I think we can all agree that we've been conceding quite a lot of sloppy goals recently and to be honest WBA highlighted that. The more and

more I think about it I am convinced it is our formation.

So there is your basic 4-2-3-1 formation. Straight away you can see the space behind the midfield 3. That space would usually be filled in by the LB and RB and it is happening but the problem we are having is that we are getting caught out too high up on the field.

Look at the last few games and the goals we have conceded from crosses (open play):

Tottenham-1 (Gallas)

Man United (Home PL)-3 (RVP x2, Hernandez)

Shakhtar Donetsk (Home CL)-2 (Willian x2)

Liverpool-1 (Suarez)

West Brom-2 (Long, Odemwingie)

In those 5 games that is 9 goals conceded from crosses in open play and it's simply too much. I am not blaming this on the LB and RB because in this formation it is part of their job to go up along the wings. However if you get the DM's to cover for them there's going to be space in the middle which could be even worse, adding extra pressure to our defence which looks quite shaky at the moment.

What I am trying to say is that in the 4-2-3-1 formation there is always going to be a massive space somewhere no matter who covers, at least it seems that way in our team because our midfield are getting caught out by other teams' speed.

A good way to solve this would be a 4-3-3 formation as this would close down the spaces and there would always be someone to cover.

Our midfield are most likely good tacklers so for the other team it would be like running against a brick wall. Another quality of our midfield is that they can hold up the ball and get it down the wings, allowing us to have defensive and midfield qualities at the same time.

An example of a 4-3-3 lineup (full strength squad) could be:

-------------Cech

Ivanovic-Terry-Cahill-Cole

---Mikel-Oscar-Ramires

----Hazard-Moses-Mata

Not necessarily with those players in those positions, but you get what I mean.

I really think Robbie should try this in a few weeks or maybe even risk it in Turin and against City next weekend. He said himself after the game that we are going to play more defensively from now on and this is most likely what he has in mind. It would definitely play to our strengths.

Anybody else agree?

Edited November 17, 201213 yr by omnidroid70

Knee jerk - nobody had a problem with the formation when we were ripping teams to bits. We are getting rinsed at the moment by internationals and crucial cl games that Utd an city aren't really facing

Knee jerk - nobody had a problem with the formation when we were ripping teams to bits. We are getting rinsed at the moment by internationals and crucial cl games that Utd an city aren't really facing

I'm not knee jerking-I'm making an analysis.

Well i wouldn't change formation yet but if i did i would do this

...........................CECH............................

...............Ivan......Terry........Cahill.............

Azpilicueta.....................................Cole....

...........................Mikel..............................

...............Oscar..............Hazard................

...........................Mata...............................

........................Sturridge...........................

This is something i would go for if we continue to ship goals all the time, i really think it can work. This formation would give our 2 full backs the license to go forward without worrying to much about the defense. It looks very balanced and i think it would work well.

Well i wouldn't change formation yet but if i did i would do this

...........................CECH............................

...............Ivan......Terry........Cahill.............

Azpilicueta.....................................Cole....

...........................Mikel..............................

...............Oscar..............Hazard................

...........................Mata...............................

........................Sturridge...........................

This is something i would go for if we continue to ship goals all the time, i really think it can work. This formation would give our 2 full backs the license to go forward without worrying to much about the defense. It looks very balanced and i think it would work well.

That would be something pretty good to try. Not sure whether RDM would want to risk it in Turin and against City because if it goes wrong then those are two big games thrown away...

That would be something pretty good to try. Not sure whether RDM would want to risk it in Turin and against City because if it goes wrong then those are two big games thrown away...

Yeah i wouldn't risk it yet but it's something i think RDM should consider.

Yeah i wouldn't risk it yet but it's something i think RDM should consider.

Definitely, it would probably work!

Knee jerk - nobody had a problem with the formation when we were ripping teams to bits.

WTF, no point analysing or discussing anything then?

Omnidroid, I think it's a fair point, as we know, formations are chosen dependant on the stregth/strengths of the players available, with the first XI 4-2-3-1 is a fair formation but in today's case perhaps we could have gone with a more defensive or more attacking formation option dependant on robbie's knowledge of the players and changes during the game, nothing wrong with raising it... Gonna watch the game now

Well i wouldn't change formation yet but if i did i would do this

...........................CECH............................

...............Ivan......Terry........Cahill.............

Azpilicueta.....................................Cole....

...........................Mikel..............................

...............Oscar..............Hazard................

...........................Mata...............................

........................Sturridge...........................

This is something i would go for if we continue to ship goals all the time, i really think it can work. This formation would give our 2 full backs the license to go forward without worrying to much about the defense. It looks very balanced and i think it would work well.

I would not mind us trying that out. If we get someone like Falcao or Cavani I'd even consider playing two up front.

More like Juventus (though playing Mata with Torres would work as well).

Well i wouldn't change formation yet but if i did i would do this

...........................CECH............................

...............Ivan......Terry........Cahill.............

Azpilicueta.....................................Cole....

...........................Mikel..............................

...............Oscar..............Hazard................

...........................Mata...............................

