Personally, this result could have been a far more depressing experience than it actually was, but fortunately I have long since been resigned to failure in the Premiership this season and yet another defeat in it simply rolls off, like water on a duck’s back. Obviously, this degree of acquiescence does not sit comfortably with many of the new breed of supporters, but it does mean that I don’t have to trawl through the Shed End match chat posts to feel the pain expressed in some quarters and the ease of assessment and calmness shown in others. For instance, splishplosh will probably have crowed at least three times before denying any betrayal of Chelsea’s cause [by predicting this setback] while Chippy on the other hand will doubtless have been as loyal as ever in the face of mocking rebuke from the incandescent and increasingly disillusioned brethren. Two sides to a very predictable coinage and at this stage in a non-existent title race you can pay your money and take your choice of argument. Here’s mine…

 

A match easily billed as a battle between extremes, Champions versus Promoted Underdogs, Haves against Have-Nots, the Evil Jose against the Up And Coming Eddie, was in truth a contest between two sides playing the game the way it should be played, both good exponents of the art, yet under pressure due to respective fragile confidence and lengthy injury list. However, to my mind it was always going to be best described as The Clash of the Luckless and, as it turned out, we won that hands down… in a penalty area… or flag down in an offside position - as I said, you pays your money and you take your choice. Then again, what do Chelsea fans really expect when we’re weighed down by a burden of expectation that was never going to be placed on the opposition? 

 

Well, to be honest, we should have had sufficient quality to have coped with the situation and many anticipated us doing so, but we didn’t and Jose must take responsibility for not setting enough problems on the pitch and for being far too predictable when confronting fresh-faced managerial talent that had previously plotted courses through three divisions of the Football League. In many ways a false nine at WHL led to a false impression at the Bridge, where a similar hunt in packs policy to Pochettino’s saw Bournemouth win plenty of second ball in the first half and just enough in the second to hold on for victory. Unlike at Spurs, where the home team had a debilitating Europa League campaign cutting into their oxygen supply, here the opposition knew exactly what it would take to spoil our plans, best laid with a Costa or without, and to make matters worse the goal came at just the right time to rejuvenate them and kick us firmly in the teeth.

 

Of course, all this begs the question not of Howe, but where does Jose go from here? And the answer lies not in his post match admittance that "Before this game it was realistic to think that our quality would take us out of this position, but maybe now we have to think about top six." but in the statement he made back in September, when he said the following:-

 

"If the season goes in one direction, that it becomes closed and we can't win [trophies], I will go just with the kids. It makes no sense, when you have nothing to win, to play the older players. I'll play the players we're waiting for instead. I can arrive in a moment where I will look to the kids and say, 'Let's go. Non-stop.' I am ruthless.

 

But at the moment everything is open. It's difficult to win the Premier League, but possible. It's difficult to win the Champions League, but possible. It's difficult to win the [domestic] cups, but possible."

 

And it will be difficult to be true to these words, but possible. No room for prevarication now Jose, and please no [still-in-Champions-League-and-a-domestic cup] bolthole scurrying. Play the old guard in Europe by all means, but the Premiership’s unreachable stage has been reached, the young players are waiting, we’re waiting. Let’s go, non-stop with them and show faith in the ability they undoubtedly have, as witnessed as recently as a couple of days ago in the Under-21 team against Celtic. Take the plunge, play Kenedy, RLC, Traore and Aina from start to finish in games and whilst you are at it shove in the likes of Colkett, Musonda and Palmer as a Christmas present to us all. Bring back Ake, Christensen, Kalas, Bamford, Solanke, Swift and Baker from loan in January and, if a signing or two is made, make it Duncan Whatmore, just to emphasise the new strategy and its importance to the club. 

