16 minutes ago, big blue said:

You keep trotting this line out like it is gospel.

Lampard didnt say that. 

He didnt even imply that CHO wasnt working hard enough in training. He gave a generic answer. He has said the same thing about every player he has been asked about "work hard in training, take your chances when they come". 

Obviously you will look for a negative in that statement, because it fits your opinion. 

The facts are CHO at 19, has worked himself into the starting 11 of the 3rd best team in the country twice under 2 different managers, only to have his progress halted by injury. The fact he keeps getting back in says more about how his attitude and how he trains, than a generic response thrown away by lampard. 

I don't mind someone saying my interpretation of what lampard said is wrong, I disagree with you but it's fair enough as press conferences are vague. 

But what he said yesterday is all that matters and it was clear, he's working hard. 

"He needs, as every player in the squad does, to work hard in training, keep improving daily in training and see the direction we are going in and be a part it."

- Pulisic 

But the next thing is to train consistently at a really high level, to work hard in training every day.

“He came back from lockdown and got injured pretty early in this period, so now he’s having to work hard to get fit again.

- Hudson-Odoi

One these players is seen as having an attitude problem. 

4 minutes ago, big blue said:

"He needs, as every player in the squad does, to work hard in training, keep improving daily in training and see the direction we are going in and be a part it."

- Pulisic 

But the next thing is to train consistently at a really high level, to work hard in training every day.

“He came back from lockdown and got injured pretty early in this period, so now he’s having to work hard to get fit again.

- Hudson-Odoi

One these players is seen as having an attitude problem. 

Lampard cited the game-changing impact of Christian Pulisic and Willian since the restart as examples of the standards Hudson-Odoi needs to reach if he is to win a regular place in the starting line-up.

‘He really needs to work hard daily in training, do the right things daily and when he gets his opportunities, whether from the bench or to start, really show input in games and make a difference,' explained the boss.

‘We’re seeing at the moment what Pulisic and Willian are doing in and when Callum comes into the team or comes on, he has to show something similar.’

 

I interpreted that as CHO isn't working hard. I added to that the fact he wasn't playing any minutes when everyone else in the squad was getting them. 

 

I felt that interpretation was backed up by Lampard 2 weeks later, saying he has noticed Hudson odoi working hard in the past 2 weeks. 

Regardless of interpretation, it's the last 2 weeks that matters. 

 

Edited July 22, 20205 yr by bisright1

2 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

I don't mind someone saying my interpretation of what lampard said is wrong, I disagree with you but it's fair enough as press conferences are vague. 

But what he said yesterday is all that matters and it was clear, he's working hard. 

Your saying he hasnt played since the restart because he has a bad attitude and hasnt trained hard enough, and your twisting quotes to back up your opinion. 

He hasnt even been match fit for most of this restart. 

He is a raw talent that hadnt quite lived up to expectation ..yet. He is only 19 remember.

There are areas in his game that are easy to criticise.

When you have to start twisting the narrative to put him down though, it just stinks of having an agenda. 

 

Just now, big blue said:

Your saying he hasnt played since the restart because he has a bad attitude and hasnt trained hard enough, and your twisting quotes to back up your opinion. 

He hasnt even been match fit for most of this restart. 

He is a raw talent that hadnt quite lived up to expectation ..yet. He is only 19 remember.

There are areas in his game that are easy to criticise.

When you have to start twisting the narrative to put him down though, it just stinks of having an agenda. 

 

I'm not putting him down. I've literally said he's working hard now and that's what matters. 

Only Frank should care about his training attitude because that's his responsibility and its up to him to decide whether a not committed guy should start the games. I don't care about nothing but his performance on the pitch. And let's be real about it, it's been sh*t apart from 4-5 games total the past two years. 

The only reason this guy signed this hyper non-realistic new contract is because he is from England and the club felt tremendous pressure of losing a local lad that eventually turns out to be a good player.  

Thankfully the board and the owner proved to be unsentimental and they will replace him soon. 

