1 hour ago, acaeus said:

heh, “the vast majority of us” is doing a lot of heavy lifting there. I counted six likes. Even if it were 600, that would still be an insignificant sample to claim consensus over something this subjective. For the record, I totally stick by my claim that Enzo Fernandez had a good game today.... welcome to add "compared to the rest of the team if it makes it easier for you."

In my opinion, this forum has developed an irrational dislike of Enzo Fernandez. It shows up in games like this one, where he was far from being the problem, yet you can read post after post singling him out before anyone mentions the actual issues. Please do check any — or all — player ratings and see how different this forum’s take on Enzo is from almost everywhere else. I'm not the outlier here.

“Affect the game”? As soon as João Pedro dropped deeper into a CAM position to accommodate the embarrassingly poor Delap up front, Enzo moved back into CM. When Lavia came on, Enzo was playing as the #5. His role and responsibilities changed multiple times during the game.
Was he ineffective when playing higher as a CAM (more like a makeshift CAM)? Yes. But so were João Pedro and Palmer whenever he drifted inside.
According to some here, we should've destroyed Newcastle after all, the much maligned Pedro Neto did not play....

Regarding the tactics, I couldn’t agree more. On the other hand, I was also one of the few around here who didn’t think Maresca was the main issue, nor that replacing him with a nobody coach would suddenly be the answer.

It's just par for the course at this point, some people keep pointing to every microscopic detail of what's wrong with Enzo. Then they'll call out the transfer fee.

Caicedo can have the average game and people will keep quiet when we all know he costs more.

The expectations for Enzo is at the standard of legends, for everyone else, the bar is on the floor. It's incredibly biased

20 minutes ago, Deino said:

It's just par for the course at this point, some people keep pointing to every microscopic detail of what's wrong with Enzo. Then they'll call out the transfer fee.

Caicedo can have the average game and people will keep quiet when we all know he costs more.

The expectations for Enzo is at the standard of legends, for everyone else, the bar is on the floor. It's incredibly biased

I don’t necessarily disagree with you but I just wonder whether he’d be a regular starter (and finisher!) with Arsenal or City which is where the bar is set at the moment?

1 hour ago, The Boehly Babes said:

I think a lot of the issues with Enzo and the optics surrounding him are due to what we’ve previously had in similar positions.

He doesn’t have the engine of Kante.

He doesn’t have the G/A’s of Super Frank.

He doesn’t have the passing range of Fabregas.

He doesn’t have the tactical nuance of Ballack.

They were the ‘Superstars’ of that position that we thought we were getting with Enzo.

He’s more of a Jorginho type player, he can put in some acceptable performances but more often than most he doesn’t ‘takeover’ or control a game and his limitations become exasperated.

All of the legends you mentioned were trained and coached by Mourinho, Wenger, Ancelotti, Conte, Heynckes among others.

They also played with elite teammates. All of them had their flaws covered and their strength trained on and magnified.

KdB and Salah were nothing players for us but under Pep and Klopp became 2 of the greatest all time PL players. Talent doesn't bloom in a vacuum

1 minute ago, OnePeterOsgood said:

I don’t necessarily disagree with you but I just wonder whether he’d be a regular starter (and finisher!) with Arsenal or City which is where the bar is set at the moment?

1 minute ago, OnePeterOsgood said:

I don’t necessarily disagree with you but I just wonder whether he’d be a regular starter (and finisher!) with Arsenal or City which is where the bar is set at the moment?

1 minute ago, OnePeterOsgood said:

I don’t necessarily disagree with you but I just wonder whether he’d be a regular starter (and finisher!) with Arsenal or City which is where the bar is set at the moment?

Of course he does. He's better than Odegaard and Zubimendi. Pep would play him in a midfield 3 with Silva and Rodri.

11 minutes ago, Deino said:

Of course he does. He's better than Odegaard and Zubimendi. Pep would play him in a midfield 3 with Silva and Rodri.

He really isn't.

1 hour ago, Deino said:

It's just par for the course at this point, some people keep pointing to every microscopic detail of what's wrong with Enzo. Then they'll call out the transfer fee.

Caicedo can have the average game and people will keep quiet when we all know he costs more.

The expectations for Enzo is at the standard of legends, for everyone else, the bar is on the floor. It's incredibly biased

The main problem with Enzo is that the club has made him their poster boy, he is undropable by all accounts, and he’s not as good as they want us to think. Your comparison with Caicedo is wrong, people are criticising his performances of late, but he, more often than not, has a good to very good game, while Enzo has one good game every multiple games when he’s missing.

51 minutes ago, Nibs said:

He really isn't.

one-versus-one.com

Odegaard vs Fernandez | Compare players

Who is better? What about Freekicks, number of shots on target and Playmaking? Check out if Fernandez or Odegaard is over all more valuable for the team

one-versus-one.com

Zubimendi vs Fernandez | Compare players

Who is better? What about Freekicks, number of shots on target and Playmaking? Check out if Fernandez or Zubimendi is over all more valuable for the team

Enzo > Odegaard

Offensively better than Zubimendi

Enzo offensively ranks #5 in the league

1 hour ago, Deino said:

Of course he does. He's better than Odegaard and Zubimendi. Pep would play him in a midfield 3 with Silva and Rodri.

I don’t watch Arsenal enough so can’t say more than that Enzo is at Jorginho level, and he couldn’t get into the Arsenal team as a regular starter.

Just now, RMH said:

The main problem with Enzo is that the club has made him their poster boy, he is undropable by all accounts, and he’s not as good as they want us to think. Your comparison with Caicedo is wrong, people are criticising his performances of late, but he, more often than not, has a good to very good game, while Enzo has one good game every multiple games when he’s missing.