 

After all is said [and hopefully done] these are your words and if you stick by them the older generation of fans wont hesitate to support you, as they have been through the bad times before - some of us even remember Tommy Doc pursuing a similar play-the-kids policy over fifty years ago. Naturally, those who have only known success may not be quite so understanding, but they offer little [except a sell/buy/sack strategy] by way of alternative and you have few options left to turn to anyway. Repetition in terms of team selection certainly isn’t one of them… but evolution is. 

.      

 

 

Nice to see you posting when some wise heads are needed Dorset but I find myself unable to fully agree with the main of your view.

 

I'll explain where I'm coming from, as you have said and rightfully so, Jose has said if the top four is out of the question he'll play the youth and that's fine but where I disagree is with the idea that by what he said, he would be thinking about playing mainly the youth...I doubt you're really thinking he should upset the whole team and make wholesale changes but with the players you mention (undoubtably some good prospects that could do a job) it will look to a lot of people that even you are thinking we should stick seven or eight kids into the first team, I think if we did that I myself would be doubting the manager.

 

I can see a huge case for RLC, Fabregas is a massive weak link and I think Ruben would sure it up enough to see Matic recapture a bit of form, my main grief with Jose is Fabregas getting an easy ride.

 

I can see a case for Traore as Costa looks unfit and uninterested, Jose doesn't seem to fancy Remy in this system and Falcao (although I'll admit to liking his movement) just hasn't done anything when given a chance.

 

Defensively we have had a lot of chopping and changing already andfor me it's more the cover in front of the back four that's the problem, Baba is getting games, Azpi is always reliable and Ivan is getting a bit of form back, Cahill Zouma and JT is still a decent three to have fighting for the other two spots.

 

I'd like to see some cameo's by some of the boys you mention and a good look at Kenedy starting maybe ahead of Pedro to see what he can bring but a massive influx of the youth in one go is not for me.

 

We are close to being able to climb the table a bit and two players are not contributing, If Costa and Fabregas could be replaced and the replacements done a reasonable job, we'd be far better off.

 

So for me it would be RLC, Kenedy and Traore given some starts and a couple of the others on the bench getting minutes when we can afford it.

 

We started going forward a few games back and that didn't end with an unlucky loss yesterday, Jose has work to do and he's shown Costa already he can be ruthless, I just hope he can treat Cesc the same way.

 

I do think Fabregas should start in the CL as his game seems more suited to it but I'd play Remy or Traore up front.

 

Whatever Jose decides though, I'll back him.

Edited December 6, 201510 yr by Chippy

Nice to see you posting when some wise heads are needed Dorset but I find myself unable to fully agree with the main of your view.

 

I'll explain where I'm coming from, as you have said and rightfully so, Jose has said if the top four is out of the question he'll play the youth and that's fine but where I disagree is with the idea that by what he said, he would be thinking about playing mainly the youth...I doubt you're really thinking he should upset the whole team and make wholesale changes but with the players you mention (undoubtably some good prospects that could do a job) it will look to a lot of people that even you are thinking we should stick seven or eight kids into the first team, I think if we did that I myself would be doubting the manager.

 

I can see a huge case for RLC, Fabregas is a massive weak link and I think Ruben would sure it up enough to see Matic recapture a bit of form, my main grief with Jose is Fabregas getting an easy ride.

 

I can see a case for Traore as Costa looks unfit and uninterested, Jose doesn't seem to fancy Remy in this system and Falcao (although I'll admit to liking his movement) just hasn't done anything when given a chance.

 

Defensively we have had a lot of chopping and changing already andfor me it's more the cover in front of the back four that's the problem, Baba is getting games, Azpi is always reliable and Ivan is getting a bit of form back, Cahill Zouma and JT is still a decent three to have fighting for the other two spots.

 

I'd like to see some cameo's by some of the boys you mention and a good look at Kenedy starting maybe ahead of Pedro to see what he can bring but a massive influx of the youth in one go is not for me.

 

We are close to being able to climb the table a bit and two players are not contributing, If Costa and Fabregas could be replaced and the replacements done a reasonable job, we'd be far better off.

