1 hour ago, strider6004 said:

Currently see us struggling to get more than £35m for him. 

He looks overweight and is playing badly and is 29 in a month or so. 

He is a gamble.

The moment he starts scoring a few that changes the fee goes up.................

Trade him to Barca for De Jong. Sorted.

4 hours ago, Kantesmini said:

Barcelona will turn to Chelsea's Romelu Lukaku, 28, in their search for a striker. The Belgium centre-forward is believed to be Barca's 'plan C' after moves for Norway's Erling Haaland, 21, and Poland's Robert Lewandowski, 33, were thwarted. (Marca)

Plan C for them sounds good at this point 

10 minutes ago, Gol15 said:

Plan C for them sounds good at this point 

If real have our no 1 stiker as their third choice to buy I think this offers us an easy issue to identify and solve - We must stop buying sh1t players!

Our attackers would flourish in another system so if they go into the other team that use real forward or with creative midfielder.

our system is good defence but it needs good wb there is no place for a real striker because He needs to creat his own chance.

I see lukaku scoring everywhere also timo if you give them someone who can see their runs.

Edited May 2, 20224 yr by Hall

On 30/04/2022 at 20:02, Kantesmini said:

If real have our no 1 stiker as their third choice to buy I think this offers us an easy issue to identify and solve - We must stop buying sh1t players!

our no1 striker who can't get in the team. 

9 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

our no1 striker who can't get in the team. 

To be fair it's clear that the reason for that goes beyond his play.

 

Don't get me wrong he screwed himself over with that interview, no one to blame for that but himself.  But the reason he gets so few minutes mostly stems from that interview and the fall out from it.  

 

Because it makes very little sense to me that Lukaku would not be in the line-up in situations where you expect to see a crowded box.  If the game is a fast paced end to end game I agree Lukaku just slows you down and is a liability.  But if the other team is just going to sit in the box and counter attack on occasion he's probably the person who should be playing up top.  

The interview did Lukaku no favours yet is not the reason he has failed.

He has failed because he is too static and his control is too poor for our system of football.

Despite the interview if he started scoring regularly he would be first choice.

Now his mindset might have convinced him he can't make it here so is not bothered about not playing and when he does only plays half-hearted.

I don't think so yet just think his attributes don't suit the team.  

 

9 hours ago, strider6004 said:

The interview did Lukaku no favours yet is not the reason he has failed.

He has failed because he is too static and his control is too poor for our system of football.

Despite the interview if he started scoring regularly he would be first choice.

Now his mindset might have convinced him he can't make it here so is not bothered about not playing and when he does only plays half-hearted.

I don't think so yet just think his attributes don't suit the team.  

 

If his control is the problem then try to pass him in the way that it wouldn’t be a problem : barella , debruyne, hakimi , lautario , …know how to find him. if you know how to use him , he will be a tool for your team ( inter, belgium, everton)Who do we have to do this ? …. Kovacevic, Ben, and james(this season 2 are injured)It’s a job for a coach to use the playerd @ your disposal to the best of their abilities. NOT to point their weak aspect of the game.

a good coach works and try to improve their players and not only the system( you can pass backward all days they won’t score and maybe you would win by 1-0)boring football.

Every real strikers would fail overhere and if we bring the young lads back from loan and keep playing this system then soon they also gonna look like sh** and who we gonna blame this time?
it’s not a popular opinion but why not hire an attacking coach.

during Frank :we are good attacking and bad defending

Tuchel in the beginning :good defending 

Tuchel now: bad defending with many errors and bad attacking no confidence @  all.

players  drop a lot in value : pulisic,timo,lukaku,ziyech and chalobah

2 hours ago, Hall said:

If his control is the problem then try to pass him in the way that it wouldn’t be a problem : barella , debruyne, hakimi , lautario , …know how to find him. if you know how to use him , he will be a tool for your team ( inter, belgium, everton)Who do we have to do this ? …. Kovacevic, Ben, and james(this season 2 are injured)It’s a job for a coach to use the playerd @ your disposal to the best of their abilities. NOT to point their weak aspect of the game.

a good coach works and try to improve their players and not only the system( you can pass backward all days they won’t score and maybe you would win by 1-0)boring football.

Every real strikers would fail overhere and if we bring the young lads back from loan and keep playing this system then soon they also gonna look like sh** and who we gonna blame this time?
it’s not a popular opinion but why not hire an attacking coach.

during Frank :we are good attacking and bad defending

Tuchel in the beginning :good defending 

Tuchel now: bad defending with many errors and bad attacking no confidence @  all.

players  drop a lot in value : pulisic,timo,lukaku,ziyech and chalobah

It all comes down to 1 question, which is the same has been raised with Timo.