Their performances are more or less equal to each other in games. People only focuses on all the good Caicedo does and only all the bad from Enzo. This happens because Caicedo's average performances are masked by how awful our defensive structure and defenders have become.

8 minutes ago, RMH said:

I don’t watch Arsenal enough so can’t say more than that Enzo is at Jorginho level, and he couldn’t get into the Arsenal team as a regular starter.

Therefore you shouldn't be commenting on the topic at all. WUMs and their agendas

8 minutes ago, Deino said:

Their performances are more or less equal to each other in games. People only focuses on all the good Caicedo does and only all the bad from Enzo. This happens because Caicedo's average performances are masked by how awful our defensive structure and defenders have become.

8 minutes ago, Deino said:

Their performances are more or less equal to each other in games. People only focuses on all the good Caicedo does and only all the bad from Enzo. This happens because Caicedo's average performances are masked by how awful our defensive structure and defenders hae become.

I think that's a fair comment. My issue with Fernandez is that he just lacks the mobility and physicality to be that box to box midfielder. He does have the ability to read the game well and does have critical passes in his locker but with us playing two deep lying midfielders I would want the other to have the mobility to eat up the rest of the space to regain possession and effect turnovers.

1 hour ago, WhiteWall said:

I think that's a fair comment. My issue with Fernandez is that he just lacks the mobility and physicality to be that box to box midfielder. He does have the ability to read the game well and does have critical passes in his locker but with us playing two deep lying midfielders I would want the other to have the mobility to eat up the rest of the space to regain possession and effect turnovers.

Enzo Fernandez, 25/26: to date,

In 44 appearances in all games, he has 12 goals 6 assists, that's 18 G/A, a good season G/A total. He's not our primary pen and FK taker either.

Do we sacrifice this to make him the standard CM that runs around a lot?

1 hour ago, Deino said:

Therefore you shouldn't be commenting on the topic at all. WUMs and their agendas

You’re taking it a bit too far, don’t you think? Are you his brother or something? Twat.

Just pointless singling anyone out anymore.

They’re all sh*t.

3 hours ago, Deino said:

one-versus-one.com

Odegaard vs Fernandez | Compare players

Who is better? What about Freekicks, number of shots on target and Playmaking? Check out if Fernandez or Odegaard is over all more valuable for the team

one-versus-one.com

Zubimendi vs Fernandez | Compare players

Who is better? What about Freekicks, number of shots on target and Playmaking? Check out if Fernandez or Zubimendi is over all more valuable for the team

Enzo > Odegaard

Offensively better than Zubimendi

Enzo offensively ranks #5 in the league

3 hours ago, Deino said:

one-versus-one.com

Odegaard vs Fernandez | Compare players

Who is better? What about Freekicks, number of shots on target and Playmaking? Check out if Fernandez or Odegaard is over all more valuable for the team

one-versus-one.com

Zubimendi vs Fernandez | Compare players

Who is better? What about Freekicks, number of shots on target and Playmaking? Check out if Fernandez or Zubimendi is over all more valuable for the team

Enzo > Odegaard

Offensively better than Zubimendi

Enzo offensively ranks #5 in the league

3 hours ago, Deino said:

one-versus-one.com

Odegaard vs Fernandez | Compare players

Who is better? What about Freekicks, number of shots on target and Playmaking? Check out if Fernandez or Odegaard is over all more valuable for the team

one-versus-one.com

Zubimendi vs Fernandez | Compare players

Who is better? What about Freekicks, number of shots on target and Playmaking? Check out if Fernandez or Zubimendi is over all more valuable for the team

Enzo > Odegaard

Offensively better than Zubimendi

Enzo offensively ranks #5 in the league

Can't be bothered to even look at that. You go whatever lengths you want to try and back-up your opinion that Enzo is some great talent. He's not.

I know Odegaard isn't in best form for the Gooners this season but in other seasons I have seem him dominate games and make the sort of passes that Enzo could only dream of.

Enzo is just a decent squad player who shouldn't be getting anything like the minutes he currently is.

Attack of Potter.

Midfield of Maresca.

Defence of Poch.

We literally experienced the worst of all BlueCo managers last night.

2 hours ago, Deino said:

Enzo Fernandez, 25/26: to date,

In 44 appearances in all games, he has 12 goals 6 assists, that's 18 G/A, a good season G/A total. He's not our primary pen and FK taker either.

Do we sacrifice this to make him the standard CM that runs around a lot?

So who is going to dominate midfield? Who do we sacrifice from the current group?

Edited March 15Mar 15 by WhiteWall

Best player on the pitch yesterday was probably Lewis Hall. An academy player that the SD's and owners moved on to fund their project, Sums it up really.

36 minutes ago, forbzy said:

Best player on the pitch yesterday was probably Lewis Hall. An academy player that the SD's and owners moved on to fund their project, Sums it up really.

To be fair, Lewis Hall came out and said that he wanted to go to Newcastle as all his family were geordies and he was a Newcastle fan. I would have loved to have kept him, but it was his choice to leave.

49 minutes ago, forbzy said:

Best player on the pitch yesterday was probably Lewis Hall. An academy player that the SD's and owners moved on to fund their project, Sums it up really.

bo**ocks. Acquaint yourself with the facts.

6 minutes ago, dermott said:

bo**ocks. Acquaint yourself with the facts.

Nono, not bo**ocks, buttocks!

1 minute ago, Valerie said:

Nono, not bo**ocks, buttocks!

Just now, dermott said:

Please @dermott , leave it to my imagination!

Also, that looks very uncomfortable when you have to run around for 90 minutes 🤔

I wondered where I had put my headband

4 minutes ago, loz said:

I wondered where I had put my headband

Ew