I`ve never seen someone so wrong so often be so absolutely certain of themselves, its almost laudable....almost.

16 hours ago, Deino said:

Not true, their decisionmaking are different according to the traits and abilities that they have, even the opponents will respond different.

True but that is not really the reason.

This is vs united who played 343 same as leverkusen. We won from brilliant play by James and good header from cucu but the game was a grind.

We attacked in 3133 same as vs leverkusen But notice how united defend against us, almost 100% man to man. Is it because Jackson is suck, Madueke is suck. Nope, man to man defend is the meta this days. Everyone run it. That is lindelof, United rcb following our lb. This may look crazy but this is very normal this days in pl.

Edited August 15, 2025Aug 15 by Bob stark

It's threads like this that underline why modern football is becoming less enjoyable. All over-analysis, data and guys with ipads.

Give me an Eden Hazard or Cole Palmer who go out and do stuff which isn't covered in the rule books and leaves the tech guys scratching their heads and pretty much redundant.

2 hours ago, Bob stark said:

True but that is not really the reason.

This is vs united who played 343 same as leverkusen. We won from brilliant play by James and good header from cucu but the game was a grind.

We attacked in 3133 same as vs leverkusen But notice how united defend against us, almost 100% man to man. Is it because Jackson is suck, Madueke is suck. Nope, man to man defend is the meta this days. Everyone run it. That is lindelof, United rcb following our lb. This may look crazy but this is very normal this days in pl.

You're not wrong but 1v1 duels isn't really a "meta". It's there since football was invented.

Here's where better players makes an impact, when it's 1v1, a lot of technical qualities become highlighted. What's the defender's preferred choice? How's the first touch of the offensive player? What're the weapons the offensive player possesses?

Guarding Jackson and Madueke is relatively easy, stay on their strong foot but give them just enough of a yard to slow down and get the ball, keeping their zones limited, why? Because Madueke is a ball hog and he has tendencies to make the wrong choice, Jackson on the other hand doesn't have high ball striking techniques, he always hit and hopes in the critical moments.

20 minutes ago, Nibs said:

It's threads like this that underline why modern football is becoming less enjoyable. All over-analysis, data and guys with ipads.

Give me an Eden Hazard or Cole Palmer who go out and do stuff which isn't covered in the rule books and leaves the tech guys scratching their heads and pretty much redundant.

Sometimes I feel like this but then I realize I want to spend time consuming Chelsea. What you can do there is to watch old matches, highlights, play FIFA/eFootball, read articles and stories. Then you stumble upon YouTube videos about tactics and delve into that. This forum naturally is one time consumer. A ton of material to go through or interact regarding Chelsea...

Back in the day without all this it was the matches.

In the end football is a very simple game which is underlined by simply level above players such as Palmer and Hazard. When you go into percentages and small margins you are left with all that strategy talk and tactics.

No wonder managers go bald talking tactics 24/7 gets tedious

3 hours ago, Bob stark said:

True but that is not really the reason.

This is vs united who played 343 same as leverkusen. We won from brilliant play by James and good header from cucu but the game was a grind.

We attacked in 3133 same as vs leverkusen But notice how united defend against us, almost 100% man to man. Is it because Jackson is suck, Madueke is suck. Nope, man to man defend is the meta this days. Everyone run it. That is lindelof, United rcb following our lb. This may look crazy but this is very normal this days in pl.

Sorry Bob - I increasingly disagree with your tactical analysis.

Yes - the Utd game was a grind, but regardless of man to man marking, it is really quite simple. Better players, with more ability and footballing intelligence, breeds more confidence, which in turn allows the players on the pitch to move the ball faster, which in turn creates more space, and pulls the opposition to different areas and out of position, which in turn creates space.

Most of the problem last season (for the last 5 or 6 seasons) has been players moving the ball too slowly, which allows opposition to sit back and defend deep, without us hurting them. That was exacerbated by sh*t players (Jackson, Mudryk as examples) not having a clue on what to do, or the football intellect or ability to do it.

It doesnt matter how the opposition defend - they will ALWAYS be trying to stop us playing and scoring. It is for good players, with good intellect to find solutions, and a manager that allows for flexibilty for players to adapt to work those solutions which unlock the different problems teams cause us.

A good player will be able to do that. A sh*t one like Jackson will have no idea.

2 hours ago, Nibs said:

It's threads like this that underline why modern football is becoming less enjoyable. All over-analysis, data and guys with ipads.