 

So for me it would be RLC, Kenedy and Traore given some starts and a couple of the others on the bench getting minutes when we can afford it.

 

We started going forward a few games back and that didn't end with an unlucky loss yesterday, Jose has work to do and he's shown Costa already he can be ruthless, I just hope he can treat Cesc the same way.

 

I do think Fabregas should start in the CL as his game seems more suited to it but I'd play Remy or Traore up front.

 

Whatever Jose decides though, I'll back him.

 

Think most of us would be happy with that.

10km more than us is ridiculous and highlights a few problems.

If Jose can get Hazard, Cesc and Costa firing then alot of our problems disappear. We have zero goal threat at the minute and it's too easy for teams

10km more than us is ridiculous and highlights a few problems.

If Jose can get Hazard, Cesc and Costa firing then alot of our problems disappear. We have zero goal threat at the minute and it's too easy for teams

Pedro is the only one that is trying

Pedro is the only one that is trying

Not sure I agree with that. I thought most of them put an effort in yesterday. It's just that it's not happening for them.

Also I'd expect a team defending for their lives to have to run around more and have to cover more distance.

REMEMBER: Robbie Savage used to cover more distance than most players and.....enough said.

Edited December 6, 201510 yr by Petworth Chelsea Fan

Pedro is the only one that is trying

I think Pedro has been pretty mediocre since he joined us...looked good on debut and that's about it

It's amazing for the team full of International level players and managed by a top manager, there were so many basics we couldn't do, or do correctly. Matic couldn't use the other foot, every time he get blocked off on his favourite foot, he either back pass or kick it out, completely disrupt our rhythm, At moment. I would play Mikle/RLC over him any day. We put zero pressure on their Gk for our corners, it's amazing how easily the GK could come out and grab the ball every time. Once they had a corner, they successfully blocked Tibo from coming out and got a goal. Funny most of us feared the worst when they had that corner. Whoever's playing the Striker role has no idea about positioning, he's never lurking around the box as he should be. No wonder the supporting players had no one to pass forward to when in good position and had to stop. Jose's been playing catch up for the whole game, not selecting a striker to start, put on a striker after an awful first half, not making the change to push on when we had them under siege, put on 2 late subs after the goal, all over. Ivanovic got another start for his heigh and leadership, ironic he was the one missed the header and f* up the clearance off the corner. I'm not going to take about the referee, it's clearly the No penalty to Chelsea policy still applies.

Play the entire under 21 squad, including subs, dont even have a single regular player on the bench, let them watch it at home and wonder if their juniors are better than them.

Genuine question.  Who is our goalscorer or who are our goal scorers?

 

Ignoring Willian's set pieces I'd struggle to come up with an answer in open play..

 

That's the problem - when we ship crap goals it's ok if we score more than the opposition.  But we don't anymore.

 

Costa has lost it.  Thinks the goal is about 15 yards to the left of where it actually is.  I always think of the 'should've gone to Specsavers' ad' every time I see him *issing about to the left of the 18 yard box.

 

Hazard 'up there with Messi & Ronaldo' - yeah right. Hasn't scored for what is it 24 games now?  If games were won on fancy dribbles we'd be right up there but sadly they aren't.

 

Willian, Pedro, Oscar struggle to score much at all.

 

Our defenders occasionally head a corner in.

 

And that's about it.

 

What was it?  40 plus crosses in on Saturday and most ended up with a Bournemouth player.

 

I don't care whether we play a 9 a false 9 an 8 as a 9 of a frigging defender as a 9 but for Christ sake why doesn't Jose batter their thick skulls hard enough to get them to get into the 6 yard box when a cross, corner or random deflection is coming in?

 

Or alternatively get our 9, in whatever guise, or our attacking midfielders, or overlapping full backs or even the *loody goalkeeper to make an intelligent run behind their lines whilst someone, anyone couldn't care less who, lobs an accurate ball to our runner.

