Chippy

I have been a Chelsea fan for 40 years and know what you are saying but that still wont stop me from arguing the point that to do what we can (not much) to help the best thing is to get behind the team and the Manager and hope the positive attitude of the fans spills onto the field, all the derogatory remarks about the manager or Roman and the rest of the backroom staff give fuel to the fires of the press and the opposition fans alike. Jack, you say "The club is relying on the vast majority of the fans packing up their troubles in their old kit bag and smiling, smiling, smiling, but for those of us with our eyes open - well we only see the slow demise of the status Jose gave us. We were top of the heap for a short time, feared by everyone. Now we are seen as a club without direction, bobbing about in the waters of discontent created by the offing of a great leader" we may be seen as a club without direction at this stage as we have clearly had an unplanned major change, It is being slowly rectified, Clarke looks to be staying(a major plus for me) Ten Cate is here with a good reputation and Grant has quietly done an ok job under the circumstances. the people seeing us as a club with no direction are 1. opposition fans and how they love it and 2, our own fans who are naturally frustrated at losing a great manager and the only man under which we have won the title in their lifetimes, I am frustrated as well, we lost a game since Jose left true but have we a god given right to win them all? if we lose a run of games before we turn this round it will still be excusable as the players have had a shock as we all have. I think we have done pretty well considering. I will not sit all doom and gloom when the Club has clearly got a lot to be thankful for, it could be that with the bad feeling and bad press, with the fact that he seems to always be the bad guy Abromovich could walk then we could be in real trouble. we all see this differently and I thank got pessimism is not one of my strong points, I am not blind to the dangers of what has happened and still could happen but also I am open to the good things that could happen. I hope you hope it turns out the way I want, until then go on venting yoyur frustration on here but please try to get behind the team and manager if you go to the games. can you imagine the happiness we are giving people like Red Rob when he peruses the site and sees everyone slating the club? well Rob mate if you see this, I think it will all be ok and I'd rather be a fan of Chelsea even now at this bad time than any other club, including Liverpool. The sun'l come out tomorrow

Well now youv'e got me when I say think positive I really mean be a bit more hopeful, Its hard for me to argue when as I said I can fully see where your coming from so dont expect to much enlightenment. I would count the positives as well as the ones you mentioned as the club still having ambition, Roman believes he is making it better and why should we doubt him? he has made mistakes but he seems man enough to put his money where his mouth is and try again, yes he meddles in team affairs to much and yes his choice of backroom staff can seem strange but we only know what we here from people somehow once connected with the club or the media in general, we dont really know the facts. what I try to do is look at it as if the man who owns the club i.e Roman wants what is best for it, I find if you believe that it go's a way to thinking he might just have a chance of getting it right, ok he has sacked the man who most people believe was the best we could get but his reasons are only guessed at and that is in the past, I think he will try and try again until he finds the right mix be that of players and/or staff and I doubt he will drop the club like some suggest. the thing is here I am not saying what your saying is wrong I am just saying we should give all the support we can to the team and cub in this difficult time, I have noticed that every derogatory piece of Journalism gets posted, every player with a doubt over his future here or a doubt over Grants credentials gets posted but anything remotely good gets ignored. I am as worried as anyone else here Bluenut but lets just say we differ as when I look on the coffee table beside me, my glass is half full. cheers

Bluenut, Mate are you the king of positive thinking? I always see where your coming from and always harbour the same doubts and worries unyet my way of dealing with it seems so far apart from yours. I was always taught if you dont have something nice to say dont say anything but obviously forums are a great place to discuss both sides of all arguments, anybody can see we have problems here but really digging out more and more people or articles heaping more gloom on the club is not gonna help, lets look at the positives and disregard everything else, or we could all buy the Sun and read how we are going to crumble while the proper top clubs get everything about perfect. cheer up mate, it might never happen

