Jonty

I think too many posters in this thread are overlooking the hilarity of Pep being subject to an abysmal refereeing performance. Tis a f**king disgrace, one might say.

Honestly Pep, Aguero et al. have become such unbearable w**kers (compared to previously when they were slightly more bearable w**kers) to the point that i'd rather Liverpool win the title. At least Klopp, Salah, Mane and most of their key players seem like genuinely decent people, rather than the entitled princesses at the Etihad.

Just quietly, and with the caveat it was his first game back in a while, but I think with Kante coming back in for Jorginho on the weekend our midfield looked worse. A sentence I never thought I would type or even read this time last year. Granted this certainly wouldn't be the case against more lively opposition, but still, it's going to be tough to leave one of our midfield 3 out each game.

We really can't play him against good teams, or even average teams with decent attacking players like United.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/oct/03/chelsea-christian-pulisic-callum-hudson-odoi Interesting point - i'd almost forgotten about Pulisic with Mason and Hudson Odoi coming through ahead of him. Feel like there's a good chance this is Pedro's last season here, and that Pulisic perhaps deserves to at least be getting that 20 minute substitute role ahead of him.

Already emerging as a strong contender for player of the year for me.

Would love to see him used at RB in a back four, think he was a bit uncertain of where he needed to be at times, but made a few tidy tackles and is clearly very athletic.

His hold up play, first touch and ability to lay off balls thumped at him with just about any part of his body to an on-rushing teammate is superb. He's already almost as good as Giroud at those elements of the game, but is also a more clinical finisher. Looks a completely different player to the United game where he couldn't get anything to stick.

Leicester look like the real deal, and as much of a caricature as he is, Rodgers has proven to be a top coach, and with Vardy, Maddison, Ndidi and Schmeichel, they have a top quality spine. I think there's a legitimate chance they take one of the top 4 spots with Liverpool and City, with us and Arsenal fighting for the other spot. I think i'd happily take 4th at this point in time.

Arguably the only player in the Premier League era to have a legitimate claim to being the greatest of all time at his position, other than Ronaldo.

It's one thing to say "sell, sell, sell", it's another to find a club willing to maintain Drinkwater's insane salary. In reality this cap will mean a few extra expensive outcasts loitering around the fringe of the squad until their contracts run out.

Callum probably has the highest ceiling of any of them, I think Ruben also has huge potential but seems unlikely he'll ever stay healthy enough. Haven't seen enough of Reece to comment.

Thought he played well other than the penalty, which at least was struck with conviction rather than the limp penalty we saw from Tammy against Liverpool. Still shouldn't be in the starting line-up often once Kante, RLC and CHO are back.

Strange substitutions tonight, clearly were under a bit of pressure and needed to lock the game up, and he pulls off Kovacic who had been one of our better players and brings on an 18 year old debutant who is too scared or nervous to compete for the ball, or make a simple pass. Will be interesting to see how long he perseveres with Dave at RB. Either way some more entertaining football and good to see Tammy and Mount continue to play well. Again we really missed a few of the injured lads so expect us to improve.

Beginning to look a bit like the last year or two of Ivanovic, doesn't seem to have the legs to stick tight enough to his man. Time and time again he's either gotten done, or has sat off the winger enough to allow them to get a free cross in this short season thus far.

I don't think any game this early in the season is must win, but this will be the first game where we'll be overwhelming enough favourites that a win is the fair expectation. Leicester are pretty well-regarded at the moment and will be a banana skin for others too.

Great post - and to add to that, if Lamps gets shanked before the end of the season, unless we're in a relegation battle, i'm going to be filthy.

Cracking game, cracking player. Hope he continues to kick on and earn himself a big role in the England squad for the Euros too so that i'm not just cheering on City/Pool/Spurs players.

Plenty to be encouraged about, this team will only get better the more experience they get, and the more used to playing together they get. Keep in mind we're still missing three starters in Rudi, CHO and RLC, and there's much more to be excited about relative to however disappointed you are about these first few results.

That's a perspective, sure. A bloody stupid perspective at that.

A big game player - not someone i'd be starting over CHO or Pulisic on a week-in, week-out basis, but for big games he seems to step it up.

I don't think we want to disrupt the unity and togetherness which we will have built this season by bringing in half a dozen new guys. I think we have strength in depth right now, but are probably lacking a world class striker and CB, so i'd just look to spend big on one world class player for each of those positions, if possible.

Agreed he needs to bulk up a bit, but I was pleasantly surprised at his technical ability - we knew he was lightning quick, but some of his footwork and ball control was excellent.

