If Kalou or another of our ex maligned players put in the performances that Torres has in the last 23 months I dread to think of the abuse he would have got.

It could hardly have been worse than the nasty and vitriolic abuse you and Just (for example) have given Torres .. could it????

Edited December 15, 201213 yr by chelseablueboy

It could hardly have been worse than the nasty and vitriolic abuse you and Just (for example) have given Torres .. could it????

 

Drogba has been booed by our fans, Torres has gotten unquestionable support despite being on Kezman's level - completely undeserved. Can't believe people complain about people complaining on a forum. Haven't seen 100 pages worth of crap about our legends and youth players being booed by our own support but you utter a word about the biggest flop in the History of World Football you're allegiance is being questioned. 

Well i hope that merest whiff of humble pie, will make you choke, ya joker!!

does that apply to the manager as well?.that is not a question directed specifically at you,but  i would like the rafa haters to respond.

 

 

 

I don't want to see Benitez succeed, say what you will about my alliegiance but the quicker hes out of here the quicker I can enjoy the football again, I'm sure Abramovic can cope with a minor setback brought on by himself and he deserves to in my mind.

 

Its difficult as I obviously want the World Club Cup as its so difficult to get to this stage and Robbie and the lads worked hard to give us the opportunity but my ideal scenario would be enough of a setback in the league to see the trigger pulled and then a huge response to whoever takes over so we still get a CL spot.

 

Its really a difficult time as once the games start and I'm watching, instinct takes over and obviously I see the players out there and am behind them, then I see the dugout and just want the nightmare to end.

Edited December 15, 201213 yr by Chippy

Show me where i 'complain about people complaining' if you would. (Las7)

Complaining and criticism is one thing (something i've done with Torres, along with most) but nasty name calling and abuse is another, especially when a certain few even use just about any thread to do do it, i don't see why some just can't give the abuse a f**king rest.

Edited December 15, 201213 yr by chelseablueboy

Drogba has been booed by our fans, Torres has gotten unquestionable support despite being on Kezman's level - completely undeserved. Can't believe people complain about people complaining on a forum. Haven't seen 100 pages worth of crap about our legends and youth players being booed by our own support but you utter a word about the biggest flop in the History of World Football you're allegiance is being questioned. 

Right so you want 100 pages about our legends, that's going to be f**king riveting reading isn't it, pages and pages of "Wow, what a great player he was." Torres divides opinion which is what makes the thread interesting.

I don't want to see Benitez succeed, say what you will about my alliegence but the quicker hes out of here the quicker I can enjoy the football again, I'm sure Abramovic can cope with a minor setback brought on by himself and he deserves to in my mind.

 

Its difficult as I obviously want the World Club Cup as its so difficult to get to this stage and Robbie and the lads worked hard to give us the opportunity but my ideal scenario would be enough of a setback in the league to see the trigger puled and then a huge response to whoever takes over so we still get a CL spot.

 

Its really a difficult time as once the games start and I'm watching, instinct takes over and obviously I see the players out there and am behind them, then I see the dugout and just want the nightmare to end.

Fair comment.

I really don't think people outside (and even some within) can comprehend the hatred there is at Chelsea for the FSW, he is NEVER going to be accepted.

If he is successful then the 'anti' noise levels will inevitably diminish (it's only human nature) but i do believe the bulk of the clubs support will NEVER accept him.

My problem is i can't bring myself to want the team to de anything but win, at the same time as loathing our current manager, which does make for a difficult moral dilema, one which i presume many share?

CBB, we are all sitting precariously on the horns of that dilemma my friend.

Drogba has been booed by our fans, Torres has gotten unquestionable support despite being on Kezman's level - completely undeserved. Can't believe people complain about people complaining on a forum. Haven't seen 100 pages worth of crap about our legends and youth players being booed by our own support but you utter a word about the biggest flop in the History of World Football you're allegiance is being questioned. 

I can recall Drogba being booed once many years ago by our fans for diving, slightly differnt situation wouldn't you say?

When have our legends and youth team been booed by our fans?

