Are we sure Gol isn't shagging Jorginho?

26 minutes ago, just said:

Slojo my opinion on Jorginho long preceded gol15's death by stats defence of him.

I would also 100% stand by the one trick pony remark. What else can he do other than pass?

A lack of physicality doesn't make you a one trick pony. 

2 hours ago, Gol15 said:

Better than Kovacic that can't even get to play and when he does he does f**king nothing and is benched again. At least with Jorginho starting recently we don't lose the game at half time lmao

Gol15 Gol15! What happened? Are we really back to this? You’d raised your game mightily on here since last season. What’s brought on this relapse? Who cares if some members don’t like Jorginho! It’s pretty daft to get worked up about this stuff and I know we’re all guilty of it (including me) but you take it to a whole other level. Does you no favours. Take a step back man.

13 minutes ago, Dean said:

Gol15 Gol15! What happened? Are we really back to this? You’d raised your game mightily on here since last season. What’s brought on this relapse? Who cares if some members don’t like Jorginho! It’s pretty daft to get worked up about this stuff and I know we’re all guilty of it (including me) but you take it to a whole other level. Does you no favours. Take a step back man.

Had Chilwell's shot gone in, you wouldn't have the chance to read that ugly stuff, I wouldn't be so frustrated and wouldn't react in that way at all, sorry.

Can't wait for Rice to sign in the summer, at least then people won't automatically bash a player after every game won or lost. Horrible fans won't change but Rice is English so there is hope.

16 hours ago, Slojo said:

A lack of physicality doesn't make you a one trick pony. 

No, but if you are decent passer but can't run with the ball, consistently win 50-50 tackles, score goals, win aerial duels, dribble out of tight spaces etc. Then that does make you a one trick pony.

As I said, given the time and the space Jorginho can usually pick a pass. Take that time and space away and he can't.

16 hours ago, Gol15 said:

Horrible fans won't change but Rice is English so there is hope.

I think you need to rethink that, unless you are happy with your blanket statement that you have to be English to be an horrible fan.

9 minutes ago, coco said:

I think you need to rethink that, unless you are happy with your blanket statement that you have to be English to be an horrible fan.

I said that "horrible fans might be more tolerant towards Rice", that doesn't say if all fans are horrible or if only certain ones are. I hope that the majority of fans won't jump on him after every game regardless of the results and I believe that because he's English there is a hope that Rice might not get the same treatment as Jorginho.

This comes from me believing that Jorginho is at the very least partially hated because he had ties with Sarri and because he came from Serie A.

Rice shouldn't be the new scapegoat, so I hope that once he starts playing that people won't be biased against him. But that's just me, I believe that people have been biased against Jorginho and I tried to rationalize why.

So no, I don't think that being from a certain nationality makes you a horrible fan, I think that we all have our biases and that the fact that Jorginho is not your typical Roy Keane DM that the PL is traditionally familiar with, that it doesn't go in his favor, he's perceived as someone that doesn't fit for this league despite being a key player for 2 seasons while we were in transition towards a new generation, if he really wasn't good enough for this league we would have never finished top 3 and top 4 in the previous seasons. 

I'm not going to go into a deep debate about this, but as you say were all bias and have our own preferences, but i can't imagine going on a Chicago Bulls forum and calling them 'horrible' fans because they show bias towards players from Chicago. It's natural.

I blame Jorginho he picked the wrong team and didn’t substitute himself early enough 

22 hours ago, just said:

No, but if you are decent passer but can't run with the ball, consistently win 50-50 tackles, score goals, win aerial duels, dribble out of tight spaces etc. Then that does make you a one trick pony.

As I said, given the time and the space Jorginho can usually pick a pass. Take that time and space away and he can't.

We saw last season and the year before when he was in form, that he could dictate the play, pass the ball very well, had good distribution and retention skills. The main issue is, is that he's slow and he's not a big unit that can compensate his slow pace. 

As soon as he started to get man marked by players we started to see him getting exposed big time, he just couldn't cut it. Last season he was excellent for the first few months, after that dropped off again but we were still vulnerable defensively with him as our deep midfielder for obvious reasons. 

He's not what I would call a one trick pony personally. But it's a silly debate anyway, we both agree on one thing, he isn't good enough for us anymore and should be on his way out asap. 

Edited December 30, 20205 yr by Slojo

On 30/12/2020 at 12:13, Slojo said:

We saw last season and the year before when he was in form, that he could dictate the play, pass the ball very well, had good distribution and retention skills. The main issue is, is that he's slow and he's not a big unit that can compensate his slow pace. 

As soon as he started to get man marked by players we started to see him getting exposed big time, he just couldn't cut it. Last season he was excellent for the first few months, after that dropped off again but we were still vulnerable defensively with him as our deep midfielder for obvious reasons. 

He's not what I would call a one trick pony personally. But it's a silly debate anyway, we both agree on one thing, he isn't good enough for us anymore and should be on his way out asap. 

I thought with Jorginho being marked when Luiz played we had an outlet for the long ball and the other was Kovacic dribbling past two lines of the opposition.

I'm a little perplexed recently with Kante and Kovacic playing why Mount is not in the middle offering himself more for shots.

