Willian has some great attributes. He can truly be a top top player. He just needs to get to that next level and find consistency. The problem is that he has always been a creator, now asked to be more aggressive and direct. It takes a while for a player to learn the movements. We have Oscar, Willian and Torres (3 of our front 4) making poor choices and bad movement - at times they're downright static. 2 of those will learn and evolve under Jose. The other is a lost cause.

 The problem is that he has always been a creator,

 

I have a very hard time believing this

I have a very hard time believing this

Watch some of his Shaktar performances then, if you can find it. What you're seeing now is not close to what he is capable of.

Watch some of his Shaktar performances then, if you can find it. What you're seeing now is not close to what he is capable of.

 

 

20 goals in 140 appearances for Shakhtar.

 

Only 2 goals for us this season and about 3 assists despite often taking free kicks and corners.

 

Hardly prolific is he.

 

He does know how to run around a lot though, so that's okay. 

Watch some of his Shaktar performances then, if you can find it. What you're seeing now is not close to what he is capable of.

 

are we just gonna disregard the fact the ukranian league and the premier league are miles away (figuratively, and literally)?

He's one player getting stick that is unjust for me. The guy works his socks off and people talk about his lack of end product yet his defensive work is saving us at the other end of the pitch. Its only his first season here aswell, he can only get better.

he needs to start putting up better numbers, or play deeper.

He's one player getting stick that is unjust for me. The guy works his socks off and people talk about his lack of end product yet his defensive work is saving us at the other end of the pitch. Its only his first season here aswell, he can only get better.

 

But he's an attacking midfielder that isn't very good at attacking.

 

Yeah he works hard and defends well but that's what defenders are for.

Edited April 3, 201412 yr by ForeverCarefree

I think thats fair comment but for £30 million its not unreasonable to have expected some more end product.

 

My dog runs around a lot too, and he only has one assist less than Willian this season.

He's one player getting stick that is unjust for me. The guy works his socks off and people talk about his lack of end product yet his defensive work is saving us at the other end of the pitch. Its only his first season here aswell, he can only get better.

 

For the third goal he was standing and watching. Ok, he probably thought between Azpi & Lamps they had Pestore dealt with but by the time he realised they hadn't it was too late and he was on his heels. But that aside, IMO he still isn't giving us anything like enough as an attacking threat. When we signed him, I thought and hoped we were getting the player who tore us apart when he played Shakatar a couple of seasons back. I want to see him doing things like Pastore and Lucas did to us last night, not run and then pass backwards or sideways. We need more than a lot of running (applies even more to Ramires that one!).

Edited April 3, 201412 yr by Nibs

It's only his first season or do people seem to forget that? Problem is people expect players to hit the ground running when in all truth some players need at least a year to settle in. Don't forget he has played most of his football in Ukraine and Russia

 

I for one think he has had a good debut season

For the third goal he was standing and watching. Ok, he probably thought between Azpi & Lamps they had Pestore dealt with but by the time he realised they hadn't it was too late and he was on his heels. But that aside, IMO he still isn't giving us anything like enough as an attacking threat. When we signed him, I thought and hoped we were getting the player who tore us apart when he played Shakatar a couple of seasons back. I want to see him doing things like Pastore and Lucas did to us last night, not run and then pass backwards or sideways. We need more than a lot of running (applies even more to Ramires that one!).

 

You do know Pastore will generally only do things like that a few times a season if he's lucky? He's a decent player but seriously lacks the consistency and mentality to be a top player. Willian has both of those

He's one player getting stick that is unjust for me. The guy works his socks off and people talk about his lack of end product yet his defensive work is saving us at the other end of the pitch. Its only his first season here aswell, he can only get better.

 

I agree, I can see why the likes of Mikel, Torres, Ramires, Luiz and Oscar get flak from time to time, but I think Willian is being judged far harsher than anyone else because of his price tag, he didn't choose it, he performed better last night than Hazard OR Oscar OR Schurrle.

End of the day he's doing the jon Jose has asked him to do and for me keeping goals out at the other end is good as scoring them.

20 goals in 140 appearances for Shakhtar.

Only 2 goals for us this season and about 3 assists despite often taking free kicks and corners.

Hardly prolific is he.

He does know how to run around a lot though, so that's okay.

And the point of you arguing his prolificacy is? It was never debated.

And in any case - Iniesta 330 games - 33 goals.....sh!t too isn't he?

I'll say it again, Willian has always played as a link-up player. He is asked to play a different role under Jose and he must also adapt to the league. Give him time. He has fantastic attributes.

And the point of you arguing his prolificacy is? It was never debated.

And in any case - Iniesta 330 games - 33 goals.....sh!t too isn't he?

I'll say it again, Willian has always played as a link-up player. He is asked to play a different role under Jose and he must also adapt to the league. Give him time. He has fantastic attributes.

