There are times I think when he just wants to play the 'hero' rather than do what is right for the team.

I think you can accuse Ivan of playing badly at the moment, but accusing him of being selfish is ridiculous. This is called going over the top, he's been a great player for us and he's scored many important goals, goals to win us games, goals to get us to Finals, or even win us Finals, but I guess if he'd been less selfish in those games and hadn't of thought like a hero, then we wouldn't of won some of the trophies that we have won. I still think he can come good this season, he's hardly the only player playing badly, I'm seeing countless people saying he's done, I'm not jumping on that bandwagon.

I want the bear to continue on the team,BUT i want him at CB,we have an utterly worldclass FB in Azpilicueta and we should not waste him at LB,personally i would play Baba-Zouma-Ivanovic-Azpilicueta as our starting backline,because i really loved ivan as a CB under Benitez

List of full backs over 6'0:

 

Stefan Lichtsteiner

Matteo Darmian

Fabio Grosso

Paolo Maldini

Eric Abidal

Willy Sagnol

Maicon

Paulo Ferreira

Filipe Luis

Luke Shaw

Mario Melchiot

 

I don't think the argument that 'a top full-back can't be more than 6 feet tall' really stands up...

I

Although I was talking about players OVER 6 feet, as brana is 6'2 and strapping,  I still think at 6 feet you can be quite agile with a fairly low centre of gravity to handle nippy wingers in 1 on 1's. However from that list you compiled of players OVER 6 foot Filipe Luis is 5'11 I believe but certainly not over 6ft, Paulo is bang on 6 foot, willy sagnol again 5'11 and Darmian again 5'11...point is if you take the best 50 full backs for the last 20 years about 80 percent at least wlll be under 6 foot, as said Ivan is not built for the job and it's caught up with him, big guys generally have slower feet than small guys, hence all the tricky players have always been shorter, fullbacks have to deal with such players and as such if big and not very agile, like ivan is now looking, will get run ragged. 

I used Wiki for the heights, obviously I don't know them off by heart.

 

I don't think being tall necessarily means that a player can't be agile or have quick feet; Thierry Henry, Zinedine Zidane, and Cristiano Ronaldo are all comfortably over 6'0 for example. You may have a point regarding build; I imagine there is more of a correlation between being broad and muscular and struggling for technique and agility, but I don't think the argument that a full-back can't be tall and top-quality stands up.

 

Also for what it's worth, Bran's height never seemed to be an issue when he was playing excellently as recently as last season.

I think that the taller full backs will decline quicker, it's why Maldini moved to centre back even though he was one of the best full backs ever.

I do think branna has lost a yard, he never used to be beaten so easily, he had fantastic strength and enough agility and pace to get close enough to utilise his strength.

Now I think he is struggling to get close to players and the amount of times he is getting beaten will have a massive effect on his confidence.

Then he also has to provide something going forward!

Full back is probably the most physically demanding position in the modern game. I think it's better suited to younger players, rather than smaller.

How many of the world's best full backs are 32 or over? Maybe dani alves, but he very rarely has to defend.

I used Wiki for the heights, obviously I don't know them off by heart.

I don't think being tall necessarily means that a player can't be agile or have quick feet; Thierry Henry, Zinedine Zidane, and Cristiano Ronaldo are all comfortably over 6'0 for example. You may have a point regarding build; I imagine there is more of a correlation between being broad and muscular and struggling for technique and agility, but I don't think the argument that a full-back can't be tall and top-quality stands up.

Also for what it's worth, Bran's height never seemed to be an issue when he was playing excellently as recently as last season.

Taller people don't seem as quick as they age. It could be a deceiving element as mentioned by the poster above. People like Maldini, Abidal and Thuram both moved central as they approached the end of their careers.

There is no way of proving this argument however so let's move on.

Lahm obviously played both midfield and full back into his 30s but he's a different beast.

Dave has a lot of similarities to Lahm, who could also play full back very comfortably on either side.

I used Wiki for the heights, obviously I don't know them off by heart.

 

I don't think being tall necessarily means that a player can't be agile or have quick feet; Thierry Henry, Zinedine Zidane, and Cristiano Ronaldo are all comfortably over 6'0 for example. You may have a point regarding build; I imagine there is more of a correlation between being broad and muscular and struggling for technique and agility, but I don't think the argument that a full-back can't be tall and top-quality stands up.

 

Also for what it's worth, Bran's height never seemed to be an issue when he was playing excellently as recently as last season.

I think Ivan was an issue last season it was just masked by willian getting him out of jail at teh detriment to his own attacking game 

I think Ivan was an issue last season it was just masked by willian getting him out of jail at teh detriment to his own attacking game

Fair enough but why has the masking suddenly stopped? Willian has been pretty much same as last year.

Well he was on the right in the first game, we were doing well and at half time looked like we would go on and score 3 or 4, the penalty and 10 men being the problem in that game, still with 10 men we managed not to concede, even although montero was killing Ivan in 1 on 1's we had cover, against city Ramires took the right as willian moved central to cover oscars spot and was not tucking in we saw what happened, after which we got pedro who is great going forward but will never do willians job of keeping ivan safe like last season, the games after willian moved off the right we saw how exposed Ivan was..in short, Ivan with fab to cover him and pedro is a disaster waiting to happen, fab has terrible positional awareness he isn't suited to that double pivot other than playing balls froward from deep, defensively he offers very little, pedro will come back but he is an attack minded player, his strength is winning back the ball high up the pitch and recycling where willian would track all the way back, we don't concede from our left flank, but that's useless when every team knows send some pace down our right and we are the second easiest team to score into in the league...

