Haven't seen you posting around here for a while Spiller!!

 

A season or two back I thought our squad looked so well balanced when we had the likes of Mata, Luiz, KDB, Schurrle as well as some very promising youngsters in the ranks - Ake, McEachran, Chalobah, Piazon & Boga (+ maybe a few more). Not saying any of the youngsters were ready to make the step up, but I thought they might get eased in gently and we still had a lot more creative options.

 

Now I know we got huge money for the likes of Mata, Luiz and Lukaku and I'm not saying it was a mistake to get rid - especially as we won the PL! BUT right now, we just seemed to have lost that squad balance and the options just aren't there.

Haha I loiter more than post now. But I agree with you again.

I think Jose's ruthless culling of the squad might well come home to roost this season. The sales certainly funded Costa and Fabregas last season but I do feel that we have a lot of eggs in few baskets. We have a lot of functional depth (Ramires, Mikel, Zouma) guys who can play a role when needed, but I'm not sure we have goals in us beyond our first xi. I couldn't see for example who could come on and give us something different in an attacking sense two weekends ago against Arsenal. I'm hoping at the very least RLC and Traore can make the breakthrough this season but barring a very good run with injuries and form I think we're in a tight spot to retain our title.

There's a huge gap between the quality of our 1st xi and our subs

GK-this where the competition is the strongest. Arguably the least important position to have competition, considering how many games a starting GK is able to play and how many they miss

FBs-3 starting quality fbs is what's needed. A RB, LB and a player capable of playing both sides. We had that in Ivan, Luiz and Dave. Luis didn't work out for whatever reason. I believe Luis is better than Baba, so it appears we are weaker here but time will tell.

CB-3 starting quality CBs. Not sure we need to strengthen here. I like the idea of signing Stones but when you look at our needs it seems strange

CM-Again 3 starting quality players needed. Mikel, Ramires, RLC aren't good enough to put any pressure on Cesc or Matic. A hybrid of cesc and Matic would be ideal. RLC could fill the 4th spot although I'd prefer Ake

AMs-same as CMs. Cuadrado, Moses, Traore aren't good enough to put pressure on the starting 3. This seems to be a recruitment error as a Cuadrado was signed to plug this gap but doesn't seem capable. I'm not ready to write him off just yet. I'd be happy with a starting quality AM , Moses as a squad player and Traore as young player with potential as our back up AMs. Hopefully Cuadrado comes good.

STs- Again Remy or Falcao not good enough to give Jose a dilemma at the ST position. If Diego is fit he'll play, his condition worries me though. I believe we should've have signed a ST better then Remy for the number 2 spot, instead of a 3rd striker.

tl:dr - The gap between the quality of our first xi and backups is too big

Haven't seen you posting around here for a while Spiller!!

 

A season or two back I thought our squad looked so well balanced when we had the likes of Mata, Luiz, KDB, Schurrle as well as some very promising youngsters in the ranks - Ake, McEachran, Chalobah, Piazon & Boga (+ maybe a few more). Not saying any of the youngsters were ready to make the step up, but I thought they might get eased in gently and we still had a lot more creative options.

 

Now I know we got huge money for the likes of Mata, Luiz and Lukaku and I'm not saying it was a mistake to get rid - especially as we won the PL! BUT right now, we just seemed to have lost that squad balance and the options just aren't there.

The crazy thing was he sold Luiz and bought Cuadrado + Luis with the money, Luis is gone and he doesn't fancy Cuadrado (reminds me of Bunchy from Ray Donovan who buys a house and a few days later wants to return it). i won't be surprised if the board are concerned about letting him spend money considering how most of his signings have turned out, there is too much chop and change with no clear policy.

As for Stones and Rahman I just don't see where they fit; is he going to use them or are they just depth? Our bench on Sat was Begovic, Zouma, Mikel, Ramires, Moses, Falcao and Remy, Moses is the closest we have to a game changer. If he brings in Stones and Rahman, who comes out of that bench besides Mikel? Are we going to stick 3 defenders on the bench?

The crazy thing was he sold Luiz and bought Cuadrado + Luis with the money, Luis is gone and he doesn't fancy Cuadrado (reminds me of Bunchy from Ray Donovan who buys a house and a few days later wants to return it). i won't be surprised if the board are concerned about letting him spend money considering how most of his signings have turned out, there is too much chop and change with no clear policy.

