10 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

I also mentioned Zidane, Henry and Pirlo. And I stick by it. The point was not to compare Nkunku to Hazard or any of the other players I mentioned - but to provide context to my argument that you are wrong when you say that "world class players shouldnt need a system built around them". Hazard, and all the other players referenced would struggle when played a) out of position and b)in a style that didnt suit their game. Messi, the best player of all time would struggle up front playing for a team hoofing it long into the box and expecting him to fight aerial battles.

Nkunku has played in a slow possession system with Maresca and quick counter attacking under Poch. He’s played lone striker, behind the striker, out wide and looked lost everywhere.

9 hours ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

Nkunku has played in a slow possession system with Maresca and quick counter attacking under Poch. He’s played lone striker, behind the striker, out wide and looked lost everywhere.

I don't agree we played quick counter attacking football under poch. Most of the games were the same slow possession heavy sarriball. And he mostly played as a lone striker or sometimes wide. But always in a slow build up team

1 hour ago, nonotnowjim said:

I don't agree we played quick counter attacking football under poch. Most of the games were the same slow possession heavy sarriball. And he mostly played as a lone striker or sometimes wide. But always in a slow build up team

It’s okay to be wrong.

1 hour ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

It’s okay to be wrong.

Go back and look at the match threads under Poch - most of the matches there were lots of complaints about the slow and ineffective football we played. Lots of people misremember Poch - but in reality we were poor most of the time.

A few examples below - but literally hundreds of instances:

vs forest:

On 11/05/2024 at 21:22, The Rising Sun said:

Walking football again.

vs Sheffield utd:

On 07/04/2024 at 21:01, WhiteWall said:

Why do we insist on killing the tempo in all our games. Its where all our unforced errors come through. Concentration lapses due to lack of tempo and intensity

vs utd (from you)

On 05/04/2024 at 00:46, Ukraine Bolt said:

Poch has watched this team get decimated after going two up and not made a single change while Ten Haag has reacted, f**king embarrassing get him f**ked off in the tunnel at the final whistle how have we allowed this to continue. w**k Spurs bastard 

vs burnley

On 30/03/2024 at 20:31, WhiteWall said:

What I can't work out is that it says we've had 81% possesion but I think we have been awful this second half again.

vs newcastle:

On 12/03/2024 at 00:53, Scott Harris said:

Surrendered control again, like they always do. Opposition teams literally don't have to do anything against this group. They can be having the worst game of their careers and all they will need to do is wait for us to f**k it all up and take advantage of it.

Impossible to back a team that doesn't even back themselves.

vs brentford:

On 02/03/2024 at 20:29, dkw said:

How can anyone still think Poch should stay. He's f**king useless, disinterested, passive and sh*te.

vs leicester:

On 17/03/2024 at 18:09, Stas1 said:

Many contributors here come up with observations such as pace, mentality, link up play, focus, positioning, and so on. And all of them are direct responsibility of the manager and his coaching team. The answer to many of our problems is obvious.

1 hour ago, nonotnowjim said:

Go back and look at the match threads under Poch - most of the matches there were lots of complaints about the slow and ineffective football we played. Lots of people misremember Poch - but in reality we were poor most of the time.

A few examples below - but literally hundreds of instances:

vs forest:

vs Sheffield utd:

vs utd (from you)

vs burnley

vs newcastle:

vs brentford:

vs leicester:

Yes, we often took our foot off the gas after scoring as is mentioned above. We also played quick football under Maresca until November this season. Nkunku was sh*te then too 👍

47 minutes ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

Yes, we often took our foot off the gas after scoring as is mentioned above. We also played quick football under Maresca until November this season. Nkunku was sh*te then too 👍

Rarely, if ever, has Nkunku played for us a) in his proper position and b) in a fast transitional style that suits his game. This isnt open to argument. It simply hasnt happened. He has shown he is an elite player and finisher when a team is set up to get the best out of him.

A better argument would be that Nkunku has never shown sufficient desire, heart or fight (or perhaps quality) for Chelsea to justify building a team around him. I would agree with that. He hasnt. Which is why he will likely be sold. But it doesnt change the fact that he was never really given a chance to do well due to the set up and style.

12 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

Rarely, if ever, has Nkunku played for us a) in his proper position and b) in a fast transitional style that suits his game. This isnt open to argument. It simply hasnt happened. He has shown he is an elite player and finisher when a team is set up to get the best out of him.

A better argument would be that Nkunku has never shown sufficient desire, heart or fight (or perhaps quality) for Chelsea to justify building a team around him. I would agree with that. He hasnt. Which is why he will likely be sold. But it doesnt change the fact that he was never really given a chance to do well due to the set up and style.