We didn't even hesitate selling guys like De Bryune, Salah and Lukaku but with players like CHO and Abraham you can always feel the uncertainty about the decisions that are about to be made. 

Edited July 22, 20205 yr by Droopy

2 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

Lampard cited the game-changing impact of Christian Pulisic and Willian since the restart as examples of the standards Hudson-Odoi needs to reach if he is to win a regular place in the starting line-up.

‘He really needs to work hard daily in training, do the right things daily and when he gets his opportunities, whether from the bench or to start, really show input in games and make a difference,' explained the boss.

‘We’re seeing at the moment what Pulisic and Willian are doing in and when Callum comes into the team or comes on, he has to show something similar.’

 

I interpreted that as CHO isn't working hard. I added to that the fact he wasn't playing any minutes when everyone else in the squad was getting them. 

 

I felt that interpretation was backed up by Lampard 2 weeks later, saying he has noticed Hudson odoi working hard in the past 2 weeks. 

Regardless of interpretation, it's the last 2 weeks that matters. 

 

Of course he has been working hard in the last 2 weeks, he only started training again 2 weeks ago. He has been injured. Did you just skip that part of the quote? He came back from the break injured, in the last 2 weeks he has managed to get himself fit enough to train regularly again. 

You are assuming lampard saying "train hard" is the same as him saying "train harder".

Its not.

Just now, big blue said:

Of course he has been working hard in the last 2 weeks, he only started training again 2 weeks ago. He has been injured. Did you just skip that part of the quote? He came back from the break injured, in the last 2 weeks he has managed to get himself fit enough to train regularly again. 

You are assuming lampard saying "train hard" is the same as him saying "train harder".

Its not.

He's been in the squad for the whole of July. He got minutes at the beginning of July. How was he injured then?

40 minutes ago, big blue said:

You keep trotting this line out like it is gospel.

Lampard didnt say that. 

He didnt even imply that CHO wasnt working hard enough in training. He gave a generic answer. He has said the same thing about every player he has been asked about "work hard in training, take your chances when they come". 

These are Lampard's quotes:

"So for Ruben, I think this period has been great for him to get fit. He is pretty fit but the reality is that next season will be the one with another pre-season that he will be really firing for.

"I am really excited for those times. It is not to say he won’t contribute now, he is coming off the bench, he may start some games and he gives us something really different."

Lampard added: "With Callum, I think the same, he has played more games than Ruben this year. I think he really needs to work hard daily in training and do the right things daily, then when he gets his opportunities from the bench or to start, then he really needs to show input in games.

"We are seeing the difference now with Christian Pulisic and what Willian are doing in the team. When Callum gets in the team, comes on or starts he has to show that he has something similar in what he can do for us." 

 

The differents in how he speaks about Ruben and Odoi is pretty clear to read. 

Lampard is a diplomatic guy you have to read between the lines and obvisiouly he was not satisfied with CHO. That was not a generic answer. 

 

 

Edited July 22, 20205 yr by Nevamind

2 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

He's been in the squad for the whole of July. He got minutes at the beginning of July. How was he injured then?

He got 14 minutes on the 4th of july. 

Our first game was june 20th.

Maybe refer to the quote from lampard that you keep on butchering, when lampard says he came back injured. 

Why do you think him being on the bench would mean he is match fit?

 

7 minutes ago, Nevamind said:

These are Lampard's quotes:

"So for Ruben, I think this period has been great for him to get fit. He is pretty fit but the reality is that next season will be the one with another pre-season that he will be really firing for.

"I am really excited for those times. It is not to say he won’t contribute now, he is coming off the bench, he may start some games and he gives us something really different."

Lampard added: "With Callum, I think the same, he has played more games than Ruben this year. I think he really needs to work hard daily in training and do the right things daily, then when he gets his opportunities from the bench or to start, then he really needs to show input in games.

"We are seeing the difference now with Christian Pulisic and what Willian are doing in the team. When Callum gets in the team, comes on or starts he has to show that he has something similar in what he can do for us." 