As for Stones and Rahman I just don't see where they fit; is he going to use them or are they just depth? Our bench on Sat was Begovic, Zouma, Mikel, Ramires, Moses, Falcao and Remy, Moses is the closest we have to a game changer. If he brings in Stones and Rahman, who comes out of that bench besides Mikel? Are we going to stick 3 defenders on the bench?

 

this is what i am thinking. some of the decisions have been questionable. I for one think that kevin de bruyne was most probably a toxic influence in the dressing room, but thats a separate issue. could the differences have been resolved better? we sold him for less than 20m, he's now being valued at 47 - 50m after a good season in Germany. Tricky one. 

 

Cuadrado for me is a disaster. I cant see him playing at all this season if he stays. 

 

Losing mata - I think the majority of us feel a sense of regret about mata going. 

 

As mentioned above, a lot of eggs in very few baskets and we are so heavily reliant on a select core of players with the gap in quality between the starting XI and the subs being vast. 

 

I know he signed a contract extension, but i cant help but feel that all is not right behind the scenes. 

There's a huge gap between the quality of our 1st xi and our subs

GK-this where the competition is the strongest. Arguably the least important position to have competition, considering how many games a starting GK is able to play and how many they miss

FBs-3 starting quality fbs is what's needed. A RB, LB and a player capable of playing both sides. We had that in Ivan, Luiz and Dave. Luis didn't work out for whatever reason. I believe Luis is better than Baba, so it appears we are weaker here but time will tell.

CB-3 starting quality CBs. Not sure we need to strengthen here. I like the idea of signing Stones but when you look at our needs it seems strange

CM-Again 3 starting quality players needed. Mikel, Ramires, RLC aren't good enough to put any pressure on Cesc or Matic. A hybrid of cesc and Matic would be ideal. RLC could fill the 4th spot although I'd prefer Ake

AMs-same as CMs. Cuadrado, Moses, Traore aren't good enough to put pressure on the starting 3. This seems to be a recruitment error as a Cuadrado was signed to plug this gap but doesn't seem capable. I'm not ready to write him off just yet. I'd be happy with a starting quality AM , Moses as a squad player and Traore as young player with potential as our back up AMs. Hopefully Cuadrado comes good.

STs- Again Remy or Falcao not good enough to give Jose a dilemma at the ST position. If Diego is fit he'll play, his condition worries me though. I believe we should've have signed a ST better then Remy for the number 2 spot, instead of a 3rd striker.

tl:dr - The gap between the quality of our first xi and backups is too big

 

This is the point i made at the start of the thread. I think our first 11 picks itself too easily, there isn't any competition. We are in need for some new squad players, players who can come off the bench and make a difference. Back in Mourinho's last time with us we had Lampard, Ballack, Essien and Makelele to chose from in the centre of our midfield. They would destroy our current midfielders. Mikel and Ramires of today wouldn't get anywhere near this team.

I don't get how some people can say that most of Jose signings are rubbish and that we shouldn't trust Jose with transfers.

Jose's signings since returning; 
Good signing last season;
   Costa, Fabregas, Luis(in and gone no net spend), Remy (looked good last season almost doubled in value if we wanted to sell),
Good signings the year before
   Willian, Matic, Zouma, Schurrle (£7m profit) 

Average signings
   Drogba and Falcao signings to fill the gap of 3rd Striker
Potentially bad signing
   Cuadrado who has barely had a chance to show his worth and was bought as a replacement for Schurrle directly from that money.

So potentially one bad signing.

I get he has let a lot of players go and this might be concerning to some and may have even been a few players favourites but I don't think anyone of those were first team regulars at the time and the majority we made big profits on.
and only KDB, Mata and Luiz could be considered close to our first team,
KDB didn't want to play backup and wasn't good enough for first team regular status and a decent offer came 

Mata was out of favour and didn't fit the Jose ethos plus we got a pretty hefty bid
and for Luiz I already think Zouma is a better defender admittedly there is less entertainment now the Luiz side show has gone but again a frankly ridiculous bid was put in 

Edit; Oops forgot Schurrle in this section he did add a different dimension to the squad but we did get decent money making a £7m profit over a season and a half and personally at the time of purchase I thought Cuadrado would offer more unfortunately that hasn't been the case but hopefully he will turn good.

