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Torres - The "Groundhog Day" Thread


Torres: stay or go?  

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  1. 1. Torres: stay or go?

    • Stay
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    • Go
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I do wonder what Torres made of last night.

 

Not even second choice now with a 36 year old Drobga above him in the pecking order. If Costa stays fit I can't see him getting many minutes other than being wheeled out for the League cup along with youth players and the like.

 

I get he is on big money but does he really want to go out like this? He will unfortunately be remembered for what he became and not what he once was and it's not pretty.

 

If I was him I would be jumping up and down telling my agent to get me a transfer to any club where he could at least try to salvage the last few years of his career. He is never going to be tearing the best defences in Europe apart, that player is long gone but perhaps a new team, a weaker league and a fresh start could see him at least deliver something of wroth as opposed to being nothing more than a financially crippling  burden that nobody, fans or manager, really wants hanging about.

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There are many athletes in the U.S., whether baseball, football, or basketball, who are past their prime and are on huge "guaranteed" wages.   None that I can recall has decided to take a lower pay for another team and break their current contract, and so what Torres is doing is not unreasonable given that.  I really do not blame him -- money is money.

Edited by Phillip
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I do wonder what Torres made of last night.

 

Not even second choice now with a 36 year old Drobga above him in the pecking order. If Costa stays fit I can't see him getting many minutes other than being wheeled out for the League cup along with youth players and the like.

 

I get he is on big money but does he really want to go out like this? He will unfortunately be remembered for what he became and not what he once was and it's not pretty.

 

If I was him I would be jumping up and down telling my agent to get me a transfer to any club where he could at least try to salvage the last few years of his career. He is never going to be tearing the best defences in Europe apart, that player is long gone but perhaps a new team, a weaker league and a fresh start could see him at least deliver something of wroth as opposed to being nothing more than a financially crippling  burden that nobody, fans or manager, really wants hanging about.

Why? He's on huge wages which no one will match and he's got a shot at like 5 trophies. Even if he is a bit player for the club I doubt I'd move either

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Torres has won everything in football barring a league title, I think he will happily stay as 3rd choice striker, in the hope he gets a winners medal or 2 by the end of the year.

The same poor mentality that has seen him struggle here, will also be the reason why he won't request to leave, in order to play regularly. He has lacked fight since day one, and I think he will be collecting his 175k a week for a least another season.

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I do wonder what Torres made of last night.

 

Not even second choice now with a 36 year old Drobga above him in the pecking order. If Costa stays fit I can't see him getting many minutes other than being wheeled out for the League cup along with youth players and the like.

 

I get he is on big money but does he really want to go out like this? He will unfortunately be remembered for what he became and not what he once was and it's not pretty.

 

If I was him I would be jumping up and down telling my agent to get me a transfer to any club where he could at least try to salvage the last few years of his career. He is never going to be tearing the best defences in Europe apart, that player is long gone but perhaps a new team, a weaker league and a fresh start could see him at least deliver something of wroth as opposed to being nothing more than a financially crippling  burden that nobody, fans or manager, really wants hanging about.

To early to judge who is second choice in my opinion. I think jose near enough admitted in his post match interview that he brought drogba on just so it gave chelsea fans the feeling of having him back. We will find out who is 2nd choice in the games where we are struggling or if costa needs a rest or is injured.

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Torres has won everything in football barring a league title, I think he will happily stay as 3rd choice striker, in the hope he gets a winners medal or 2 by the end of the year.

The same poor mentality that has seen him struggle here, will also be the reason why he won't request to leave, in order to play regularly. He has lacked fight since day one, and I think he will be collecting his 175k a week for a least another season.

So if cech stays and fights for his place does that mean he lacks fight aswell? Have you not thought that perhaps torres wants to stay and fight for his place? Not everything is black and white you know

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Think it's unfair to say he's happy to sit and take the money since he's always been involved until now as either s starter or playing every other game.

I'd actually argue it's his desire to win the 1 thing he hasn't won the EPL title which might be making him want to continue on.

I also don't think he has gave up with football, it's been his life since he was a boy it's just he's not as good at it as he once was.

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So if cech stays and fights for his place does that mean he lacks fight aswell? Have you not thought that perhaps torres wants to stay and fight for his place? Not everything is black and white you know

What is black and white is the way torres couldn't live with the competition when drogba was here. He retreated into his shell, and he's gone from being a lethal striker, to player that doesn't even get himself into scoring positions because he is scared of missing.

That to me is a lack of fight. Torres failures at chelsea have been 80% mental, 15% physical, and 5% tactical.

He has never earned a place in the side before, so what makes think that he is staying to fight and earn his place back now?

Petr Cech has been an outstanding servant to the club, if he wants to stay and fight for his place, I fully believe he would do just that, as he fought back from a life threatening injury, to return to being a world class keeper.

If he does leave after winning everything and breaking numerous records, it will be because of pride and self belief, that he is still good enough to be play at the very top.