 

The differents in how he speaks about Ruben and Odoi is pretty clear to read. 

Lampard is a diplomatic guy you have to read between the lines and obvisiouly he was not satisfied with CHO. That was not a generic answer. 

 

 

If you are reading between the lines, then that is an opinion, not a fact. 

It is only obvious if you are looking for the negative in the quote. 

It's not just about what he does in matches and on the training ground.

He also needs to hang out with the right kind of people. The kind of people who whouldn't have broken the lockdown to get their leg over with a hooker. By all accounts, Ravell Morrison  continued to hang out with "the lads" and look where that's got him.

JT could easily have gone off the rails but he was smart enough to have a good look at his behaviour before it dameged him and as we know he went on to be a great pro.

CHO will soon be leaving his teen years behind him, so the time is coming to start behaving more responsibly.

Edited July 22, 20205 yr by Dixon

2 minutes ago, big blue said:

He got 14 minutes on the 4th of july. 

Our first game was june 20th.

Maybe refer to the quote from lampard that you keep on butchering, when lampard says he came back injured. 

Why do you think him being on the bench would mean he is match fit?

 

So he was fit enough to play on the 4th of July, but he wasn't able to train fully with the team until 2 weeks ago?

I always assumed that players would train with the team before they were thrown onto the pitch. He's 19 and had a light injury over a month ago, if he was fit enough to play on the 4th, he was fit enough to start on Sunday when Pulisic was rested - but he didn't start. He didn't even come on until the last 10 minutes.

The quote you have shared isn't the quote I am referring to. It's the one nevamind has shared above. I haven't butchered anything. 

1 minute ago, big blue said:

If you are reading between the lines, then that is an opinion, not a fact. 

It is only obvious if you are looking for the negative in the quote. 

You are creating your own opinions. 

Your opinions are that he hasn't been match fit for the whole of the restart. You are basing that on nothing Lampard has said in the past month. You think he's a raw talent, that is an opinion. 

If we are not allowed opinions on this forum based off the tiny snippets of information that we have shared by Lampard, what are we doing here?

3 minutes ago, big blue said:

If you are reading between the lines, then that is an opinion, not a fact. 

It is only obvious if you are looking for the negative in the quote. 

Well the same can be said about you. You are looking for a obvious good message in his quotes. 

I can't really read much good into his quotes tbh. How far can a Manager go before it is considered "throwing him under the bus." As i said Lampard is a diplomatic guy. 

 

Just now, Nevamind said:

Well the same can be said about you. You are looking for a obvious good message in his quotes. 

I can't really read much good into his quotes tbh. How far can a Manager go before it is considered "throwing him under the bus." As i said Lampard is a diplomatic guy. 

 

Im taking the quotes at face value. Why would I form a negative opinion on someone, based on something somebody didnt say? 

We are forgetting that he's literally still a teenager.. I've been very critical of him in the past in certain games, but I'd be lying if I said the potential wasn't there. He does need a bit of a kick up the backside and needs to start putting in 100% effort. He was okay the other day when he came on against Utd, and showed flashes of brilliance, but he also made some silly mistakes which im sure will get ironed out as time goes on.

If we end up signing another winger like Benrahma, I would definitely want to loan him out to another prem club like Palace where he will get a lot of game time like RLC did, and this will do wonders for him.

4 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

So he was fit enough to play on the 4th of July, but he wasn't able to train fully with the team until 2 weeks ago?

I always assumed that players would train with the team before they were thrown onto the pitch. He's 19 and had a light injury over a month ago, if he was fit enough to play on the 4th, he was fit enough to start on Sunday when Pulisic was rested - but he didn't start. He didn't even come on until the last 10 minutes.

The quote you have shared isn't the quote I am referring to. It's the one nevamind has shared above. I haven't butchered anything. 

You are creating your own opinions. 

Your opinions are that he hasn't been match fit for the whole of the restart. You are basing that on nothing Lampard has said in the past month. You think he's a raw talent, that is an opinion. 

