1 hour ago, abramovich said:

Hell no. We have little chance of getting a result at Etihad as it is, with Lukaku in the lineup we'll have zero chance against Pep's lot, it's like playing with ten men. His inability to trap the ball and poor hold up play will result in us being under City pressure non stop. There's no upside in playing him against a team like City, we'll have to go with false nine, run for 90 minutes and hope it works out in our favour.

I disagree with all of this. His hold-up play is generally very good in my opinion. Especially when he gets to ball too his feet.

Also not trying to absolve Lukaku of any blame here but neither of CHO, Mount or Werner did enough around him yesterday. None of them looked to threaten as far as i'm concerned and then it's always going to be hard for our focal point. They need to be closer to Lukaku and they also need to be a lot better in general.

He's our top scorer but I don't think Mount have been very good this season. Certainly nowhere near the level he showed in the Champions League last season.

16 minutes ago, Gol15 said:

I would be surprised if Tuchel doesn't start the game with him, despite everything you said.

Then he'll have no one to blame but himself if/when we drop points.

Even the local Manchester paper have worked out how much more we troubled them with the Mount/Havertz/Werner front line.

4 minutes ago, Sindre said:

I disagree with all of this. His hold-up play is generally very good in my opinion. Especially when he gets to ball too his feet.

Also not trying to absolve Lukaku of any blame here but neither of CHO, Mount or Werner did enough around him yesterday. None of them looked to threaten as far as i'm concerned and then it's always going to be hard for our focal point. They need to be closer to Lukaku and they also need to be a lot better in general.

He's our top scorer but I don't think Mount have been very good this season. Certainly nowhere near the level he showed in the Champions League last season.

Werner and Mount were very poor but they got held to account and hauled off.

That's the difference and the one thing annoying me the most, I really thought him having to work his way back in after injury meant Tuchel was going to treat him on merit the same way Pep has with his record signing but it appears we're back to him starting and finishing games unconditionally.

8 minutes ago, Argo said:

That's the difference and the one thing annoying me the most, I really thought him having to work his way back in after injury meant Tuchel was going to treat him on merit the same way Pep has with his record signing but it appears we're back to him starting and finishing games unconditionally.

Difference being that Lukaku was brought in to address a glaring weakness, having no goalgetters in attacking areas.

Also don't think he's been playing unconditionally. As a matter of fact that was one of the reasons for his outburst, that Tuchel didn't play him sooner after an injury. As of right now I think the manager is trying to play the man into form. Before these last three matches he didn't play for 90 minutes since early October.

 

1 minute ago, Sindre said:

Difference being that Lukaku was brought in to address a glaring weakness, having no goalgetters in attacking areas.

Also don't think he's been playing unconditionally. As a matter of fact that was one of the reasons for his outburst, that Tuchel didn't play him sooner after an injury. As of right now I think the manager is trying to play the man into form. Before these last three matches he didn't play for 90 minutes since early October.

The goal getter argument can be used when we're playing the lesser sides, but he has little track record in big games and even more so against Tottenham (1 goal in 16).

The fact this is all starting again after his interview makes it even more worrying.

It's frustrating because if we use the system we played against them last season I genuinely believe we will get a result at The Etihad this weekend but I hold little hope of seeing it.

4 minutes ago, Argo said:

Then he'll have no one to blame but himself if/when we drop points.

Even the local Manchester paper have worked out how much more we troubled them with the Mount/Havertz/Werner front line.

We lost the last time without having a single shot on target. We played a 3-5-2 with Lukaku and Werner up front. I don't see how we can win without being able to have a shot on target.

17 hours ago, Scott Harris said:

Okay, I have to ask, why does this keep happening to all of your posts? I have resisted the urge to ask for over a year now, but I need to know 😆

Lol, I don't realize that I always do that until you told me. 😅😅

I apoligise in case someone already mentioned this.

Last night Lukaku received the award for best Belgian player in 2021 that plays outside of Belgium. 

He beat names like KDB and Courtois who also had a very strong year. 

I assume that he mainly won because his very strong first half of the year in Italy.  

Congratulations Romelu.

