9 minutes ago, Stim said:

 

I know a guy...

Only one  ?

17 minutes ago, Stim said:

Which you can still blame on the boards daft transfers and insistence on a tiny squad.

I know a guy...

There's many legit criticism's you can level at the last two transfer windows but the one thing it did do was vastly improve squad depth.

9 hours ago, Saaladin said:

You're evaluating things without relativity. 

You say we only lost Costa and Matic. Yes true, but we also added champions league play.

So not only do we lose Matic, who have us strength and balance in midfield as well as sound passing we lost our most influential forward. Then we added the most difficult and prestigious competition in the world and continued to the semis of two other competitions. 

That is a lot of matches for a coach who literally has no influential options off his bench. Not one single player that you would want to come in to make a difference.

You say we spent more than Liverpool and Arsenal and Tottenham. That means nothing when you are constantly evening it out sales.

We sold Costa got Morata = downgrade

sold Matic got Baka = downgrade

Conte was fuming all summer because his team got WORSE when they were mounting a title defence and wanting to challenge in CL. He had every right to be annoyed and with this tiny squad Chelsea didn't stand a chance. Please tell me which 11 you would have been choosing that Conte was somehow missing... 

Liverpool went out and bought Salah, Mane, Milner, Oxlade, Virgil, Wijnaldum -- They did exactly what Klopp asked.

City - let's not list the names they bought for Pep. 

Its actually outrageous what the Chelsea board did. Selling Matic to United? Wth...

And you people blame Conte because he wasn't a good enough cheerleader? It's actually naive...

We are not paying him to be a cheerleader, we are paying him (an annual salary the average person won't earn in their entire lifetime) to manage, train & motivate the team. 

Despite you attempting to paint a picture of poor little Conte having the most bleak set of circumstances of any Manager in world football, it is worth remembering that the poor little lamb put pen to paper on a revised contract worth £9M/year in July. 

Now if you can put your violin away for a few minutes, perhaps you can appreciate that if the club is paying the man £9M a year, he should be doing absolutely everything in his powers to get the best out of what he has got. The fact he perhaps missed out on getting all the new shiny toys he wanted in the summer is neither here nor there. Chelsea fans don't want rid of him because we aren't top of the league; the majority want rid of him because he is making it obvious he doesn't give a sh*t, is sulking, moaning and demotivating the players in the process.

It's worth remembering the club spent £75M on Morata because Conte fell out with Costa (and famously text him to say he was no longer wanted). The club backed Conte, and set a new club record transfer fee in order to get him his man. Downgrade? Arguably, but one which Conte was seemingly well on board with. 

Our squad isn't the best in the league, but it is good enough to be doing a lot better than we have been doing since Conte decided to make no secret of his desire to leave. We are currently massively underachieving, and no amount of finger pointing at the board will absolve Conte of all blame. 

 

2 hours ago, Valerie said:

Sure, that"s true, but that doesn't make Conte totally blameless. If my boss had Conte's body and vocal language, I'd want to kick him, but seeing that would get me in trouble, I'd mentally sign off, as some of our players look to be doing.

Conte having poor body language is simply a myth.

The guy has been as emotional as ever in our most recent games. The results being bad means he is not jumping into the stands with glee. I assume that is expected.

That being said, when Tottenham scored I remember Conte kicking a water bottle across the dugout. Pretty sure that is not an emotionless, care-free manager that is just waiting out his contract. You can see in his face that he cares. 

7 minutes ago, mclovin83 said:

We are not paying him to be a cheerleader, we are paying him (an annual salary the average person won't earn in their entire lifetime) to manage, train & motivate the team. 

Despite you attempting to paint a picture of poor little Conte having the most bleak set of circumstances of any Manager in world football, it is worth remembering that the poor little lamb put pen to paper on a revised contract worth £9M/year in July. 

Now if you can put your violin away for a few minutes, perhaps you can appreciate that if the club is paying the man £9M a year, he should be doing absolutely everything in his powers to get the best out of what he has got. The fact he perhaps missed out on getting all the new shiny toys he wanted in the summer is neither here nor there. Chelsea fans don't want rid of him because we aren't top of the league; the majority want rid of him because he is making it obvious he doesn't give a sh*t, is sulking, moaning and demotivating the players in the process.

