Sarri - In or Out?

[dansubrosa]

Yeah in my opinion, people really can’t be calling for Sarri’s head due to yesterday - As painful it is losing to them, they’re clearly miles ahead of us.

We were unlucky not to get anything, typical they get another wonder goal, on another day that would have gone over the bar. Us hitting the post too, all the luck Liverpool get this season probably will win them the title. I feel Sarri got the line up and tactics right, we’re just not good enough.

[dansubrosa]

Yeah in my opinion, people really can’t be calling for Sarri’s head due to yesterday - As painful it is losing to them, they’re clearly miles ahead of us.

We were unlucky not to get anything, typical they get another wonder goal, on another day that would have gone over the bar. Us hitting the post too, all the luck Liverpool get this season probably will win them the title. I feel Sarri got the line up and tactics right, we’re just not good enough.

[icecoolguy22]

The alarming fact is under this manager, we lost every away games against teams in the top 6, and we were not even close in any of those games, I think it was like 1 : 13. I struggle to remember another season we lost so many away games, and heavy beat ups. We had poorer team in the past 10 years, but no team was as soft as this one, the least we'd expect from Chelsea was pack the double deck bus and grind out a 0:0. Conte's team was poor last season, but he won the FA cup against a better team, ugly or not. Under Sarri, we just so focused on playing that pretty football, and lost the toughness that was embedded in us for the last decade. Again, it's not all Sarri's fault, someone knew all about his strength and weakness and still went for him.  I don't feel confident we could win the Europa league, suppose we get through this week, comes Semi or Final we will meet a team matching out status, and I just don't fancy us winning a tough game against a good/determined opponent.

[bisright1]

Fact is if we win the Europa League, certain fans who think Sarri is the reason we won't win it, will never give him credit. 

I'm excited to see how we fare next year under Sarri. I'm very disappointed by our fan base this year and hope we don't make a terrible decision by chopping him. 

[drjonesy1994]

6 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

Fact is if we win the Europa League, certain fans who think Sarri is the reason we won't win it, will never give him credit. 

I'm excited to see how we fare next year under Sarri. I'm very disappointed by our fan base this year and hope we don't make a terrible decision by chopping him. 

Have you not just spent however long saying that managers dont win you finals?

[Argo]

14 minutes ago, icecoolguy22 said:

The alarming fact is under this manager, we lost every away games against teams in the top 6, and we were not even close in any of those games, I think it was like 1 : 13. I struggle to remember another season we lost so many away games, and heavy beat ups. We had poorer team in the past 10 years, but no team was as soft as this one, the least we'd expect from Chelsea was pack the double deck bus and grind out a 0:0. Conte's team was poor last season, but he won the FA cup against a better team, ugly or not. Under Sarri, we just so focused on playing that pretty football, and lost the toughness that was embedded in us for the last decade. Again, it's not all Sarri's fault, someone knew all about his strength and weakness and still went for him.  I don't feel confident we could win the Europa league, suppose we get through this week, comes Semi or Final we will meet a team matching out status, and I just don't fancy us winning a tough game against a good/determined opponent.

Don't think it's as bad as the Scolari era, in that period we were losing home and away to big teams and I think our home record against top ten sides wasn't much better than our away record against similar sides currently.

For now I'll put the away defeats to a learning curve of the new system, but those results must be improved upon next season.

[drjonesy1994]

One thing that is really bugging me at the mo is those that are Sarri in moaning that those that are Sarri out are fickle, or disappointing or whatever term they want to use

I supported Mourinho, Conte, Di Matteo all to the end. 3 blokes IMO who deserved a bit of patience and perhaps one or two of them were unlucky to lose the job when they did. Me personally i have seen nothing from Sarri this season to convince me he is the right man going forward, and 2 wins against Brighton and West Ham is not enough to convince me otherwise. 

Just because i don't support this manager doesn't make me a better or worse fan than those of you that do.

Those of you that do support him, fair enough you must have your reasons but just because some of us don't agree with you doesn't mean that we are fickle or bad fans.

[bisright1]

23 minutes ago, drjonesy1994 said:

Have you not just spent however long saying that managers dont win you finals?

Yeah and I don't think Sarri will be the reason we win the final. But those who think a manage is the main reason a team wins a final and that's why we won't, will conveniently change that view if Sarri does win. 

[Nibs]

3 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

Yeah and I don't think Sarri will be the reason we win the final. But those who think a manage is the main reason a team wins a final and that's why we won't, will conveniently change that view if Sarri does win. 

Eh? Reading that has given me a headache!

 

[bisright1]

18 minutes ago, drjonesy1994 said:

One thing that is really bugging me at the mo is those that are Sarri in moaning that those that are Sarri out are fickle, or disappointing or whatever term they want to use

I supported Mourinho, Conte, Di Matteo all to the end. 3 blokes IMO who deserved a bit of patience and perhaps one or two of them were unlucky to lose the job when they did. Me personally i have seen nothing from Sarri this season to convince me he is the right man going forward, and 2 wins against Brighton and West Ham is not enough to convince me otherwise. 

Just because i don't support this manager doesn't make me a better or worse fan than those of you that do.