People will mainly remember the penalty miss, but he did win the penalty through his work ethic chasing a lost cause, and also with pretty much his first touch of the ball, probably saved a goal with his block after Kepa had knocked the ball onto the bar. Edit: With that being said, Giroud was also very good and I think his interplay in tight spaces means he should be the first choice for now.

Agree with pretty much all DB's sentiments - an undeserved scoreline but with a team this new and young, there's going to be a few like this, and i'm not looking forward to the Super Cup. Once Rudiger and Kante are back we should be a lot more solid defensively though - exhibit A being Kante's incredible last ditch tackle to prevent Rashford's hattrick. Interesting question for me is how the first choice midfield looks at full-strength, if we assume Pulisic/Willian/CHO/Pedro take the two wide positions and Kante is locked in for one of the deeper roles. There's a three-way fight for that #10 role between Barkley, Mount and RLC, and then a two-way between Kovacic and Jorginho for the other deep role (which RLC could also potentially take). I'm not sure yet who deserves those spots, but Barkley and Jorginho are probably in the lead right now. As DB stole most of my thoughts on the game, i'll instead offer some unsolicited player rankings: Kepa: 7/10 - Couldn't do anything about any of the four goals: penalty, tap-in, one-on-one, deflected shot. Distribution was decent and made a few tidy saves, one of the few calming influences at the back. Dave: 4/10 - At fault for Martial's goal although a tough situation against a substantially bigger attacker. Given he doesn't offer a lot going forward he needs to be at his dominant peak defensively, and i'm a little concerned he has lost a step of pace and is no longer quite at it. Also questionable positioning/communication for the third goal. Few strikeforces will have as much pace as Martial-Rashford though, so better days ahead. Christensen: 5/10 - More composed on the ball than he was at times last season, but lost Rashford for the third. Otherwise made a few key tackles and blocks - I think he's a step down from Luiz but is now comfortably our best CB partner for Rudiger. Zouma: 2/10 - Shocking first half, although not really responsible for the second-half goals. I think the pace really troubled him, and that he'll be a more effective CB against more physical, less quick strikeforces. I still believe in him long-term as a serviceable squad player, but don't think he'll ever be comfortable enough on the ball to be a nailed on starter. Emerson: 6/10 - The best defender today, got unlucky with the deflection on the last goal, but perhaps could have done more in the build-up to the second. Solid striker of the ball and far more handy going forward than Dave, which is going to mean a lot of our attacking play this season runs down his flank. Unlucky to hit the bar. Jorginho: 6/10 - For all the talk last season of needing to play a 4-3-3 with Kante more advanced to fit in Jorginho, he actually looked more comfortable next to Kovacic, which was fairly amusing. With the inexperience around him he seemed to take a leadership role in the middle of the park, and think he's going to be key for us this year as a playmaker - his role will be very different once Kante is next to him I imagine. Kovacic: 5/10 - Typical decent at everything while not standing out for anything in particular performance, think he'll find starting roles hard to come by once RLC and Kante are fully fit, which makes the big fee we paid for him appear like it was exclusively down to the transfer ban. Barkley: 7/10 - Thought he was our most dangerous player and not sure why Frank brought him off rather than Mount or Pedro (or why he got shunted to the wing). Like Jorginho, I think our fate this season is going to fall in large part on his shoulders. I think he's got the physical and technical tools needed to be our starting attacking mid, just needs to pick up the confidence. Mount: 6/10 - Very surprised to see him start, but he looked very comfortable. Faded once we went behind, I think he'll be better suited to coming off the bench this season while he finds his feet, but we can also feel comfortable about starting him following this performance. Also potentially our best long-distance threat. Pedro: 4/10 - Think he was our least effective attacking player although because of his effort on both ends, he'll always at least offer a 4/10. Made a couple of wrong decisions when he could have played in Tammy, and think his role is under peril once CHO returns. Tammy: 5/10 - Decent performance and unlucky to hit the post, he's not a top striker yet but on today's performance he has enough in his bag to start a lot of games this season at least. I still think we'll need to spend big on a striker next summer, and that Tammy will slot into a backup role going forward. Questionable whether he's already better than Giroud - against defences which sit deep I think Giroud's physicality and passing will make him more valuable. Subs: Kante 7/10, we missed him so dearly and he stopped a near-certain goal with an incredible recovery tackle; Pulisic/Giroud 5/10 - Unfortunate they both came into the game while the defence self-imploded and game suddenly became lost. Frank: 6/10 - Tactically he appeared to get it right, before being undone by personal error and some unlucky finishing. Substitutions were positive. At Derby he was very attack-minded, but like Sarri and others before him, he may need to start treating these tougher games a bit more pragmatically in-future. I think he would have learned a lot about his personnel today, and I hope the club will be patient with him.