Give me an Eden Hazard or Cole Palmer who go out and do stuff which isn't covered in the rule books and leaves the tech guys scratching their heads and pretty much redundant.

You don't need any of this to enjoy football. But if you want to understand why for example mou 1.0 or Conte first season was so good then you need to understand this.

It is funny reading so many fans here trying to argue about this. The best part is when everyone keep talking about how having better st and winger help our build up when in 90% of screenshot that I share, they were not even in the picture.

Did you guys watch Chelsea last season?

Maresca offense is all about central build up. Two winger high and wide, overload in the middle. Recycle the ball, find the free 10/6, progress. The winger doesn't get involve in the build up.

Edited August 16, 2025Aug 16 by Bob stark

23 minutes ago, Bob stark said:

It is funny reading so many fans here trying to argue about this. The best part is when everyone keep talking about how having better st and winger help our build up when in 90% of screenshot that I share, they were not even in the picture.

Did you guys watch Chelsea last season?

Maresca offense is all about central build up. Two winger high and wide, overload in the middle. Recycle the ball, find the free 10/6, progress. The winger doesn't get involve in the build up.

Only because you used the Jackson and Madueke example.

After Maresca's press conference, he explicitly states that he needs better players for the buildup. It's clear as day that tactics are created around the players. A better player will improve everything

42 minutes ago, Deino said:

Only because you used the Jackson and Madueke example.

After Maresca's press conference, he explicitly states that he needs better players for the buildup. It's clear as day that tactics are created around the players. A better player will improve everything

Completely agree better player improve everything

How does

Cucu - Palmer - Santos

Chalobah - Acheampong - Gusto

Improve over

Cucu - Palmer - Enzo

Colwill - Tosin - James??

4 hours ago, Bob stark said:

Completely agree better player improve everything

How does

Cucu - Palmer - Santos

Chalobah - Acheampong - Gusto

Improve over

Cucu - Palmer - Enzo

Colwill - Tosin - James??

This was during preseason? Why does it matter? Preseason is for testing out players and combinations against a semi-serious team

Should be revisited again after Maresca has established the new starting XI

On 16/08/2025 at 06:34, Bob stark said:

It is funny reading so many fans here trying to argue about this. The best part is when everyone keep talking about how having better st and winger help our build up when in 90% of screenshot that I share, they were not even in the picture.

Did you guys watch Chelsea last season?

Maresca offense is all about central build up. Two winger high and wide, overload in the middle. Recycle the ball, find the free 10/6, progress. The winger doesn't get involve in the build up.

Ah yes, a single freeze frame from 96 minutes of football definitely shows the entire picture....

How to build up against team who blocked middle.

As I said in Palace thread, the space is on the wide area low and we need cucu n Enzo to flare wide. Enzo n estevao move wide, done.

Is this a good tactical move,this is such an obvious thing that I don't think you need manager to "fix" this. Playing in midfield 3 and you have 2 player playing either very static blocking the passing lane or just running behind without offering option is just crazy.

15 minutes ago, Bob stark said:

How to build up against team who blocked middle.

As I said in Palace thread, the space is on the wide area low and we need cucu n Enzo to flare wide. Enzo n estevao move wide, done.

Is this a good tactical move,this is such an obvious thing that I don't think you need manager to "fix" this. Playing in midfield 3 and you have 2 player playing either very static blocking the passing lane or just running behind without offering option is just crazy.

Wrong. Passing it sideways between our defenders is not a good way to "build up" against teams who block the middle. That just allows them to settle.

The way is to go hammer and tongs, passing and moving the ball forward, with pace, and pulling their players out of position.

Slow and Steady does NOT always win the race.

3 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

Wrong. Passing it sideways between our defenders is not a good way to "build up" against teams who block the middle. That just allows them to settle.

The way is to go hammer and tongs, passing and moving the ball forward, with pace, and pulling their players out of position.

Slow and Steady does NOT always win the race.

😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫

There is no such thing as just pass forward. Team pass sideway to create passing angle and to free up player so you can pass forward.

41 minutes ago, Bob stark said:

😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫

There is no such thing as just pass forward. Team pass sideway to create passing angle and to free up player so you can pass forward.

