He's no world beater but he's been dependable and solid.

Reminds me of Paulo on the other side all those years ago.

He's far better than he gets credit I am happy with him especially now i see he has good free kick on him

18 hours ago, Chelsbear said:

He's no world beater but he's been dependable and solid.

Reminds me of Paulo on the other side all those years ago.

You know I was gonna make the Paulo comparison but I thought people might take it the wrong way so I bottled it lol 

I actually think the Paulo Ferreira comparison is valid in Alonso's case, although IMO Alonso is a bit below Paulo's peak.

Not so much in terms of their overall strengths - Alonso is better offensively whereas Paulo was better defensively, but in that both deliver consistently solid performances without ever really looking like superstars. Alonso has at times not looked completely convincing (Man City) but he's never been outright atrocious, unlike Ivanovic since 2015/16. However, besides his performance vs Everton, he has rarely stood out. 

29 minutes ago, DaRick said:

I actually think the Paulo Ferreira comparison is valid in Alonso's case, although IMO Alonso is a bit below Paulo's peak.

Not so much in terms of their overall strengths - Alonso is better offensively whereas Paulo was better defensively, but in that both deliver consistently solid performances without ever really looking like superstars. Alonso has at times not looked completely convincing (Man City) but he's never been outright atrocious, unlike Ivanovic since 2015/16. However, besides his performance vs Everton, he has rarely stood out. 

Paulo Ferreira was unbelievably dependable.

Alonso has a long way to go to be considered dependable.  Funny how people are pointing out Alonso being in the team when we've only conceded two goals in 11 games.  You can still play poorly and be on a winning side, they aren't mutually exclusive.. and in his role, he's being asked to defend less anyway.  I'd give all that credit to Dave (huge fan), Cahill (I constantly and still do think he's not up to it but has really proved me wrong of late) and Luiz (who I constantly said was unreliable and prone to errors but who has made far less errors than he has outstanding games since returning). 

I'm not willing him to fail, as some people think when their opinion is not shared.  He is just constantly our opponents best outlet for attack.  Really really hope he improves.

Edited December 20, 20169 yr by Van Butsen

He isn't playing poorly though.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but you calling him woeful was just wrong. 

Edited December 20, 20169 yr by Bobbywoodhogan

Well he's been dependable so far for Chelsea and we can only go on what he's done thus far.

How long does he have to go before we can describe him as dependable? I mean we are at Christmas and he's been just that so far.

24 minutes ago, Bobbywoodhogan said:

He isn't playing poorly though.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but you calling him woeful was just wrong. 

He is though, he is beaten at every turn of pace, he is sluggish to get back (when compared with out other wingback) and he hasn't done anything to counter these faults to prove that he is playing well or ca be dependable.  The times he has popped up in attack, he's been wasteful and slow and hasn't made or finished opportunities well enough.

You can sit there all you like Bobby with your stance, but all you do is say this is right, this is wrong, with nothing to back it up.

Have you heard any of the commentary on him?  To paraphrase G.Neville "he has totally abandoned his defensive duty in this second half".  I'm fairly sure that as the first game he saw him play and might have only seen him once more.  If he watches a few more, I'm sure we will hear more of this unless he starts playing better.  It's not something I've pulled out of thin air.  He has been our weakest link easily.  Call it what you will.
 

Edited December 20, 20169 yr by Van Butsen

He is not a marquee signing, that is his main problem. I recall when we signed Azpilicueta everyone doubted that he will ever make it at Chelsea and that he is another player set to be loaned out. He proved us wrong and he became a crucial member of the starting eleven. Are we really trying too hard to find a weak spot in the team after 11 straight wins and some in incredible performances? Don't fix what is not broken, personally i would only get cover for him so he has competition. I bet Dave would do a great job if he is given games, only game he played at wing back was West Ham if a recall correctly? Hardly enough time to see him shine.

23 minutes ago, Van Butsen said:

He is though, he is beaten at every turn of pace, he is sluggish to get back (when compared with out other wingback) and he hasn't done anything to counter these faults to prove that he is playing well or ca be dependable.  The times he has popped up in attack, he's been wasteful and slow and hasn't made or finished opportunities well enough.