........................Sturridge...........................

This is something i would go for if we continue to ship goals all the time, i really think it can work. This formation would give our 2 full backs the license to go forward without worrying to much about the defense. It looks very balanced and i think it would work well.

The only thing I'd change is Luiz in for Mikel.

The only thing I'd change is Luiz in for Mikel.

We're already conceding too many goals.

I'd also like to see Robbie mix it up a bit, not every game but take a bit of predictability out of our play. Good coaches will set their sides up knowing how we play exactly like we have done in years gone by.

I just want to watch a Chelsea game where we don't look like amatures at the back.

There seems to be no progress in our defending from earlier in the season. Yes Terry is out but we have Ivan, Luiz, Cesar, Cole and Cahill...other clubs would kill for that.

We shouldn't go back to a 4-3-3. I think the formation is the right one for our team, we just need to adjust and get the balance correct.

Personally, in terms of how vulnerable we are, I blame the midfield wholly. Ramires is possibly my favourite player but his midfield partner in this formation must be a sitting player. This is so obvious and I'm growing frustrated at how long it's taking Robbie to realise this, just as I grew frustrated with how long it took him to realise Ramires must play in midfield, just as I'm growing frustrated with how long it's taking him to drop Torres. It must be said also, Cahill and Luiz aren't a patch on Terry defensively.

With our normal starting XI I think 4-2-3-1 suits us just fine, however, in today's situation v West Brom with 5 changes I'd have liked to have seen an extra player in midfield with a 4-5-1 (too defensive perhaps) or changed nominally to 4-3-3. Crucially though, as we saw Man City f**k up royallywhen they played 3 at the back, if you haven't practised at it can really go against you. Respect to Robbie for his risks today, shame it didn't pay off for us late on in the game :(

Personally, in terms of how vulnerable we are, I blame the midfield wholly. Ramires is possibly my favourite player but his midfield partner in this formation must be a sitting player. This is so obvious and I'm growing frustrated at how long it's taking Robbie to realise this, just as I grew frustrated with how long it took him to realise Ramires must play in midfield, just as I'm growing frustrated with how long it's taking him to drop Torres. It must be said also, Cahill and Luiz aren't a patch on Terry defensively.

Since Mourinho we haven't had a decent tactician in charge. This is my opinion but over the years we always seem to make the same mistakes over a season, and it always takes us ages to change it.

I think playing a 4-2-3-1 full backs aren't supposed to be that attacking, as it leaves the two centre backs way too exposed as the holding midfielders we have tend to wander. When we played a 4-3-3 our holding midfielder would stay in his position, and usually another centre midfielder would've helped us out at the back.

We have very attacking full backs and it does leave us too exposed in defence. And with Ramires/Lampard naturally having attacking mentalities then it causes problems. We just need to balance the squad that is all.

RDM needs to experiment with formations, 4-5-1 could work

Opposition teams know exactly how we're going to line up tactically every match, and so they know how to deal with us - some better than others, obviously. Let's face it, we've been sussed - RDM needs to change tactics now and then just to keep the opposition guessing.

Personally think the players we have would suit Xmas tree formation.

Cech

Ivan terry Cahill Cole

Ramires mikel Oscar

Hazard Mata

Sturridge.

With mikel sitting permanently in front the back 4, Ramires box to box, Oscar starting moves from deep, Mata and hazard given free reign to roam, create, and support Sturridge.

Personally think the players we have would suit Xmas tree formation.

Cech

Ivan terry Cahill Cole

Ramires mikel Oscar

Hazard Mata

Sturridge.

With mikel sitting permanently in front the back 4, Ramires box to box, Oscar starting moves from deep, Mata and hazard given free reign to roam, create, and support Sturridge.

Opposition teams know exactly how we're going to line up tactically every match, and so they know how to deal with us - some better than others, obviously. Let's face it, we've been sussed - RDM needs to change tactics now and then just to keep the opposition guessing.

That's exactly what I thought while I was writing this thread, we're too obvious, and unless we think of a counter-tactic we're going to continue getting sussed.

Edited November 18, 201213 yr by omnidroid70

I agree that the major problem we face is that our midfield is often found too open with most of our players caught too far up field. We need more men in the middle for two reasons. Our pressing game (Barcelona style say) can be much more effective. We can win back possession and hold possession a lot easier. Also, at any point of time, we can have at least two men in the center and/or covering for a fullback.

I think our players are capable of attacking well even if we have one less player attacking usually. I think this is one real luxury we can afford at the moment with the quality of attackers we have now. Trying a false 9 is another option.

I'd play the following against Juve and City:

4-3-3, Oscar further back than normal man marking Pirlo/Tevez and allowing Mikel and Ramires to help out our full backs. Hazard and Sturridge free roles interchanging positions with Mata behind pulling the strings:

-------------------Cech--------------

Cesar----Ivanovic--Cahill---A.Cole

-----Ramires--Oscar--Mikel----------

-----------------Mata-------------------

------Hazard-----------Sturridge----

Just hit em on the counter and sit deep the rest of the time

I agree with Big Blue. That's the formation I would go for.