If you decide a player is sh*t you do just stop supporting them then?

Edited December 15, 201213 yr by mclovin83

It seems to me here that there are people who fail to differentiate between criticism and hatred. I've seen very few if any complaints about the criticism directed towards Torres, but there has been an increasing tendency to hurl vitriolic abuse at the player, and it's this that's been the subject of complaints.

 

People have gone so far not only to say they hate Torres, but to hope that he fails. Not that he goes on to fail after being sold, but to hope that he fails as a Chelsea player. I don't know about anyone else, but that's not my definition of support. Hating a Chelsea player, hoping he fails - what do you do if he scores? Gnash your teeth and curse the fact that it was your most hated player who hit the back of the net?

 

I'm not going to go over the media hype rubbish about his attitude all over again. He looks annoyed when taken off, he doesn't always celebrate as exuberantly as some would like. That's the way he is. It's not an insult. He's not the only player whose attitude can appear questionable at times. It's not a hanging matter, not cause for the extreme level of hatred directed towards him. He's just a footballer after all. Not a rapist, or a pervert or mass-murderer, but a footballer.

 

I'm not even going to go over the widespread and quite justified disappointment at his goalscoring record for Chelsea, or the indisputable fact that we paid well over the odds for him. What I am going to say is that I suspect that a great deal of the hatred directed towards Fernando Torres isn't based on his failure as a footballer, but on embarrassment and frustration at the almost endless derision directed towards him in the media ever since the day he signed for us.

 

Get it straight. Fernando Torres was vastly overpriced and has been a huge disappointment. But it's not his fault we paid so much for him. It's not even Liverpool's. It's the damned fool board of directors.

I can recall Drogba being booed once many years ago by our fans for diving, slightly differnt situation wouldn't you say?

When have our legends and youth team been booed by our fans?

If you decide a player is sh*t you do just stop supporting them then?

 

 

If I decide a player is sh*t it doesn't mean I will boo them at the ground. But when I say he is sh*t on a forum, to me it's unacceptable for my support to the club to be called into question. 

 

 

Well i hope that merest whiff of humble pie, will make you choke, ya joker!!

 

 

These type of comments, are just the type of thing that makes this thread a joke worth of 100 pages. Even if Torres starts scoring on a regular basis it won't change the fact that he was playing like a Championship level player for two years. Yet people get upsad when I say a thing which is absolutely factual - thus far Torres is the biggest flop in World football, that's not even a statement you can call into question at this point. 

Every other big flop Veron /Kaka /Sheva /Mendieta /Carroll are not at the same level because at least the mistake was realized by the boards in charge of these clubs and they didn't make any of these players undropable till they turned good. The fact is that after a season during which Torres went 24 hours of football without scoring, we sold all alternatives and made him an automatic first choice. This decision ended up costing us this season, and proved that our board is filled with people unable to accept responsibilities for their mistakes, instead they keep firing coaches who cannot get the best out of Torres, because what we see is his best. Good forward for a mid table club should not be starting for a club trying to get into the top four while trying to win trophies. 

 

To me at the end of this season, it's not Rafa who should be sacked first and foremost Buck; Gourlay should be out the door well ahead of trying to use Rafa to wash their hands from responsibility yet again. Simply put Roman has made people who seem to have no understand in running a football club become integral in all decisions. 

One of the facts that gets me, and i agree he has been sh*te at times, is his personal character assassination, whenever i have heard him do interviews he comes across as articulate intelligent and mostly humble, i have never heard the "Whiny" side of his so called personality, its all hearsay, listen to his interview on winning the golden boot at the euros, he is humble and almost apologetic, he is trying to make amends for his shortfall, and i say i do hope he succeeds, but i aint sure he will.

If I decide a player is sh*t it doesn't mean I will boo them at the ground. But when I say he is sh*t on a forum, to me it's unacceptable for my support to the club to be called into question. 