You can sit there all you like Bobby with your stance, but all you do is say this is right, this is wrong, with nothing to back it up.

Have you heard any of the commentary on him?  To paraphrase G.Neville "he has totally abandoned his defensive duty in this second half".  I'm fairly sure that as the first game he saw him play and might have only seen him once more.  If he watches a few more, I'm sure we will hear more of this unless he starts playing better.  It's not something I've pulled out of thin air.  He has been our weakest link easily.  Call it what you will.
 

He really hasn't been beaten at every turn of pace at all. You're basically not impressed with him that's all it is. Nobody else thinks he's woeful apart form you. That should tell you something.

The guy is getting slated after he has helped the team go on a 11 match winning streak, imagine the criticism after a loss. I think Moses & Alonso are both doing a phenomenal job but the role is starting to take its toll especially with 3 back to back games last week, A wingbacks role is arguably the most demanding physically in the game as they have to tuck in and become a 5 whilst defending yet provide width in attack when required.

Incredibly unfair to criticize Alonso considering we are top but we may need to rotate a little when we get fixture congestion in the near future. 

It's strange in a time when we are on a 11 game winning run with one of if not the best defensive record in the league one of our defenders is described as woeful.

A guy who is new to English football, Chelsea and the system remember.

 

Just now, Chelsbear said:

It's strange in a time when we are on a 11 game winning run with one of if not the best defensive record in the league one of our defenders is described as woeful.

A guy who is new to English football, Chelsea and the system remember.

 

It's strange that a player can't individually be judged for his performances separately to the team. 

Anyway, no getting through to you two.  I'm just glad all the past-it players and loaned for a reason players are shoving it right up you this season.  Not that you didn't will them to fail.

 what a strange poster you are.

I'm not the one complaining about a key player in our table topping team.....

Edited December 20, 20169 yr by Chelsbear

11 minutes ago, Van Butsen said:

It's strange that a player can't individually be judged for his performances separately to the team. 

Anyway, no getting through to you two.  I'm just glad all the past-it players and loaned for a reason players are shoving it right up you this season.  Not that you didn't will them to fail.

What are you jabbering on about? 

Honestly mate go take 5 and have a glass of Christmas sherry

1 minute ago, Van Butsen said:

It's strange that a player can't individually be judged for his performances separately to the team. 

Personally I think you're judging Alonso having already made your mind up... Yes he isn't the fastest fullback but how fast you can run isn't really something that you can improve drastically.

Alonso isn't making massive errors defensively and if anything he is expected to work harder than Moses is on the right.

He gets a lot less support from Hazard than Moses does from Pedro and Willian because Hazard is being given more licence stay forward and drive forward counter attacks.

Look at the Palace game, crosses were coming in from their right back. Alonso was marking Zaha who comes infield, it's up to Hazard or Matic to get across to stop their fullback. 

I don't pretend that Alonso is the best left sided player out there but he's performing well and doing the job that's asked of him and find the level of criticism he's received from some supports excessive given the run of form we are on and that we have conceded just two goals since Conte started picking Alonso. 

I think for this season he's perfectly fine, he can manage against most wingers in the league but if we play in Europe next season I wouldn't trust him against the likes of Ronaldo, Cavani, Bale etc.

i do think we need an improvement in that position to compete against the best of Europe, but he's good enough in league.

2 minutes ago, Bobbywoodhogan said:

What are you jabbering on about? 

Honestly mate go take 5 and have a glass of Christmas sherry

There's no point explaining it to you Bobby, I'm positively unsure as to whether you even remember the stuff you post on here now. 

The below sums you up as a poster in general.  

On 7/16/2013 at 14:34, Bobbywoodhogan said:

Never gonna happen and don't want him

 

5 minutes ago, ForeverCarefree said:

Personally I think you're judging Alonso having already made your mind up... Yes he isn't the fastest fullback but how fast you can run isn't really something that you can improve drastically.

Alonso isn't making massive errors defensively and if anything he is expected to work harder than Moses is on the right.

He gets a lot less support from Hazard than Moses does from Pedro and Willian because Hazard is being given more licence stay forward and drive forward counter attacks.