 

Got to be better than Tibo/Beg passing to Cahill/Brana/Terry/Zouma who then either pass it straight back to Tibo/Beg and repeat.  Or alternatively one of the back four on receipt of the ball switches it cross field to another member of the quartet and round and round we go.  Then in a moment of inspiration they try and involve the defensive midfield duo who either promptly pass it back to the quartet or circumvent them altogether and pass straight back to Tibo/Beg - this is assuming they don't cede possession first.  And then lo, a brain cell kicks in and somehow we get the ball up to our attacking midfielders/wingers (not sure what these merged positions ought to be called these days) and off we go, mazy runs, amazing runs, maximum effort runs, occasional lazy runs but all with a common them - pretty much parallel with the opposition goal.  And then, when we finally get a cross or lob or low drilled pass in to their danger zone, there is no bugger there.  Costa will be out left arguing with their RB and everyone else in our attack force (haha) will be spectating from about 20-25 yards out.

 

Frustrating.

Edited December 7, 201510 yr by Bloo

I know, but I'm also £180 better off than I was this afternoon.

You're still sick mate but in a different sense of the word now

Jose said that they practised attacking corners in training over 40 times. We had what 10 corners and didn't threaten once.

Pedro I admit put a shift in. William tried and so did the defence. It's the attacking players that are the problem - they are not performing at all. They get away with it because it's less easy to highlight.

Nice to see you posting when some wise heads are needed Dorset but I find myself unable to fully agree with the main of your view.

 

I'll explain where I'm coming from, as you have said and rightfully so, Jose has said if the top four is out of the question he'll play the youth and that's fine but where I disagree is with the idea that by what he said, he would be thinking about playing mainly the youth...I doubt you're really thinking he should upset the whole team and make wholesale changes but with the players you mention (undoubtably some good prospects that could do a job) it will look to a lot of people that even you are thinking we should stick seven or eight kids into the first team, I think if we did that I myself would be doubting the manager.

 

 

A valid criticism Chippy - you are right in so far as there was a certain amount of overkill in the number of kids I was putting up for selection - but who doesn’t overindulge at Christmas time!? Seriously though, what was once a gentle push for youth is fast becoming a significant shove and radical surgery of this sort will soon be the only answer. The diehard naysayer element within the fan base want to go even further, believing frontal figure lobotomy is the only solution to a problem they fail to address themselves, other than to propose augmenting that cutaway with a midseason mass culling of players. By contrast, bringing a sprinkling of youngsters straight into the lost cause that is the Premier League is viable, makes a statement, but is nowhere near as invasive. 

 

Indeed, I would keep the current under fire incumbents firmly in place against Porto and if we reach the knockout stage let them continue as the nucleus for rest of that campaign. In the meantime [in the Premiership] let these guys have an uncomfortable [for them] glimpse of the future from the bench for a while, or at least until a reassessment can be made in January. My teams for the next two matches, injuries permitting:- 

 

Against Porto (4-2-3-1) - Courtois, Dave, JT, Cahill, Baba, Matic, Fabregas, Willian, Oscar, Hazard, Remy  subs - Begovic, Branna, Zouma, Ramires, Mikel, Costa, Pedro.

 

Against Leicester (4-3-3) - Courtois, Dave, JT, Zouma, Baba, Kenedy, Matic, RLC, Willian, Costa, Hazard  subs - Begovic, Cahill, Colkett, Masunda, Traore, Pedro, Palmer. 

Handshake to Bournemouth fans who had a great deserved day out and made lots of noise...Handshake to a team of unknowns each worth 50 quid on how to play as a team

Saturday was Bournemouth's second clean sheet away from home this season. Their only other clean sheet was against Hartlepool in the Capital One Cup.

 

When I find stats like that I honestly begin to question whether half of our starting 11 are fit to wear a Chelsea shirt - they are a disgrace to the club and themselves.