It's worth remembering the club spent £75M on Morata because Conte fell out with Costa (and famously text him to say he was no longer wanted). The club backed Conte, and set a new club record transfer fee in order to get him his man. Downgrade? Arguably, but one which Conte was seemingly well on board with. 

Our squad isn't the best in the league, but it is good enough to be doing a lot better than we have been doing since Conte decided to make no secret of his desire to leave. We are currently massively underachieving, and no amount of finger pointing at the board will absolve Conte of all blame. 

 

And that is simply where we disagree. 

This team is actually exactly where it should be in the standings.

We have an unproven striker - Conte probably did want Morata, that being said, he knew he was selling Costa and was very clear from the beginning of the summer we needed TWO strikers to be purchased. The club bought only Morata (who was never a proven lead man) and held on to Costa until January while scraping the bottom of the striker barrel until settling on Giroud. Conte never wanted Batshuayi and regardless of what he is doing in BVB he never performed well from Chelsea outside of a couple of goals. He doesn't hold the ball well and has difficulty with ball retention and re-distribution. 

Getting rid of Costa, that had to happen. He was dead to Conte the day he started stirring up transfer trouble right in the middle of a title run. It was selfish of Costa to not wait until the summer and he could have quashed those rumors but chose to play it out and piss off his coach and club. Conte wanted him out and I would to if I'm trying to win a league and my star striker is thinking of glorious moves to China.

Again, regarding not getting targets, he has every right to moan. He won the league and got absolutely NO backing from the club. For every decent player brought in - a better player was sent out. 

We did not strengthen at all, and in fact reduced the overall quality of the team. 

4 hours ago, dkw said:

And the excuses just keep coming. He doesn't give a toss, he gave up months ago after whinging like a little girl not getting what she wanted for Xmas for months, it's pathetic and frankly I wouldn't miss him one bit as I prefer a manager that makes the best of a situation using his skills instead of just giving up. 

You prefer being unrealistic then in my opinion. 

Our schedule was significantly harder, our competition in the league and CL all went out and spent huge amounts of money and Chelsea basically downgraded and you think Conte should make the best of that? Well, he did. We are still in Europa league contention so the board got what it invested in.

4 hours ago, didierforever said:

Yup. Totally agree. Conte is completely faultless and hence done no wrong.

Ofcourse, there are a couple of things that need to be answered though:

1. Wait till 80minutes to make a substitution in almost every game

2. Keep picking the same team after crying like a little spoilt bitch about the squad strength before and after each game of the season

3. Keep picking cesc in a 2-man mid

4. Keep picking moses after he has underperformed for the majority of the season.

5. Keep picking alonso after the guy has seemed exhausted due to the tremendous rotation in the LWB position

6. Keep playing false 9 instead of playing a striker who is banging in for fun for BVB

7. The general sourness and negativity that this guy is/has brought is the SOLE reason we are in the position we are. If we had not qualified for CL, i would be fine with it, but the nature of our performances and results and team selections and tactics makes it so obvious that we could have done so much better. And the guy responsible to get the best out of the squad would rather ridicule the squad saying they are not good enough than bloody man-up and fight.

Conte has shown that he is an ego-maniac who cares little about the well being of the club. The guy has bought us down massively. He should be told to f**k RIGHT OFF 

1. Who should he have brought on before 80 minutes to flip a game? Barkley? Hudson-Odoi? Zappa?

2. Your statement makes no sense here - He is obviously complaining about the size and quality of his squad to he will clearly keep picking the same team. Which rotations should he have made? What were the results when he did a rotation? If you remember it may have been the Watford game where he rotated the team - as you suggest he should have - after the loss he said that he chose the wrong team - Bakayoko got a red I believe and there were one or two other guys who got a start.

3. Who else should he choose in his 2-man Mid? Vidal? Fabregas was the only choice and every supporter knows it. Bakayoko was tripping over his laces and Drinkwater was pedestrian.

