Deserves a bit of applause for actually starting some young players, Miazga, Baba, Kenedy, RLC. Took long enough

Deserves a bit of applause for actually starting some young players, Miazga, Baba, Kenedy, RLC. Took long enough

And bringing on Pato and Clarke-Salter.

Wish he would give Begovic another game.

just curious, CFC has been unbeaten in the League since Uncle Guus has taken over? If that is so, he does deserve a round of applause

14 games under Guus. 7 wins, 7 draws, 0 losses. 3rd in the league during this time. 1st in away but only mid-table (12th) at home. We've conceded 12 goals at home and 2 goals away. So weird.

We've passed Tottenham for longest unbeaten league streak this season (15). Hopefully we'll make it 16 before getting humiliated again by Man City.

I'd be surprised if we got more than 8-10 points from the rest of the season as we're playing a bunch of title contenders and relegation battlers who will be much more motivated.

Enjoy it while it lasts.

Edited April 2, 201610 yr by offside

Thats the spirit.

At home we've played decent teams and not been able to get wins.

 

Away from home we've played some very poor teams (Palace, Norwich, Villa) and a team reduced to ten men (Arsenal).

 

The only slightly surprising result is the Southampton away win but all the other ones are pretty much what you'd expect from a mid-table team.

 

Hiddink's achievement is basically getting a mid-table team to perform slightly above expectations.

Hiddink's achievement is basically getting a mid-table team to perform slightly above expectations.

 

So are you saying we should discount the 15 match unbeaten streak? Sorry I won't join you in that endeavor. I will continue to say well played Uncle Guus!!! IMHO he is a lot better than the Interim One aka fsw

So are you saying we should discount the 15 match unbeaten streak? Sorry I won't join you in that endeavor. I will continue to say well played Uncle Guus!!! IMHO he is a lot better than the Interim One aka fsw

 

Quite the opposite actually. I'm saying you should look at every one of those matches in the unbeaten run, the quality of opponent and their form during that period rather than just looking at the headline figure.

 

It would be like me saying we're better than Barca because we've never lost to Real Madrid in a competitive match (bad example but El Clasico is on). It's true but we've only played them three times.

Quite the opposite actually. I'm saying you should look at every one of those matches in the unbeaten run, the quality of opponent and their form during that period rather than just looking at the headline figure.

 

It would be like me saying we're better than Barca because we've never lost to Real Madrid in a competitive match (bad example but El Clasico is on). It's true but we've only played them three times.

 

???

by all means enjoy El Clasico & I will enjoy our 15 match unbeaten streak. It's a lil' something to cheer about in this dreadful season. Yes, I do look for positivity

Hiddink's achievement is basically getting a mid-table team to perform slightly above expectations.

To get a mid table quality team to be in 3rd place is more than "slightly" above expectations, albeit with the matches left and the fact that those teams will be much more motivated (some of our players may already be saving themselves for Euros) I don't expect that form to continue.

Still, I think we've eked out an acceptable season considering the state of affairs the first half. If you had presented this outcome to me in December, I would have gladly taken it. Certainly disappointing, but not disastrous and humiliating.

Even though the point total would be the same, I prefer having the disaster occur in the first half of the season rather than in the second half (e.g. Crystal Palace).

 

by all means enjoy El Clasico & I will enjoy our 15 match unbeaten streak. It's a lil' something to cheer about in this dreadful season. Yes, I do look for positivity

 

Come on mate, be fair. All I've said is look at the reality of those teams and the context of the matches rather than just repeating '15 match unbeaten streak' ok. We all know you can type it so you've won that bet with whomever you made it. No need for memes when we're all capable of using our words.

just curious, CFC has been unbeaten in the League since Uncle Guus has taken over? If that is so, he does deserve a round of applause

It's guaranteed to be the record in the league this season because there are too few games left for another team to surpass it.

Edited April 2, 201610 yr by offside

He's done a very good job since he arrived. I'm pretty sure he's exceeded expectations considering we couldn't even get a solid win before he arrived.

Well done Gus.

15 games unbeaten. Not a bad job

15 games unbeaten. Not a bad job

Yes and no, our home form is simply not good enough.

Yes and no, our home form is simply not good enough.

Balanced by the best away form in the league. Overall we are 3rd since Guus arrived. That's a good job by any measure, especially considering we were 16th then, albeit with the upcoming opponents who will be much more motivated, I think we'll slip a bit.

It seems a good chunk of fans have forgotten just how bad things were a few months ago.

Edited April 3, 201610 yr by offside

Balanced by the best away form in the league. Overall we are 3rd since Guus arrived. That's a good job by any measure, especially considering we were 16th then, albeit with the upcoming opponents who will be much more motivated, I think we'll slip a bit.

It seems a good chunk of fans have forgotten just how bad things were a few months ago.