Genuine question.  Who is our goalscorer or who are our goal scorers?

We only have Costa who is out of form, Pedro has an eye for goal but he almost always skies it or can't generate enough power on a low shot, Matic likes a long shot but his accuracy percentage is quite low.

The main attackers Willian, Hazard, Oscar and Cesc simply aren't goalscorers, they are good at creating and tiki-taka'ing inside the box. Unless they have an extremely clear shot they wouldn't take a chance and would rather pass it.

We only have Costa who is out of form, Pedro has an eye for goal but he almost always skies it or can't generate enough power on a low shot, Matic likes a long shot but his accuracy percentage is quite low.

The main attackers Willian, Hazard, Oscar and Cesc simply aren't goalscorers, they are good at creating and tiki-taka'ing inside the box. Unless they have an extremely clear shot they wouldn't take a chance and would rather pass it.

 

You forgot 'Own Goal'. He has been our leading goal scorer after Willian I think. He really needs to step up.

cant score goals anymore, previously our mid field attackers stepped up and provided goals, because in the last decade 

club has bought only a couple of top class, reliable over many seasons goalscorers - the Drog,and Anelka

 

duds (mostly)-

 

Kezman

Crespo 

Mutu

Kalou

Pizarro

Sheva

Anelka

Di Santo

Sturridge

Torres

Lukaku

Demba Ba

Remy

Costa

 

thought Costa was it after his start last season, but now we see he's a 'fraud', until we get at least 2 consistent '#9 type' goalscorers in doesn't matter 

what youth plays, whether Jose is or is not the manager, what tactics, whose individually playing crap or ok etc.

 

are Chelsea just unlucky or poor judges of forward talent?

 

was embarrassing to lose to Bournemouth, but shows us what team work can do, something our team is clearly lacking

cant score goals anymore, previously our mid field attackers stepped up and provided goals, because in the last decade 

club has bought only a couple of top class, reliable over many seasons goalscorers - the Drog,and Anelka

 

duds (mostly)-

 

Kezman

Crespo 

Mutu

Kalou

Pizarro

Sheva

Anelka

Di Santo

Sturridge

Torres

Lukaku

Demba Ba

Remy

Costa

 

thought Costa was it after his start last season, but now we see he's a 'fraud', until we get at least 2 consistent '#9 type' goalscorers in doesn't matter 

what youth plays, whether Jose is or is not the manager, what tactics, whose individually playing crap or ok etc.

 

are Chelsea just unlucky or poor judges of forward talent?

 

was embarrassing to lose to Bournemouth, but shows us what team work can do, something our team is clearly lacking

 

I would not call the bolded players as duds. Crespo was good when he played for us. He just wasn't at home in London but he was a true professional when he played and scored a lot of important goals for us. Anelka was mostly played on the wings where he still played well. The one season he was played as a central striker, he was our top goal scorer IIRC. Kalou, although infuriating, was more than adequate as a backup striker. Same goes for Remy actually.

I wonder if I watched a different game.  The team SHOULD of been better, no doubt.  The three points gained, no doubt.

 

But there was quite a few chances, and I actually felt like we were closer to scoring in the first half, none buried. 

 

We did lose to an offside goal and again denied a pretty clear penalty.

 

Bournemouth did a smash and grab.  It happens in the best of times, it certainly will happen at the worst of times.

 

The Bournemouth players clearly showed more heart (our manager shows more heart than some of our key players) but they were NOT the better team.

 

The team should of done better but I didnt find the performance nearly as poor as some here are talking about.  If we had an inform Costa it wouldnt have even been close.

 

I do feel Mourinho got the selections wrong and even the half time sub wrong (should of been Pedro of Cesc imo).