 

Aside - Golden boot in Belgium went to Paul Onuachu who scored 34 goals in 2021 for my Belgian team KRC Genk. The man is a giant. 

2 hours ago, Sindre said:

I disagree with all of this. His hold-up play is generally very good in my opinion. Especially when he gets to ball too his feet.

Also not trying to absolve Lukaku of any blame here but neither of CHO, Mount or Werner did enough around him yesterday. None of them looked to threaten as far as i'm concerned and then it's always going to be hard for our focal point. They need to be closer to Lukaku and they also need to be a lot better in general.

He's our top scorer but I don't think Mount have been very good this season. Certainly nowhere near the level he showed in the Champions League last season.

We can't have been watching the same player. When he gets ball to his feet his touch lets him down at least half the time, and I'm being generous. He can't run with a ball, can't dribble worth sh*t and is not a good passer, either. His headers, except for Zenit match, are of poor quality, he can't even head on goal on most occasions. Despite being physically strong he doesn't know how to use that strength properly and gets pushed off the ball far too often. He does look like he puts in effort since coming back post interview but he seems overweight and looks exhausted after every sprint or tussle with the opposition player.

1 hour ago, Gol15 said:

We lost the last time without having a single shot on target. We played a 3-5-2 with Lukaku and Werner up front. I don't see how we can win without being able to have a shot on target.

We beat them three times last season under Tuchel and we didn't have Lukaku at the time. I'm not saying this season's loss is all his fault, far from it and we may very well lose on Saturday with or without Lukaku, but I do believe we've got a better chance to get something out of the game if we at least start with him on the bench.

Edited January 13, 20224 yr by abramovich

How can you blame Lukaku for not scoring …if the crosses that coming to him are bad or behind him. If other forward missing more clear goal then that’s okay because they are young or they gave us Champions L.

Why don’t we wait untill we have some decent wingsback again. If you really are neutral then you will see he is our best finishing striker for the chances that he got.

The team needs to play with more risk without passing back all the time Odoi is doing nothing up front why don’t try Pulisic with Werner instead of using him as a wingback. And keep Jorginho out also he always look behind and stop no tempo.

 

Edited January 13, 20224 yr by Hall

21 minutes ago, Hall said:

How can you blame Lukaku for not scoring …if the crosses that coming to him are bad or behind him. If other forward missing more clear goal then that’s okay because they are young or they gave us Champions L.

Why don’t we wait untill we have some decent wingsback again. If you really are neutral then you will see he is our best finishing striker for the chances that he got.

The team needs to play with more risk without passing back all the time Odoi is doing nothing up front why don’t try Pulisic with Werner instead of using him as a wingback. And keep Jorginho out also he always look behind and stop no tempo.

 

He had a 1 on 1 in the early stages.

But yes he is our best finisher but forward player's need to be more than just scorers in this day in age, we're a fanbase that had atleast one of Gudjohnsen, Drogba or Hazard in our squad for our 19 straight season's so we should know that more than anyone.

Also Rom is our record signing and has had a UCL winning system tinkered with to accommodate him so he absolutely should be getting held to the highest standard. Lots of goals (including at The Ethiad this coming Saturday) or a very high general influence on games is minimum requirement.

Edited January 13, 20224 yr by Argo

1 minute ago, Argo said:

He had a 1 on 1 in the early stages.

But yes he is our best finisher but forward player's need to be more than just scorers in this day in age, we're a fanbase that had atleast one of Gudjohnsen, Drogba or Hazard in our squad for our 19 straight season's, we should know that more than anyone.

That would be the Gudjohnsen that partnered Jimmy Floydd Hasselbaink a man who didn't press his trousers let alone opposition defenders. 

Drogba, who played off of the best goal scoring midfield player of the modern era.

And Eden Hazard a player who was given a reprise from doing any defensive duties because he was Eden Hazard. 

Not a big Lukaku fan but I do think there is merit to the lack of supply argument. When we are on song, the attack is fluid and we move the ball quickly to the opposition penalty area moving defenders out of position. In games like yesterday, we just sit back and pass around the back 5 till everyone is in place for the opposition and that includes Lukaku being constantly marked. Maybe the players around him are trying to play with him as well but it isn't gelling right now. We go back to Sarri-ball in some games.