 

How many of those away wins were against teams in the bottom five?

 

How many were against ten men?

 

I'm not trying to have a pop at Guus because he's got the same limitations that Jose had, but rather than sticking to the superficial talking points isn't it useful to actually look at the quality of opposition that we faced? Or is that unimportant?

Yes and no, our home form is simply not good enough.

 

Are you taking into account our pre guus form? end of the day we had lost 9 games in the league by jan and at best looked clueless, I look at it with the question how many of those draws would of been loses if we hadnt made a change to get a reaction?

How many of those away wins were against teams in the bottom five?

How many were against ten men?

I'm not trying to have a pop at Guus because he's got the same limitations that Jose had, but rather than sticking to the superficial talking points isn't it useful to actually look at the quality of opposition that we faced? Or is that unimportant?

That's unimportant relative to our dire state. How many games did we LOSE in the first half against teams of any quality? Harping on the home record is massive nitpicking.

Are you taking into account our pre guus form? end of the day we had lost 9 games in the league by jan and at best looked clueless, I look at it with the question how many of those draws would of been loses if we hadnt made a change to get a reaction?

 

Under Jose we were looking to win home games, and that meant we took more chances which is why (in my opinion) the results were either wins or losses apart from the first match against Swansea.

 

Guus has been far less ambitious which is why we've drawn all but one game at home.

 

Away from home I think you have to look at the level of opponent we were facing under both Jose and Guus. Guus has faced three of the bottom five teams away from home, and when he faced Arsenal they went down to ten men. The match at Southampton is the only real surprise in my opinion.

 

That's not to say Guus has done a bad job or Jose did a good one, just that when you account for the difficulty of opponent (which is a measure that isn't actually used in football statistics for some reason) then it's not as clear as the over-simplistic statements of 'games unbeaten' suggests.

Under Jose we were looking to win home games, and that meant we took more chances which is why (in my opinion) the results were either wins or losses apart from the first match against Swansea.

Guus has been far less ambitious which is why we've drawn all but one game at home.

If you play to win every game but end up losing half of them (4 losses out of 8 at home under Jose), then maybe it's time to rethink the strategy of playing to win every game.

And let's not overrate the home opponents during that time:

Swansea D

Crystal Palace L

Arsenal W

Southampton L

Aston Villa W

Liverpool L

Norwich W

Bournemouth L

These are several of the same teams we've played away since Jose left, and our away record against them is outstanding. If you nitpick that our away opponents have been weak, then why weren't we able to defeat nor even draw against them at home?

Under Jose we were looking to win home games, and that meant we took more chances which is why (in my opinion) the results were either wins or losses apart from the first match against Swansea.

 

Guus has been far less ambitious which is why we've drawn all but one game at home.

 

Away from home I think you have to look at the level of opponent we were facing under both Jose and Guus. Guus has faced three of the bottom five teams away from home, and when he faced Arsenal they went down to ten men. The match at Southampton is the only real surprise in my opinion.

 

That's not to say Guus has done a bad job or Jose did a good one, just that when you account for the difficulty of opponent (which is a measure that isn't actually used in football statistics for some reason) then it's not as clear as the over-simplistic statements of 'games unbeaten' suggests.

 

I agree its not black and white, but id have to question mourinhos thinking as if he had done a couple of basic things whilst still in charge to get back on track, like you say guus has done gone back to basics and been less ambitious but it has brought results, results that probably would of kept mourinho in the job even if no trophys were to appear if he had done similar.

 

For a manager like mourinho who has a reputation for changing tactics and players to suit the opposition based on the attention to detail in his opposition reports it boggled my mind at how rigid he was, a few minor changes could of steadied the ship but he either didnt see it or want to implement them, its fine going all out for the win in a cup competition but 6/8 games into this season he should of realised that something wasnt right and that he needed to make a change to get things on track, instead he carried on seemingly hoping that they would play into form again.

If you play to win every game but end up losing half of them (4 losses out of 8 at home under Jose), then maybe it's time to rethink the strategy of playing to win every game.

And let's not overrate the home opponents during that time:

Swansea D

Crystal Palace L

Arsenal W

Southampton L

Aston Villa W

Liverpool L

Norwich W

Bournemouth L

These are several of the same teams we've played away since Jose left, and our away record against them is outstanding. If you nitpick that our away opponents have been weak, then why weren't we able to defeat nor even draw against them at home?

 

What was Palace's form like in the first half of the season versus the second half? Go and have a look and you'll see it's not as simple as you're trying to make it.

 

If you take Jose's last 7 games at home and Guus's first 7, here's their points record.

 

Jose - 9 points from a possible 27.

Guus - 9 points from a possible 27.

 

And for a really rough piece of analysis, in those 7 games both guys faced 3 teams who are currently above us and 4 teams who are currently below us with the exact same points tally.