Edited September 10, 201510 yr by Oneclubinlondon

Well he was on the right in the first game, we were doing well and at half time looked like we would go on and score 3 or 4, the penalty and 10 men being the problem in that game, still with 10 men we managed not to concede, even although montero was killing Ivan in 1 on 1's we had cover, against city Ramires took the right as willian moved central to cover oscars spot and was not tucking in we saw what happened, after which we got pedro who is great going forward but will never do willians job of keeping ivan safe like last season, the games after willian moved off the right we saw how exposed Ivan was..in short, Ivan with fab to cover him and pedro is a disaster waiting to happen, fab has terrible positional awareness he isn't suited to that double pivot other than playing balls froward from deep, defensively he offers very little, pedro will come back but he is an attack minded player, his strength is winning back the ball high up the pitch and recycling where willian would track all the way back, we don't concede from our left flank, but that's useless when every team knows send some pace down our right and we are the second easiest team to score into in the league...

Fair comment. Forgot that Willian hasn't really been used on the right since the first game.

Fair comment. Forgot that Willian hasn't really been used on the right since the first game.

He hasn't been playing well either, end of last season he was our in form player, he looked fantastic, same in pre-season, he has looked well off the pace, people are saying see he isn't a number 10 after all but I personally believe he is best suited to number 10, I think he is just suffering a dip in form like many of our players, lets hope we see a new refreshed team on Saturday and go on from there, I just hope Ivan hasn't won back his confidence unless it's at CB 

He hasn't been playing well either, end of last season he was our in form player, he looked fantastic, same in pre-season, he has looked well off the pace, people are saying see he isn't a number 10 after all but I personally believe he is best suited to number 10, I think he is just suffering a dip in form like many of our players, lets hope we see a new refreshed team on Saturday and go on from there, I just hope Ivan hasn't won back his confidence unless it's at CB 

 

 

willian has never looked fantastic in a chelsea shirt

I think you can accuse Ivan of playing badly at the moment, but accusing him of being selfish is ridiculous. This is called going over the top, he's been a great player for us and he's scored many important goals, goals to win us games, goals to get us to Finals, or even win us Finals, but I guess if he'd been less selfish in those games and hadn't of thought like a hero, then we wouldn't of won some of the trophies that we have won. I still think he can come good this season, he's hardly the only player playing badly, I'm seeing countless people saying he's done, I'm not jumping on that bandwagon.

I haven't just suddenly called him rubbish at the moment, I have been saying that since day one and since he has been in that position the team has been exposed down the right..not his fault..he is not a RB, never has, never will be IMO.  He is a CB and that is where he plays his best and he certainly isn't done. He might come up with a crucial goal now and then but overall he has been a disaster waiting to happen and I don't blame him entirely.  The manager put him there and now the manager is going to have to deal with it.  Go back and watch games since he has been there.  As I said, he continually drifts towards the centre of the 18 yard box when we are defending (if he is back in time) and that leaves a big hole on the right for the opponents to play in unless who ever is playing in front of him comes back and defends.  As for my observation of him being 'selfish', I still think there are times when he is somewhat selfish for his own gratification, but that is my observation not yours.  

 

It will be interesting to see him play this weekend if he is selected as to how he plays his game.

If Ivan is benched against Everton, Baba better make the best if it. Hes only going to get one crack at it and if it isnt pitch perfect, hes not getting another shot any time soon

Depends how he looks in training, one thing frequently overlooked on here is that Jose does get to watch, coach and assess these players every day of the week, not just in matches.

Depends how he looks in training, one thing frequently overlooked on here is that Jose does get to watch, coach and assess these players every day of the week, not just in matches.

Only has two days with the squad to prepare for this one.

Recent form should have a massive baring on team selection surely?

Only has two days with the squad to prepare for this one.

Recent form should have a massive baring on team selection surely?

 

Will obviously be relevant but while it is pretty much the only factor we go off to suggest personnel changes, it is only one of many things he can look at to make decisions.

 

For all we know Baba is getting skinned by Mikel every training session.

For all we know Baba is getting skinned by Mikel every training session.

 

If that's true whoever green lit stumping up £21m needs a disciplinary hearing. 

If that's true whoever green lit stumping up £21m needs a disciplinary hearing.

Probably the same person who recommended Cuadrado as the next Ronaldinho and Salah as the Egyptian Messi.

Mikel has skinned better players than Rahman

I don't think we will see baba at the weekend. After courtois' injury I can't see Mourinho wanting to make more changes to the defensive line.

I think it will be Ivan zouma Terry Azpi.

I really cant take Jose seriously if Ivan plays.

It's a slap in the face for the players on the bench...when will they get a chance if the guy is picked despite performing like a headless chicken?

Interesting, stats almost identical, what has dropped, interception and most important he is dribbled past 10 times more than he was in 11/12 and 5 times more that he was last season 

If ivan plays I'm not watching the game. Because it will end in tears lol