If we are not allowed opinions on this forum based off the tiny snippets of information that we have shared by Lampard, what are we doing here?

RLC made the bench against spurs, well before he was considered match fit. 

You like reading into things so much, when lampard said CHO has been working hard the last couple of weeks, could that not have meant maybe since he returned to full training? Or does reading between the lines only work when it fits your narrative. 

9 minutes ago, Dixon said:

It's not just about what he does in matches and on the training ground.

He also needs to hang out with the right kind of people. The kind of people who whouldn't have broken the lockdown to get their leg over with a hooker. By all accounts, Ravell Morrison  continued to hang out with "the lads" and look where that's got him.

JT could easily have gone off the rails but he was smart enough to have a good look at his behaviour before it dameged him and as we know he went on to be a great pro.

CHO will soon be leaving his teen years behind him, so the time is coming to start behaving more responsibly.

f**kin hell haha.

CHO is nothing close to Ravell Morrison. How exactly do you know who CHO's close friends are? I've seen absolutely nothing to suggest he's hanging out with a bad crowd, the fact he's so liked by his team mates suggests the opposite. As for breaking lockdown to get his leg over a 'hooker'? Jesus christ. He had a girl over and got caught out, and no she wasn't a hooker. 

Lets not act like JT was the model professional either, he literally called Ferdinand a 'black c**t' and shagged Wayne Bridges Mrs while having a wife. Best CB this countries ever produced but i wouldn't exactly say he was someone to look up to in his personal life. 

Anyway, im out, if he doesnt play tonight, we know it must be because he has been throwing cones, and pissing by the goal post in training.

 

Just now, big blue said:

RLC made the bench against spurs, well before he was considered match fit. 

You like reading into things so much, when lampard said CHO has been working hard the last couple of weeks, could that not have meant maybe since he returned to full training? Or does reading between the lines only work when it fits your narrative. 

Well players don't return to full training after they have been playing matches in the PL. 

You can read between the lines, which is what I have been doing with press conferences, or you can fully make things up to fit your agenda - which is what you are doing if you think a player who played in the premier league wasn't in full training at the same time. 

You are free to say that CHO has only just become match fit, or is not fully match fit yet. I can accept that interpretation. But to say he wasn't in full training before 2 weeks ago is just incorrect. 

13 minutes ago, big blue said:

Im taking the quotes at face value. Why would I form a negative opinion on someone, based on something somebody didnt say? 

I don't know what you are on about but i was refering to comments denying he wasn't training well a few weeks ago. 

I just quoted Lampard and as you can read he said, Odoi "really needs to train hard and do the rights things daily" , also "he has to show that he has something similar in what he can do for us." 

You are right you dont even need to read between the lines. Especially if you consider how good he spoke about Ruben.

 

 

Edited July 22, 20205 yr by Nevamind

18 minutes ago, Dixon said:

It's not just about what he does in matches and on the training ground.

He also needs to hang out with the right kind of people. The kind of people who whouldn't have broken the lockdown to get their leg over with a hooker. By all accounts, Ravell Morrison  continued to hang out with "the lads" and look where that's got him.

JT could easily have gone off the rails but he was smart enough to have a good look at his behaviour before it dameged him and as we know he went on to be a great pro.

CHO will soon be leaving his teen years behind him, so the time is coming to start behaving more responsibly.

I assume you feel the same about Mason then as he broke lockdown to hang out with Rice, who again, I assume you’re dead against us signing as he broke lockdown rules with Mason?

1 minute ago, EdinburghBlue said:

I assume you feel the same about Mason then as he broke lockdown to hang out with Rice, who again, I assume you’re dead against us signing as he broke lockdown rules with Mason?

There's something different about Mason and Rice....🙄

Edited July 22, 20205 yr by bisright1

3 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

There's something different about Mason and Rice....🙄

Which is...?

1 minute ago, EdinburghBlue said:

Which is...?

I'm not projecting what I think, I'm projecting what he might think. 

I don't care that CHO broke lockdown, or Mason. Everyone their age did.