It always seems he is busy closing down opposition players instead of being the attacking midfielder.

Not sure if this is tactical or our midfield is just not fit enough.

22 minutes ago, Strider6003 said:

I thought with Jorginho being marked when Luiz played we had an outlet for the long ball and the other was Kovacic dribbling past two lines of the opposition.

I'm a little perplexed recently with Kante and Kovacic playing why Mount is not in the middle offering himself more for shots.

It always seems he is busy closing down opposition players instead of being the attacking midfielder.

Not sure if this is tactical or our midfield is just not fit enough.

Kovacic for his abillities doesn't use them enough. Good passer of the ball, good dribbler, but he doesn't seem to utilise them going forward and I have no idea why. It seems to be a mental block in his head, Hazard was quite similar in some instances where he could've scored far more goals if he chose to take more risks. Because I remember Sanchez who was half the player Hazard was in ability, would get more goals than Hazard because he was constantly playing more direct and trying to score goals. Hazard on the other hand, would look for the pass or try to keep possession, even though he could turn players inside out. 

Kovacic we've seen him turn players inside out with his dribbling, we've also seen him put in inch perfect balls across the field but he won't take the risks. Mount also seems to be going that way as well, it's obviously something to do with the coaching. 

Oh so close!!! Nearly, nearly, nearly out the door but now he's back in the room with the best seat in the lounge and the TV remote in his hand.

Let's delete the last 102 pages and do it all over again. You know you want to.

Bet Billy Gilmour's mum isn't happy. Bet Brutos is delighted.

Edited January 27, 20215 yr by just

Page 1.

Well, hhhmmm. Errrr. OK, let's start with the worst players from the Italian leagues to ever play for us. Christian Panucci. Juan Cuadrado. Gabriele Ambrosetti. Jorginho.

 

95% pass accuracy, world class simulation to get an opponent booked. 10/10 man of the match

How many games until he gets exposed again for his lack of pace and strength?

Edited January 27, 20215 yr by jack_super_class

Tuchel broke the record for most passes made and highest possession ever recorded for a first match of any manager in PL history.

After 1 training session 78.9% possession, Jorginho has now 6 clean sheets in 12 games played  Even Kovacic is back he made the most dribbles today... If only Lampard kept the 2 of them as the 6's... But what's done is done.

Hopefully its kante and mount back as soon as possible and business as usual. Watching jorginho in midfield reminder me of the dross we had to watch under sarri.

Another thing sprung to mind just now, he finds himself on the wing in an early crossing position and instead of looking if the cross is on he's looking if he could pass backwards to the wingback or sideways into midfield..

Something he regularly does is return the ball straight back to a player who has been closed down and under pressure from opponents in a tight space and has passed to Jorginho to retain the ball and buy a bit of space and time to try and free themselves from the press. Jorgy doesn't care, and he's incapable of turning with the ball, so he just fires the 8 yard wall pass straight back at them and we lose the ball.

Drives me frickin nuts, but for the stats it shows up as another completed pass on his match pass percentage so I guess it keeps Gol happy.

 

54 minutes ago, Gol15 said:

Tuchel broke the record for most passes made and highest possession ever recorded for a first match of any manager in PL history.

After 1 training session 78.9% possession, Jorginho has now 6 clean sheets in 12 games played  Even Kovacic is back he made the most dribbles today... If only Lampard kept the 2 of them as the 6's... But what's done is done.

Well, if we got Wenger instead of Tuchel we'd probably have even surpassed those metrics while still collecting just the one point.

 

Im not digging at Tuchel as he literally just got here.....Im just beyond amused at those who think we saw something tangibly different on the pitch today from what was happening before Tuchel got here..... I guess a lot more touches to get to the same result?

 

Edit: and by same result I don't mean just the draw, but the uninspiring performance.

Edited January 27, 20215 yr by Barry Bridges

Certainly was not the worst of our lot today. 

14 minutes ago, Barry Bridges said:

 

Well, if we got Wenger instead of Tuchel we'd probably have even surpassed those metrics while still collecting just the one point.

 

Im not digging at Tuchel as he literally just got here.....Im just beyond amused at those who think we saw something tangibly different on the pitch today from what was happening before Tuchel got here..... I guess a lot more touches to get to the same result?

 

Edit: and by same result I don't mean just the draw, but the uninspiring performance.

 

Jorginho to Mount ---> Mount to Tammy --> 1:0 win. Sadly Tammy stopped running there for a sec and missed out on an easy tap in.

This is very similar to Kovacic to Havertz ---> Havertz to Chilwell --> 1:0 win, but Chilwell couldn't put it on target.

 

17 minutes ago, Gol15 said:

 

Jorginho to Mount ---> Mount to Tammy --> 1:0 win. Sadly Tammy stopped running there for a sec and missed out on an easy tap in.

This is very similar to Kovacic to Havertz ---> Havertz to Chilwell --> 1:0 win, but Chilwell couldn't put it on target.

 

Jorginho's pass to Mount was just a pass, Mount turned it into an opening by cleverly backing up between two defenders. Tammy went for the cutback which probably was the right choice as the defenders left him, Mason was trying to find Havertz, should of passed it to Tammy.