4. Moses was average all-season - all flare no result - however - our last minute bargain basement purchase Zappacosta was worse. So again, no choice for Conte.

5. I believe Conte tried for the last 3 transfer windows to buy the Juve wing back only to be rejected despite the price going down. Then he tried about 2-3 other targets and couldn't get the board to spend for them. Only in January did we finally get Emerson who was injured all season up to that point. Great!

6. Batshuayi was not fitting in to Conte's football. He wasn't holding the ball and was inefficient in playing simple passes on the ground. He was losing the ball under pressure too much. 

7. It is not a coincidence that the teams that spend money in football win. City and United are #1 and #2 for a reason. Madrid and Barca the same. What you are asking from Conte, "To fight" he did that as best he could. I see a team that is playing for him the best they can. I haven't seen guys giving up. Even against West Ham it was a great performance but lacking in critical areas. I saw no giveup in them. And Conte was visibly frustrated and has been throughout this poor run.

35 minutes ago, Saaladin said:

Conte having poor body language is simply a myth.

The guy has been as emotional as ever in our most recent games. The results being bad means he is not jumping into the stands with glee. I assume that is expected.

That being said, when Tottenham scored I remember Conte kicking a water bottle across the dugout. Pretty sure that is not an emotionless, care-free manager that is just waiting out his contract. You can see in his face that he cares. 

Actually, I don't see that he cares overly much. In my eyes his demeanour is meek, passive, not contemplating how to change things around. He looks as if he doesn't want to make a difference. He doesn't have to jump up and down like a toddler with ADD, that hardly is contributing much, but his players who have seen him in a title-winning seasin note the difference, draw their own conclusions, and respond in kind.

52 minutes ago, Saaladin said:

Conte having poor body language is simply a myth.

The guy has been as emotional as ever in our most recent games. The results being bad means he is not jumping into the stands with glee. I assume that is expected.

That being said, when Tottenham scored I remember Conte kicking a water bottle across the dugout. Pretty sure that is not an emotionless, care-free manager that is just waiting out his contract. You can see in his face that he cares. 

Oh gee. Conte kicked a water bottle. Hold the Front Page!

5 minutes ago, Ewell CFC said:

Oh gee. Conte kicked a water bottle. Hold the Front Page!

Finish reading the sentence

3 minutes ago, Stim said:

Finish reading the sentence

 

3 minutes ago, Stim said:

Finish reading the sentence

By finishing reading the sentence you mean that by kicking a water bottle that is living proof that the man cares and is not just seeing out his contract? 

Thanks for that earth shattering observation.

5 minutes ago, Ewell CFC said:

By finishing reading the sentence you mean that by kicking a water bottle that is living proof that the man cares and is not just seeing out his contract? 

Thanks for that earth shattering observation.

It was more valuable than whatever you "contributed".

Managers are bullied way too much nowadays

Of course Conte's tactics have been off several times this season but some people act as if he got a top 4 team and relegated them

The man won the league with the same players that came 10th one year prior, and those players are obviously mentally weak as a group. Luck seemed to be with us all season in 2016-17 and Conte's spot on tactics in combination with that won us the league

Then summer came and he wanted to re-enforce the team in order to defend the title. The board failed him and we ended up with a worse team

Costa's departure tends to be overlooked. The guy was carrying us back in early 2016. Combine that with the unfortunate midfield situation and we already lack in 2 very important areas. Add Hazard's injury and poor form, the fact that the squad is paper thin and got burnt out etc etc

No wonder we're struggling this season

Conte is trying his best. Our players are too

They just can't do anything more this season

Luck has also not been our friend. Conte's tactics vs Barcelona were so as to hit the nail on the head and the players pulled a hell of a performance but the crossbar denied us not once, not twice but 3 times. Luck is a very important factor in football. In last year's 3-1 win over man city for example luck contributed a lot.

