8 hours ago, bisright1 said:

That fa cup final was the first final conte had ever won.

You knew that right?

Conte is famously bad in cup competitions. The fa cup against united was the exception. Not the rule. 

The refusal to give Conte any kind of credit on this forum is absolutely staggering.

8 hours ago, bisright1 said:

 

duplicate

Edited May 1, 20197 yr by drjonesy1994

8 hours ago, bisright1 said:

 

duplicate

Edited May 1, 20197 yr by drjonesy1994

48 minutes ago, drjonesy1994 said:

The refusal to give Conte any kind of credit on this forum is absolutely staggering.

I don't think I've come across one single person who doesn't praise him to the hilt for the title winning season, don't confuse that for the deserved criticism he got for those awful last 6 months (FA Cup aside).

1 minute ago, Argo said:

I don't think I've come across one single person who doesn't praise him to the hilt for the title winning season, don't confuse that for the deserved criticism he got for those awful last 6 months (FA Cup aside).

I've seen the opposite mate. Not @bisright1, but others have said we fluked our way to the title that season etc etc. There was also someone the other week who said that our first half against Everton in the 2-0 loss was a better performance than when we beat Everton 5-0 on our way to the title.

Obviously you know i am not Sarri's biggest fan but i have still given him credit when it's been deserved this season. 

1 hour ago, drjonesy1994 said:

I've seen the opposite mate. Not @bisright1, but others have said we fluked our way to the title that season etc etc. There was also someone the other week who said that our first half against Everton in the 2-0 loss was a better performance than when we beat Everton 5-0 on our way to the title.

Obviously you know i am not Sarri's biggest fan but i have still given him credit when it's been deserved this season. 

Really? Worst I've heard/seen is that he benefitted from circumstances (ie no Europe) which i fundamentally disagree with. I'd keep my eye out in future because i'd certainly be disputting such if i see it.

1 hour ago, drjonesy1994 said:

I've seen the opposite mate. Not @bisright1, but others have said we fluked our way to the title that season etc etc. There was also someone the other week who said that our first half against Everton in the 2-0 loss was a better performance than when we beat Everton 5-0 on our way to the title.

? Obviously you know i am not Sarri's biggest fan but i have still given him credit when it's been deserved this season. 

i've been accused of saying Conte fluked his way to that title. But it was misinterpreted. My reference about him winning the fa cup final was his first cup competition, is because the previous poster suggested Conte was better than Sarri because he won the FA Cup and Sarri would have lost that match.

Conte is a good manager, he won us the title with his tactical switch. I just don't think he had much depth after that was found out and wasn't great with the players from a man management perspective when the chips were down. I think he was one in a line of managers we have who think incredibly short term. If I could have first season Conte every year, I'd be happy. 

Conte has been to some EPL matches I would enjoy it if he got another job here in England, it would give us the chance to see him objectively somewhere else.

3 hours ago, ducavis said:

You want Allegri here? If you thought we were boring to watch under Jose & Conte, try & catch a Juve game.

I watch Juve regularly and think Allegri is a great manager. He is very tactically flexible and capable of changing games. 

I've never cared about boring. I'd have Conte and Jose back in a heartbeat. Much preferable to ideologues who have one way of playing and aren't capable of adapting for different matches. 

3 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

i've been accused of saying Conte fluked his way to that title. But it was misinterpreted.

I did say not you to be fair mate. 

People have said that we won the league because City/ Liverpool whoever else weren't as strong as they are now. But surely that can be the case for any champions? If any of those 2 win the title this year i doubt the reaction from their fans will be "Well we only one it because of how poor everyone in 3rd-6th have been poor".

I get that the last 6 months soured some peoples views of Conte's but on the whole i think he deserves a bit more credit.

3 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

i've been accused of saying Conte fluked his way to that title. But it was misinterpreted.

I did say not you to be fair mate. 

People have said that we won the league because City/ Liverpool whoever else weren't as strong as they are now. But surely that can be the case for any champions? If any of those 2 win the title this year i doubt the reaction from their fans will be "Well we only one it because of how poor everyone in 3rd-6th have been poor".

I get that the last 6 months soured some peoples views of Conte's but on the whole i think he deserves a bit more credit.

