22 minutes ago, Valerie said:

Oh FFS this is about the 8th time I forgot Broja is still on our books.

He's been with the club since 2009, he is under contract until 2028.

Averaging one goal per game and winning a trophy before even setting foot in Cobham. Not a bad start.

4 hours ago, Scott said:

He's been with the club since 2009, he is under contract until 2028.

So many more opportunities to forget about him.

He's a footballer. He can play football. Which is what you want in a football team. Unlike a Mudryck type of player who was just about speed (and we now know how he achieved that).

Pedro Already linking up well with Palmer. Joao Pedro is a good signing imho.

btw - Caicedo and Cucurella - our signings from Brighton have been good signings. I guess we overpaid, but the players have been a success.

He looked a very good player from what we saw. His movement, strength, hold up, link up and finishing were all excellent.

I’m trying not to get carried away as it’s very early days (Mutu also looked great) - but this guy can play. Looks a great fit with the squad, and is a reminder of just how poor Jackson has been.

Don’t think we’d sign him for £60M now!

On 14/07/2025 at 11:33, dermott said:

Go back to the first 10 pages of several threads - Caicedo and Cucarella in particular - and have an even bigger chuckle. Typical of this place. Premature ejaculation rules.

But then read the Sterling thread. And balance is restored.

On 14/07/2025 at 10:33, dermott said:

Go back to the first 10 pages of several threads - Caicedo and Cucarella in particular - and have an even bigger chuckle. Typical of this place. Premature ejaculation rules.

First few pages on the Caicedo thread most people say would be a good signing to replace Kante but would likely cost a fortune, 60M+ for someone with minimal PL exposure. We ended up paying nearly double that.

Cucurella is a lot of people saying he's limited and we'll have to overpay. Both are correct.

5 minutes ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

First few pages on the Caicedo thread most people say would be a good signing to replace Kante but would likely cost a fortune, 60M+ for someone with minimal PL exposure. We ended up paying nearly double that.

Cucurella is a lot of people saying he's limited and we'll have to overpay. Both are correct.

How is Cucurella limited?

Just now, Sconnie Blue said:

How is Cucurella limited?

Not particularly quick, not a great tackler and not very creative. Three pretty important traits for a full back.

Plays a pivotal role under Maresca and maximises what he's got but let's not pretend like he's some freak athlete or elite footballer.

Just now, Ukraine Bolt said:

Not particularly quick, not a great tackler and not very creative. Three pretty important traits for a full back.

Plays a pivotal role under Maresca and maximises what he's got but let's not pretend like he's some freak athlete or elite footballer.

Great in possession. Can operate as a traditional fullback or inverted. Can play in a back 3. Can score goals. When tasked he can take players out of a game completely ala Saka, Salah, and Doue.

To suggest he’s a limited player is disingenuous.

1 minute ago, Sconnie Blue said:

Great in possession. Can operate as a traditional fullback or inverted. Can play in a back 3. Can score goals. When tasked he can take players out of a game completely ala Saka, Salah, and Doue.

To suggest he’s a limited player is disingenuous.

You've not listed a single trait that would suggest he isn't limited.

You're talking about him playing in a system that suits him.

21st percentile in shot creating actions.

15th percentile for assists.

10th percentile for progressive carries.

4th percentile for successful take ons. (insane stats)

51st percentile for tackles.

39th percentile to interceptions.

This is the only season he's shown he can score goals and that's because Maresca had him box crashing.

These are his limitations. He is limited.

I agree he's great in possession however he makes few progressive passes (48th percentile).

The stats all shows he's limited, i've gave him credit and said he maximises what he's got in this system but he's still a limited footballer.

24 minutes ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

You've not listed a single trait that would suggest he isn't limited.

You're talking about him playing in a system that suits him.

21st percentile in shot creating actions.

15th percentile for assists.

10th percentile for progressive carries.

4th percentile for successful take ons. (insane stats)

51st percentile for tackles.

39th percentile to interceptions.

This is the only season he's shown he can score goals and that's because Maresca had him box crashing.

These are his limitations. He is limited.

I agree he's great in possession however he makes few progressive passes (48th percentile).

The stats all shows he's limited, i've gave him credit and said he maximises what he's got in this system but he's still a limited footballer.

Percentiles don't mean much when these are the same metrics for Cucurella under DeZerbi (21/22) + Poch.

81st percentile in shot creating actions

21st percentile in assists (62nd under Poch)

86th percentile for progressive carries

59th percentile in successful take ons

77th percentile in tackles (91st percentile under Poch)

16th percentile in interceptions.