Look at the Palace game, crosses were coming in from their right back. Alonso was marking Zaha who comes infield, it's up to Hazard or Matic to get across to stop their fullback. 

I don't pretend that Alonso is the best left sided player out there but he's performing well and doing the job that's asked of him and find the level of criticism he's received from some supports excessive given the run of form we are on and that we have conceded just two goals since Conte started picking Alonso. 

Well all I can respond to you is tell you that I'm not.  I really hope he improves. I'd love him to make that spot his own.  CP was easily his best game, I haven't said otherwise.  But the majority of his games I think he has been our weakest link, slow, incapable of beating a player (either with or without the ball).

I was a massive David Luiz critique and I'm eating my words right now.
I was a massive Gary Cahill critique and I've softened somewhat, wouldn't say I'm dining yet though.

I'm willing to change my mind, I hope I do.

You don't go on a winning run like ours and have a defensive record like ours carrying passengers for 11 games, man city was a bad game, spuds not great but outside of that he has been very good and his presence in the air has been massively overlooked (almost like pep digging out his own fans after the arsenal game). Also Alonso is the only only in the team that has won every game he has started

Edited December 20, 20169 yr by barak81

2 hours ago, Van Butsen said:

There's no point explaining it to you Bobby, I'm positively unsure as to whether you even remember the stuff you post on here now. 

The below sums you up as a poster in general.  

 

So I can't have been wrong PRIOR to signing him? Have I slagged him off since he started playing in the team? Did I admit to been wrong about moses here? Yes I did. Point been a person can be wrong about a player but don't make sh*t up cause you don't rate a player. 

I would love to know how it sums me up aswell? Much like many people I made a pre judgement and the player has proven me wrong. I'm delighted I was so wrong cause I think he's a solid, dependable footballer.

Edited December 20, 20169 yr by Bobbywoodhogan

6 hours ago, TrueBlueBIH said:

He is not a marquee signing, that is his main problem. I recall when we signed Azpilicueta everyone doubted that he will ever make it at Chelsea and that he is another player set to be loaned out. He proved us wrong and he became a crucial member of the starting eleven. Are we really trying too hard to find a weak spot in the team after 11 straight wins and some in incredible performances? Don't fix what is not broken, personally i would only get cover for him so he has competition. I bet Dave would do a great job if he is given games, only game he played at wing back was West Ham if a recall correctly? Hardly enough time to see him shine.

I can't recall anyone saying Cesar wouldn't be a success. While Van Butsen may have exaggerated saying woeful he has got a point in general, Alonso has struggled defensively in some games vs pacey wingers and that Saints game Tadic murdered him. As for not fixing what isn't broken its that mindset that's led to our last two title defenses being a joke.

Another point work th making, as much as Cahill has re found his form he hasn't got the pace of Dave and I don't think anyone in the team is as good a one on one defender as Dave, life must be a hell of a lot more fun when you got Dave backing you up

13 hours ago, Argo said:

I can't recall anyone saying Cesar wouldn't be a success. While Van Butsen may have exaggerated saying woeful he has got a point in general, Alonso has struggled defensively in some games vs pacey wingers and that Saints game Tadic murdered him. As for not fixing what isn't broken its that mindset that's led to our last two title defenses being a joke.

He signed this season, not 5 years ago. You would change the team every half season or? The 2009/10 title winning season we were runners up the next season how was that a joke of defending a title? The last was obviously a disaster. We can hardly expect to defend the title every season with such a competitive league. Title defenses are very rare in the last 7 years with no team defending their title. United has a good run with three in a row and us before that.

1 hour ago, TrueBlueBIH said:

He signed this season, not 5 years ago. You would change the team every half season or? The 2009/10 title winning season we were runners up the next season how was that a joke of defending a title? The last was obviously a disaster. We can hardly expect to defend the title every season with such a competitive league. Title defenses are very rare in the last 7 years with no team defending their title. United has a good run with three in a row and us before that.

So do you think we should keep the team as is until we end up in 7th, 8th, maybe 9th spot in 2, 3 years?  Maybe less? Then start looking for replacements the following summer?  Or when do you try and work on improving as a team?  Is there a tipping point?