3 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

i've been accused of saying Conte fluked his way to that title. But it was misinterpreted.

I did say not you to be fair mate. 

People have said that we won the league because City/ Liverpool whoever else weren't as strong as they are now. But surely that can be the case for any champions? If any of those 2 win the title this year i doubt the reaction from their fans will be "Well we only one it because of how poor everyone in 3rd-6th have been poor".

I get that the last 6 months soured some peoples views of Conte's but on the whole i think he deserves a bit more credit.

How can we objectively judge Conte?

I don't think we can.

He won the league in his first season with changing our style and bringing Moses into the first team. We won the league though due to European absence we played less matches than our peers in the top 4 .

In the second season we won the FA Cup after poor league form at the end of the season leaving us in 5th position.

 

11 minutes ago, drjonesy1994 said:

I did say not you to be fair mate. 

People have said that we won the league because City/ Liverpool whoever else weren't as strong as they are now. But surely that can be the case for any champions? If any of those 2 win the title this year i doubt the reaction from their fans will be "Well we only one it because of how poor everyone in 3rd-6th have been poor".

I get that the last 6 months soured some peoples views of Conte's but on the whole i think he deserves a bit more credit.?

For me, if you get 90+ points you deserve to win the league. This is the first time in PL history that 90+ doesn't win you the league. So anyone making the case we won because everyone else was poor, is an idiot. 

What I think is that we should have won the previous 3 seasons, because everyone else was poor. But it was irrelevant in 2017, because we were good enough in any year to win. (except this one, we've not had a team good enough to compete in this ridiculous season for a long time.

Edited May 1, 20197 yr by bisright1

39 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

For me, if you get 90+ points you deserve to win the league. This is the first time in PL history that 90+ doesn't win you the league. So anyone making the case we won because everyone else was poor, is an idiot. 

Agree with this to a point, for me if you win the league over the course of a 38 game season i think you deserve it. Can say that other teams weren't great or whatever but the bottom line is you've been the best team for 38 games.

35 minutes ago, drjonesy1994 said:

Agree with this to a point, for me if you win the league over the course of a 38 game season i think you deserve it. Can say that other teams weren't great or whatever but the bottom line is you've been the best team for 38 games.

There has to be a caveat to that. You deserve it UNLESS you happen to be Liverpool or Spurs (God Forbid)!!

 

2 hours ago, Spiller86 said:

I'd have Conte and Jose back in a heartbeat.  

Conte maybe under the right circumstances but Jose back again would be an absolute disaster.

4 hours ago, drjonesy1994 said:

I've seen the opposite mate. Not @bisright1, but others have said we fluked our way to the title that season etc etc. There was also someone the other week who said that our first half against Everton in the 2-0 loss was a better performance than when we beat Everton 5-0 on our way to the title.

Obviously you know i am not Sarri's biggest fan but i have still given him credit when it's been deserved this season. 

I think teams adopt the personality of their manager.  Conte's first season was filled with hard work, determination, and enthusiasm.  When his personality changed and it went sour in the second half of the second season, so did our performance.  I think today, our team is like Sarri.  Not quite sure of what to expect, no ability or desire to change, very robotic and structured.  And until the "Palpable Discord", Mourinho's teams were like him:  arrogant, defiant, cold, ruthless.

I absolutely loved Conte in his first season.  He was as excited as any of our players and supporters when we scored and won.  I wish Roman, Marina, the board, and Conte could have sat in a room in the summer after his 1st season or early in the 2nd season and ironed out the differences.  

14 hours ago, bisright1 said:

That fa cup final was the first final conte had ever won.

You knew that right?

Conte is famously bad in cup competitions. The fa cup against united was the exception. Not the rule. 

That's exactly why he is a winner, he won vs Jose that has had amazing records in finals. Sarri won exactly no title whatsoever no cup no league, and yet somehow he's better than Conte? Please..

3 hours ago, bisright1 said:

 if you get 90+ points you deserve to win the league. 

 

Edited May 1, 20197 yr by robdog

3 hours ago, bisright1 said:

For me, if you get 90+ points you deserve to win the league.

Unless some other team playing in the league gets at least one more point than you.