Should a manager build a team around a player with a very limited skill set in order to get the best out of him, or should a player adapt first to the teams system and let the style of play evolve over time?

With Rom, you have a player who has shown very little. No goals, poor first touch, bad passing, bad work rate, bad attitude, bad decision making etc. Should rom address those first before we build a team around him, or should a manager accept that Rom is a lazy buffet raider and build the team around him from the start. 

What comes first, the chicken or the egg?

3 hours ago, Hall said:

If his control is the problem then try to pass him in the way that it wouldn’t be a problem : barella , debruyne, hakimi , lautario , …know how to find him. if you know how to use him , he will be a tool for your team ( inter, belgium, everton)Who do we have to do this ? …. Kovacevic, Ben, and james(this season 2 are injured)It’s a job for a coach to use the playerd @ your disposal to the best of their abilities. NOT to point their weak aspect of the game.

a good coach works and try to improve their players and not only the system( you can pass backward all days they won’t score and maybe you would win by 1-0)boring football.

Every real strikers would fail overhere and if we bring the young lads back from loan and keep playing this system then soon they also gonna look like sh** and who we gonna blame this time?
it’s not a popular opinion but why not hire an attacking coach.

during Frank :we are good attacking and bad defending

Tuchel in the beginning :good defending 

Tuchel now: bad defending with many errors and bad attacking no confidence @  all.

players  drop a lot in value : pulisic,timo,lukaku,ziyech and chalobah

Inter played with Lukaku on the counter with balls in behind, Chelsea don't do that and i certainly don't want to see us do that. I prefer us as a team that tries to control the game. 

As for saying Tuchel can't coach an attacking brand of football, that's complete bollocks. Take the Utd game for example, he coached a 4-0, but the players on the pitch missed chances. Same again with Everton, plenty of good chances but Pickford had a worldie. 

Chelsea v Utd we have an xG of 1.96 compared to their 0.54.

Chelsea v Everton we have an xG of 1.53 compared to their 0.92. 

Tuchel's game plan isn't the issue, individual errors are. Ship Lukaku back to a small team where he can play on the counter and flourish. 

1 hour ago, nonotnowjim said:

Should a manager build a team around a player with a very limited skill set in order to get the best out of him, or should a player adapt first to the teams system and let the style of play evolve over time?

 

The more important question is should a  manager build to minimize player weakness or maximize strength? 

2 hours ago, nonotnowjim said:

It all comes down to 1 question, which is the same has been raised with Timo.

Should a manager build a team around a player with a very limited skill set in order to get the best out of him, or should a player adapt first to the teams system and let the style of play evolve over time?

With Rom, you have a player who has shown very little. No goals, poor first touch, bad passing, bad work rate, bad attitude, bad decision making etc. Should rom address those first before we build a team around him, or should a manager accept that Rom is a lazy buffet raider and build the team around him from the start. 

What comes first, the chicken or the egg?

Then why you keep buying this type of player or agree to sign himand pay this much. Then wanted to adjust to your way of playing?

you do that young player or cheap player not for this price tag. So sorry so this is the coach or club to blame. If You buy Ronaldo and ask him to play wide forward sorry this won’t work also. 
 

Ps if you 100m for a player would try to use his capabilities or playing the way you do and feeling frustrated when he can control a ball or bad touches.

 

you paid for 100 m goal scorer but you dont give the ball to him or find his movement then sorry you can’t blame him here.

noone doubt that lukaku in front of a goal is letal. You you have to get the ball there first

Edited May 3, 20224 yr by Hall

37 minutes ago, Hall said:

Then why you keep buying this type of player or agree to sign himand pay this much. Then wanted to adjust to your way of playing?

you do that young player or cheap player not for this price tag. So sorry so this is the coach or club to blame. If You buy Ronaldo and ask him to play wide forward sorry this won’t work also. 
 

Ps if you 100m for a player would try to use his capabilities or playing the way you do and feeling frustrated when he can control a ball or bad touches.

 

you paid for 100 m goal scorer but you dont give the ball to him or find his movement then sorry you can’t blame him here.

noone doubt that lukaku in front of a goal is letal. You you have to get the ball there first

Lukaku is not lethal in front of goal for a big team. Flourishes for a small team. 

5 hours ago, Hall said:

If his control is the problem then try to pass him in the way that it wouldn’t be a problem

If he needs perfect conditions to do the basics of football then he's a fundamentally sh*t footballer who doesn't belong at this level.

