On 27/10/2018 at 19:13, Dixon said:

I clearly talked about a midfield three of Kante. Kovacic and Jorginhio, not a midfield two.  Also, Drinkwater provided way more in the opponents half than any of our three do. I certainly would not be adverse to Kovacic, Kante (only in his old position + a creative/ goal scoring midfielder. I'll say it till I'm blue in the face, Jorginho is the problem! Slow, can't defend and offers nowt in the oppoants half. Another Mikel but with more 5 yard passes.

I agree with most of your points but Jorginho is so much better than Mikel.

Edited October 28, 20187 yr by Ernie_blue

1 minute ago, Barry_Stanton said:

Exactly, the current form they are in is amazing for both, but now we just have to see how they play with each other with one of Kante/Jorginho is unavailable. Only then will be truly be able to see how good they are

True and Burnley won't be the acid test yet if they can both get more time and together this can build into something and with the club still in four competitions you start to see the potential.

1 minute ago, Strider6003 said:

True and Burnley won't be the acid test yet if they can both get more time and together this can build into something and with the club still in four competitions you start to see the potential.

Definitely, its a massive bonus that they are both still young and yet to reach their primes. But i have the slight fear that we are already becoming too reliant on Kante and Jorginho, so it would be reassuring knowing if one of them was missing that they can step up to the plate

24 minutes ago, Barry_Stanton said:

was the Pedro injury a blessing in disguise? Surely this will allow RLC to get some more games if the Pedro injury lasts long enough.

Not once Hazard is back. Hazard, Giroud & Willian for me over RLC and Pedro 

1 minute ago, Anglejjd said:

Not once Hazard is back. Hazard, Giroud & Willian for me over RLC and Pedro 

Fair point, but aside from todays game where Willian played well, Im more inclined to give RLC a shot over him based on recent form. Or at least worst case scenario even if Willian starts, then RLC is the sub to come when he comes off

3 minutes ago, Barry_Stanton said:

Definitely, its a massive bonus that they are both still young and yet to reach their primes. But i have the slight fear that we are already becoming too reliant on Kante and Jorginho, so it would be reassuring knowing if one of them was missing that they can step up to the plate

Yes that is true and add Kovacic into the mix yet when we need goals I see Barkley coming on and I think RLC can be in the front three on the right when we are short up front.

Hazard - Morata - and RLC or Pedro in the front 3 for goals.

IMO Willian goes to the bench for both RLC and Pedro, he missed a couple of clear cut chances today but sure managed to score in the second half, my point is against a top team he will be even more inconsistant.

Then Barkley - Jorginho - Kante.

All you can ask is that RLC takes the opportunities afforded to him, and he's done just that over the past week.

Clinical finish, although he just happened to be in the right area at the right time. 

7 hours ago, Barry_Stanton said:

was the Pedro injury a blessing in disguise? Surely this will allow RLC to get some more games if the Pedro injury lasts long enough.

No. Pedro is our best finisher, losing Pedro is definitely bad. 

On 27/10/2018 at 17:00, Dixon said:

Has ANY team EVER won a title with a midfield three so completely lacking in creativity and goal power? In just one game RLC has scored two more goals then the other three put together this season.

I would like to hear the logic of us wanting such a impotent  first choice midfield. If any one of those three contributed what should be bang average creativity and goal power/threat, we probably would have beaten Liverpool and Utd, even with our sh*te strikers. 

RLC was given a chance and and he grabbed it and deserves another chance in the league. 

 

This is not a very clever question when probably the most dominant team of the last decade (Barcelona) had a midfield that barely scored. Xavi, Iniesta and Busquets neither reached up goals not impressive assist numbers playing a team that was so prolific. Look at midfielders of other good teams and you will see that this is not particularly uncommon. 

If you are talking about England only, we have had both defenders and forwards contributing more than midfielders to both out title wins since Lamps left.

1 hour ago, ashwin said:

This is not a very clever question when probably the most dominant team of the last decade (Barcelona) had a midfield that barely scored. Xavi, Iniesta and Busquets neither reached up goals not impressive assist numbers playing a team that was so prolific. 

08/09 Xavi 10 goals 30 assists

09/10 Xavi  7 goals 18 assists

10/11 Xavi  5 goals 15 assists

11/12 Xavi 14 goals 16 assists

12/13 Xavi 7 goals 13 assists

On 28/10/2018 at 05:13, Dixon said:

I clearly talked about a midfield three of Kante. Kovacic and Jorginhio, not a midfield two.  Also, Drinkwater provided way more in the opponents half than any of our three do. I certainly would not be adverse to Kovacic, Kante (only in his old position + a creative/ goal scoring midfielder. I'll say it till I'm blue in the face, Jorginho is the problem! Slow, can't defend and offers nowt in the oppoants half. Another Mikel but with more 5 yard passes.

Without Jorginho we wouldn't control posession like we do, he orchestrates everything from the middle of the park. He was bought in by Sarri to do this and to implement his style of play. A massive part of how the team has taken to it so quick. Dropping him would be madness.