 

plus ça change.

Edited April 3, 201610 yr by ShedEnder91

What was Palace's form like in the first half of the season versus the second half? Go and have a look and you'll see it's not as simple as you're trying to make it.

Maybe you meant this as a rhetorical question, but I'll treat it at face value.

 

Here are the form standings at the time we have played each team. Last six games except for the first five opponents in which case it's whatever they had played. I've omitted the Sunderland game under Steve Holland.

 

Under Jose:

Swansea: Home, Draw, Opponent form NA

Manchester City: Away, Loss, Opponent form 1st

West Brom: Away, Win, Opponent form 20th

Crystal Palace: Home, Loss, Opponent form 3rd

Everton: Away, Loss, Opponent form 6th

Arsenal: Home, Win, Opponent form 6th

Newcastle: Away, Draw, Opponent form 18th

Southampton: Home, Loss, Opponent form 6th

Aston Villa: Home, Win, Opponent form 20th

West Ham: Away, Loss, Opponent form 2nd

Liverpool: Home, Loss, Opponent form 8th

Stoke: Away, Loss, Opponent form 4th

Norwich: Home, Win, Opponent form 18th

Tottenham: Away, Draw, Opponent form 2nd

Bournemouth: Home, Loss, Opponent form 16th

Leicester: Away, Loss, Opponent form 1st

 

Average opponent form home: 11

Average opponent form away: 6.75

Average opponent form overall: 8.73

Chelsea league standing home: 13th

Chelsea league standing away: 17th

Chelsea league standing overall: 16th

 

Under Guus:

Watford: Home, Draw, Opponent form 2nd

Manchester United: Away, Draw, Opponent form 9th

Crystal Palace: Away, Win, Opponent form 10th

West Brom: Home, Draw, Opponent form 9th

Everton: Home, Draw, Opponent form 14th

Arsenal: Away, Win, Opponent form 11th

Watford: Away, Draw, Opponent form 18th

Manchester United: Home, Draw, Opponent form 4th

Newcastle: Home, Win, Opponent form 16th

Southampton: Away, Win, Opponent form 3rd

Norwich: Away, Win, Opponent form 20th

Stoke: Home, Draw, Opponent form 8th

West Ham: Home, Draw, Opponent form 6th

Aston Villa: Away, Win, Opponent form 20th

 

Average opponent form home: 8.43

Average opponent form away: 13

Average opponent form overall: 10.71

Chelsea league standing home: 14st

Chelsea league standing away: 1st

Chelsea league standing overall: 3rd

 

Comparison:

 

The average opponent form at home under Guus has been slightly better (8.43) than under Jose (11).

 

Our league standing at home under Guus has been 14th, under Jose 13th.

 

The average opponent form away under Guus has been much weaker (13) than under Jose (6.75).

 

Our league standing away under Guus has been 1st, under Jose 17th.

 

The average opponent form overall under Guus has been slightly weaker (10.71) than under Jose (8.73).

 

Our league standing overall under Guus has been 3rd, under Jose 16th.

 

Interpret that as you'd like.

Edited April 3, 201610 yr by offside

Under Jose we were looking to win home games, and that meant we took more chances which is why (in my opinion) the results were either wins or losses apart from the first match against Swansea.

 

Guus has been far less ambitious which is why we've drawn all but one game at home.

 

Away from home I think you have to look at the level of opponent we were facing under both Jose and Guus. Guus has faced three of the bottom five teams away from home, and when he faced Arsenal they went down to ten men. The match at Southampton is the only real surprise in my opinion.

 

That's not to say Guus has done a bad job or Jose did a good one, just that when you account for the difficulty of opponent (which is a measure that isn't actually used in football statistics for some reason) then it's not as clear as the over-simplistic statements of 'games unbeaten' suggests.

My turn to nitpick. When Jose's squad faced Arsenal, they were down to 9 men. In both cases we won, so you can't conclude much if anything from that. Plus, it's not our fault that they got themselves red carded, just as it's not our opponents' fault that we got red carded a few games. If one team gets red carded and is thus easier to play against, it's not a reason to discount the other team's results.

If you don't like the 'games unbeaten' statement, then how about overall league standing, since that is what really matters? 16th versus 3rd.

I don't expect us to keep up this form since our remaining games are against teams fighting for the title or fighting to survive, so they will be super motivated while our lads will be playing out the games and thinking ahead to the summer. They might be saving themselves for the summer competitions. You see that every year with mid table teams once they're locked into the mid table. In addition we'll probably (hopefully) play very inexperienced players. Even though I expect us to slip in terms of overall league standing, there is no doubt the second half of the season has been a major success compared to the first half especially if you consider more youth time as one form of success.

Edited April 3, 201610 yr by offside