49 minutes ago, Hall said:

If You buy Ronaldo and ask him to play wide forward sorry this won’t work also. 

You mean the same Ronaldo who played wide forward for Real and broke the PL scoring record from the wing?

Actual world class players do it under any system, any manager, any circumstances.

51 minutes ago, Hall said:

Ps if you 100m for a player would try to use his capabilities or playing the way you do and feeling frustrated when he can control a ball or bad touches.

He thinks he's as good as Lewandowski, Kane, Suarez and Benzema.

Those would deliver in any system, he's set his own standards.

9 minutes ago, Argo said:

You mean the same Ronaldo who played wide forward for Real and broke the PL scoring record from the wing?

Actual world class players do it under any system, any manager, any circumstances.

He thinks he's as good as Lewandowski, Kane, Suarez and Benzema.

Those would deliver in any system, he's set his own standards.

Then why don’t Man u use him as wide forward now? Because is another kinda player now not the same speed / workrate. You bought Lukaku for goals not for fancy dribbels or tikka takka style. He wasn’t know for workrate we needed goals. We got forward with workrate Timo but he can’t finish. You wanted goals from him but don’t find him when he move into the channel or he move away from his defenders then sorry. So i blame tuchel on this. As good as he is defence the poor is his attacking playbook.

if tuchel decides what he want and know how to use him or new strikers in this role then everyone will fail @ chelsea.

1 hour ago, Hall said:

Then why you keep buying this type of player or agree to sign himand pay this much. Then wanted to adjust to your way of playing?

you do that young player or cheap player not for this price tag. So sorry so this is the coach or club to blame. If You buy Ronaldo and ask him to play wide forward sorry this won’t work also. 
 

The only reason why Ronaldo gets to walk in any team and play where he wants is because he’s that good.

The signing pricetag of Lukaku doesn’t reflect his overall skill as a player nor does it reflect about him as a teammate either since he isn’t a big presence in the dressing room.

Messi was earning huge money in Barcelona in the recent years but when it all comes down to it he was only capable of getting results against weaker teams so it wasn’t worth it to almost go broke because of it.

Lukaku is plan C for Barcelona now, they take 2 players ahead of him. We made the mistake of having him as our plan B and we didn’t dodge that bullet that has been hurting.

6 minutes ago, Hall said:

You bought Lukaku for goals not for fancy dribbels or tikka takka style.

Yep and if he was the world class forward he himself claims to be he'd have got them despite the issues around him.

Ronaldo played in an absolute wretched team performance against us yet guess what? Soon as he sniffed an opening the ball was in our net.

Benzema (a player this guy thinks he's on par with) fed on absolute scraps against us at The Bernabeu and guess what? He still scored the decisive goal. 

Funny how the same players haven't stopped Kai having 50+ touches a game and scoring goals when he's played up top isn't it?

42 minutes ago, Argo said:

Yep and if he was the world class forward he himself claims to be he'd have got them despite the issues around him.

Ronaldo played in an absolute wretched team performance against us yet guess what? Soon as he sniffed an opening the ball was in our net.

Benzema (a player this guy thinks he's on par with) fed on absolute scraps against us at The Bernabeu and guess what? He still scored the decisive goal. 

Funny how the same players haven't stopped Kai having 50+ touches a game and scoring goals when he's played up top isn't it?

Comparing Lukaku to Ronaldo is cringe at this point, similarly to the level of comparing D.Costa to Werner.

They have nothing in common, totally different mentality and the skill difference is so huge that I was relieved that Man City wanting Ronaldo at the start of the season ended when SAF made a phone call.

Lukaku couldn't even contribute as a super sub for us in the later part of this season! There is no excuse for him!

Edited May 3, 20224 yr by Gol15

2 hours ago, Gol15 said:

The only reason why Ronaldo gets to walk in any team and play where he wants is because he’s that good.

The signing pricetag of Lukaku doesn’t reflect his overall skill as a player nor does it reflect about him as a teammate either since he isn’t a big presence in the dressing room.

Messi was earning huge money in Barcelona in the recent years but when it all comes down to it he was only capable of getting results against weaker teams so it wasn’t worth it to almost go broke because of it.

Lukaku is plan C for Barcelona now, they take 2 players ahead of him. We made the mistake of having him as our plan B and we didn’t dodge that bullet that has been hurting.

The pricetag is what chelsea want to pay for him. If Chelsea has scouted or Tuchel watch him play you know what you have bought.

You don’t go buy a house without checking everything inside also. 
 