The question whether that was attempted. When Estevao is Caicedo bolting into space, is Enzo making sure he is onside ready to spring the trap. Or is the ball passed at such a slow lazy tempo that Estevao looks up, sees nothing is now on and then passes another slow tempo pass back to Trev, only for it all to be repeated without a West Ham player with ten yards of us.

16 minutes ago, WhiteWall said:

Estevao looks up, sees nothing is now on and then passes another slow tempo pass back to Trev, only for it all to be repeated without a West Ham player with ten yards of us.

This is actually better than two wide midfielder sitting narrow blocking passing lane for everyone. At least now west ham mid/fw need to move wide to cover which open up passing lane in the middle.

1 minute ago, Bob stark said:

This is actually better than two wide midfielder sitting narrow blocking passing lane for everyone. At least now west ham mid/fw need to move wide to cover which open up passing lane in the middle.

But again you fail to acknowledge that a lack of tempo, intensity or desire makes the whole exercise apathetic and pointless. Whilst we are lazily passing the ball backwards and forwards the opposition themselves are reshaping at a jogging pace also.

What your stills can't show is the risk averse lack of intent and the slow pace of the passes being made.

I can bear this if there is probing, vision, movement with intent. If there is an underlying sense of brooding power ready to pounce once an opening is created. This is just powder puff aimless passing to each other with risk aversion at the forefront of the philosophy

3 minutes ago, WhiteWall said:

But again you fail to acknowledge that a lack of tempo, intensity or desire makes the whole exercise apathetic and pointless. Whilst we are lazily passing the ball backwards and forwards the opposition themselves are reshaping at a jogging pace also.

What your stills can't show is the risk averse lack of intent and the slow pace of the passes being made.

I can bear this if there is probing, vision, movement with intent. If there is an underlying sense of brooding power ready to pounce once an opening is created. This is just powder puff aimless passing to each other with risk aversion at the forefront of the philosophy

This is not me denying that. Passing speed, intent, quality matter. But it doesn't matter if you have two player blocking the passing lane. The distance that your opp need to cover is so short that it is too easy for them to block everything.

Passing forward is not just about the passer. You need the player in front of them to move either to receive or to create passing angle for others.

Edited August 23, 2025Aug 23 by Bob stark

Let me give you one example (I just go to some random minute and this is the first settled possesion that I can get) Sarr is blocking passing angle to Cucu. Now if all cucu does is sit there or run forward. Our cb can move the ball as fast they want, it won't matter. Now imagine this the moment acheampong receive the ball and pass to Chalo, Cucu move wide. Either Sar need to move wide to cover for cucu which mean there is passing angle to Palmer or cucu can be free and start our offense

Edited August 23, 2025Aug 23 by Bob stark

Sorry Bob - you really over complicate this issue.

It is actually really simple.

Passing the ball faster, without the constant slow, sideways and stagnant passing between defenders, will pull the opposition out of shape, and in turn, create space for us.

When Maresca instucts this team to pass it 50 times between CBs and defenders around the halfway line, the only thing it is doing is allowing the opposing team to reset and get in shape.

You can give 1 off examples of any given game, because of course, on a pitch with 11 men, there will always be options, and players not in the 100% optimal position - but it is largely irrelevent.

GENERALLY speaking, we need to move the ball faster, with more progressive passing, which in turn pull the opposition out of position, and creates space for our very good and expensive attacking players to exploit.

3 hours ago, Bob stark said:

😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫

There is no such thing as just pass forward. Team pass sideway to create passing angle and to free up player so you can pass forward.

and nobody said only ever pass it forward....

We are saying we need to pass the ball forward more progressively, and pass the ball faster..... and stop the endless/pointless 500 passes between defenders over and over again.

As I said in Sanchez thread, to save a shot against a player taking a shot you must use your hands.

As you see from this picture, Sanchez not used his hands well. What he should have done is took a step to the side and then stretched his hand out to save it. This is obvious thing, most manager should see this.

let's analyze United. It is simple but it is borderline insanity to be this bad.

15 min into the game.

Bruno looks lost whereas ugarte is marking reijnders. simple pass to Rodri who is free.

Now whose job is it to mark foden ? Does Ugarte need to sprint back to foden after marking reijnders ?

Is it shaw job? Which mean de light will have to defend that right hand channel 1v1 vs Haaaland 😂😂😂

You simply cannot have this many confusion defensively. I rarely criticize manager tactic, most of the time it is not the problem but in Amorim case it is just so bad.

Edited September 17, 2025Sep 17 by Bob stark