45 minutes ago, kiwi1691 said:

08/09 Xavi 10 goals 30 assists

09/10 Xavi  7 goals 18 assists

10/11 Xavi  5 goals 15 assists

11/12 Xavi 14 goals 16 assists

12/13 Xavi 7 goals 13 assists

So only 1 season over 10 then?  Sorta proves the other poster's point.

1 hour ago, kiwi1691 said:

08/09 Xavi 10 goals 30 assists

09/10 Xavi  7 goals 18 assists

10/11 Xavi  5 goals 15 assists

11/12 Xavi 14 goals 16 assists

12/13 Xavi 7 goals 13 assists

As @ashwin said, that Barcelona team scored so heavily that these contributions actually look quite minor. 

EDIT: Goalscoring contributions obviously.

Edited October 29, 20187 yr by DaRick

16 hours ago, Dixon said:

If anyone has moved goalposts its you!  You have not come up with a team that had 3 non creative non goal scoring midfielders. Instead, you single out two in midfield and not even mentioning a creative, goal scoring midfielder in the team that won a title.

Anyway, proof is in the pudding today. Leave out one of our three and there is instantly way more goal threat from our midfield. 

 

 

Didn't Madrid just win 3 champions leagues with Casemiro, Kroos and Modric with very little goal contributions from either.

35 minutes ago, yorkleyblue said:

So only 1 season over 10 then?  Sorta proves the other poster's point.

The post referred to goals and assists

32 minutes ago, kiwi1691 said:

The post referred to goals and assists

Even RE assists, Xavi's assists column was enhanced greatly by the (many) clinical Barcelona finishers who could finish off the chances that he created (though his 2008/09 tally is very impressive indeed). 

At any rate, Xavi's game wasn't so much about delivering the final killer ball (though he certainly could), than it was about maintaining the tempo and bringing his teammates into play via passing and receiving the ball when moving forwards. 

Basically, he was a cross between Jorginho and Fabregas, maybe leaning towards the former. 

On 27/10/2018 at 20:13, Dixon said:

I'll say it till I'm blue in the face, Jorginho is the problem! Slow, can't defend and offers nowt in the oppoants half. Another Mikel but with more 5 yard passes.

That's one of the wierdest things I've read on the internet, and I've been reading bizarre sh*t on the internet for over 20 years. You honestly think Jorginho, the man who acts as our conductor and dictates the large majority of our play from midfield is the problem?  And you compare him to Mikel, a player who he resembles about as much as Michael Owen resembles JT?

Please tell me you wrote this after drinking heavily.

2 hours ago, DaRick said:

As @ashwin said, that Barcelona team scored so heavily that these contributions actually look quite minor. 

EDIT: Goalscoring contributions obviously.

Agian, i clearly talked about creativity not just goals and assists = creativity! Look at Xavis record and see that his goals and assits were between 20-40 a season.  If we had one miidfielder with those stats and 25 from Morata we would be very close to being favs to win the title.

This is the classic 'Modric is sh*t' argument though, isn't it? The flawed idea that just because somebody isn't making a direct contribution to a goal that they aren't at all involved in the creative process. 

Kevin Nolan, on the whole, would make more direct goal contributions over the course of a season than Andres Iniesta. Now tell me who is the more creative player. 

59 minutes ago, Dixon said:

Agian, i clearly talked about creativity not just goals and assists = creativity!

Look at Xavis record and see that his goals and assits were between 20-40 a season.  If we had one miidfielder with those stats and 25 from Morata we would be very close to being favs to win the title.

I think this is like saying "if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle".

At any rate, Xavi at Barcelona and Xavi at Chelsea would be:

Two different styles of play. 

20 hours ago, DaRick said:

All you can ask is that RLC takes the opportunities afforded to him, and he's done just that over the past week.

Clinical finish, although he just happened to be in the right area at the right time. 

Some people call it luck, some call it trade?? You can’t teach that 

9 hours ago, Dixon said:

Agian, i clearly talked about creativity not just goals and assists = creativity! Look at Xavis record and see that his goals and assits were between 20-40 a season.  If we had one miidfielder with those stats and 25 from Morata we would be very close to being favs to win the title.

I think the biggest issue here is the likelihood of Morata getting to 25 goals. We have goals coming from Hazard, Willian, Barkley, Alonso etc. Its our CF's that are lacking.

42 minutes ago, Jackbuchanan said:

I think the biggest issue here is the likelihood of Morata getting to 25 goals. We have goals coming from Hazard, Willian, Barkley, Alonso etc. Its our CF's that are lacking.

Over how many seasons

1 hour ago, WhiteWall said:

Over how many seasons

I know it was a very average Burnley, but i was pleased with Morata's performance. Worked hard, good movement, took his goal well, great reflex header and a couple of other decent efforts. After a really tough time he's showing some signs he might yet make good at Chelsea.