.... Not the highest benchmark at the moment mind

Those questioning his work rate, did you want Ballack to show more "effort"?

I haven't checked the stats on Ruben but Ballack often had the highest miles covered. It's just that it never looked like he broke stride.

It might be different with Ruben but looks can be decieving.

Still, especially if you're coming on I expect a player to show a bit more urgency, especially if it is a young player who is not established yet.

However he might have done exactly what has been expected from him. 

Those questioning his work rate, did you want Ballack to show more "effort"?

I haven't checked the stats on Ruben but Ballack often had the highest miles covered. It's just that it never looked like he broke stride.

It might be different with Ruben but looks can be decieving.

Agreed!

Problem is he is never going to fit in the 2 & he is not a 10. To get the best out of him you need a runner next to him; a Ramires or Essien-type player. So unless you play 4-3-3 he is pretty useless. This is why Toure and Pogba are divisive players; they look lazy and useless to some.

I don't see the ballack comparison at all.

If people are suggesting rlc looks laid back when he plays then I'd say he is closer to mikel in that respect.

Ballack was the most dominant of MFs, he oozed class, and self confidence, covered the ground like a gazelle, and could score at will, (probably more before he joined us)

Yeh I agree.

He despreately needs to be given a run of 10 games from the start.

IMO When he comes on near the end of a match, he looks like he is scared of making a mistake.

Hopefully the club have given him a massive big contract, because they .........

A.) sincerely and genuinely plan to work out the best position for him to play in and give him a proper regular run in the side as a starter.

Or

B.) they have just given him the big money contract to make sure they get a big transfer fee for him ?!

I hope it's A.) as i want to see a more home grown young players making it into the 1st team instead of selling them on.......and buying mediocre foreign players for circa 15 to 20 million or worse buying our rejects back for double the money !

The sad thing is that we don't as a club know how to develop young players. We just throw them in occasionally and just expect them to perform. When they don't, they don't get near the first team.

Ruben needs a manager that believes in him and is willing to help develop him. Hopefully Conte can bring this to the club.

Yeh I agree.

He despreately needs to be given a run of 10 games from the start.

IMO When he comes on near the end of a match, he looks like he is scared of making a mistake.

Hopefully the club have given him a massive big contract, because they .........

A.) sincerely and genuinely plan to work out the best position for him to play in and give him a proper regular run in the side as a starter.

Or

B.) they have just given him the big money contract to make sure they get a big transfer fee for him ?!

I hope it's A.) as i want to see a more home grown young players making it into the 1st team instead of selling them on.......and buying mediocre foreign players for circa 15 to 20 million or worse buying our rejects back for double the money !

 

 

That is very true. Its far harder for a young player to come on when protecting a slender lead than getting your chance like Traore did from the start. He has had a tendency to play very safe, a good run of starts now would aid his progress in a first team environment without the pressures of winning every game.

I'm getting frustrated with Ruben. Everyone is rooting for him and wants to see him do well. Everyone is trying to make him happy. (Would he have gotten that brilliant new contract if he were anyone else?)

He's letting people down with his attitude. I don't even see major passion for Chelsea.

I don't know what the problem is. If he were lazy, I doubt the youth coaches would have recommended him for promotion. Maybe it's stage fright? Not everyone is a natural in front of crowds. Some people completely clamp up.

I hope he sorts through this, and I hope JT takes him under his wing and guides him there.

What was JT like at age 19?

Edited March 6, 201610 yr by offside

All this comparison with Ballack is way off. So what if he has a languid movement. Ballack was possibly the most natural 2 footed player in the history of the premier league.

What was JT like at age 19?

 

Not held in anywhere near the same regard, sent on loan, almost sold and wouldn't get consistent runs in the side until Ranieri took over when I think he'd have been 20/21.

 

Ruben is suffering almost the same fate as every other youth product in the last decade. No chances. There's a very good chance that the same thing that has happened to other youngsters happens to him, where we change the coach and he just gets lost in the shuffle because that's what we do over and over again.

Not held in anywhere near the same regard, sent on loan, almost sold and wouldn't get consistent runs in the side until Ranieri took over when I think he'd have been 20/21.

Ruben is suffering almost the same fate as every other youth product in the last decade. No chances. There's a very good chance that the same thing that has happened to other youngsters happens to him, where we change the coach and he just gets lost in the shuffle because that's what we do over and over again.

You say it like he was getting runs from the previous coach.

You say it like he was getting runs from the previous coach.

Point is a coach will have a development plan in place for integrating certain youth players.

When we chop and change coaches it sets back that plan and the youth player is back to square one.

It's much harder to develop youth with a revolving door on the manager's office than if you have someone in place for 3+ years who gets to see the players grow.

Point is a coach will have a development plan in place for integrating certain youth players.

/quote]

Was it the same coach whose track record of bringing youth through isn't impressive. Ruben according to reports didn't want to extend his contract under Jose and was looking to leave. Let's not pretend otherwise.

