3 minutes ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

Ugochukwu was the most pointless expensive signing. £25m for someone to spend time on loan. Its not like it'll be a massive profit flip either unless he starts pulling up trees on loan. 

So long he is sold above his remaining book value at the time, that is all the club care about. 

I think there is a player there but the injuries have seriously stalled any progression. Age is on his side though. 

35 minutes ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

Ugochukwu was the most pointless expensive signing. £25m for someone to spend time on loan. Its not like it'll be a massive profit flip either unless he starts pulling up trees on loan. 

He was a key part, along with Doku, of the Rennes team that finished 4th. Was a good signing, we just then went and bought 6 other midfielders. 

9 minutes ago, Remodez said:

He was a key part, along with Doku, of the Rennes team that finished 4th. Was a good signing, we just then went and bought 6 other midfielders. 

two very average players

The Santos Kid. . . I guess we are planning on selling 'Butch' Casadei?

Andrey Santos – the GT – the Generational Talent and one for the future. . . we are looking at a season long loan to Portugal as a possibility. Potentially huge talent.

Apparently Barcelona, Strasbourg and Newcastle have asked about his availability on loan. AND a Decision will be taken after pre-season

Bumping this thread because for me this lad is the pilot of the whole project, if it exists.

If this project is a mix of buying emerging talent for profit but also to increase the success of the team on a footballing level, and if we have recruited a project manager that will redefine our style and will develop and improve the players, then here you go Enzo, the original generational Brazilian. 

This was an interesting watch. I don't think this guy has an affinity to Chelsea but I don't know. I just thought it was a good watch which illustrates that the kid possesses a bag of tools that Maresca should be able to turn into a mainstay with our side and could help him to help the team to honours.

For us to get really hot on Paez, Estevao and any others coming along, I really want this lad to be the pilot for it all and to show there is merit to this program. 

 

For what it's worth I think he is a good player, there's a reason Barcelona was interested, I would just be surprised if he actually played for us simply cause there are too many bodies. I think he's good enough to be used as a squad player though but then again I also really like Lesley.

Interested to see him in preseason.  Some noise that Lesley may go on a PL loan, which would be good for dev.  If we are to play 3 mids this season, then we do need 5-6 bodies.  Some won't be pleased with bench time, but we need rotation.  Caicedo, Ezno, Lavia, KDH, Conor and Santos would do for me.  If that is too defensive and Carney can be used in a no.8 role, then I'd rather move on Conor and see what Santos can do.

Whatever happens this kid needs game time in order to develop. Last year was a complete waste given the amount of minutes he got.

4 hours ago, WhiteWall said:

Bumping this thread because for me this lad is the pilot of the whole project, if it exists.

If this project is a mix of buying emerging talent for profit but also to increase the success of the team on a footballing level, and if we have recruited a project manager that will redefine our style and will develop and improve the players, then here you go Enzo, the original generational Brazilian. 

This was an interesting watch. I don't think this guy has an affinity to Chelsea but I don't know. I just thought it was a good watch which illustrates that the kid possesses a bag of tools that Maresca should be able to turn into a mainstay with our side and could help him to help the team to honours.

For us to get really hot on Paez, Estevao and any others coming along, I really want this lad to be the pilot for it all and to show there is merit to this program. 

 

this blokes head is huge 

2 hours ago, PhilH930 said:

Interested to see him in preseason.  Some noise that Lesley may go on a PL loan, which would be good for dev.  If we are to play 3 mids this season, then we do need 5-6 bodies.  Some won't be pleased with bench time, but we need rotation.  Caicedo, Ezno, Lavia, KDH, Conor and Santos would do for me.  If that is too defensive and Carney can be used in a no.8 role, then I'd rather move on Conor and see what Santos can do.

If it must be a PL team I would like to see him at Fulham or Everton given both Paulhina and Onana will probably leave but could be another Forrest situation there. 

Edited July 13, 20242 yr by Remodez

I think we all agree that the PL is different to any  other League in the world.

But how does a young player from abroad develop into a PL player if he is loaned out to foreign teams, sometimes not even getting much playing time anyway?.

Why can't WE develop him by coaching him to play PL football for Chelsea ?, instead of just crossing our fingers and hoping some other club will develope him into a Chelsea player ?

 

 

9 minutes ago, The Rising Sun said:

I think we all agree that the PL is different to any  other League in the world.

But how does a young player from abroad develop into a PL player if he is loaned out to foreign teams, sometimes not even getting much playing time anyway?.