 

 

 

 

These type of comments, are just the type of thing that makes this thread a joke worth of 100 pages. Even if Torres starts scoring on a regular basis it won't change the fact that he was playing like a Championship level player for two years. Yet people get upsad when I say a thing which is absolutely factual - thus far Torres is the biggest flop in World football, that's not even a statement you can call into question at this point. 

Every other big flop Veron /Kaka /Sheva /Mendieta /Carroll are not at the same level because at least the mistake was realized by the boards in charge of these clubs and they didn't make any of these players undropable till they turned good. The fact is that after a season during which Torres went 24 hours of football without scoring, we sold all alternatives and made him an automatic first choice. This decision ended up costing us this season, and proved that our board is filled with people unable to accept responsibilities for their mistakes, instead they keep firing coaches who cannot get the best out of Torres, because what we see is his best. Good forward for a mid table club should not be starting for a club trying to get into the top four while trying to win trophies. 

 

To me at the end of this season, it's not Rafa who should be sacked first and foremost Buck; Gourlay should be out the door well ahead of trying to use Rafa to wash their hands from responsibility yet again. Simply put Roman has made people who seem to have no understand in running a football club become integral in all decisions. 

Do i really need to spell it out AGAIN..

It's NOT the criticism (like your post above) it's the personal abuse that pisses me and a few others off.

I'm not a member of the Torres Taliban, nor am i an apologist for his bad performances, but however bad a time a player has at the club, but i'll never wish ill on him as it appears some do.

That is all, seems quite fair to me, or am i missing something?

Maybe the reason he comes across as whiny is on the field as much as off the field. To me he comes across as a whinger and probably what makes it easier to believe is the little things like when he gets out muscled he instantly looks to the ref for a foul, or when he over runs the ball dives and looks to the ref. the same things used to frustrate me with drogba but the difference with drogba is he learned to stay on his feet, he got the crowd and players around him motivated and took his game to another level. I just don't see that ever coming from Torres he just seems to make excuses. I think we could all forgive him if he kept the work rate up that he was showing at the beginning of the season but I imagine a lot of people, myself included, see that Torres lack if work rate had some impact on robbies departure and maybe that is the reason some abuse has gone to a more personal level

It seems to me here that there are people who fail to differentiate between criticism and hatred. I've seen very few if any complaints about the criticism directed towards Torres, but there has been an increasing tendency to hurl vitriolic abuse at the player, and it's this that's been the subject of complaints.

 

People have gone so far not only to say they hate Torres, but to hope that he fails. Not that he goes on to fail after being sold, but to hope that he fails as a Chelsea player. I don't know about anyone else, but that's not my definition of support. Hating a Chelsea player, hoping he fails - what do you do if he scores? Gnash your teeth and curse the fact that it was your most hated player who hit the back of the net?

 

I'm not going to go over the media hype rubbish about his attitude all over again. He looks annoyed when taken off, he doesn't always celebrate as exuberantly as some would like. That's the way he is. It's not an insult. He's not the only player whose attitude can appear questionable at times. It's not a hanging matter, not cause for the extreme level of hatred directed towards him. He's just a footballer after all. Not a rapist, or a pervert or mass-murderer, but a footballer.

 

I'm not even going to go over the widespread and quite justified disappointment at his goalscoring record for Chelsea, or the indisputable fact that we paid well over the odds for him. What I am going to say is that I suspect that a great deal of the hatred directed towards Fernando Torres isn't based on his failure as a footballer, but on embarrassment and frustration at the almost endless derision directed towards him in the media ever since the day he signed for us.

 

Get it straight. Fernando Torres was vastly overpriced and has been a huge disappointment. But it's not his fault we paid so much for him. It's not even Liverpool's. It's the damned fool board of directors.

 

The voice of reason, as always... 

Edited December 15, 201213 yr by Amputechture

It seems to me here that there are people who fail to differentiate between criticism and hatred. I've seen very few if any complaints about the criticism directed towards Torres, but there has been an increasing tendency to hurl vitriolic abuse at the player, and it's this that's been the subject of complaints.