I still believe in Conte and the players. The board needs to give more freedom to Antonio and let him do what he knows best

As I have said before, we are allowed an off season. We are not 10th or 16th, we are 5th. United in the last 4 seasons came 7th, 4th, 5th and 6th. We've won 2 league titles the same 4 years. Some people seriously need to chill. It hurts me to see Chelsea struggling so much ever since the turn of the year but sacking Conte is not the way to go I believe.

KTBFFH

6 minutes ago, Stim said:

It was more valuable than whatever you "contributed".

And of course your own in depth, illuminating, sage like contributions ( normally one liners of the tutt tutt variety), are a forum high point which we all really look forward to reading......yawn....

Guardiola has lost 3 in a row now. It can happend to the best. He had a 450 million spend and got most of the players he asked according to news reports. 

If Conte stays next season I would love to see him in the same mood as last year. In my opinion that was some of the best football I have seen from Chelsea, and the passion was contagious I felt like a young kid. Conte is clearly a good tactician and will give chances to youngsters if they deserve it... 

However, if he intends to remain with the same attitude as this year than it's best for all parties that he leaves. 

So the new contract that Conte signed pays him 9 million pounds a year?   That's crazy money.   What was he getting paid prior to signing the new contract?   And are any other managers getting paid more than that?

1 hour ago, Saaladin said:

And that is simply where we disagree. 

This team is actually exactly where it should be in the standings.

We have an unproven striker - Conte probably did want Morata, that being said, he knew he was selling Costa and was very clear from the beginning of the summer we needed TWO strikers to be purchased. The club bought only Morata (who was never a proven lead man) and held on to Costa until January while scraping the bottom of the striker barrel until settling on Giroud. Conte never wanted Batshuayi and regardless of what he is doing in BVB he never performed well from Chelsea outside of a couple of goals. He doesn't hold the ball well and has difficulty with ball retention and re-distribution. 

Getting rid of Costa, that had to happen. He was dead to Conte the day he started stirring up transfer trouble right in the middle of a title run. It was selfish of Costa to not wait until the summer and he could have quashed those rumors but chose to play it out and piss off his coach and club. Conte wanted him out and I would to if I'm trying to win a league and my star striker is thinking of glorious moves to China.

Again, regarding not getting targets, he has every right to moan. He won the league and got absolutely NO backing from the club. For every decent player brought in - a better player was sent out. 

We did not strengthen at all, and in fact reduced the overall quality of the team. 

Yep, we are going to have to agree to disagree; on our form since the turn of the year (around the time Conte seemingly stopped giving a toss) we would be 15th in the league. Do you honestly think our squad is not worthy of higher than 15th in the league? 

The squad really isn't as bad as you make out, but this is subjective and we could go round in circles all day. 

Regardless, this isn't the point- he signed a new contract and is pocketing £9M/year, and for that reason he should be giving his all. A world class Manager earns their money by making the best of what they have, instilling a winning mentality, and effecting games with their tactical nous. 

Conte has sulked & moaned his way through a season without doing any of the above. 

The problem here is Conte does nothing to change. He has been very rigid with his tactics and selection.  

Even when we were losing to Spurs,City,Utd he didn't really make any changes till the last 10 minutes.

And players like Hazard,Rudiger,Fabregas have publicly questioned his tactics.

Edited April 11, 20188 yr by DG19

30 minutes ago, mclovin83 said:

Yep, we are going to have to agree to disagree; on our form since the turn of the year (around the time Conte seemingly stopped giving a toss) we would be 15th in the league. Do you honestly think our squad is not worthy of higher than 15th in the league? 

The squad really isn't as bad as you make out, but this is subjective and we could go round in circles all day. 

Regardless, this isn't the point- he signed a new contract and is pocketing £9M/year, and for that reason he should be giving his all. A world class Manager earns their money by making the best of what they have, instilling a winning mentality, and effecting games with their tactical nous. 

Conte has sulked & moaned his way through a season without doing any of the above. 

It's easy to point to the second half of the season and extrapolate our would be finishing position.

However the reality is we did ok in the first half and a tired team with no depth struggled in the second half. Which Conte said would happen if we didn't increase the squad size.

Tactically, I see nothing wrong with our setup. It looks right and for most of the game it goes well. But a fatigued team will make errors and concede foolish goals and/or fail to make decisive moves that gain you more than 1 goal.