We played fast free flowing football until mid-December. Nkunku featured in all but one of those games playing anywhere from LW, CF and CAM. He had 2 goals and 1 assist in 4 months in the league. The bloke is sh*te and your hypocrisy stinks, if Jackson was putting up those numbers you’d have jumped off a roof.

Can’t we just throw him into the Simmons deal? Going to be pretty annoyingly large squad again the way it’s going

1 hour ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

We played fast free flowing football until mid-December. Nkunku featured in all but one of those games playing anywhere from LW, CF and CAM. He had 2 goals and 1 assist in 4 months in the league. The bloke is sh*te and your hypocrisy stinks, if Jackson was putting up those numbers you’d have jumped off a roof.

From start of 23/24 season to mid Dec ( Brentford on 15/12) in a total of 16 league games played he did indeed feature in 15 games.

He played CF in 12, LW in 2 and AW in 1.

In 6 of the 10 games he played less than 10 minutes. In another 6 he played between 10&20 minutes In one of these games against Bournemouth he played 11 minutes and scored the only goal in our 1-0 win. In another game he played 58 minutes and another where he featured 26 and the final of those 15 games against Southampton where he scored and provided an assist in a 5-1 away victory.

4 minutes ago, terraloon said:

From start of 23/24 season to mid Dec ( Brentford on 15/12) in a total of 16 league games played he did indeed feature in 15 games.

He played CF in 12, LW in 2 and AW in 1.

In 6 of the 10 games he played less than 10 minutes. In another 6 he played between 10&20 minutes In one of these games against Bournemouth he played 11 minutes and scored the only goal in our 1-0 win. In another game he played 58 minutes and another where he featured 26 and the final of those 15 games against Southampton where he scored and provided an assist in a 5-1 away victory.

Thank you for agreeing with everything I said.

Id like to see Christopher Nkunku moved on, he doesnt want to be here so its probably for the best. Hes hardly set the Premier League on fire but should still allow us to recoup a decent fee.

2 hours ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

We played fast free flowing football until mid-December. Nkunku featured in all but one of those games playing anywhere from LW, CF and CAM. He had 2 goals and 1 assist in 4 months in the league. The bloke is sh*te and your hypocrisy stinks, if Jackson was putting up those numbers you’d have jumped off a roof.

Fast free flowing football? Dont think we did. A few other snippets from the match thread... I think you are misremembering our style.

Vs everton (december)

On 22/12/2024 at 22:32, CFCCAN said:

we played with little urgency, all walking pace to the half way line and then a slight jog from there on in.  We know you need to play quick passes to pull the defence out of position and you need players with the ability to have ball control and play quick one two's.  This was not the game for Jackson IMO

Vs BRentford (Dec)

On 16/12/2024 at 00:22, Frankie8Lampard said:

Maresca's biggest flaw is the same as Guardiola's; they will stick to one way of playing no matter the criticism or how bad a player plays. He's doing the same with Jackson.

Vs forest (Nov):

On 06/10/2024 at 19:08, Scott Harris said:

We should have won it with those two chances for Felix and Nknuku, but the whole game was poor from us. That is not how you approach a team playing a low block, and Maresca set us up like we were not expecting it. We were just too slow with our creativity. It didn't help that the likes of Jackson, Enzo and Gusto decided to play stinkers. Really poor today.

Vs West Ham (sep)

On 22/09/2024 at 05:51, H2SO4aq said:

my god is our style of football awful to watch… yes winning is nice but the progress the ball to edge of the box then pass it back 15 times before repeating is just terrible.

 my wife watched as much as she could (still plays women’s league) first comment was how it looks like we’re just doing passing drills all game.

Vs Bournmouth (sep)

On 15/09/2024 at 05:47, CFCCAN said:

Bournemouth a difficult place that can any team up we got 3 points....but really we were sh*te.  If it wasn't for Sanchez we'd be walking home with our tail between our legs.   I'm not sure what is in the water at Cobham but whatever it is it stinks.  For what, 3 - 4 seasons now, under different management we are still seeing this sideways backwards 5-10 yard sh*te going nowhere and when we do finally get in the box it goes to hell in a hand basket.....and speaking of baskets...Jackson needs to be put in a hamper and put out to sea, where he can float around all day...that boy is a basket case of a centre forward.  .

Vs palace (sep)

On 01/09/2024 at 19:16, Ajbod said:

My thoughts exactly, all of them holding on to the ball far too long. Tempo way to slow. Passing througout was slow and inaccurate. I don't care who scores the goals, the attacking unit, need to work as one. If it means running out to take defenders away, then you are doing your part, and contributing to the goal.

