The stronger  teams are tending to win the penalty shootouts. They are stronger mentally and technically better. By the standards of all the other penalties in that shootout Akanji’s effort was pretty soft. 
 

overall the standard of penalty shooting has improved and the restrictions on goalies has made it that bit easier. 

6 hours ago, Simplymo said:

I agree with @Scott Harris 100% but I do think England needed Southgate in the beginning. They needed the unity they have now compared to before when they couldnt stand each other. I honestly think we needed that but i also think it went too far.

We needed a proper tactical coach with gareth joining the FA as some type of "player health and management director" to keep the unity going (really good man manager, the players will run through walls for). But more importantly, once his job was done, we needed a modern tactical coach of the likes of Pep, klopp, tuchel, etc...someone that can lay down the tactical work for the actual games.

 

Another way of looking at it...The players won those games. Southgate only coached the "mental" side of things. Which is still a big part of being the coach but not the rest of it.

I agree. I backed Southgate in the beginning, England had a good World Cup for a young side, but they never got better from there and really needed a proper coach to get the best out of them. The last world cup, the Nations League and the current Euro's are more than enough evidence that the FA should have got somebody else in after the Euro's in 2021.

5 hours ago, axman2526 said:

Don't you think that is maybe the fault of our mindsets though, how we were brought up to view the national side?

I mean when I was a lad then going on teenager the expectation was England should beat anybody, and we should do it while playing with Brazilian dominance. 

 

That was the attitude from those i went to schools, college and university with. We made this sport, we own it, we are the best, we have the best league and everyone should be made to tremble before us.

When you're one of the top nations in world football, producing some of the best footballers every generation, playing in the top league in world football, you should have a winning mindset. We're the only nation in world football that produces this level of quality and fails to put in good performances in international competition. No other nation that produces this level of quality would accept it, so I don't see why we should.

English players don't play like this in international tournaments because they don't have the quality, it's something else stopping them, and that something else right now is Southgate. When Southgate throws his tactics out of the window because it's failed him once again, England find something and come up with a moment to score a goal, just like Bellingham did against Slovakia, and just like Saka did against Switzerland. Once you remove Southgate's tactics, it's like a sense of relief for these players. They all play in attacking teams, so stop being so cautious and let them attack.

Edited July 7, 20242 yr by Scott Harris

Southgate will go back to the same formation used in the first 4 games, Guehi will come back and maybe Shaw, no other changes

Southgate isn’t a good manager but a lucky one.  He’s managed to get the easy side of the draw in basically every tournament. The only top teams he’s faced in 4 tournaments are Croatia, Belgium, Italy and France and lost all of them.  He’s yet to beat a top side.  
 

I’m grateful for the way he’s changed the culture in the nation side as it was a necessity.  But after the defeat to Italy I said we needed to move on.  While I got some funny looks at the time I think most are in full agreement now.  Due to the nicely fallen fixtures we will probably get to another final but lose again.  I have no faith in Southgate setting up a team to beat a team like Spain.

Southgate bashing is beyond stupid (present company respected and accepted) 

Let’s say we are likely to choose a new manager after this tournament whatever happens any one would bite their hands off for his record 3 semis and 1 final it is mind blowing 🤯 

I think two scenarios 

1. he wins it, then tells us to stick it up our arse 

2.  We lose at some point and he stoically resigns  

It is irrelevant who he picks and the tactics he employs - if I asked all of you, you would come up with something different 

Get behind him, get behind your country - look at the Dutch (alright Valarie 😜) - ok it’s become a bit annoying now, but bang average team,  they have created an atmosphere, I liken  it very much to Euro ‘96 

get behind your manager and team and who knows we might do it this time 

It pains me to see the press conferences where the manager and players are defending themselves the whole time 

get behind them all - Come on England 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 

32 minutes ago, andy said:

Southgate bashing is beyond stupid (present company respected and accepted) 

Let’s say we are likely to choose a new manager after this tournament whatever happens any one would bite their hands off for his record 3 semis and 1 final it is mind blowing 🤯 

I think two scenarios 

1. he wins it, then tells us to stick it up our arse 

2.  We lose at some point and he stoically resigns  

It is irrelevant who he picks and the tactics he employs - if I asked all of you, you would come up with something different 

Get behind him, get behind your country - look at the Dutch (alright Valarie 😜) - ok it’s become a bit annoying now, but bang average team,  they have created an atmosphere, I liken  it very much to Euro ‘96 

get behind your manager and team and who knows we might do it this time 

It pains me to see the press conferences where the manager and players are defending themselves the whole time 

get behind them all - Come on England 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 

I think any other manaager with the talent at his disposal should have won a competition from 3 semis and 1 final. Southgate has the winning ethic of a spurs manager.