Again, I saw a vibrant team playing some nice football against West Ham - But when we needed a goal to kill off the game it seemed there was no juice left. Then we concede.

Is our starting 11 bad enough to finish 15th? No of course not. But at some point that talented squad will be beat up enough that even the neighborhood wuss can put him down once in a while.

And still we are 5th not 10th.

9 minutes ago, DG19 said:

The problem here is Conte does nothing to change. He has been very rigid with his tactics and selection.  

Even when we were losing to Spurs,City,Utd he didn't really make any changes till the last 10 minutes.

And players like Hazard,Rudiger,Fabregas have publicly questioned his tactics.

I keep asking this argument to be backed up by one piece of evidence...

Who should Conte have been bringing on before the last 10 minutes?

1 hour ago, Saaladin said:

It's easy to point to the second half of the season and extrapolate our would be finishing position.

However the reality is we did ok in the first half and a tired team with no depth struggled in the second half. Which Conte said would happen if we didn't increase the squad size.

Tactically, I see nothing wrong with our setup. It looks right and for most of the game it goes well. But a fatigued team will make errors and concede foolish goals and/or fail to make decisive moves that gain you more than 1 goal.

Again, I saw a vibrant team playing some nice football against West Ham - But when we needed a goal to kill off the game it seemed there was no juice left. Then we concede.

Is our starting 11 bad enough to finish 15th? No of course not. But at some point that talented squad will be beat up enough that even the neighborhood wuss can put him down once in a while.

And still we are 5th not 10th.

You are literally just absolving Conte of any blame on the basis of "fatigue". 

Anyone would think we are fielding a 5 a side team because we can't field a full side of 11 players, the way you are talking. 

I am baffled as to how you can blame the size of the squad when Conte doesn't even use the players that he does have. 

No doubt that will be someone else's fault... probably the boards for not buying good enough players I would guess.  

I have to admire your determination to defend Conte, but it just doesn't wash with me I am afraid. 

There is no excuse for the way he has conducted himself over the last few months; it's as pathetic as it is unprofessional. He hasn't earn't his wage as a Manager, in any capacity, and we can roll the "fatigue" excuse out as many times as we like, but it doesn't change a damn thing, especially when he has players in the squad he isn't even using. 

 

1 hour ago, Saaladin said:

I keep asking this argument to be backed up by one piece of evidence...

Who should Conte have been bringing on before the last 10 minutes?

Drinkwater for Fabregas after about 50 minutes on Sunday. 

2 hours ago, Phillip said:

So the new contract that Conte signed pays him 9 million pounds a year?   That's crazy money.   What was he getting paid prior to signing the new contract?   And are any other managers getting paid more than that?

He was getting paid 6.5 million. Now he gets paid 9 mill an increase to winning the title last year and to ward off competition from inter Milan that were willing to offer a 12.5 million per year. Lippi gets paid 18 million. Guardiola and mourinho around 15 million and Wenger 8.5 million. 

1 hour ago, DG19 said:

The problem here is Conte does nothing to change. He has been very rigid with his tactics and selection.  

Even when we were losing to Spurs,City,Utd he didn't really make any changes till the last 10 minutes.

And players like Hazard,Rudiger,Fabregas have publicly questioned his tactics.

The thing is my friend that Conte's squad lacks depth

He doesn't have that super sub than can turn the game around, not even close

Against Spurs we had Drinkwater, Giroud, Baka, Emerson and Cahill on the bench

We literally went all in and we even got that first goal. When Spurs got the upper hand though we had no plan b. What subs could Conte have made?

When we beat them 4-0 some 3 or 4 years ago we had a bench consisting of players like Willian, Oscar, Salah and Ba

Not exactly Madrid's bench but can make a difference

And Demba Ba came as a sub and scored a brace if I recall correctly

9 minutes ago, mclovin83 said:

Drinkwater for Fabregas after about 50 minutes on Sunday. 

Drinkwater? That's your defining sub? Ok.

I think I made my point clear enough.