I think its good thinking by Grant to play Maka more at this time, Essien injured, Lampard injured Mikel Suspended, all factors at different times I expect but in any case his experience must be a calming influence. I prefer to focus on Rickys words myself http://www.premiershiplatest.com/news/m ... 55443.html

JT certainly needs a rest, it cost us last season when he was out but to be honest I think this season we have better cover, I would feel comfortable with Ricky and Alex at CB and think Alex will be a good player for us with a run in the team, even Ben Haim is fair back up I just think we have seen what he has but Alex may have more to come. JT has not been himself lately due to the injuries although still been good, I would rather he rested and was fit for our CL matches as I think we could do well in the competition. What we cant replace is his leadership though and we need to rely on Lampard to be maybe a louder type captain in his absence, also DD to rally the team and fans like we know he can. I selfishly hope JT misses both England games and gets fully fit before coming back even for us.

All fans speculate about possible signings true but with whats gone on at Chelsea I just feel its best to let it settle as much as is possible, let the new people see what they can get out of the players we already have before we start bringing new players in, we have players who if they could rekindle what they have shown in the past would be quality and if we sold them on current form would be worth very little, other players used differently could also be better than they have been and we could be changing players and waiting for new players to get used to the premiership when we already have them here. I dont doubt we need one or two players and if I had to say where it would be a striker and a playmaker but my feeling is we might already have them.

Bluenut, youv'e got me nodding again

I think the break has come at a good time for us, on the back of a couple of decent results and with Cate coming in maybe it could help. I thought the corners were a bit better against Valencia but defensively still bad, mind you now Lamps is back perhaps he should practice them if he is going to be taking any, as Evissy says though Malouda and Joe might be better bets maybe Frank will pick up a few clearances that way.

It's hard to Judge as Rijkaard seems to be happy to give Lionels hair a free role while Jose always made sure Joeys was neat and tidy, I am sure both are head and shoulders above Ronaldo's slicker style though