If torres had those qualities, he would have put a transfer request in at the end of last season, having been dropped in place of an aging Samuel eto'o, and an average journeyman in demba ba.

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People saying he is on high wages and in the hunt for 5 trophies and that is why he should stay.

 

I already acknowledged the wages are a problem but my point was that, for a man who already has more money than he can possibly spend, he may wish to take a pat cut (and still earn more in one week than most of us do in a year) in order to salvage his career. A few years in a lesser league, a Europa League level club perhaps and he might just end his career on a high with a bit of respect. If he winds his contract down at Chelsea he will regrettably be remembered as a laughing stock and that is the sad but undeniable truth.

 

As for 5 trophies.... how much will he value those if he has little to no contribution? I just can't see how he will get a sniff this year.

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It really is astonishing how Torres with all the class he showed at Liverpool has been so utterly terrible at our club. And not just now, but from the first games he played. Probably the biggest flop in PL history in my book, Liverpool at least got some money back for Carroll and wasn't stuck with his wages for years.

 

He is perfectly happy with sitting on the bench with his wages i suppose but i do wish he had guts enough to go to another club and give his career a last go albeit for less money. I don't see that happening though. So he'll be here for the next two years.

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What is black and white is the way torres couldn't live with the competition when drogba was here. He retreated into his shell, and he's gone from being a lethal striker, to player that doesn't even get himself into scoring positions because he is scared of missing.

That to me is a lack of fight. Torres failures at chelsea have been 80% mental, 15% physical, and 5% tactical.

He has never earned a place in the side before, so what makes think that he is staying to fight and earn his place back now?

Petr Cech has been an outstanding servant to the club, if he wants to stay and fight for his place, I fully believe he would do just that, as he fought back from a life threatening injury, to return to being a world class keeper.

If he does leave after winning everything and breaking numerous records, it will be because of pride and self belief, that he is still good enough to be play at the very top.

If torres had those qualities, he would have put a transfer request in at the end of last season, having been dropped in place of an aging Samuel eto'o, and an average journeyman in demba ba.

Never earnt a place in the side before? So why did the best manager in world football continue to play him last season despite having 2 other strikers and also praised his attitude and how hard working he is? Why is it so hard to believe that torres would want to stay and fight costa who is unproven in the premier league and drogba who is nowhere near as good as he once was? It's not like he has ronaldo and messi ahead of him in the pecking order.

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Never earnt a place in the side before? So why did the best manager in world football continue to play him last season despite having 2 other strikers and also praised his attitude and how hard working he is? Why is it so hard to believe that torres would want to stay and fight costa who is unproven in the premier league and drogba who is nowhere near as good as he once was? It's not like he has ronaldo and messi ahead of him in the pecking order.

The best manager of the world rightfully dropped him in every big game of season when eto'o was fit. Eventually ba surpassed him in the pecking order. Mourinho also lamented his striking options last season, and even went as far to say he had no strikers.

Why would torres want to play under a manager that clearly holds him in such low regard. Eto'o and ba both took the hint. Torres seems content to lap up that money, with the minimum of fuss.

So my point still stands, he has never earned his place in the team, he has only ever been in the team on reputation.

Has he ever put in 4/5 performances in on the spin, which has warranted him to be first choice?

I think you would struggle to find many decent back to back performances.

How many big games in 4 and a half years, has he been the difference for us?

Maybe 1 or 2?

If he does possess this fighting spirit, then it has been seriously lacking in his chelsea career so far.

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Never earnt a place in the side before? So why did the best manager in world football continue to play him last season despite having 2 other strikers and also praised his attitude and how hard working he is? Why is it so hard to believe that torres would want to stay and fight costa who is unproven in the premier league and drogba who is nowhere near as good as he once was? It's not like he has ronaldo and messi ahead of him in the pecking order.

If you mean fighting for his place, like he did after the victory in munich when he pissed all over the greatest night in the history of Chelsea by moaning about being left out of the starting line-up and wanted to have assurances the he is the Nr. 1 Striker the season after, i agree.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/fernando-torres-slams-chelsea-and-hints-841821

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The best manager of the world rightfully dropped him in every big game of season when eto'o was fit. Eventually ba surpassed him in the pecking order. Mourinho also lamented his striking options last season, and even went as far to say he had no strikers.

Why would torres want to play under a manager that clearly holds him in such low regard. Eto'o and ba both took the hint. Torres seems content to lap up that money, with the minimum of fuss.

So my point still stands, he has never earned his place in the team, he has only ever been in the team on reputation.

Has he ever put in 4/5 performances in on the spin, which has warranted him to be first choice?

I think you would struggle to find many decent back to back performances.

How many big games in 4 and a half years, has he been the difference for us?

Maybe 1 or 2?

If he does possess this fighting spirit, then it has been seriously lacking in his chelsea career so far.