Given that into consideration I still stand that this version of Cucurella is better than under DeZerbi or Poch simply because of his versatility and the fact he not a limited footballer.

Edited July 20, 2025Jul 20 by Sconnie Blue

1 hour ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

Plays a pivotal role under Maresca and maximises what he's got but let's not pretend like he's some freak athlete or elite footballer.

He won the Euros with Spain in 2024 and was named in the team of the tournament. That might be considered an elite footballer credential.

He also has great hair.

its his birthday in a couple of days. He will be 27.

34 minutes ago, Sconnie Blue said:

Percentiles don't mean much when these are the same metrics for Cucurella under DeZerbi (21/22) + Poch.

81st percentile in shot creating actions

21st percentile in assists (62nd under Poch)

86th percentile for progressive carries

59th percentile in successful take ons

77th percentile in tackles (91st percentile under Poch)

16th percentile in interceptions.

Given that into consideration I still stand that this version of Cucurella is better than under DeZerbi or Poch simply because of his versatility and the fact he not a limited footballer.

So what elite attributes does he have to not make him limited? I've told you what he lacks and all you've come back with is that he can play multiple positions and he can keep possession.

Its not even an insult, Azpi was a limited football too. Made the absolute most out of what he got.

On 14/07/2025 at 19:33, dermott said:

Go back to the first 10 pages of several threads - Caicedo and Cucarella in particular - and have an even bigger chuckle. Typical of this place. Premature ejaculation rules.

Except that, in the majority of cases, people are right. It turns out that in most cases we can form a good opinion of a player's career from a few games. Most new transfers fail so it pays (statistically) to skew cynical.

The few examples we remember are examples of survivorship bias and don't demonstrate that people are generally wrong about these things.

8 hours ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

So what elite attributes does he have to not make him limited? I've told you what he lacks and all you've come back with is that he can play multiple positions and he can keep possession.

It’s not even an insult, Azpi was a limited football too. Made the absolute most out of what he got.

The elite attributes are a solid all round game and consistency. Azpi was not limited as a defender and using him as a comparison seems strange. I don’t look at stats too much but I wouldn’t be surprised if Statistically Grimaldo was, in attacking numbers, one of the best and he is put on the bench for cuccerella for Spain.

If you look back historically you could argue faults in a lot of all time full backs games. Cole didn’t have monster numbers going forward and Robertson has better stats there but who would you want as a left back? Were marcello or Carlos monster defenders? Maldini didn’t have electrifying pace or wasn’t setting the world on fire in attacking numbers but is widely considered the best ever at left back. I’m not comparing cuccerella to any of these but am making a point.

It’s not something I’ve looked into but I’d actually argue that being solid across the stats is probably a better metric for a fullback than being elite in certain things and lacking in others. Look at Trent for example as that.

42 minutes ago, carefree franco said:

The elite attributes are a solid all round game and consistency. Azpi was not limited as a defender and using him as a comparison seems strange. I don’t look at stats too much but I wouldn’t be surprised if Statistically Grimaldo was, in attacking numbers, one of the best and he is put on the bench for cuccerella for Spain.

If you look back historically you could argue faults in a lot of all time full backs games. Cole didn’t have monster numbers going forward and Robertson has better stats there but who would you want as a left back? Were marcello or Carlos monster defenders? Maldini didn’t have electrifying pace or wasn’t setting the world on fire in attacking numbers but is widely considered the best ever at left back. I’m not comparing cuccerella to any of these but am making a point.

It’s not something I’ve looked into but I’d actually argue that being solid across the stats is probably a better metric for a fullback than being elite in certain things and lacking in others. Look at Trent for example as that.

All of the full backs you listed had elite attributes, i'm just asking for one elite attribute that Cucurella has that another player couldn't replicate.

I'd argue his mentality possibly as that's got him where he is today. I don't know why pointing out the obvious has triggered so many people, i've even said he's vital in Maresca's system.

39 minutes ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

All of the full backs you listed had elite attributes, i'm just asking for one elite attribute that Cucurella has that another player couldn't replicate.

I'd argue his mentality possibly as that's got him where he is today. I don't know why pointing out the obvious has triggered so many people, i've even said he's vital in Maresca's system.

I’m not triggered by it, I’m just pointing out that being good at everything and being rounded is an elite attribute in itself.

12 minutes ago, carefree franco said:

I’m not triggered by it, I’m just pointing out that being good at everything and being rounded is an elite attribute in itself.

12 hours ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

Not particularly quick, not a great tackler and not very creative. Three pretty important traits for a full back.