3 hours ago, Strider6003 said:

How can we objectively judge Conte?

I don't think we can.

He won the league in his first season with changing our style and bringing Moses into the first team. We won the league though due to European absence we played less matches than our peers in the top 4 .

In the second season we won the FA Cup after poor league form at the end of the season leaving us in 5th position.

 

The weakest argument of all is probably the fact that we didn't play European football during Conte's first season.
Spuds used to never play in Europe and that didn't really help them to win the title now didn't it? We used to win league titles while playing in Europe and without playing in Europe that's not an argument, Conte took over a lost squad and adapted his tactics to the strenghts of the players he had, if that was done by anyone else that man would be the special-genius-amazing-master of the game but I feel sad to see other Chelsea fans buying the trashtalk from the regular haters that invented that excuse...

Conte came to us as a winner and left as a winner, his second season was bad but he never really got the full support from the board, not even after he won the league because the board thought that the squad by winning the league is obviously good enough...Even before the second season started Pedro got injured then Hazard was injured as well for example, then one of the first games we lost due to some stupid Cahill or was it David Luiz red card that was super exaggerated by the ref at the time ( don't even remember who we played ), point is a lot of things just went wrong.

3 hours ago, Strider6003 said:

How can we objectively judge Conte?

I don't think we can.

He won the league in his first season with changing our style and bringing Moses into the first team. We won the league though due to European absence we played less matches than our peers in the top 4 .

In the second season we won the FA Cup after poor league form at the end of the season leaving us in 5th position.

 

The weakest argument of all is probably the fact that we didn't play European football during Conte's first season.
Spuds used to never play in Europe and that didn't really help them to win the title now didn't it? We used to win league titles while playing in Europe and without playing in Europe that's not an argument, Conte took over a lost squad and adapted his tactics to the strenghts of the players he had, if that was done by anyone else that man would be the special-genius-amazing-master of the game but I feel sad to see other Chelsea fans buying the trashtalk from the regular haters from other clubs that invented that excuse...

Conte came to us as a winner and left as a winner, his second season was bad but he never really got the full support from the board, not even after he won the league because the board thought that the squad by winning the league is obviously good enough...Even before the second season started Pedro got injured then Hazard was injured as well for example, then one of the first games we lost due to some stupid Cahill or was it David Luiz red card that was super exaggerated by the ref at the time ( don't even remember who we played ), point is a lot of things just went wrong.

Edited May 1, 20197 yr by Gol15

1 minute ago, Gol15 said:

The weakest argument of all is probably the fact that we didn't play European football during Conte's first season.
Spuds used to never play in Europe and that didn't really help them to win the title now didn't it? We used to win league titles while playing in Europe and without playing in Europe that's not an argument, Conte took over a lost squad and adapted his tactics to the strenghts of the players he had, if that was done by anyone else that man would be the special-genius-amazing-master of the game but I feel sad to see other Chelsea fans buying the trashtalk from the regular haters that invented that excuse...

Conte came to us as a winner and left as a winner, his second season was bad but he never really got the full support from the board, not even after he won the league because the board thought that the squad by winning the league is obviously good enough...Even before the second season started Pedro got injured then Hazard was injured as well for example, then one of the first games we lost due to some stupid Cahill or was it David Luiz red card that was super exaggerated by the ref at the time ( don't even remember who we played ), point is a lot of things just went wrong.

I think the European matches are a big factor through team fatigue and less preparation time for the manager against the next opposition.

I don't think Spurs are a good comparison as they have won nothing as people here say, 'serial bottlers.'

I think Conte remains as an enigma, he might have succeeded again had we got Alex Sandro and another decent striker, we will never know.

I would like to see him at another EPL club to see how good he might be, for me the jury is still out.

He deserves respect though for the League title.

 

31 minutes ago, robdog said:

 

Well they never got 90+ points. No one has and come second 

Every top team in recent PL history targets 90 points because they've always won the league. Same at teams at the bottom want to get 40+(or is it 42)

It's only this season that two decided to target 100. So that rule is out the window. But Conte did it when that was the unspoken rule and regardless of everyone else, we did enough to win that year. 

I don't think Sarri is a better manager than Conte by the way. But Conte is the past and Sarri is our current and probably future manager.