 

Because he's an attacking midfielder that isn't very good at attacking. 

 

He's almost a year in now and his goals and assists for us aren't good enough.

 

He'll be 26 going into the new season, he isn't going to improve vastly from the player he is now. 

 

In his position you get judged by your contribution to attacking play, he's directly contributed to 5 goals. 

 

5 goals from a £30m player? Even Moses managed double figures last season with reduced playing time. 

He doesnt look anywhere near dangerous enough to warrant the price we paid for him.

His shooting is dire, final ball lacking and gives the ball away far too often.

His work rate and engine are fantastic but come on...we need more than that

Edited April 3, 201412 yr by RFC_CFC

5 goals from a £30m player? Even Moses managed double figures last season with reduced playing time. 

 

Wow, I didn't realise that, that's actually quite impressive. I remember his awesome header against Shakhtar, but somehow failed to notice that he scored 4 in 6 in the Europa League. Then again Torres managed to get 6...

He's almost a year in now and his goals and assists for us aren't good enough.

He'll be 26 going into the new season, he isn't going to improve vastly from the player he is now.

Like you say, less than a year with the team. For sure his output is not up to scratch yet.

It's not about improving vastly, he doesn't need to do that. He already has all the attributes. He needs to be more effective and adapt to the demands of the PL. That will come with time.

Wow, I didn't realise that, that's actually quite impressive. I remember his awesome header against Shakhtar, but somehow failed to notice that he scored 4 in 6 in the Europa League. Then again Torres managed to get 6...

 

I'm not suggesting that Moses is a better player but he did manage to contribute more of an attacking threat despite being restricted to a lot of sub appearances.

 

Willian has been afforded the opportunity to have an extended run in the side this season and it's hard not to feel rather underwhelmed by his overall contribution. 

 

Willian, 32 appearances, 7 as sub - 2 goals and 3 assists. 

 

Schurrle, 31 appearances, 15 as sub - 7 goals, 1 assist.

 

 

I'm looking at those numbers and wondering if it really was worth the £50m investment? 

Like you say, less than a year with the team. For sure his output is not up to scratch yet.

It's not about improving vastly, he doesn't need to do that. He already has all the attributes. He needs to be more effective and adapt to the demands of the PL. That will come with time.

 

His career stats up to now suggest otherwise. 

I'm not suggesting that Moses is a better player but he did manage to contribute more of an attacking threat despite being restricted to a lot of sub appearances.

Willian has been afforded the opportunity to have an extended run in the side this season and it's hard not to feel rather underwhelmed by his overall contribution.

Willian, 32 appearances, 7 as sub - 2 goals and 3 assists.

Schurrle, 31 appearances, 15 as sub - 7 goals, 1 assist.

I'm looking at those numbers and wondering if it really was worth the £50m investment?

It's amazing we are where we are in the league considering our strikers aint hitting the double figures either.

Thank god for Eden.

His career stats up to now suggest otherwise.

No. They suggest a player who has never been prolific. That is all his stats suggest. Do you honestly expect a player to come from Anzhi, play a different role in a better league, and score/assist more than he ever has within his first season?

Get some perspective mate.

It's amazing we are where we are in the league considering our strikers aint hitting the double figures either.

Thank god for Eden.

 

A striker really is a must, recent matches such as last night and Palace showed that we are at times looking too dependent on individual brilliance rather than good team work. 

 

No. They suggest a player who has never been prolific. That is all his stats suggest. Do you honestly expect a player to come from Anzhi, play a different role in a better league, and score/assist more than he ever has within his first season?

Get some perspective mate.

 

I expect a player who cost £30m and near his peak to perform like one.... Mate. 

He doesnt look anywhere near dangerous enough to warrant the price we paid for him.

His shooting is dire, final ball lacking and gives the ball away far too often.

His work rate and engine are fantastic but come on...we need more than that

 

 For me this is what it comes down to.

 

£30 million. Yes i know he does a handy job and i know he works for the team but its just not unreasonable for us to have expected a little more for £30 million. We'd have the same amount of energy and running if we had signed Lee Cattermole.

 

I think he is decent enough (i gave him my mom last night)  but he cost £30 million. Just a little under what we paid for Hazard and more than we played for Mata and Oscar. Suarez cost less. As did Silva at City. Obviously its a little unfair to compare him to other transfers at other clubs for that type of outlay there should be more end product and id even allow for a settling in period when saying that too. Its genuinely not unfair to compare Moses contribution last season compared to Willians when your look at the prices paid.

 

We'll see if he improves next season, he's done enough to be considered a worthy member of the squad but I cant help but feeling we have overpaid and the money wouldve been far better spent elsewhere.

 

Already said somewhere else this morning that we have 4 current Brazilian internationals on our books that cost approx £100 million. We simply are not seeing that outlay repaid at the moment.

Edited April 3, 201412 yr by bjd