Why can't WE develop him by coaching him to play PL football for Chelsea ?, instead of just crossing our fingers and hoping some other club will develope him into a Chelsea player ?

 

 

Meanwhile the kid that we have been coaching, Sam Rak-Sakhi, is now thinking about his options because of a clear.

If, as it currently seems, this board is intent on buying talent rather than creating it, then we need the likes of Santos, Gabriel, Guiu to be successful because soon there will be nothing coming through that is the quality of Rak-Sakhi, George or Richards.

6 hours ago, WhiteWall said:

Bumping this thread because for me this lad is the pilot of the whole project, if it exists.

If this project is a mix of buying emerging talent for profit but also to increase the success of the team on a footballing level, and if we have recruited a project manager that will redefine our style and will develop and improve the players, then here you go Enzo, the original generational Brazilian. 

This was an interesting watch. I don't think this guy has an affinity to Chelsea but I don't know. I just thought it was a good watch which illustrates that the kid possesses a bag of tools that Maresca should be able to turn into a mainstay with our side and could help him to help the team to honours.

For us to get really hot on Paez, Estevao and any others coming along, I really want this lad to be the pilot for it all and to show there is merit to this program. 

 

 

1 hour ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

this blokes head is huge 

Sry, I couldn't watch it all. It just looked weird him reading his notes placed above the camera. How much is a cheap autocue these days. Piece of glass and a stand! Hahaha, 

1 hour ago, The Rising Sun said:

I think we all agree that the PL is different to any  other League in the world.

But how does a young player from abroad develop into a PL player if he is loaned out to foreign teams, sometimes not even getting much playing time anyway?.

Why can't WE develop him by coaching him to play PL football for Chelsea ?, instead of just crossing our fingers and hoping some other club will develope him into a Chelsea player ?

 

 

I sort of agree, but unfortunately we aren't doing it right or we wouldn't have situations like below. With us he or any other newbie won't get into the first team squad. So it's the case of being on the development team. Which tbh is fine for them to find their feet but they need premier league or at least championship experience too. A loan is a big risk (may or may not get gametime) but I think it's still needed. Even if its just for a short time as part of their integration into the squad. They're just kids at 18...need nurturing, new country, language, club, culture, everything. It just feels harsh if we expect them to compete at chels for the first squad 0 as soon as they arrive.

50 minutes ago, WhiteWall said:

Meanwhile the kid that we have been coaching, Sam Rak-Sakhi, is now thinking about his options because of a clear.

If, as it currently seems, this board is intent on buying talent rather than creating it, then we need the likes of Santos, Gabriel, Guiu to be successful because soon there will be nothing coming through that is the quality of Rak-Sakhi, George or Richards.

Yep, he's a free agent seeing if anyone wants him. Development team don't get much exposure which leads to a good chance of chels resigning him.

Edited July 13, 20242 yr by Simplymo

1 hour ago, The Rising Sun said:

I think we all agree that the PL is different to any  other League in the world.

But how does a young player from abroad develop into a PL player if he is loaned out to foreign teams, sometimes not even getting much playing time anyway?.

Why can't WE develop him by coaching him to play PL football for Chelsea ?, instead of just crossing our fingers and hoping some other club will develope him into a Chelsea player ?

 

 

I don't believe there is anything inherently special about the PL, it is absolutely possible to loan out players to foreign teams for them to be ready for PL. We keep trying to force PL teams to play our youths and this rarely works out.

By all accounts Porto wanted Santos on loan but we went with Forrest instead, decisions like this are what cost us in the long run. Even if the Forrest loan had worked out and he played more often, you still can't beat the stability offered by Porto, CL football and their elite coaching. 

I think the loans need to be set up so that the team taking players, are contractually obliged to play them for a percentage of the season, with a bonus paid for every game they play. Obviously other terms need adding to stop them forcing unfit players to play. Or wearing them out purely for the money.

1 hour ago, Simplymo said:

I sort of agree, but unfortunately we aren't doing it right or we wouldn't have situations like below. With us he or any other newbie won't get into the first team squad. So it's the case of being on the development team. Which tbh is fine for them to find their feet but they need premier league or at least championship experience too. A loan is a big risk (may or may not get gametime) but I think it's still needed. Even if its just for a short time as part of their integration into the squad. They're just kids at 18...need nurturing, new country, language, club, culture, everything. It just feels harsh if we expect them to compete at chels for the first squad 0 as soon as they arrive.

Yep, he's a free agent seeing if anyone wants him. Development team don't get much exposure which leads to a good chance of chels resigning him.