Tuchel might have to think of a more attacking formation with the current players as our 343 relies on the front 3 being top of their game. This hasn't been the case for some time now. 

1 minute ago, ForeverCarefree said:

That would be the Gudjohnsen that partnered Jimmy Floydd Hasselbaink a man who didn't press his trousers let alone opposition defenders. 

 

 

Yep, and as good at Gudjohnsen and Jimmy partnership was at it's peak we finished 6th. And the latter despite being a great scorer won nothing and even has a couple of relegations to his name.

The moment Eidur started sharing the lone striker role with Drogs we pissed the league.

4 minutes ago, ForeverCarefree said:

 

And Eden Hazard a player who was given a reprise from doing any defensive duties because he was Eden Hazard. 

 

And he wasn't scoring any where near as much as the likes of Neymar, Salah etc but the majority of us would argue his case against those until we were blue in the face.

5 minutes ago, ForeverCarefree said:

Drogba, who played off of the best goal scoring midfield player of the modern era.

In no small part thanks to Didier himself becoming a perfect foil.

9 minutes ago, ForeverCarefree said:

That would be the Gudjohnsen that partnered Jimmy Floydd Hasselbaink a man who didn't press his trousers let alone opposition defenders. 

Drogba, who played off of the best goal scoring midfield player of the modern era.

And Eden Hazard a player who was given a reprise from doing any defensive duties because he was Eden Hazard. 

Times have changed a lot since City started dominating the league.  Who would of imagined a time when a team with no big defenders, no forwards, and no 20+ a season goal scorer would dominate the league with a lightweight team? Nobody is the answer, apart from Pep.

20 minutes ago, Argo said:

In no small part thanks to Didier himself becoming a perfect foil.

And yet here we are with people having lost patience with Lukaku after 20 appearances. 

He isn't being given a chance to become anything. 

13 minutes ago, coco said:

Times have changed a lot since City started dominating the league.  Who would of imagined a time when a team with no big defenders, no forwards, and no 20+ a season goal scorer would dominate the league with a lightweight team? Nobody is the answer, apart from Pep.

But City are the exception to the rule rather than the norm. The way he's setting up the team isn't something most other teams look to replecate them because frankly you can't... And that's why Pep is one of the greatest coaches of the modern era. 

They're being heavily linked for a move for Haaland come the summer and they were in for Harry Kane this summer too so it's not like Pep isn't interested in having a pure goal scorer in his side having recently lost one of the greatest goalscorers that the Premier League has ever seen in Ageuro. He was also looking to convert Feran Torres into a forward in the early stages of this season. 

3 minutes ago, ForeverCarefree said:

And yet here we are with people having lost patience with Lukaku after 20 appearances. 

He isn't being given a chance to become anything. 

I apologise If I'm wrong because didn't you quickly (and rightly) mark Saul's card as being out of his depth?

Why does the £97m singing get unconditional time and patience but the one who cost us nothing wrote off after a half?

2 minutes ago, Argo said:

I apologise If I'm wrong because didn't you quickly (and rightly) mark Saul's card as being out of his depth?

Why does the £97m singing get unconditional time and patience but the one who cost us nothing wrote off after a half?

I mean Lukaku, a player bought to score goals, has 8 goals in 20 appearances to date despite a spell out with an ankle injury and covid disrupting his season. Not set the world on fire but he's shown enough to demonstrate that he can deliver on what we needed most, scoring goals. 

Sual put in performances that made Bakayoko's match against Watford look like a midfield masterclass. Not really sure how you can compare the two players but the hyperbole throughout this thread has ceased to surprise me at this point. 

One thing that must be said about last night was that their defenders were super grabby, Sanchez I think was constantly grabbing the arms of Lukaku to restrict his mobility which looked like a foul to me.

Werner was also being grabbed by Emerson Royal which I didn't rate his performance anway but made him less effective as well.

3 minutes ago, ForeverCarefree said:

But City are the exception to the rule rather than the norm. The way he's setting up the team isn't something most other teams look to replecate them because frankly you can't... And that's why Pep is one of the greatest coaches of the modern era. 