Vs Wolves (august)

On 25/08/2024 at 17:32, PhilH930 said:

We have no control today. They need to calm down and play to our strengths. Get the ball wide and into space. 

Vs Manure (august)

On 18/08/2024 at 21:18, Scott Harris said:

Any of you taking positives from that, give your head a wobble. Your standards are on the floor. The Bridge is dead silent, the club feels lifeless and boring, and this is the type of football we have to put up with for yet another season. We are supposed to be one of the top clubs in Premier League football, we're at home, and we haven't even created a genuine chance on goal. It's been sh*t.

45 minutes ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

Thank you for agreeing with everything I said.

Not sure I was necessarily agreeing or disagreeing but one thing the numbers confirm is that he didn’t actually have that many minutes on the pitch even if we were playing fast free flowing football.Indeed 293 minutes out of 1350 is barely over 20%

Edited July 29, 2025Jul 29 by terraloon

Nkunku is a lost cause now, let’s move on.

5 hours ago, nonotnowjim said:

Fast free flowing football? Dont think we did. A few other snippets from the match thread... I think you are misremembering our style.

Vs everton (december)

Vs BRentford (Dec)

Vs forest (Nov):

Vs West Ham (sep)

Vs Bournmouth (sep)

Vs palace (sep)

Vs Wolves (august)

Vs Manure (august)

The highlights are free to watch on YouTube.

Its not worked out.

He has barely played and when he has featured, hes been terrible. A good footballer that is interested will still find a way to show their quality. He has not. Get rid, simple as.

5 hours ago, terraloon said:

Not sure I was necessarily agreeing or disagreeing but one thing the numbers confirm is that he didn’t actually have that many minutes on the pitch even if we were playing fast free flowing football.Indeed 293 minutes out of 1350 is barely over 20%

Because he wasn’t as good as Jackson. Or Palmer. Or Neto. Or the tea lady.

Nkunku has never been world class but he definitely had the potential to be.

It was pretty clear when he signed that he wasn’t a Timo. He was levels above Werner as a player. I was genuinely excited when he signed.

It’s sad that injury has robbed him that development to the point that Werner had a better few years with us than Nkunku did.

Needs somewhere where he plays every week.

Nkunku definitely was not good enough, however he also does not fit our system whatsoever. He needs a big man upfront to play off.

9 hours ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

The highlights are free to watch on YouTube.

Watched the entire games at the time. Dont need to rewatch the slow boring, stagnant and stale possession for the sake of possession.

If highlight videos are your thing, fairly sure that I can find you a highlights video of Nkunku, Mudryk or even perhaps Nicolas Jackson that make them all look like world beaters.

8 hours ago, Clown Lake said:

Nkunku definitely was not good enough, however he also does not fit our system whatsoever. He needs a big man upfront to play off.

Could the same be said for Simons?

24 minutes ago, Adamrb said:

Could the same be said for Simons?

Werner. - Leipzig to Chelsea. Huge success (they don’t call him champions league winning Timo for nothing!)

Nkunku - Leipzig to Chelsea. Huge failure. Never given a chance to thrive

Simons - Leipzig to Chelsea….

23 minutes ago, Adamrb said:

Could the same be said for Simons?

Not really. He is a risk, as are all attacking players from a Bundesliga where defending is optional, but Simons has transformed from a 'golden boy' with tricks and flicks to a really hard-grafting, energetic player. He fits right in either as a wide attacker or in Enzo Fernandez' role as a link player. We've seen the value of a player like this in Bernardo Silva and Dominic Szobozslai, not necessarily the best player on the park but able to make a difference in slow-paced games through sheer energy.

Nkunku has been pony barring that first pre season in the US.

Failed at PSG.

Failed with the Frogs National side.

Stat Padded in the Bundesliga (Questions around wether that can still be classed as a Top 5 European League need to be answered)

Failed at Chelsea.

He’s not World Class. He’s not even Class.

If Nicholas Jackson can keep you out the side, regardless of the system, then you don’t deserve to call yourself a professional footballer.

He should move to a smaller club or an easier league, it’s that simple.

2 hours ago, nonotnowjim said:

Watched the entire games at the time. Dont need to rewatch the slow boring, stagnant and stale possession for the sake of possession.

If highlight videos are your thing, fairly sure that I can find you a highlights video of Nkunku, Mudryk or even perhaps Nicolas Jackson that make them all look like world beaters.

Must have been a few late nights for you staying up to watch those, maybe the tiredness took over and blurred your memory.

Your favourite players are Werner, Nkunku and Felix. I imagine highlight videos are how your formulate a view on a player because it certainly can't be from watching them.