I would not call the bolded players as duds. Crespo was good when he played for us. He just wasn't at home in London but he was a true professional when he played and scored a lot of important goals for us. Anelka was mostly played on the wings where he still played well. The one season he was played as a central striker, he was our top goal scorer IIRC. Kalou, although infuriating, was more than adequate as a backup striker. Same goes for Remy actually.

 

I think he was even the league's top scorer that season, despite Drogba's re-integration to the first XI under Hiddink, as well as CRonaldo playing for Man Utd at the time.

 

I also think Ba and Sturridge were decent on the few occasions they got opportunities, and it's very harsh to call Costa a dud considering we would never have won the league last season without him.

cant score goals anymore, previously our mid field attackers stepped up and provided goals, because in the last decade 

club has bought only a couple of top class, reliable over many seasons goalscorers - the Drog,and Anelka

 

duds (mostly)-

 

Kezman

Crespo 

Mutu

Kalou

Pizarro

Sheva

Anelka

Di Santo

Sturridge

Torres

Lukaku

Demba Ba

Remy

Costa

 

thought Costa was it after his start last season, but now we see he's a 'fraud', until we get at least 2 consistent '#9 type' goalscorers in doesn't matter 

what youth plays, whether Jose is or is not the manager, what tactics, whose individually playing crap or ok etc.

 

are Chelsea just unlucky or poor judges of forward talent?

 

was embarrassing to lose to Bournemouth, but shows us what team work can do, something our team is clearly lacking

 

Lukaku's doing alright. 10 goals already and Man of the Match last night.

Whoever buys and sells our players is obviously on commission and should be hung drawn and quartered in a public place after his Swiss bank account has been emptied. Our record is truly appalling, almost to the point of farce

You can actually go back a bit further with that list. Fleck, Furlong, Sutton, Casiraghi, were all pre Roman purchases.

 

Im not saying these. or some of the ones on the list above, are bad players, they just didn't work at Chelsea for some reason.

You can actually go back a bit further with that list. Fleck, Furlong, Sutton, Casiraghi, were all pre Roman purchases.

 

Im not saying these. or some of the ones on the list above, are bad players, they just didn't work at Chelsea for some reason.

 

they came for the shopping and the easy living. We've become a take the money and run club.

I do hope the unfashionable Leicester can keep it up, a) to make Lineker eat his words about Ranieri's appointment and b) to set an example to all the high profile stars who thought PL was a stroll in the park

After the introduction my second post in here, many more to come,
really fed up by the negativity in Talkchelsea, it has become a war which the reasonable people can't win, imo, time to jump ship,
have read a lot posts in here and it seems like a very comy place, never mind.

 

I'm getting curious about the possible lineups and tactical approaches.
We play at home and it's at least a must-not-lose, what is Jose Mourinho going to do?
 

I think Azpilicueta will return, Courtois, Matic, Willian, Hazard, Pedro have booked their place in the starting lineup, imo.
What about Zouma? I think he should be in there, alongside Terry.
What about Fabregas, is Mourinho going to make the big change and field Loftus-Cheek instead?

But who is going to man up and plays the through balls? Costa could have finished it against Bournemouth.

Should we go with Diego Costa, although he doesn't offer the necessary runs within the final third?

We need goals, Remy is a better finisher at the moment, imo.
Ivanovic was at fault for the goal against Bournemouth, imo, should have made the clearance, but for example he delivered that ball in the box for Hazard.
Baba is more attacking, but has his flaws in the defense, what about Kenedy? He really goes for it in the opponent's box.

I think we shouldn't forget to pressure Porto and don't let them unfold.
Compactness and not giving an easy goal away.

 

I haven't seen them enough to make a valid assessment.

How are they really coping with the losses of their fullbacks, Torres, Casemiro, Martinez and so on.

 

.....................Remy................

Hazard.........Willian......Pedro......

..........Matic...........Loftus-Cheek....

Baba....Zouma...Terry....Azpilicueta

...................Courtois.........

 

More likely we'll see Fabregas, Ivanovic and Costa in it.