 

That's absolutely true, and it goes in the other direction too. Fair support of Torres (a recent example: not willing him to be a failure), is mistaken for unconditional fanboyism. Any kind of participation in this thread seems to cause people to get tarred with either one brush or the other, when most right-thinking shed-enders are somewhere in between.

Edited December 15, 201213 yr by bluedave

Maybe the reason he comes across as whiny is on the field as much as off the field. To me he comes across as a whinger and probably what makes it easier to believe is the little things like when he gets out muscled he instantly looks to the ref for a foul, or when he over runs the ball dives and looks to the ref. the same things used to frustrate me with drogba but the difference with drogba is he learned to stay on his feet, he got the crowd and players around him motivated and took his game to another level. I just don't see that ever coming from Torres he just seems to make excuses. I think we could all forgive him if he kept the work rate up that he was showing at the beginning of the season but I imagine a lot of people, myself included, see that Torres lack if work rate had some impact on robbies departure and maybe that is the reason some abuse has gone to a more personal level

May i be so bold as to replace that word with, 'assume without any proof whatsoever'..

Thanks 

Do i really need to spell it out AGAIN..

It's NOT the criticism (like your post above) it's the personal abuse that pisses me and a few others off.

I'm not a member of the Torres Taliban, nor am i an apologist for his bad performances, but however bad a time a player has at the club, but i'll never wish ill on him as it appears some do.

That is all, seems quite fair to me, or am i missing something?

 

Did I not address a guy who wanted me to choke on humble pie?  

 

Case and point really

<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="chelseablueboy" data-cid="572740" data-time="1355585139"><p>

May i be so bold as to replace that word with, 'assume without any proof whatsoever'..<br />

Thanks </p></blockquote>

The game against west brom is proof enough, how many shots did he have, how many runs did he make, sturridge outshone him in the last 20 mins having spent all game out wide. To me that is physically seeing him not put the effort in

 but you utter a word about the biggest flop in the History of World Football you're allegiance is being questioned. 

Your above quote either means you don't know much about World football, or it is a widely sweeping statement of disparaging proportions!

Edited December 15, 201213 yr by Ballack & Blu

If I decide a player is sh*t it doesn't mean I will boo them at the ground. But when I say he is sh*t on a forum, to me it's unacceptable for my support to the club to be called into question. 

 

 

 

 

But as others have alreday pointed out, nobody has a problem with people saying Torres is sh*t or the biggest flop in world football or anything else of that nature, in fact I would say it is the basis of a good debate and pretty much the purpose of this thread. It is, however, the pathetic insults and over the top hatred directed at Torres, even wishing for him to fail in a Chelsea shirt that grates on people, myself included.

On the plus side villa battering the scouse 3-0 ha ha

Your above quote either means you don't know much about World football, or it is a widely sweeping statement of disparaging proportions!

 

 

Only players that can even be debated to be on the same level are Mendieta and Carroll. One was loaned out after 27 appearances for Lazio the other was loaned after 58 appearances for Liverpool. But Carroll isn't one of the top payed players in the World. If Torres was loaned after his first and a half season at the club he would have left with the same record as Carroll has at Liverpool, instead after such a record he was made into an automatic starter.

 

But please go on. I'd love to know who exactly you had in mind since you seem so knowledgeable 

Edited December 15, 201213 yr by Las7

<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="chelseablueboy" data-cid="572740" data-time="1355585139"><p>

May i be so bold as to replace that word with, 'assume without any proof whatsoever'..<br />

Thanks </p></blockquote>

The game against west brom is proof enough, how many shots did he have, how many runs did he make, sturridge outshone him in the last 20 mins having spent all game out wide. To me that is physically seeing him not put the effort in

The 'proof' i meant (as well you know) was that his lack of workrate (perceived or otherwise) led to Robbie losing his job, and just so i don't suffer from the same selective quoting as you, here is what you posted..

"I imagine a lot of people, myself included, see that Torres lack if work rate had some impact on robbies departure"

You see what you want to see, and in regards to Torres it will ALWAYS be negative. 

So.. ah f**k it, i give up............