Also forgot Cech but again Courtois is obviously the future and £10m considering he only had a year left on his contract is a pretty good fee.  This only counts as a bad sale because it was to Arsenal but hopefully we continue to see agent Cech at work rather than the performances we all enjoyed seeing in a Chelseas shirt. 

So again potentially looks like one bad sale again but again that is because Cuadrado has flopped. 

Admittedly I occasionally think Mata could be the difference in games where we look to be lacking creation but then again he hasn't exactly filled himself with glory since leaving.   

Edited August 11, 201510 yr by PedroMendez

What about Salah?

It's not really about the player numbers it's more the amount of money we have chucked at the right hand side and we STILL don't have a player who can assist and score goals in that position.

We have spent the best part of £75 million on 3 players and we are still struggling with end product.

Willian is a hard worker and is not a bad player by any means but his end product is not worthy of someone who cost a near 30 million quid.

Salah was a flop from day one while the less said about Cuadrado the better really.

What about Salah?

It's not really about the player numbers it's more the amount of money we have chucked at the right hand side and we STILL don't have a player who can assist and score goals in that position.

We have spent the best part of £75 million on 3 players and we are still struggling with end product.

Willian is a hard worker and is not a bad player by any means but his end product is not worthy of someone who cost a near 30 million quid.

Salah was a flop from day one while the less said about Cuadrado the better really.

 

Throw Schurlle in on top of that and you're knocking on for £100m there's still room for improvement. 

Take your point Pedro. We have been opportunistic in the market and Costa and Fabregas won us the league as result of it. In the process though we have hollowed out the squad to the point where it is weaker than this time last season.

Unless Cuadrado does a 180 we will be relying largely on the same 11 players to win us games most weeks with the bench being more about protecting a lead than establishing one. I'm unsure that this is a good thing. But of course the X Factors are RLC and Traore (perhaps Moses as well). If they step up we may have better depth than we think.

Can be argued we have made a rod for our own back. Who do we really want? Baba and stones? Why, are they what we really need?

We had Luis, we let him go. He is a very good left back, had we played him he would have stayed and this elongated negotiation for baba would be not needed.

We want stones, why? Because he is English? As good as stones may be we got a hell of a player in zouma for 12.5mill.i would rather another zouma than stones at 34mill.

Our defence needed improvement, is

Azpilequata Zouma jt Luis

Not better and a different option to the usual four? Is having

Azpilequata stones jt baba

So much better?

We have back up in key positions who have no hope in hell of displacing the main choices.

Ramires, Mikel and you rlc. No chance of pushing matic or cesc. I would very much like us to sign wetsel before the end of the window, give us at least a 3rd competitive option.

Then there is Moses, cuadrado and even traore. Much as I rate the latter, what chance do those 3 have of playing rather than hazard, oscar and willian? None, ramires will be ahead of them in the line.

Again Pedro is out there, and experienced goal maker and scorer.

Those players would offer us something different, and we could ofset the cost a little by moving on Mikel, cuadrado and allowing rlc and traore loans, preferably to premier league sides that would play them.

Zouma can cover matic, given stones looks likely. Moses, Pedro, hazard, oscar, willian, cesc and ramires is enough for the attacking midfield.

Take your point Pedro. We have been opportunistic in the market and Costa and Fabregas won us the league as result of it. In the process though we have hollowed out the squad to the point where it is weaker than this time last season.

Unless Cuadrado does a 180 we will be relying largely on the same 11 players to win us games most weeks with the bench being more about protecting a lead than establishing one. I'm unsure that this is a good thing. But of course the X Factors are RLC and Traore (perhaps Moses as well). If they step up we may have better depth than we think.

By no means was I implying the squad is perfect and I get we have got rid of a lot of creativity I was just pointing out that actually Jose's ruthlessness in the market has actually been quite good. 

And now because Cuadrado has potentially flopped we are potentially lacking a creative game changer on the bench (Moses could still be the answer but not convinced) which is what all good teams need and its even more disappointing since I am sure a lot of you like me thought he was going to be a great signing and really add to the squad, especially when you consider how him and Hames lit up the world cup and where making chances out of nothing. 

What about Salah?

It's not really about the player numbers it's more the amount of money we have chucked at the right hand side and we STILL don't have a player who can assist and score goals in that position.

We have spent the best part of £75 million on 3 players and we are still struggling with end product.