http://www.sundayherald.com/sport/shfoo ... m_time.php GRANT AVRAM TIME Chelsea?s new manager deserves more respect, writes Gabriele Marcotti FEW PEOPLE have been more spectacularly written off before their first game in charge than Avram Grant, the man who replaced The Special One at the helm of Chelsea. Those kindest to him described him as a yes-man puppet, with little managerial nous and even less of a track record, who got his job because he happens to be the same religion as the club owner. The ugliness of those last allegations quickly spilled over into some of the Chelsea fans and club chairman Bruce Buck complained that Grant had been subject to racist and anti-Semitic abuse during the home game against Fulham last weekend. The absurdity of some kind of Jewish anti-Mourinho conspiracy is best left to those who have a copy of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion stashed away on their bookshelves. By midweek, the message from pundits south of the border was: "Avram, you're not crap because you're Jewish, you're crap because you're crap." Grant's credentials were placed in doubt because he doesn't have a Uefa Pro Licence and because his track record in management wasn't deemed impressive enough. Grant won four league titles and three domestic cups in Israel in a 16-year career in club management which began in 1986. As manager of Israel, he led them through an undefeated qualifying campaign for the 2006 World Cup (in a tough group which included France, Switzerland and the Republic of Ireland) and ended up missing out on goal difference. advertisementAs track records go, it's hardly Mourinhoesque. But then compare it to his rivals. Mark Hughes only had a spell as Wales manager when he got the Blackburn job. Lawrie Sanchez had four years at Wycombe in which he lost more games than he won and an admittedly more impressive stint as Northern Ireland manager before joining Fulham. Chris Hutchings, Sammy Lee, Gareth Southgate and Roy Keane all had zero managerial experience when they were handed their first Premiership jobs. Neither did Ruud Gullit or Gianluca Vialli, two of Grant's predecessors at Chelsea, both of whom delivered silverware to Stamford Bridge. Is Grant's cv really so poor? And then came Wednesday night. Chelsea away to Valencia in the Champions League. A crucial game, since a loss would have left them bottom of the group with a single point. And still no Frank Lampard, no Michael Ballack, no Ricardo Carvalho and John Terry playing with a broken cheekbone against a side which had won seven straight in all competitions. Grant began proving some people wrong an hour or so before kick-off, when he submitted his team sheet. There, on the bench, was Andriy Shevchenko. Yes, Sheva, the man who, according to some, helped cost Mourinho his job. Roman Abramovich's mate, the striker who'd been imposed from above, the guy who - conventional wisdom went - Grant would always play because the Israeli manager is nothing more than a toady and a suck-up and a "thank you sir, may I have another?"-style lackey who does his master's bidding. Except he isn't. And the Ukrainian's expensive butt cheeks firmly planted on the Mestalla bench are evident proof that Grant can be his own man. Of course, the critics still had a dig, suggesting that his 4-3-3 was basically a rip-off of the formation Mourinho used in his first two seasons at the club. Which is wrong on two counts. Mourinho's wingers - Arjen Robben and Damien Duff in the early incarnation - were genuine wide men who stayed up the pitch and remained in wide positions in an effort to stretch the opposing back four (which is what opened lanes down the middle for Lampard to run into). Grant's wide men in Valencia, Joe Cole and Florent Malouda, had far more licence to roam and were expected to track back defensively. Indeed, the goal which sealed Chelsea's 2-1 win was a direct result of Cole coming back to win the ball in midfield, before unleashing a picture-perfect pass into the path of Didier Drogba, who notched the winner. Cole was ecstatic after the game, telling the press that Chelsea were "11 brothers" on the pitch. Another case of sucking up to the new boss? Maybe. But it can also be that Cole realises that a shift in Chelsea's direct style to a more structured approach where the ball is delivered to feet rather than to Drogba's head could benefit someone like him. For all his talent - and the hype which surrounded him ever since he first made a splash as a 16-year-old wunderkind at West Ham - Cole was somewhat marginal to Chelsea under Mourinho, starting little more than a third of the club's Premiership games in the past three seasons. Another twist in the tale came on Thursday. Most of us - yours truly included - assumed that Grant was effectively a caretaker, charged with getting Chelsea into the Champions League next season and, perhaps, delivering a decent run in a cup competition (whether in Europe or domestically). He would then make way for the proverbial big-name boss. That reading of the situation was apparently blown apart when it emerged the club were looking to bring in Henk ten Cate as Grant's assistant. Ten Cate is in his second season as Ajax manager - they lost the title on goal difference last year, but failed to get past the Champions League preliminary rounds this year and last. He had a successful spell as Frank Rijkaard's assistant at Barcelona and previously made his name with overachieving smaller clubs like Vitesse Arnhem and NAC Breda in the Dutch league. At 52, and having finally been given the chance at a big club, it would appear the only way that he would accept Chelsea would be if he were given some kind of long-term assurances. But if that were to be the case, it would imply that Grant is here to stay next season as well. That's because, when most high-profile managers switch clubs, they bring with them their own staff of trusted assistants. And if Chelsea landed a Marcello Lippi or a Juande Ramos next season, what would become of Ten Cate? Grant spoke openly about the Dutchman, saying there were plenty of job openings at the club since Mourinho had taken his staff with him. Ten Cate would replace Baltemar Brito, the previous assistant. Except while Brito is a relative no-name, Ten Cate has a much higher profile. A move for him would have major repercussions across the coaching staff. In any case, the Avram Grant Experience travels to the Reebok today with another decimated squad. Drogba and John Obi Mikel are suspended, Michael Ballack and Shaun Wright-Philips are injured, Lampard and Michael Essien are highly doubtful. Chelsea need another three points to keep the bandwagon rolling. And yet you can't help but feel that, unless they rattle off 10 wins on the trot, Grant still won't get any kind of respect from the punditocracy.

Tony Gayle on SSN saying Liverpool are not as good as Arsenal Utd or Chelsea and said Chelsea are getting stronger and he thinks Pool will end 4th. I'd almost take that.

same as moos, couldn't see the game. how did we look in the second half with Pizzaro instead of Kalou?