Was it the same coach whose track record of bringing youth through isn't impressive. Ruben according to reports didn't want to extend his contract under Jose and was looking to leave. Let's not pretend otherwise.

That's just speculation with regards to RLC's contract. He's played just as little football under Hiddink and yet he's still signed on for another five years.

But my point wasn't purely about RLC and Mourinho it's about our poor record of youth development in general, we've created an environment that is bad for youth players because of the short termism of our managerial appointments.

Ugh I came across this replay that makes his lack of urgency in that game undeniable. I don't think he could have done anything to prevent the goal, but he could have at least shown his teammates that he wanted to help them out regardless of whether he actually could help.

Ugh I came across this replay that makes his lack of urgency in that game undeniable. I don't think he could have done anything to prevent the goal, but he could have at least shown his teammates that he wanted to help them out regardless of whether he actually could help.

 

But why? In that situation what are you looking for him to do? 

 

So many things go wrong in that video that to focus on Ruben not sprinting back in an effort to 'show his teammates that he wanted to help them out' is a little odd. Willian gives the ball away cheaply and everything goes wrong from there because the full-backs are wildly out of position, Azpi fails to mark Diouf, Courtois doesn't get enough distance on the ball and Mikel (the defensive midfielder) is 20 yards in front of the ball.

 

It's schoolyard errors.

 

In fact the deepest midfielder is Fabregas who makes just as little effort to get back when he should be there. 

All this comparison with Ballack is way off. So what if he has a languid movement. Ballack was possibly the most natural 2 footed player in the history of the premier league.

 

For me the comparison is a simple paradox. If despite his languid style he can't impact a game in the same way Pogba/Ballack can/did then for me he becomes a liability to the team. Harsh I know, and I may be misjudging his potential, but we've already sold Ramires, and seemingly passed up the opportunity to sign Imbula, who else will we miss out on?

Edited March 7, 201610 yr by the special one

That replay there is actually quite shocking to me. Did not notice it during the game and while its not his fault on the first place its says a lot that he just walks back towards our own goal while Stoke is countering. He may get away with that having be the star at u21 level, and maybe he's gotten to used to that but i can imagine any manager would rip him to pieces over that.

But why? In that situation what are you looking for him to do? 

 

So many things go wrong in that video that to focus on Ruben not sprinting back in an effort to 'show his teammates that he wanted to help them out' is a little odd. Willian gives the ball away cheaply and everything goes wrong from there because the full-backs are wildly out of position, Azpi fails to mark Diouf, Courtois doesn't get enough distance on the ball and Mikel (the defensive midfielder) is 20 yards in front of the ball.

 

It's schoolyard errors.

 

In fact the deepest midfielder is Fabregas who makes just as little effort to get back when he should be there.

Just watched it and your so right, where the hell was Mikel in that whole clip, ment to be a DM. What William did to lose the ball was criminal.

Also had a laugh at Iva, hands straight behinds his back lol.

That replay there is actually quite shocking to me. Did not notice it during the game and while its not his fault on the first place its says a lot that he just walks back towards our own goal while Stoke is countering. He may get away with that having be the star at u21 level, and maybe he's gotten to used to that but i can imagine any manager would rip him to pieces over that.

 

As harsh a critic of RLC's potential that I am, he may been given instruction by Guus to play in an advanced position (in which case where the f**k was Mikel going?). If anyone should be criticised it's Guus for subbing Matic at a time when we looked to have the win in the bag.

Edited March 7, 201610 yr by the special one

hmmmm, some people will do their very bets to find fault with Mikel, regardless of anything like the facts!

 

Mikel at fault for the goal, FFS?  Have some self-respect, people.  There are some reasons to be down on Mikel sometimes, but that just ain't one of them in any sane universe.

hmmmm, some people will do their very bets to find fault with Mikel, regardless of anything like the facts!

 

Mikel at fault for the goal, FFS?  Have some self-respect, people.  There are some reasons to be down on Mikel sometimes, but that just ain't one of them in any sane universe.

 

I think Mikel's name has been brought up with another 5 or 6 players as being at fault for the goal, plus the coach's, and by no means was he given the majority of the blame. All that's been asked is why the only defensive midfielder left on the pitch is 20 yards ahead of the ball when we're holding on to a 1-0 lead in the 85th minute. Yes he's looking to provide an outlet for us on the break but is that really the best position for him to be occupying?

hmmmm, some people will do their very bets to find fault with Mikel, regardless of anything like the facts!

 

Mikel at fault for the goal, FFS?  Have some self-respect, people.  There are some reasons to be down on Mikel sometimes, but that just ain't one of them in any sane universe.

If people can be down on RLC then people can be much more down on William, Mikel, Courtouis or Baba being to far up. No one has blamed Mikel for the goal but where was he for a DM, running at the half way line. So he is one of many of players who fault can be found on for that goal.