Wrong

 

You are missing my point entirely. I couldn't give a monkeys what has gone on in the past. We all know what has gone on. My point is for you to say he lacks fight for staying is just not true. If jose is happy to have him as one of our 3 strikers then he can't rate him that badly. It really isn't hard to believe that torres thinks he can get a lot of game time this year ahead of drogba. But as usual people will look to his wages and say he is only staying because of that. Truth is the club offered him that why should he ask for a paycut?

Edited by Bluehatter
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Wrong

You are missing my point entirely. I couldn't give a monkeys what has gone on in the past. We all know what has gone on. My point is for you to say he lacks fight for staying is just not true. If jose is happy to have him as one of our 3 strikers then he can't rate him that badly. It really isn't hard to believe that torres thinks he can get a lot of game time this year ahead of drogba. But as usual people will look to his wages and say he is only staying because of that. Truth is the club offered him that why should he ask for a paycut?

I'm not wrong about him not starting most of the big games, schurrle even played ahead of him away at United.

I'm not blaming torres for earning the amount he does, I do question his character though, and I also think if he was on less money, he would have moved after the damping comments Mourinho made about strikers.

Considering his reputation, I think it is pretty damning that demba ba wasn't happy being 2nd/3rd choice and playing for a manager who doesn't rate him.

Torres on the other hand seems happy enough despite mourinho's comments last season. I mean where is his pride?

I don't think Mourinho has much of a choice but to accept torres as part of the squad, as he isn't going anywhere.

I'm sure if it was up to Mourinho he would be out the door with the other 2 he deemed not good enough.

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I'm not wrong about him not starting most of the big games, schurrle even played ahead of him away at United.

I'm not blaming torres for earning the amount he does, I do question his character though, and I also think if he was on less money, he would have moved after the damping comments Mourinho made about strikers.

Considering his reputation, I think it is pretty damning that demba ba wasn't happy being 2nd/3rd choice and playing for a manager who doesn't rate him.

Torres on the other hand seems happy enough despite mourinho's comments last season. I mean where is his pride?

I don't think Mourinho has much of a choice but to accept torres as part of the squad, as he isn't going anywhere.

I'm sure if it was up to Mourinho he would be out the door with the other 2 he deemed not good enough.

Your original post said every big game so therefore you were wrong.

 

I prefer to look at it the opposite way. Torres is determined to stay and prove jose wrong. You may be right that jose doesn't have a choice and he has to accept torres as part of the squad but he clearly doesn't rate him as badly as most people on here otherwise he would make sure he had another striker because realistically we are going to need our 2nd/ 3rd striker to step up at some point during the season so jose obviously still has some faith in him.

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Its obvious Jose wants Torres as much as most of us want a bad case of herpes but he is shrewd enough to understand and accept that he is stuck with him in the squad and can do absolutely nothing about it.

The only way Torres is leaving is:

A) He asks to leave via a transfer request.

B) Roman bites the bullet and makes it known that Torres is surplus to requirements and the club will listen to any offers, loan or sale, without any target recoup transfer fee, ( the reported £20 million is a complete joke).

Unfortunately neither option looks imminent and so Jose is stuck with him. Its a sad and pathetic situation for both the player and the club which could well haunt us at some point in the season.

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Well Jose gave the message loud and clear last night that he isn't part of his 1st team but I think it could be a messy ending. Personally I can't see Torres taking the hint and toddling off into the sunset. I think we will have another.........

 

 

 

 

 

As he put him on the bench he did not give a loud & clear message though did he, to give a real clear message he should have use a youngster on the bench in place of Torres, giving a message that even youth is above you.  

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I think Jose respects the effort Torres puts in but also knows the guys just not got it anymore.

Leaving him on the bench at the weekend and not bringing him on should hammer home that he isn't going to get much of a look in so that might make the wheels start turning on him looking for a move be it transfer or loan.

I'm not going to slate the guy as I think he's a thoroughly nice guy and he has tried but sadly his form and ability have gone to sh*t since he signed, I'm sure he didn't want that just as much as we didn't but sh*t happens I guess. We are the ones who choose to give him a ludicrous contract and a 5 year deal.

I'm sure he will have regrets about his time here as we do for him but he's still won 2 European cups and a few cups, not a total failure but will never be remembered for anything other than his incredible decline.

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Not really sure at this point what we should do with Torres. He is an experienced player. Do we sell him or loan him out and buy an experienced player as our second striker or just stick with him. He is still an okay player though but an unfortunate injuries to Costa and Drogba and we are stuck with him. Even he would think that is not an optimal situation with his track record...

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As he put him on the bench he did not give a loud & clear message though did he, to give a real clear message he should have use a youngster on the bench in place of Torres, giving a message that even youth is above you.

Take your point mbh but with the Boro loan deal for Bamford seemingly done and dusted it probably wasn't an option on the night. What did happen was a 36 year old who has spent the last two seasons playing in the Chinese and Turkish leagues was the preferred forward substitute over a £50 million striker fully fit and 6 years younger.

Edited by just
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