Willian is a hard worker and is not a bad player by any means but his end product is not worthy of someone who cost a near 30 million quid.

Salah was a flop from day one while the less said about Cuadrado the better really.

 

Throw Schurlle in on top of that and you're knocking on for £100m there's still room for improvement. 

i didn't think Salah was a Mourinho purchase thought he was sorted before Mourinho came but anyway if you consider Salah and Schurrle have both gone for profits its more like £45m but I get your point we have been trying to fill that position for a while.

I think Willian has deserved his place at that position and can't see anyone available that would displace him.  

So for me the problem is Cuadrado but I don't see us admitting defeat after half a season and swapping him out.

Salah joined us midway through Joses first season.

Salah joined us midway through Joses first season.

Fair enough didn't understand the signing in the first place and he definitely counts as a bad signing my bad

its shyte being the champions with such a crap squad and manager who doesn't know his arse from his elbow in the market

 

wish we had a winner like LVG or Brenda , now they can spend

This is the point i made at the start of the thread. I think our first 11 picks itself too easily, there isn't any competition. We are in need for some new squad players, players who can come off the bench and make a difference. Back in Mourinho's last time with us we had Lampard, Ballack, Essien and Makelele to chose from in the centre of our midfield. They would destroy our current midfielders. Mikel and Ramires of today wouldn't get anywhere near this team.

 

Yep. If we analyse our bench from Saturday

 

- Begovic - Starting Quality, best backup in the league

 

- Zouma - Starting Quality, can cover CB and DM

 

- Mikel - Not starting quality, can cover only one position, both Zouma and Mikel arent need in my opinion. I'd replace Mikel on the bench with Baba for FB cover

 

- Ramires - Offers us something different so I'd keep him on the bench 

 

- Moses - Moses is a squad player at best, too similar to Willian in my opinion.This player needs to be a creator and a goal scorer. An AM is only going to come on if we are losing or drawing. Signing a quality RW would give us a creative option off the bench against the big teams (with Willian starting for his defensive contribution) and a player against the smaller teams who can break down deeper sitting defences.

 

- Falcao - We play one up top, not sure we need two strikers on the bench. Remy is better than Falcao in a general sense but i think Falcao strengths suit our system more. I also don't think Jose trusts Remy as was evident with Drogba starting big games last year. Signing a ST in the mold of diego and having Remy as the 3rd option is what I think we have tried to do. Unfortunately as most can see Falcao is not comparable in quality to Diego. Not a revolutionary opinion but i believe we should've signed a ST as similar to Diego as we could instead of taking a punt on Falcao 

 

- Remy - If were only going with 1 ST on the bench. Then this position would go to the CM cesc/matic hybrid i mentioned in the first post who could replace Matic if we are losing/drawing or replace Cesc if we are winning

Maybe we're just pretending we're not going to sign any really top quality players this Summer in order to lull our rivals into a false sense of security. We just want to appear complacent and a bit smug but in reality we're preparing deals for any of the likes of Gotze, Reus, Koke, Griezmann or Pedro behind the scenes and in secret.

By leaving it late to make a couple of such signings we won't give our rivals enough time to react.

There might actually be a logic to our apparent complacency.

TBH I'm not sure. We might just be smug enough to think we could get away with just a tweak to last year's squad. You can't tell with our Board.

Edited August 11, 201510 yr by Socrates

Maybe we're just pretending we're not going to sign any really top quality players this Summer in order to lull our rivals into a false sense of security. We just want to appear complacent and a bit smug but in reality we're preparing deals for any of the likes of Gotze, Reus, Koke, Griezmann or Pedro behind the scenes and in secret.

By leaving it late to make a couple of such signings we won't give our rivals enough time to react.

There might actually be a logic to our apparent complacency.

TBH I'm not sure. We might just be smug enough to think we could get away with just a tweak to last year's squad. You can't tell with our Board.

Glass half full ehh, hope so mate. 

In all fairness, our rivals' benches were hardly filled with world-class stars either. There were a couple of starting-quality players dotted around, but for the most part they would have been starting if fit.