1. Will welcome Gareth Southgate's resignation if he wins or bottles it like a spud. I would have gladly welcomed his resignation after any of the last few competitions. 

2. we lose and he can f*ck off faster. 

Well behind the team but the players have carried the gaffer. 

 

8 hours ago, Scott Harris said:

When you're one of the top nations in world football, producing some of the best footballers every generation, playing in the top league in world football, you should have a winning mindset. We're the only nation in world football that produces this level of quality and fails to put in good performances in international competition. No other nation that produces this level of quality would accept it, so I don't see why we should.

English players don't play like this in international tournaments because they don't have the quality, it's something else stopping them, and that something else right now is Southgate. When Southgate throws his tactics out of the window because it's failed him once again, England find something and come up with a moment to score a goal, just like Bellingham did against Slovakia, and just like Saka did against Switzerland. Once you remove Southgate's tactics, it's like a sense of relief for these players. They all play in attacking teams, so stop being so cautious and let them attack.

Is it always the manager then? England have had wonderful players for longer than I have been alive, yet a single world cup to show for it. Has it always been that, since Sir Alf, none of the managers had a clue?

England currently play a system that is working well, but does nothing. Then they go a goal behind and play no system and just rely on the fact that they have outstanding individually talented players. This is it.

Tactics. Strategy. Plan. Yeah, we do not really have that

Lewis just beat Max, over you Gareth don’t screw this up!!!

3 hours ago, axman2526 said:

Is it always the manager then? England have had wonderful players for longer than I have been alive, yet a single world cup to show for it. Has it always been that, since Sir Alf, none of the managers had a clue?

Not always, but in a lot of cases it is. Sven and Capello failed because they kept trying to shoehorn the best players into the team, every squad from that era lacked balance. Steve McClaren was always well out of his depth, same goes for Hodgson and Southgate. We have also heard stories about the toxic environment the players from the so called golden generation went through, and this was the case with squads in the 90's too. Players that were rivals never got along and couldn't leave that rivalry at home. I can't explain what happened in the 70's, 80's and most of the 90's because I wasn't born or was too young to remember. I also think England have been on the end of some horrible luck at times, like Campbell's very odd disallowed goal against Portugal in 2004, Lampard's goal that was never given in 2010 in the World Cup, and of course the hand of god in 86.

I have always said that the ones at fault the most are the FA. They never look for the right coach that fits the current generation of players we have, it's not something that crosses their mind. The one and only thing they look for is a coach that won't hurt their image. Personally, I prefer managers with a bit of personality to them to go alongside their good coaching, but the FA doesn't want that. The FA wants bland and boring.

Edited July 7, 20242 yr by Scott Harris

24 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

Not always, but in a lot of cases it is. Sven and Capello failed because they kept trying to shoehorn the best players into the team, every squad from that era lacked balance. Steve McClaren was always well out of his depth, same goes for Hodgson and Southgate. We have also heard stories about the toxic environment the players from the so called golden generation went through, and this was the case with squads in the 90's too. Players that were rivals never got along and couldn't leave that rivalry at home. I can't explain what happened in the 70's, 80's and most of the 90's because I wasn't born or was too young to remember. I also think England have been on the end of some horrible luck at times, like Campbell's very odd disallowed goal against Portugal in 2004, Lampard's goal that was never given in 2010 in the World Cup, and of course the hand of god in 86.

I have always said that the ones at fault the most are the FA. They never look for the right coach that fits the current generation of players we have, it's not something that crosses their mind. The one and only thing they look for is a coach that won't hurt their image. Personally, I prefer managers with a bit of personality to them to go alongside their good coaching, but the FA doesn't want that. The FA wants bland and boring.

Tommy Tuchel still needs a job. If you get your wish and Southgate goes, think the FA would appoint a German.

3 hours ago, axman2526 said:

Is it always the manager then? England have had wonderful players for longer than I have been alive, yet a single world cup to show for it. Has it always been that, since Sir Alf, none of the managers had a clue?

I largely agree. Umpteen managers employing diffèrent styles, yet no tournament wins for 56 years. I think individually and in terms of squad depth this is the best group we’ve had, yet we still appear robotic and clumsy- technically we always seem lacking despite the players being technically adept when turning out for their clubs- would employing say Pep - end of the rainbow- make any difference?- they’re just something about the tempo of tournament football which doesn’t play to our strengths IMO, and yet we continue to plod along at international football speed, manager after manager, tournament after tournament 

 

 

3 hours ago, axman2526 said:

Tommy Tuchel still needs a job. If you get your wish and Southgate goes, think the FA would appoint a German.

I would take him in a heartbeat, the FA wouldn't dare though. Too much of a personality.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/article/2024/jul/07/marc-cucurella-spain-euro-2024-football

Cucurella came into his own in the away game v Villa and has stood out since then. The guy has so much energy and commitment, I'm very much a fan now.

