiar with him, he installs more confidence in them and I think he does a better job at communicating with the defenders.

Regarding your comment about Ferreira being half decent, I disagree, in his first two seasons with us, particularly the first season, he was very solid in that right back position, a very good player for a short time.

Best I've ever seen by a mile.

But JT and Ricci were the best partnership I've seen, Ashley was the best-left back I've seen, Makelele and Matic are two of the best defensive midfielders I've seen, Ferreira was half-decent, Gallas was solid, Azpi and Ivanovic are the two best right-backs I've seen and Jose is the best manager I've ever seen.

All that helps.

My honest opinion is that Courtois is better than Cech is right now. 2012 Cech was a legend, but I'll take 2015 Courtois.

Edited January 17, 201511 yr by Floyd25

Courtois is better when it comes to dealing with crosses and corners, when it comes to shot stopping there is very little in it, but as I've mentioned before, I still think that ?ech is a tad better. It isn't a coincidence that we concede less goals with ?ech in goal though, the defenders are more familiar with him, he installs more confidence in them and I think he does a better job at communicating with his players.

 

 

Again, I've not seen any of that on the pitch. 

 

Unless you're saying that Cech's experience and communication skills involved him telling the team not to let Swansea have any shots on target today.

 

Regarding your comment about Ferreira being half decent, I disagree, in his first two seasons with us, particularly the first season, he was very solid in that right back position, a very good player for a short time.

 

 

Yeah, felt I was being a little unfair when I typed that. 

Haha, no I'm sure that he says a lot more to the defenders than don't concede here lads. I think he's good at organising them and keeping them in check, but mainly I think he just installs more belief in to the back four when he's playing.

Again, I've not seen any of that on the pitch.

Unless you're saying that Cech's experience and communication skills involved him telling the team not to let Swansea have any shots on target today.

We've also played a more open game this season, but I was actually looking for specific incidents where Courtois's inexperience has shown on the actual football pitch. 

Im too busy looking for Schurrle's errors to catch Courtois'....jokes!

 

But seriously, I dont have any howlers top of my head because that's not my point and also because Courtois hasn't made many (if any) major or costly errors. Yet at the same time, I cant recall any games where Courtois won the points like Cech regularly has, or even as Thibault has done for Atletico.  Im stating that Cech has played in this league and with this team for over a decade whilst this is Courtois first season with both and while as experienced as a goal keeper can be at his age, he is green compared to Cech.  So to me, those reason alone logically mean that it shouldnt be surprising that Cech would have better stats this season than Courtois.

 

I have no doubt Courtois will be every bit the keeper we expect and eventually make us miss Cech not one bit aside from sentimentality.  Nor is this a statement that we should bench the lad for Cech.  Yet, Courtois has not been as good this season as he was last and I suspect its because last season he was comfortable/familiar with his team/league and this season its all new.

Haha, no I'm sure that he says a lot more to the defenders than don't concede here lads. I think he's good at organising them and keeping them in check, but mainly I think he just installs more belief in to the back four when he's playing.

 

 

See I think Courtois does that too....because he's better.

 

Im too busy looking for Schurrle's errors to catch Courtois'....jokes!

 

But seriously, I dont have any howlers top of my head because that's not my point and also because Courtois hasn't made many (if any) major or costly errors. Yet at the same time, I cant recall any games where Courtois won the points like Cech regularly has, or even as Thibault has done for Atletico. 

 

 

Leicester at home, 1v1 against Nugent. You could probably throw in one of the saves he made against United too.

 

 Im stating that Cech has played in this league and with this team for over a decade whilst this is Courtois first season with both and while as experienced as a goal keeper can be at his age, he is green compared to Cech.  So to me, those reason alone logically mean that it shouldnt be surprising that Cech would have better stats this season than Courtois.

 

I have no doubt Courtois will be every bit the keeper we expect and eventually make us miss Cech not one bit aside from sentimentality.  Nor is this a statement that we should bench the lad for Cech.  Yet, Courtois has not been as good this season as he was last and I suspect its because last season he was comfortable/familiar with his team/league and this season its all new.

