Callum Hudson-Odoi

[Guest Sindre]

Not really working out for him is it.

As one of the very first players to show up at Cobham he's had all pre-season and yesterday to make a claim for himself in the XI but he just didn't manage to do that did he? Don't know if he's just stagnated or what it is but thought he was very poor yesterday.

 

[ducavis]

2 hours ago, Sindre said:

Not really working out for him is it.

As one of the very first players to show up at Cobham he's had all pre-season and yesterday to make a claim for himself in the XI but he just didn't manage to do that did he? Don't know if he's just stagnated or what it is but thought he was very poor yesterday.

 

He isn’t a WB simple as, all down to the formation not the player. I would go as far as saying he will be better playing on the left.  Same reason Pulisic looks awful playing on the right. With 3yrs left on his contract, best thing for him/us is a season loan to a team playing a 4-3-3. Needs a 20+ solid starts for his development, then assess whether to keep/sell with 2 years left on his deal.

[Deino]

2 hours ago, Sindre said:

Not really working out for him is it.

As one of the very first players to show up at Cobham he's had all pre-season and yesterday to make a claim for himself in the XI but he just didn't manage to do that did he? Don't know if he's just stagnated or what it is but thought he was very poor yesterday.

 

It's the formation, he is better in the final 3rd a la Salah. 

[Nevamind]

Thats too easy to pin it on the formation or not? 

Actually he was good in this formation when he made a few starts since Tuchel came in. He just faded away and never got his form back it seems. 

LWB demands more defending of course but nonetheless he showed a bit too little.

Alonso who admittedly ownes this position looked way more positiv. 

[Brigadeiro]

Maybe he was asked to be a little bit more conservative than Alonso because he was covering newbie Chalobah. I do agree he wasn't at his best though.

Whenever he's on the left he's eager to run at players (did a beautiful move against Arsenal I think playing as LWB), but on the right he seems too passive and just passes around to Ziyech/Chalobah waiting for the overlap on the wing... There's no movement towards the box like Alonso usually does so he's never a "surprise" for the defence. 

I still hope TT keeps trusting him though as long as we're winning, think he'll eventually become good enough with the confidence and experience as I don't think the loan move is on the cards right now and next season would be too late. 

[The Don Antonio]

At the end of the day Callums stagnation is all due to the individual. He could have signed for us and gone on loan just like CHalobah, James, Mount ,Tomori and Abraham. He is the only one in that bunch who wanted to get paid based on his potential and not the actual work he put in. 

With 3 years left on his contract i would advocate a loan to a prem team where he can get a run of starts to help him kick on because he will never get that in our team.

[ducavis]

25 minutes ago, The Don Antonio said:

At the end of the day Callums stagnation is all due to the individual. He could have signed for us and gone on loan just like CHalobah, James, Mount ,Tomori and Abraham. He is the only one in that bunch who wanted to get paid based on his potential and not the actual work he put in. 

With 3 years left on his contract i would advocate a loan to a prem team where he can get a run of starts to help him kick on because he will never get that in our team.

This is not right though. We offered him those wages to deter him from moving to Bayern. Would you reject a 4x wage increase by your boss? The onus was/is on the club to figure out a clear path to develop him based on those wages.

Last season we rejected a €40m offer from Bayern, and earlier this season we rejected a £20m offer from Bayern again. Someone high up seems to value him more than the management team does, and they are clearly not relaying the message down the chain.

[SydneyChelsea]

2 hours ago, ducavis said:

Last season we rejected a €40m offer from Bayern, and earlier this season we rejected a £20m offer from Bayern again. Someone high up seems to value him more than the management team does, and they are clearly not relaying the message down the chain.

I'd say they are thinking that if Hudson-Odoi gets 10 goals + assists, he will be worth a lot more than €40m to another English club.

[Guest Sindre]

2 hours ago, ducavis said:

This is not right though. We offered him those wages to deter him from moving to Bayern. Would you reject a 4x wage increase by your boss? The onus was/is on the club to figure out a clear path to develop him based on those wages.

Last season we rejected a €40m offer from Bayern, and earlier this season we rejected a £20m offer from Bayern again. Someone high up seems to value him more than the management team does, and they are clearly not relaying the message down the chain.