Those of you that do support him, fair enough you must have your reasons but just because some of us don't agree with you doesn't mean that we are fickle or bad fans.

I am fine with people thinking he should go.

But I'm not fine with the "he's never won anything" argument. It's stupid  He did a better job at Napoli than any manager we could get now who happened to win a domestic cup. And I'm not fine with booing Sarri when we are winning a game. 

I personally think Sarri needs more time than any manager we've had before. He's changing our entire ethos. He didn't get a pre season and we are still very much in the hunt for the top 4 and a European cup. The performances can improve, pep and klopp both showed that

Also I'm irritated constantly by no serious replacement for Sarri being considered. 

[bisright1]

Just now, Nibs said:

Eh? Reading that has given me a headache!

 

Lol. 

Some people say we wont win the Europa League because Sarri is our manager

If we do. They will say it was the team that won it. 

I think regardless, it's the team that wins a final. The manager can only do so much at that point. 

[Argo]

32 minutes ago, drjonesy1994 said:

One thing that is really bugging me at the mo is those that are Sarri in moaning that those that are Sarri out are fickle, or disappointing or whatever term they want to use

I supported Mourinho, Conte, Di Matteo all to the end. 3 blokes IMO who deserved a bit of patience and perhaps one or two of them were unlucky to lose the job when they did. Me personally i have seen nothing from Sarri this season to convince me he is the right man going forward, and 2 wins against Brighton and West Ham is not enough to convince me otherwise. 

Just because i don't support this manager doesn't make me a better or worse fan than those of you that do.

Those of you that do support him, fair enough you must have your reasons but just because some of us don't agree with you doesn't mean that we are fickle or bad fans.

If that's aimed at me I don't think anyone's a lesser fan for wanting him out and I apologize if it looked like I implied anything in that direction.

I do think (from my experience) there is a general case of stubbornness with the average Chelsea fan and I think Sarri has to do something spectacular to win over the most stubborn section over, for example I also believe there would still be Mourinho chanting to this day had Conte not blew him out of the water which showed we made the correct decision.

[ForeverCarefree]

1 hour ago, Argo said:

Will even that work? We have in general improved a lot since the cup final and Hudson Odoi is getting a lot more games and the vultures are still out when we lose a game, even away to one of the best teams in PL history when we didn't actually play that badly.

We have the most stubborn fanbase and honestly I think only a season that could hold up on Conte's first or Jose's first spell could win them over.

Wait, did you just say that this current Liverpool side (who haven't actually won anything yet) are one of the best Premier League sides ever?

Blimey, hyperbole of the highest order that one.  

[Shweaves]

13 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

I personally think Sarri needs more time than any manager we've had before. He's changing our entire ethos. He didn't get a pre season and we are still very much in the hunt for the top 4 and a European cup. The performances can improve, pep and klopp both showed that

I agree with this, give him more than a season to instill his style. At times, there is a lot of sideways passing but in other games we can see what he is working toward (recently seen in Brighton and West Ham). 

 

Also about the losing at Anfield comments, (first loss in 8 visits or something), we won a brilliant match there earlier this season in the league cup...

[Nibs]

15 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

Lol. 

Some people say we wont win the Europa League because Sarri is our manager

If we do. They will say it was the team that won it. 

I think regardless, it's the team that wins a final. The manager can only do so much at that point. 

There are probably some that will not want to give Sarri any credit as they have made it clear that they feel he is not up to the job so if he wins a trophy it will mean back-tracking. I don't rate Sarri, but if he does manage to win the EL, then he WILL deserve  credit. I think you are wrong that a coach / manager cannot do much. Coaches play a MASSIVE part in every game - especially finals. Selecting the right side, motivating the players, reacting as the game develops and making the right changes at the right times during the game. All these decisions can be the difference between winning & losing and regrettably, that is where I feel Sarri falls down as he has been getting a lot of these things wrong throughout the season and not sure he is learning from his mistakes.

But we live in Hope. 

[squabble]

15 minutes ago, ForeverCarefree said:

Wait, did you just say that this current Liverpool side (who haven't actually won anything yet) are one of the best Premier League sides ever?

Blimey, hyperbole of the highest order that one.  

In fairness to him they are on target for the 2nd or 3rd highest points total in Premier league history.

[Argo]

22 minutes ago, ForeverCarefree said:

Wait, did you just say that this current Liverpool side (who haven't actually won anything yet) are one of the best Premier League sides ever?

Blimey, hyperbole of the highest order that one.  

In terms of consistency absolutely, they are looking extremely well placed to match or better our 04/05 total, have the best defence probably since the days of us and United fighting it out with JT/Carvalho and Rio/Vidic and in terms of how well they work together you could make a case for them having the most fearsome front three in football save for PSG's. Midfield is their only real weakness but Klopp's style means any exposure to that is minimul.

I hate that club more than any other, but the reality is they are very much up there on the pitch.

Edited April 15, 2019 by Argo

[dansubrosa]

Yeah they are a very, very good team. It’s annoying how they got lucky with Salah though. No chance they ever saw him becoming this good.