Maybe if he came out and slagged us off he would be better thought of, funny how we all loved Gallas no matter what he supposedly came out and said unyet Sheva says all the right things, never says anything against the club and always keeps positive and he gets peoples backs up? I hope he sgets back to being three quarters the player he was at his best, that would still be enough to score twenty a season and get the respect he deserves. and even if he never gets it back, he still gets my respect for having been as good as he was.

I must admit I would have had Pizzaro or Sheva there but Kalou has done it and if he took all the chances he got he would be hard to leave out. we dont watch em in training so perhaps Grant has seen he is the sharper of the three, come to that we have all seen that

Looks like a fair team considering the choices, as you say thoufgh I would have preferred Pizza or Sheva to Kalou until later on when he could come on and torment their tired legs.

Bolton are a tough side and will be up for this one, I'd go with Cech ; Belletti, Carvalho, Terry, Cole SWP, Makelele, Lampard/Essien, Malouda Cole, Pizarro Sub : Sheva, Cudicini, Kalou, Alex, Sidwell, Paulo Thats if Franks back in time. edit..I thought Essien pulled up a bit on wednesday night and maybe would be rested.

gotta Hand it to him, he nailed it, a few tricks up his sleave, done it all off the cuff, if he knuckled down a bit he could be flick-ing great, surprised their was only one fan, no wonder Sweepy never played wednesday night, that bloke had his boots on thats how bored I am.

I thought he had perfected that one already, maybe he's getting a bit typecast

I said a few times before Jose went that Roman was no fool and both of these men are born winners, It never stood up in my argument that two such winners would learn to put up with each other for the sake of what they both like to do (win). what you say though is true, we know everyone likes to think of Roman as a kid with a toy but its his toy after all with the money he has put in if he thinks we can play better football under Grant or whoever, its his choice. He is not a football man but that shouldn't mean he has no knowledge of the game and I would imagine he took a lot of advice before all this happened. people like Harry Redknap and Arsene Wenger have said decent things about Grant and he has done ok so far. all the talk of managers coming in, player unrest and poor body language or dampened goal celebrations dont really help his or our cause, which at the end of the day is the same.

Got to agree with this, Jose as is blatently obvious is a different personality to Grant, Tactile with the players and that is his choice, the players have to get used to a manager before that sort of comaradary sets in if it ever does. I couldn't give a flying F**k myself as I would rather a lame high five after a 1-2 away win at valencia than a good kiss and cuddle after 1-1 draw at home to Rosenbourg. no reflection on Jose as a manager just on the way things were going.

Just wondered how long we are talking in the match preview thread, I recon we will win 1-2 with Drogba getting the winner after a Joey Cole equaliser, I'd put money on it. I think Grant done ok, His subs and the tactics, Credit to him for it, credit to Jose fore instilling the will to win in this team and credit to the man that put up the money for some of these players. lets hope we credit ourselves with more of the same in the league KTBFF

Your not wrong mate but surely at Chelsea if your good you may get a reprieve? or maybe not

We do when Sheva starts! See Sheva starts and how many goals we've scored in those games. it's taken a few games but even Avram can see it. to be fair Grant never had a lot of choice but to play Sheva with Drogs injured, Pizza has not exactly been prolific, and Kalou can miss a chance or two

1 swallow does not a summer make. Stay of execution me thinks are we back to Billie Piper again? nice to hear you giving grant a stay of execution though Bluenut, being as yours is one of those opinions I value and being in the give the man a chance camp seemed strange to me as mostly I am nodding my head when I read your posts. thats what forums are about though for sure.

Dorset my finger hit the remote at the same sort of time aswell and you are spot on with what you have said. one more thing about morose mr Souness, did you notice he said if Drogba had have played against Fulham Chelsea would have won that match? perhaps he thinks we started with ten men eh?