Definitly not CHO's fault he's on those wages.

Could it perhaps be another case of a youngster getting too much money too early and feels like he's made it though? Perhaps.

Because he's definitly not kicked on yet and especially under Tuchel I feel he's had plenty of chances to impress and he's just not taking them.
There is also some talk that the club is prepared to listen to offers for him at this point.

[Ukraine Bolt]

4 minutes ago, Sindre said:

Definitly not CHO's fault he's on those wages.

Could it perhaps be another case of a youngster getting too much money too early and feels like he's made it though? Perhaps.

Because he's definitly not kicked on yet and especially under Tuchel I feel he's had plenty of chances to impress and he's just not taking them.
There is also some talk that the club is prepared to listen to offers for him at this point.

Has he had a choice on the wing for Tuchel yet? Every opportunity seems to be at wing back.

Obviously against nothing opposition but didn't he play the other day in that behind closed doors friendly on the wing and get 8 assists or something?

[The Don Antonio]

3 hours ago, ducavis said:

This is not right though. We offered him those wages to deter him from moving to Bayern. Would you reject a 4x wage increase by your boss? The onus was/is on the club to figure out a clear path to develop him based on those wages.

Last season we rejected a €40m offer from Bayern, and earlier this season we rejected a £20m offer from Bayern again. Someone high up seems to value him more than the management team does, and they are clearly not relaying the message down the chain.

We offered him those wages because he made a transfer request. If he had kept his head down and kept working hard like the others in our academy his career would have taken a different path, especially if he went out on loan. The problem is we cant loan him due to his wages.  He was signed on potential and not actual value. Do you honestly think we would have given him those wages if he didn't make a transfer request just when we were banned from signing players and Hazard leaving at the end of the season.

I guess i shouldn't be so harsh since he was just 17 years old at the time but his brother is one selfish and Lousy agent. Luckily for Odoi he has age on his side but i honestly see another team helping him reach his full potential not Chelsea. We have better players than him in the attacking positions and Tuchel Rates James and Azpi over Odoi in the wingback roles

[Guest Sindre]

29 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Has he had a choice on the wing for Tuchel yet? Every opportunity seems to be at wing back.

Obviously against nothing opposition but didn't he play the other day in that behind closed doors friendly on the wing and get 8 assists or something?

The wingbacks are the wings in Tuchel's system though. None of the three up front are playing as wingers in any way but the wingbacks take up the traditional wing positions when we attack.

So in theory i'd say the position should fit CHO very well as he's up against the opposition fullback 1 v 1 a lot of the time. But he struggle to get past them and he still seems a lot slower than he was before that horrible injury a few years ago.

[Ukraine Bolt]

18 minutes ago, Sindre said:

The wingbacks are the wings in Tuchel's system though. None of the three up front are playing as wingers in any way but the wingbacks take up the traditional wing positions when we attack.

So in theory i'd say the position should fit CHO very well as he's up against the opposition fullback 1 v 1 a lot of the time. But he struggle to get past them and he still seems a lot slower than he was before that horrible injury a few years ago.

As a wingback its always in the back of your mind that if you lose the ball, you're the player that has to track back and defend out wide. You're bound to be more cautious. 

As a winger in a flat back 4 you know you have the cover of the full back and likely another player in the middle of the pitch to drop in. You can afford to take more risks. CHO at LW, or even RW, to me is a different beast to at wing back. 

[AndyDowsleftflank]

I really wish he'd get a loan and the opportunity to play 90 minutes every week. I doubt another season on our bench is beneficiary to anyone and I dont see him forcing into the starting 11 if we continue with 3-4-3 or 3-5-2.  As far as I can tell we are well covered without him, so a loan would be win-win in my book 

[ducavis]

1 hour ago, SydneyChelsea said:

I'd say they are thinking that if Hudson-Odoi gets 10 goals + assists, he will be worth a lot more than €40m to another English club.

Fair point but never going to reach those numbers without at least 12-15 starts which he isn’t getting as things stand.

[Ukraine Bolt]

Should be ahead of Pulisic for me.

[ducavis]

1 hour ago, Sindre said:

Definitly not CHO's fault he's on those wages.