 

And despite that, Cech threw in some errors last season that actually cost us points. 

 

I think experience and familiarity can sometimes be overrated. I also think that if this was the Cech of 2012 then I wouldn't be arguing quite so much, but it isn't.

 

My preference right now is for the better keeper and in so many regards, that's Courtois.

Again, I've not seen any of that on the pitch. 

 

Unless you're saying that Cech's experience and communication skills involved him telling the team not to let Swansea have any shots on target today.

 

 

Yeah, felt I was being a little unfair when I typed that. 

  But its even the subconcious and uncommunicated.  I suspect Cech knows in any given situation what Terry will do before Terry even does it, such is their history together and understanding.  Courtois wont have that understanding yet. That extra second of understanding can make the difference between a world class save and a goal.  Yet only time playing together will form that understanding so its not a slight to Courtois' ability.  The lad who eventually replaced Courtois will go through the same thing even if, like Courtois, he is already one of the best in the world even at a young age.

 

PS.  I just want to clarify, I am not arguing in anyway against Courtois.  Im just stating if Cech has slightly better stats this season, its shouldnt be surprising given the context and nor should it be used to slight Courtois.  I mean its Petr freaking Cech playing in his same team and league for over a decade.  I couldnt name you a keeper who, in his first season here, would of shown Cech up.  Its just not to be expected in my mind.

Edited January 17, 201511 yr by Barry Bridges

Cech proving his class with every performance.

Cech proving his class with every performance.

 

You forgot this 

 

Or you didn't actually watch the match. Love Cech but he had nothing to do today so hard to say he 'proved' anything.

You can't let one pro cech post go without having to shoot it down huh. I know where the   must go.

 

Almost at the PL record, hope he gets it.

Edited January 17, 201511 yr by Stim

You can't let one pro cech post go without having to shoot it down huh.

 

That wasn't a pro-Cech post. It was a troll, or you simply didn't watch the game.

 

As it goes, it's in my nature to support young players as they come through. It just so happens that in this case the young player I'm supporting is the second best in his position in world football and an upgrade on his predecessor.

 

But if you'd like to point to one single act Cech made today that supports the theory that your comment wasn't complete tosh then I will happily concede that Cech is better than Thibaut.

That wasn't a pro-Cech post. It was a troll, or you simply didn't watch the game.

 

As it goes, it's in my nature to support young players as they come through. It just so happens that in this case the young player I'm supporting is the second best in his position in world football and an upgrade on his predecessor.

 

But if you'd like to point to one single act Cech made today that supports the theory that your comment wasn't complete tosh then I will happily concede that Cech is better than Thibaut.

Siggy had a shot in the opening moments. A thunderbolt from midfield that crashed off the top left post.  Cech had it covered and had ti been on target, it would of been a world class save.....to be fair, I suspect Courtois would of too..... its the low balls in the corner that seem to be beating him, not the ones hitting top corners.

 

Sorry if that's clutching at straws but thats really all the Swans had today 

Siggy had a shot in the opening moments. A thunderbolt from midfield that crashed off the top left post.  Cech had it covered and had ti been on target, it would of been a world class save.....to be fair, I suspect Courtois would of too..... its the low balls in the corner that seem to be beating him, not the ones hitting top corners.

 

Sorry if that's clutching at straws but thats really all the Swans had today 

 

The only other time he dived for the ball was to stop the ball going out for a corner in the second-half. Absolute worldie.

 

My point is that Courtois is a young keeper who has been out of the side because of injury and yet people seem to be crawling over one another to big up Cech for even the slightest thing. I understand the affinity, I love the big man for what he's done but we've got a young man who is our future and needs our support.

 

It's not even like it's a dodgy youngster - he's the best keeper in the world not named Neuer. If people can't get behind him then what chance do out non-La Liga winning and CL Finalist 22 year olds have?

Still rate Cech above him for now. And saying good things about Cech is not not supporting Thibaut, or not getting behind him.

Edited January 17, 201511 yr by Stim