They could play for us in the U18, U21 etc maybe ? Where they could also adapt to a different culture?

In the Chris Robinson video about our Academy etc he agrees that the loan system is necessary because U21 competitions in England are a waste of time because clubs don't take it seriously.

He agrees with Neil Bath that if the PL increased the prize money to say £10million, it would become a competitive League where Young players could play PL style football against each other.

But he says the loan system is very hard to get right

 

12 minutes ago, Ajbod said:

I think the loans need to be set up so that the team taking players, are contractually obliged to play them for a percentage of the season, with a bonus paid for every game they play. Obviously other terms need adding to stop them forcing unfit players to play. Or wearing them out purely for the money.

Any bonus or penalties will never be worth more than a PL club reaching their target, whether that's avoiding relegation or challenging for europe. 

48 minutes ago, Remodez said:

I don't believe there is anything inherently special about the PL, it is absolutely possible to loan out players to foreign teams for them to be ready for PL. We keep trying to force PL teams to play our youths and this rarely works out.

By all accounts Porto wanted Santos on loan but we went with Forrest instead, decisions like this are what cost us in the long run. Even if the Forrest loan had worked out and he played more often, you still can't beat the stability offered by Porto, CL football and their elite coaching. 

But if as you say playing youths in PL football doesn't often work out, but you expect those same players to go away and play regularly for foreign teams straight away, surely that points to a big difference between the PL and others ?

28 minutes ago, The Rising Sun said:

But if as you say playing youths in PL football doesn't often work out, but you expect those same players to go away and play regularly for foreign teams straight away, surely that points to a big difference between the PL and others ?

The difference is the level of competitiveness, not quality as is usually implied. We have seen enough young players come from Portugal and fit right in the PL to not have to force PL loans. 

A team like Forrest is not going to risk relegation playing one of our youths, whereas Porto will have ample opportunities to do so. 

 

4 hours ago, The Rising Sun said:

They could play for us in the U18, U21 etc maybe ? Where they could also adapt to a different culture?

In the Chris Robinson video about our Academy etc he agrees that the loan system is necessary because U21 competitions in England are a waste of time because clubs don't take it seriously.

He agrees with Neil Bath that if the PL increased the prize money to say £10million, it would become a competitive League where Young players could play PL style football against each other.

But he says the loan system is very hard to get right

 

That would be a great idea!

10mil is nothing to get young players ready, double or triple that even. 

Why hasn't it been done?

3 hours ago, Remodez said:

The difference is the level of competitiveness, not quality as is usually implied. We have seen enough young players come from Portugal and fit right in the PL to not have to force PL loans. 

A team like Forrest is not going to risk relegation playing one of our youths, whereas Porto will have ample opportunities to do so. 

 

Very true...

 

I agree...either home or abroad, loans are necessary but really difficult to get right. Maybe we've just been sh*t at it for a few years. Lol

8 hours ago, Simplymo said:

Very true...

 

I agree...either home or abroad, loans are necessary but really difficult to get right. Maybe we've just been sh*t at it for a few years. Lol

You're never gonna get every loan correct but I feel like we've shot ourselves in the foot many times.

12 hours ago, Remodez said:

The difference is the level of competitiveness, not quality as is usually implied. We have seen enough young players come from Portugal and fit right in the PL to not have to force PL loans. 

A team like Forrest is not going to risk relegation playing one of our youths, whereas Porto will have ample opportunities to do so. 

 

He rejected a move to Porto because he wanted to stay in the PL & acclimatise, didn’t work out though. From his latest words he didn’t even expect to sent out on loan when he was signed, but accepted one because we had too many players in the middle of the park.

 

17 hours ago, PhilH930 said:

Interested to see him in preseason.  Some noise that Lesley may go on a PL loan, which would be good for dev.  If we are to play 3 mids this season, then we do need 5-6 bodies.  Some won't be pleased with bench time, but we need rotation.  Caicedo, Ezno, Lavia, KDH, Conor and Santos would do for me.  If that is too defensive and Carney can be used in a no.8 role, then I'd rather move on Conor and see what Santos can do.

No way he sticks around to be sixth man in midfield. His advisors are already saying he needs to play. Look around the top teams in the league who play 4-3-3 &  their 6th body in the middle, you don’t want to be that player.  Arsenal have Fabio Vieira/Smith Rowe, Liverpool have Curtis Jones/Bobby Clark, and City have Rico Lewis as cover

The Twatterati are saying Andrey is going back on loan to Strasbourg for the season.

Good move for the kid.