Could it perhaps be another case of a youngster getting too much money too early and feels like he's made it though? Perhaps.

Because he's definitly not kicked on yet and especially under Tuchel I feel he's had plenty of chances to impress and he's just not taking them.
There is also some talk that the club is prepared to listen to offers for him at this point.

As he though? Like RIP Mourinho stated he is a winger playing as a WB, 2 different positions with different responsibilities.

Find me a young player in world football who has broken through without at least 20 starts at a young age. We are wasting our time not selling, and wasting his time rejecting offers. 

[ducavis]

44 minutes ago, Sindre said:

The wingbacks are the wings in Tuchel's system though. None of the three up front are playing as wingers in any way but the wingbacks take up the traditional wing positions when we attack.

So in theory i'd say the position should fit CHO very well as he's up against the opposition fullback 1 v 1 a lot of the time. But he struggle to get past them and he still seems a lot slower than he was before that horrible injury a few years ago.

No it doesn’t and wouldn’t. You wouldn’t play Pulisic as a WB or Hazard as one. He needs to be isolated against a FB, not worrying about what is going on behind him. 

[ducavis]

47 minutes ago, The Don Antonio said:

We offered him those wages because he made a transfer request. If he had kept his head down and kept working hard like the others in our academy his career would have taken a different path, especially if he went out on loan. The problem is we cant loan him due to his wages.  He was signed on potential and not actual value. Do you honestly think we would have given him those wages if he didn't make a transfer request just when we were banned from signing players and Hazard leaving at the end of the season.

I guess i shouldn't be so harsh since he was just 17 years old at the time but his brother is one selfish and Lousy agent. Luckily for Odoi he has age on his side but i honestly see another team helping him reach his full potential not Chelsea. We have better players than him in the attacking positions and Tuchel Rates James and Azpi over Odoi in the wingback roles

Why didn’t we sell then instead of putting him on 6-figures a week? Simply put we were/are afraid of him fulfilling his potential at a club with a real plan to aid his development. The only reason he handed in the request was he backed himself to fulfill his potential somewhere else. We have stuck him on those wages and have no real plan in place. 2 season have been wasted, I reckon this season will go the same way as I can’t see him getting on the bench when everyone is fit. Begs the question; why haven’t we sold him to Bayern in the last 2 seasons.

[Bob stark]

14 minutes ago, ducavis said:

No it doesn’t and wouldn’t. You wouldn’t play Pulisic as a WB or Hazard as one. He needs to be isolated against a FB, not worrying about what is going on behind him. 

He doesn't need to be worried what is behind him, he is being protected by 3 cb

[axman2526]

We should just bite the bullett and agree to pay part of his wages and loan him to somewhere he will play as for wingback he is behind James and Dave on the right and Alonso and Chiwell on the left.

As for wide players he is behind Werner, Havertz, Mount, Ziyech and Pulisic. Is pointless him staying for both him and us.

[Bob stark]

39 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

As a wingback its always in the back of your mind that if you lose the ball, you're the player that has to track back and defend out wide. You're bound to be more cautious. 

As a winger in a flat back 4 you know you have the cover of the full back and likely another player in the middle of the pitch to drop in. You can afford to take more risks. CHO at LW, or even RW, to me is a different beast to at wing back. 

The biggest different imo offensively are on the break (You are simply not involve in transition because you are so far away), 2nd playing wb mean you are basically playing supporting role, 

[Bob stark]

4 minutes ago, axman2526 said:

We should just bite the bullett and agree to pay part of his wages and loan him to somewhere he will play as for wingback he is behind James and Dave on the right and Alonso and Chiwell on the left.

As for wide players he is behind Werner, Havertz, Mount, Ziyech and Pulisic. Is pointless him staying for both him and us.

I personally agree that he should go on loan somewhere but as wide attacker, you can give argument that he is our best wide player 

[axman2526]

2 minutes ago, Bob stark said:

I personally agree that he should go on loan somewhere but as wide attacker, you can give argument that he is our best wide player 

We don't play wingers or pure wide attackers though. They are more inside forwards.

[Bob stark]

1 minute ago, axman2526 said:

We don't play wingers or pure wide attackers though. They are more inside forwards.

Yup more like two 10