Southgate really riding his luck again Saturday and somehow we are in the semi finals.

Great penalties and we did play better but that second half was getting worse and suddenly we're 1-0 down and he hadn't made any changes. The way we were playing second half,  was crying out for changes and some fresh legs but he doesn't do anything until we're 1-0 down and he gives them a miserly 15 minutes to make an impact. He needs to be more proactive but it ain't ever gonna happen. We could really do with Kane getting injured or picking up a bug as we're playing with 10 men and we'd be so much better off with Toney or Watkins but Southgate is never gonna drop Kane.

Will our luck hold out against the Dutch..................?

 

I suppose it will come down to who is the most bottle-y: a team with Morata as their captain or a team with Harry Kane as their captain. 

On 07/07/2024 at 07:00, Scott Harris said:

When you're one of the top nations in world football, producing some of the best footballers every generation, playing in the top league in world football, you should have a winning mindset. We're the only nation in world football that produces this level of quality and fails to put in good performances in international competition. No other nation that produces this level of quality would accept it, so I don't see why we should.

English players don't play like this in international tournaments because they don't have the quality, it's something else stopping them, and that something else right now is Southgate. When Southgate throws his tactics out of the window because it's failed him once again, England find something and come up with a moment to score a goal, just like Bellingham did against Slovakia, and just like Saka did against Switzerland. Once you remove Southgate's tactics, it's like a sense of relief for these players. They all play in attacking teams, so stop being so cautious and let them attack.

Have you not watched France in the past year or so, I would argue they are worse than us given their stacked team. 

Misquote nvm

Edited July 8, 20242 yr by Remodez

1 hour ago, Nibs said:

Southgate really riding his luck again Saturday and somehow we are in the semi finals.

Great penalties and we did play better but that second half was getting worse and suddenly we're 1-0 down and he hadn't made any changes. The way we were playing second half,  was crying out for changes and some fresh legs but he doesn't do anything until we're 1-0 down and he gives them a miserly 15 minutes to make an impact. He needs to be more proactive but it ain't ever gonna happen. We could really do with Kane getting injured or picking up a bug as we're playing with 10 men and we'd be so much better off with Toney or Watkins but Southgate is never gonna drop Kane.

Will our luck hold out against the Dutch..................?

 

I'm pretty confident we will make the final. Whether we win it or not is another question. 

52 minutes ago, Remodez said:

Have you not watched France in the past year or so, I would argue they are worse than us given their stacked team. 

The format and the timing of international tourney encourage team to play struggle ball. 

 

On 05/07/2024 at 19:36, AlexTommo said:

Morata got booked in the celebrations and will now miss the semi final. Complete and utter moron.

advantage Spain

16 hours ago, Scott Harris said:

Not always, but in a lot of cases it is. Sven and Capello failed because they kept trying to shoehorn the best players into the team, every squad from that era lacked balance. Steve McClaren was always well out of his depth, same goes for Hodgson and Southgate. We have also heard stories about the toxic environment the players from the so called golden generation went through, and this was the case with squads in the 90's too. Players that were rivals never got along and couldn't leave that rivalry at home. I can't explain what happened in the 70's, 80's and most of the 90's because I wasn't born or was too young to remember. I also think England have been on the end of some horrible luck at times, like Campbell's very odd disallowed goal against Portugal in 2004, Lampard's goal that was never given in 2010 in the World Cup, and of course the hand of god in 86.

I have always said that the ones at fault the most are the FA. They never look for the right coach that fits the current generation of players we have, it's not something that crosses their mind. The one and only thing they look for is a coach that won't hurt their image. Personally, I prefer managers with a bit of personality to them to go alongside their good coaching, but the FA doesn't want that. The FA wants bland and boring.

And the best 2 managers in my life time Venables and Hoddle were only given one tournament.  Both played entertaining football and unlucky to go out.  A time when we went out with a bang feeling unlucky to go home, rather than the current situation where we know we played terrible and deserved to lose.  

Id love us to win the Euros but strangely I feel like I will still look back at the Euro 96 and World Cup 98 tournaments more fondly.

1 hour ago, Remodez said:

Have you not watched France in the past year or so, I would argue they are worse than us given their stacked team. 

France are doing their usual Deschamps thing. Making it through. They're handicapped this time by neither Greizmann nor Mbappe being fully fit. Greizmann has been their key, their link up player, their playmaker. Apart from his masked broken nose, which is handicapping him, Mbappe is carrying a knee problem. We'll see.

1 hour ago, Bob stark said:

The format and the timing of international tourney encourage team to play struggle ball. 

 

I can see a difference between the winter tourney and this...our football calendar is so messed up and packed anyway but players do look tired and exhausted in this tourney.