 

I suppose the critique of our squad has been that our depth players aren't good enough to challenge for the first team. Let's see how many of these would challenge for the Chelsea first XI:

 

Man City

GK Caballero

RB Zabaleta*

CB Demichelis

CB Denayer

AM Nasri

CF Iheanacho
CF Aguero*

 

Arsenal

GK Ospina

RB Chambers

LB Gibbs

CB Paulista

DM Arteta

RW Sanchez*

CF Walcott

 

Man Utd

GK Johnstone

RB Valencia

CB McNair

CM Schweinsteiger

CM Herrera

AM Pereira

CF Hernandez

 

* Obviously all three of Zabaleta, Aguero, and Sanchez would almost certainly be starters for Chelsea, but they can hardly be considered depth players; all three were on the bench for fitness reasons. In the interests of this debat they probably be replaced by Sagna, Bony, and Oxlade-Chamberlain respectively. I would consider signing Oxlade-Chamberlain but would have little interest in the other two.

 

Players in italics have never started for their respective clubs. In fact only Pereira has appeared at all at senior level, and he played for 13 minutes, when Man Utd were already 3-0 up at home.

 

The only area of depth on that list which genuinely worries me is Man Utd's strength at centre mid. They have Carrick, Schweinsteiger, Schneiderlin, Herrera, Blind, and arguably Fellaini. The first four would definitely challenge for a first-team place at Chelsea (although the first two are 30+ and injury-prone), I'm yet to be convinced by Blind as a midfielder and I wouldn't be interested in us signing Fellaini.

 

Nasri I would be curious about signing, I think he's a very good player, although he isn't consistent enough to be a regular starter, and likely wouldn't be content with a role on the bench. I would consider taking Gibbs purely within the context of us being 'between left backs'. If we sign Rahman my interest ends entirely.

 

Rojo, Young, Delph, Wilshere and Welbeck all missed out from a combination of injury or lack of match fitness. I don't think I'd be particularly interested in any of them. De Gea did too, but I have a feeling he wouldn't particularly appreciate playing second fiddle to Courtois.

 

So yes, our depth isn't particularly impressive in terms of challenging the first XI. Then again, you could say exactly the same about all of our title rivals. The only major worry this causes me is in thinking about any of the Premier League sides' European hopes. In terms of the title race, seemingly we're all as sh*t as each other.

There's a huge gap between the quality of our 1st xi and our subs

GK-this where the competition is the strongest. Arguably the least important position to have competition, considering how many games a starting GK is able to play and how many they miss

FBs-3 starting quality fbs is what's needed. A RB, LB and a player capable of playing both sides. We had that in Ivan, Luiz and Dave. Luis didn't work out for whatever reason. I believe Luis is better than Baba, so it appears we are weaker here but time will tell.

CB-3 starting quality CBs. Not sure we need to strengthen here. I like the idea of signing Stones but when you look at our needs it seems strange

CM-Again 3 starting quality players needed. Mikel, Ramires, RLC aren't good enough to put any pressure on Cesc or Matic. A hybrid of cesc and Matic would be ideal. RLC could fill the 4th spot although I'd prefer Ake

AMs-same as CMs. Cuadrado, Moses, Traore aren't good enough to put pressure on the starting 3. This seems to be a recruitment error as a Cuadrado was signed to plug this gap but doesn't seem capable. I'm not ready to write him off just yet. I'd be happy with a starting quality AM , Moses as a squad player and Traore as young player with potential as our back up AMs. Hopefully Cuadrado comes good.

STs- Again Remy or Falcao not good enough to give Jose a dilemma at the ST position. If Diego is fit he'll play, his condition worries me though. I believe we should've have signed a ST better then Remy for the number 2 spot, instead of a 3rd striker.

tl:dr - The gap between the quality of our first xi and backups is too big

That is exactly how I see the squad at the moment.

At the end of last season the signings I wanted were lacazette, greizmann, and witsel.

I can understand the falcao gamble, as we did alright in the striker department last season despite injury problems and a 37 yr old drogs. You would expect costa and remy to be available for more games than they were last season.

I can understand why we haven't brought in attacking midfielder if the club still has faith in cuadrado.

I really can't understand why mikel and ramires are both here, especially mikel since zouma can play mikel role when needed.

A new centre back is probably the last area I think we need to strengthen, ivanovic is more than capable at CB. Stones however is top notch and I think the club are trying to beat the competition to the punch with this one.

Really hope we pull something out of the bag in the next 3 weeks.