Plays a pivotal role under Maresca and maximises what he's got but let's not pretend like he's some freak athlete or elite footballer.

13 hours ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

So what elite attributes does he have to not make him limited? I've told you what he lacks and all you've come back with is that he can play multiple positions and he can keep possession.

Its not even an insult, Azpi was a limited football too. Made the absolute most out of what he got.

Dave wasnt a limited fullback... Genuinely World Class full back who had a motor, was up and down the flanks and could score and assist. Guy locked down left and right side of defences, scored big goals and was a terrific defender up adn down the pitch.

While i really do enjoy and like Cucurella and what he brings to the team, this comparison is a bit disengenuous as for me one is head and shoulders above the other for his service and influence. Cucurella is on his way to becoming a cult figure no doubt, but our defence and his play was well shakey until Januaryish and he, despite being a Euro Champ still looked odd man out at times so lets hope he keeps it going this season, always get good odds on him stabbing one home. ;-)

33 minutes ago, bluelightening said:

Dave wasnt a limited fullback... Genuinely World Class full back who had a motor, was up and down the flanks and could score and assist. Guy locked down left and right side of defences, scored big goals and was a terrific defender up adn down the pitch.

While i really do enjoy and like Cucurella and what he brings to the team, this comparison is a bit disengenuous as for me one is head and shoulders above the other for his service and influence. Cucurella is on his way to becoming a cult figure no doubt, but our defence and his play was well shakey until Januaryish and he, despite being a Euro Champ still looked odd man out at times so lets hope he keeps it going this season, always get good odds on him stabbing one home. ;-)

Still a limited full back that maximised what he was gifted with. I'm sure he himself would be the first to admit it too.

Agree regards Cucurella.

14 hours ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

So what elite attributes does he have to not make him limited? I've told you what he lacks and all you've come back with is that he can play multiple positions and he can keep possession.

Its not even an insult, Azpi was a limited football too. Made the absolute most out of what he got.

I also said he's a goal threat and can take the best wingers out of the game. Elite isn't something I throw around loosely given the quality in today's game relative to back then. If there was anything elite about Cucurella it's that he doesn't get dispossessed. Arguably the best fullback on the planet at that.

A limited player is just that. Someone who is limited to what they can do.

Cucurella can be a goal threat with his attacking instincts in the box. A trait no one ever knew he had until Maresca.

He's very good in possession which makes him a valuable asset to most possession oriented teams.

He can play as a traditional fullback and can progressively carry the ball forward + contribute to shot creating actions, like we saw under DeZerbi.

He can play as a LCB and hold his position in more conservative tactics.

He can man mark a player and take some of the very best out of the game completely. Salah, Doue, and Saka being prime examples.

1 hour ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

Still a limited full back that maximised what he was gifted with. I'm sure he himself would be the first to admit it too.

Agree regards Cucurella.

Come on... 2 x PL titles, 1x league cup, 1x FA cup, 1 x CL, 2 x Europa league, 1 UEFA super cup, 1x fifa CWC is are not a trophy haul of a limited player. Dave was a cut above and served with distinction.

I'd have Dave in ahead of Cucurella at left back in this side.

I'd probably even go for Gallas ahead of Cucurella. Cucurella by the end of his time with us and I might view him differently and its fair to see what he brings this side so Im defo very happy with him. Anyhow this is Pedro page... we also still have Chilwell who is a top defender.

52 minutes ago, Sconnie Blue said:

I also said he's a goal threat and can take the best wingers out of the game. Elite isn't something I throw around loosely given the quality in today's game relative to back then. If there was anything elite about Cucurella it's that he doesn't get dispossessed. Arguably the best fullback on the planet at that.

A limited player is just that. Someone who is limited to what they can do.

Cucurella can be a goal threat with his attacking instincts in the box. A trait no one ever knew he had until Maresca.

He's very good in possession which makes him a valuable asset to most possession oriented teams.

He can play as a traditional fullback and can progressively carry the ball forward + contribute to shot creating actions, like we saw under DeZerbi.

He can play as a LCB and hold his position in more conservative tactics.

He can man mark a player and take some of the very best out of the game completely. Salah, Doue, and Saka being prime examples.

One season has made him an elite goal threat because the manager had him playing as a 10 for half the season?

What do you mean by getting dispossed? In what regard? When taking a man on? He gets tackled during 60% of his take ons so i don't know what you mean with that one.

Versatility isn't something that doesn't make him limited, your physical attributes are. Quoting half a season under a manager 4 years ago doesn't change anything, Ashley Cole used to play up top for Arsenal academy but that doesn't mean he could do a shift there while at Chelsea.