Lukaku has his playing style. He is at a age that know what he can do and don’t.

eather you sell him and take a big loss or stop complaining about his pricetag and workrate.

there are enought clubs out there that would like to buy him @ discount price and know how to use him correctly.

this mistake is from the board and tuchel so learn to live with it or complain to the club.

What you're seeing here in this debate is part of the reason we need a new ownership model change. Recently we've only asked he manager what type of player he needs and looked to get 2nd, 3rd or even 4th choice targets.

Often these targets are completely different stylistically to the number 1 target who the manager wanted for a specific role in the team. 

Haaland was the number 1 target last summer we failed to sign him and saw Lukaku as the next best thing.

This is the issue, from now on the board needs to follow the Klopp and Pep approach which is just give Tuchel whoever he wants. It's a risk if say we let him go but imo he should get 5 years here. If he can achieve 3 trophies in one year how many can he acquire in a sustained period with his own players. 

Signing Lukaku may have been a mistake but a valuable lesson for the new owners to see, they can learn from our failure to recruit players that suit Tuchel's intended style. The board should have backed TT and signed Koundé they didn't and now we risk losing 4 defenders this summer if not more. 

Pep and Klopp both constructed their teams in different ways. Klopp acquired the necessary pieces over various windows, as did Pep except he got much more players across the various transfer windows. 

Essentially we have to do what City did after Pep's first season they gave him the fullbacks to play his style. Now we need to give Tuchel the cbs to play his. If he wants a dm get him the one he wants. Or the scouts do their actual jobs and identify players based of a set criteria that actual equates to what the squad needs. 

One of three outcomes will happen regarding Lukaku, he goes on loan, someone buys him and we sell at a loss or he stays. If he stays he can still be useful but a change in shape would be needed.

18 minutes ago, Hall said:

this mistake is from the board and tuchel so learn to live with it or complain to the club.

When he talks like this, gives himself a workrate exception like he Hazard and still doesn't deliver then he's fair game for some well earned stick.

The "blame the club not the player" line only works if he's humble and works hard, neither apply to him.

4 hours ago, LongtimerLurker said:

What you're seeing here in this debate is part of the reason we need a new ownership model change. Recently we've only asked he manager what type of player he needs and looked to get 2nd, 3rd or even 4th choice targets.

Often these targets are completely different stylistically to the number 1 target who the manager wanted for a specific role in the team. 

Haaland was the number 1 target last summer we failed to sign him and saw Lukaku as the next best thing.

This is the issue, from now on the board needs to follow the Klopp and Pep approach which is just give Tuchel whoever he wants. It's a risk if say we let him go but imo he should get 5 years here. If he can achieve 3 trophies in one year how many can he acquire in a sustained period with his own players. 

Signing Lukaku may have been a mistake but a valuable lesson for the new owners to see, they can learn from our failure to recruit players that suit Tuchel's intended style. The board should have backed TT and signed Koundé they didn't and now we risk losing 4 defenders this summer if not more. 

Pep and Klopp both constructed their teams in different ways. Klopp acquired the necessary pieces over various windows, as did Pep except he got much more players across the various transfer windows. 

Essentially we have to do what City did after Pep's first season they gave him the fullbacks to play his style. Now we need to give Tuchel the cbs to play his. If he wants a dm get him the one he wants. Or the scouts do their actual jobs and identify players based of a set criteria that actual equates to what the squad needs. 

One of three outcomes will happen regarding Lukaku, he goes on loan, someone buys him and we sell at a loss or he stays. If he stays he can still be useful but a change in shape would be needed.

Partially agree on that. What if tuchel want hakimi on the lb ( 100m now) and rice as dm (100m) and haaland another 150 m with wages and new central defender delight another 100m. You know they can only buy him only 1 player.  You know that this won’t be possible and he have to use the player that he have at their best abilities. This year we rarely use player on their best position : pulisic as wingback or azpi as wingback when you have reece.

 

2 hours ago, Hall said:

Partially agree on that. What if tuchel want hakimi on the lb ( 100m now) and rice as dm (100m) and haaland another 150 m with wages and new central defender delight another 100m. You know they can only buy him only 1 player.  You know that this won’t be possible and he have to use the player that he have at their best abilities. This year we rarely use player on their best position : pulisic as wingback or azpi as wingback when you have reece.

 

He'll probably never admit it publicly but signing Lukaku for a £100m and letting Tammy go was a mistake. His main issue with Tammy was his hold up play and first touch, yet he could have been coached to do these better.

If Mourinho wanted him that suggests he was more than capable to be a starting number 9, say what you want about Jose but he doesn't not play mediocre players, his club might sign them but he won't play you if he doesn't rate you.