[abramovich]

8 hours ago, Argo said:

I do like the potential of his system, we play out from the back with ease even against elite sides and we had a blip in the winter to say the least but either side of that i feel we have by in large played reasonably well, infact since the cup final i feel we are playing with a lot more speed and creating a lot more chances (although some would argue that ain't hard) and Sarri has improved his squad management, those two reasons have brought me back to Sarri in as i did want him out in February due to the embarrassing capiluations but as i alluded to new information and all that. Also what has to be factored is he has come in tasked with changing an entire clubs culture with a broken pre season and hardly any free midweeks (think we have had like 2/3 since August which is obscene).

All things considered i want to give him a second season to see if we can build on the groundwork he has laid, half because i do see potential in the end game and half because i fear we will panic and reboot to reactive football which unless doing well is soul destroying to watch (i'd take us this season over 10/11, the last days of AVB, the Robbie/Rafa season, 15/16 and last season any day of the week).

No, we don't play with ease from the back, and not just against top sides, we struggled to do that even against teams like Slavia, for example. Any side that can organize pressing well, creates serious problems for Sarri's Chelsea. Last night was a good example when Liverpool was making things very difficult for us and we conceded possession time and again, couldn't even string more than a few passes in our own half on many occasions.

[drjonesy1994]

40 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

I am fine with people thinking he should go.

But I'm not fine with the "he's never won anything" argument. It's stupid  He did a better job at Napoli than any manager we could get now who happened to win a domestic cup. And I'm not fine with booing Sarri when we are winning a game. 

I personally think Sarri needs more time than any manager we've had before. He's changing our entire ethos. He didn't get a pre season and we are still very much in the hunt for the top 4 and a European cup. The performances can improve, pep and klopp both showed that

Also I'm irritated constantly by no serious replacement for Sarri being considered. 

I've given my reasons a few times over in the past, i can't be arsed going into all of them again. I do think the "he has won nothing" argument isn't a great one - but then again from what i have seen the majority of people on here haven't been using that argument.

I've also given suggestions of who i would like to replace him, it's up to you whether you take them seriously or not.

[drjonesy1994]

47 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

Lol. 

Some people say we wont win the Europa League because Sarri is our manager

If we do. They will say it was the team that won it. 

I think regardless, it's the team that wins a final. The manager can only do so much at that point. 

My view on this, if we win the EL then great. Credit will have to be given to Sarri AND the team for achieving that. It's not like i actively want to see us not win just so I can have a go at Sarri.

If he manages to turn it around, then fair enough. Unfortunately though IMO i haven't seen anything to suggest that will happen. 

[Argo]

5 minutes ago, abramovich said:

No, we don't play with ease from the back, and not just against top sides, we struggled to do that even against teams like Slavia, for example. Any side that can organize pressing well, creates serious problems for Sarri's Chelsea. Last night was a good example when Liverpool was making things very difficult for us and we conceded possession time and again, couldn't even string more than a few passes in our own half on many occasions.

Even Liverpool fans I was with for the game were praising us for how well we were playing out in the first half and after the reverse fixture said we done it better than even City ever did against them.

Of course when you apply tactics which in layman terms is don't hoof unless you are completely boxed in mistakes will happen on occasion, they even did to Pep's Barca, but I've constantly pinpointed out the times we have played out well this season to people because I honestly thought that was the aspect of Sarri tactics that would take the longest.

[abramovich]

3 hours ago, bisright1 said:

Lol. Their manager won't be playing. There isn't a secret formula for winning a cup final. Don't blame Sarri for kepa being a prick. 

I don't blame Sarri for Kepa being a prick.

I do blame Sarri for not being able to execute his authority when one of his players openly defies him in front of the whole world. It's like saying, don't blame the sergeant because it was the soldier who refused to follow orders. No, blame the sergeant, because apparently he commands neither fear, no respect from his subordinates.

[bisright1]

11 minutes ago, drjonesy1994 said:

I've given my reasons a few times over in the past, i can't be arsed going into all of them again. I do think the "he has won nothing" argument isn't a great one - but then again from what i have seen the majority of people on here haven't been using that argument.

I've also given suggestions of who i would like to replace him, it's up to you whether you take them seriously or not.

I never saw who you suggested.

Wallosh said Eddie Howe, Holland or Nuno Santos. 3 managers who haven't won anything before and who our fanbase would turn on just as quickly.  

I have problems with Sarri, I just think we have bigger problems and losing a manager with a system and a style right now, would do more damage than good.

My opinion might change at the end of the season. But planning to get rid of a manager who is still in the hunt for a trophy and who could get us into the top 4, would send a signal to the market that we really are a short term planning club. 

Edited April 15, 2019 by bisright1

[Ukraine Bolt]

18 minutes ago, abramovich said:

I don't blame Sarri for Kepa being a prick.

I do blame Sarri for not being able to execute his authority when one of his players openly defies him in front of the whole world. It's like saying, don't blame the sergeant because it was the soldier who refused to follow orders. No, blame the sergeant, because apparently he commands neither fear, no respect from his subordinates.

Was Ferguson a weak manager who couldn't assert his authority when Les Sealey refused to go off in '91 league cup final?