Also I think it is wide of the mark to suggest the board are worried about Mourinho spending more money, as I very much doubt he has had sole responsibility for most of the signings since he came back.

I think he has alot more control over who leaves rather than comes in.

We have made a profit on schurrle and Salah so I don't think you can say we wasted money on them. We didn't take much of a hit on luis either.

I think the answer to this thread depends on whether the 2 Colombian's cam contribute significantly. Rlc and traore stepping up would be a massive bonus, and 1 I'm not really expecting.

In all fairness, our rivals' benches were hardly filled with world-class stars either. There were a couple of starting-quality players dotted around, but for the most part they would have been starting if fit.

 

I suppose the critique of our squad has been that our depth players aren't good enough to challenge for the first team. Let's see how many of these would challenge for the Chelsea first XI:

 

Man City

GK Caballero

RB Zabaleta*

CB Demichelis

CB Denayer

AM Nasri

CF Iheanacho

CF Aguero*

 

Arsenal

GK Ospina

RB Chambers

LB Gibbs

CB Paulista

DM Arteta

RW Sanchez*

CF Walcott

 

Man Utd

GK Johnstone

RB Valencia

CB McNair

CM Schweinsteiger

CM Herrera

AM Pereira

CF Hernandez

 

* Obviously all three of Zabaleta, Aguero, and Sanchez would almost certainly be starters for Chelsea, but they can hardly be considered depth players; all three were on the bench for fitness reasons. In the interests of this debat they probably be replaced by Sagna, Bony, and Oxlade-Chamberlain respectively. I would consider signing Oxlade-Chamberlain but would have little interest in the other two.

 

Players in italics have never started for their respective clubs. In fact only Pereira has appeared at all at senior level, and he played for 13 minutes, when Man Utd were already 3-0 up at home.

 

The only area of depth on that list which genuinely worries me is Man Utd's strength at centre mid. They have Carrick, Schweinsteiger, Schneiderlin, Herrera, Blind, and arguably Fellaini. The first four would definitely challenge for a first-team place at Chelsea (although the first two are 30+ and injury-prone), I'm yet to be convinced by Blind as a midfielder and I wouldn't be interested in us signing Fellaini.

 

Nasri I would be curious about signing, I think he's a very good player, although he isn't consistent enough to be a regular starter, and likely wouldn't be content with a role on the bench. I would consider taking Gibbs purely within the context of us being 'between left backs'. If we sign Rahman my interest ends entirely.

 

Rojo, Young, Delph, Wilshere and Welbeck all missed out from a combination of injury or lack of match fitness. I don't think I'd be particularly interested in any of them. De Gea did too, but I have a feeling he wouldn't particularly appreciate playing second fiddle to Courtois.

 

So yes, our depth isn't particularly impressive in terms of challenging the first XI. Then again, you could say exactly the same about all of our title rivals. The only major worry this causes me is in thinking about any of the Premier League sides' European hopes. In terms of the title race, seemingly we're all as sh*t as each other.

 

Good points. Our squad may be better than our rivals. I was going to say its dangerous to stand still but i'm not sure we have. Maybe it comes down to recruitment. I see us as having 4 glaring weaknesses (5 if you include GK).

 

GK-Addressed in the best way possible, starting quality homegrown player

LB - Look to be addressing. Situation out of our hands with player wanting to leave. Baba is a downgrade in my opinion but may prove to be better in our system than Luis

CM - Not addressed

AM - Addressed with Cuadrado, doesnt look like it'll work out

ST - Addressed with Falcao. I'm skeptical but would love to be proven wrong

 

When you look at the above we've addressed 4/5 positions of weakness. The end of the season will tell us if the recruitment has been sufficient or not.

 

For me, we need to sign a CM before Sept and lose Mikel. I'm not a Mikel hater but we can upgrade in his position. I'd take Verratti over every midfielder in the world at the moment

For me, we need to sign a CM before Sept and lose Mikel. I'm not a Mikel hater but we can upgrade in his position. I'd take Verratti over every midfielder in the world at the moment

I'm glad I'm not the only one thinking this way. I really think we need a player who can rotate in and out with Fabregas/Oscar.

We need Ramires that can shoot from distance. A box to box player that can finish too.

Problem is I don't think that player exists!!

We need Ramires that can shoot from distance. A box to box player that can finish too.

Problem is I don't think that player exists!!

Lampard was probably closest we've ever had to that.