They're being heavily linked for a move for Haaland come the summer and they were in for Harry Kane this summer too so it's not like Pep isn't interested in having a pure goal scorer in his side having recently lost one of the greatest goalscorers that the Premier League has ever seen in Ageuro. He was also looking to convert Feran Torres into a forward in the early stages of this season. 

Calling them an exception seems a bit defeatist to me. We have made progress in emulating city's style of play under Tuchel and were a lot closer to them in the league under the new manager. Lukaku was brought in at great cost to try to close that gap, but it's not happened so far. But i have learned a lesson from Rudiger to never give up on a player, so i think Lukaku can come good if he just hits form against the weaker teams, he should be scoring against at least half the team in the league, were now well into the 2nd half of the season and he's only managed to score against Arsenal, Villa and Brighton, he needs to improve his form and people should stop making excuses for him.

4 minutes ago, sonic90 said:

One thing that must be said about last night was that their defenders were super grabby, Sanchez I think was constantly grabbing the arms of Lukaku to restrict his mobility which looked like a foul to me.

Werner was also being grabbed by Emerson Royal which I didn't rate his performance anway but made him less effective as well.

Are you saying our players need to grab more?

Remember those classy goals from Chilly and James before their injuries? first time shots, volleys.....those are the kind of finishes i am expecting from Romelu. Like the volley he missed on his left foot last night, yes its half a chance, but so were those goals Chilly and James were scoring.

5 minutes ago, ForeverCarefree said:

I mean Lukaku, a player bought to score goals, has 8 goals in 20 appearances to date despite a spell out with an ankle injury and covid disrupting his season. Not set the world on fire but he's shown enough to demonstrate that he can deliver on what we needed most, scoring goals. 

Sual put in performances that made Bakayoko's match against Watford look like a midfield masterclass. Not really sure how you can compare the two players but the hyperbole throughout this thread has ceased to surprise me at this point. 

Saul at his peak would have fit this system like a glove so on that basis he should have got some patience. 

Re Rom I didn't want him then either (mainly because of the way he left us and how he doesn't do fighting for his place) but i could understand the logic of getting him under Conte, getting him into a fluid interchangeable system just never made any sense and now we've potentially got ourselves into a hole as Broja looks like he can slot into this system like a glove. If Lukaku saw fighting for a place with Costa as a 20 year old as beneath him, he's hardly likely to take falling below Mando lying down let's be honest.

As I said on the Tuchel thread long term we have a decision to make. We either go our separate ways, he adapts better to our style or we scrap what we've been working on since the Sarri days and play a compact counter style that would get the best out of him (in other words become a modern version of Liverpool gearing everything up towards Torres).

This halfway middle ground is not helping either party, especially against the type of opponent we face on Saturday.

29 minutes ago, coco said:

Remember those classy goals from Chilly and James before their injuries? first time shots, volleys.....those are the kind of finishes i am expecting from Romelu. Like the volley he missed on his left foot last night, yes its half a chance, but so were those goals Chilly and James were scoring.

They scoring that but after 5 that went out of the park 😞. So if you give that 5 to Lukaku i bet he will get alteast 3. And from the positions they are playing , they will have more freedom and time then a striker position.

look at Pulisic when CF how good was he then? Of Kai when up frond and ball ate coming to your direction. I rest my case

 

 

Edited January 13, 20224 yr by Hall

52 minutes ago, Hall said:

They scoring that but after 5 that went out of the park 😞. So if you give that 5 to Lukaku i bet he will get alteast 3. And from the positions they are playing , they will have more freedom and time then a striker position.

look at Pulisic when CF how good was he then? Of Kai when up frond and ball ate coming to your direction. I rest my case

 

 

The failings of Kai and Pulisic (you forgot Werner) are talked about on their respective threads on this forum. Although don't expect to see them pulled apart and dissected as much as Romelu, they have credit in the bank for last seasons heroics.

Romelu has no credit, cost us a stinking amount of money, and has tried blaming others (sKy interview) for his failings so far.

I understand why you make excuses for your fellow countryman, but i'm sure you know deep down he's not a big time player and the best Chelsea can hope for is 15+ goals against 8-9 of the weaker teams in the league, if he can find his form.