On 06/12/2021 at 08:42, Argo said:

But history also suggests that the success (both with us and his general career success) will give him credit in the bank.

The only time it didn't was Robbie but that was unique circumstances (the UCL being a gift from the gods and Roman not wanting to give him the full time gig anyway).

There is also the case of Carlo who was fired in the tunnel after finishing the second, the season after doing the double. 

I think with Lukaku the players need to be told how we wants the ball and to which foot.

Also on crosses where will he run, to the near post, hog the middle, along the line etc.

We have seen it time and again, great crosses going between defenders and keeper with no-one to there to put it away, or a ball cut back with no-one waiting.

You would expect all this to come out in training and the approach of the other players will change to whoever the front man is whether that be Lukaku, Havertz or Werner.

Ideally when we concede corners Lukaku would be near the circle waiting for the counter attack yet you can bet instead he will be in the box defending because of his size. 

Edited December 7, 20214 yr by strider6004

12 minutes ago, forbzy said:

There is also the case of Carlo who was fired in the tunnel after finishing the second, the season after doing the double. 

I think Carlo's downfall was his European record for us.

He was appointed for his UCL pedigree and didn't even match the efforts of all our previous managers in the same tournament. The United tie was in my opinion the most gutless exit we've had in that competition to date.

It was done in an awful way though no arguments there.

2 hours ago, Gol15 said:

Tuchel simply must know how to get the best out of him.

How much do you alter a decent looking team to assist Lukaku ? and at what cost ?

I think the changes would need to be a complete 180 degrees change, give up possession, sit deep, two banks of four defending, counter at will.

A tweak won't do it, needs a sledgehammer to fit into place.

 

49 minutes ago, coco said:

How much do you alter a decent looking team to assist Lukaku ? and at what cost ?

I think the changes would need to be a complete 180 degrees change, give up possession, sit deep, two banks of four defending, counter at will.

A tweak won't do it, needs a sledgehammer to fit into place.

 

Could Tuchel simply ask Lukaku to start scoring goals? That might work?

1 minute ago, Munkworth said:

Could Tuchel simply ask Lukaku to start scoring goals? That might work?

Just now, coco said:

8 hours ago, coco said:

This is his 2nd stint at the club, and fourth club in the league he has played for, so it's hardly as if he's a rookie who needs time. For price we paid we paid for him he should be oven ready.

Played what, 8 or 9 games for us before the injury? Scored 4 and then he’s been out for month so now he’s trying to get back to full fitness. Hardly enough time to start branding him a flop is it?

Also, let’s just say his first few months have been ‘a flop’ are we really going to start turning on him already? A guy who’s dream it’s been to play for Chelsea since he was a kid and now he’s getting his chance to be the main man? The guy has already deactivated his twitter partly because his own fans are slagging him off, is that the sort of fan base we really want to be? Declan Rice gets more love from Chelsea fans than Rom and he plays for bloody West Ham.

1 hour ago, coco said:

How much do you alter a decent looking team to assist Lukaku ? and at what cost ?

I think the changes would need to be a complete 180 degrees change, give up possession, sit deep, two banks of four defending, counter at will.

A tweak won't do it, needs a sledgehammer to fit into place.

 

To be honest if that wins us the league I don't mind, after all that's what Conte did, there is a huge step between decent and champion, I don't think that this squad can go from decent to terrible if Tuchel adapts the tactic towards Lukaku and Werner.

We can also see it in another way, it would be more intriguing if you don't alter anything at all after getting your big signing, if Tuchel really expects Lukaku just to fit in maybe he's not that good as we all thought. I mean if we don't count PSG, the one striker that was good under him was who, Aubameyang?

7 minutes ago, timetowaste said:

Played what, 8 or 9 games for us before the injury? Scored 4 and then he’s been out for month so now he’s trying to get back to full fitness. Hardly enough time to start branding him a flop is it?

Also, let’s just say his first few months have been ‘a flop’ are we really going to start turning on him already? A guy who’s dream it’s been to play for Chelsea since he was a kid and now he’s getting his chance to be the main man? The guy has already deactivated his twitter partly because his own fans are slagging him off, is that the sort of fan base we really want to be? Declan Rice gets more love from Chelsea fans than Rom and he plays for bloody West Ham.

Clearly those fans are closest hammers.

47 minutes ago, Munkworth said:

20 minutes ago, timetowaste said:

Played what, 8 or 9 games for us before the injury? Scored 4 and then he’s been out for month so now he’s trying to get back to full fitness. Hardly enough time to start branding him a flop is it?

Also, let’s just say his first few months have been ‘a flop’ are we really going to start turning on him already? A guy who’s dream it’s been to play for Chelsea since he was a kid and now he’s getting his chance to be the main man? The guy has already deactivated his twitter partly because his own fans are slagging him off, is that the sort of fan base we really want to be? Declan Rice gets more love from Chelsea fans than Rom and he plays for bloody West Ham.

Predicting a Chelsea striker will be a flop is nearly always a safe bet. I think a lot of us have been fooled by the goal record in Serie eAsy.

I sincerely hope you can come back and quote me for doubting him over the coming months.

1 hour ago, timetowaste said:

Played what, 8 or 9 games for us before the injury? Scored 4 and then he’s been out for month so now he’s trying to get back to full fitness. Hardly enough time to start branding him a flop is it?

Also, let’s just say his first few months have been ‘a flop’ are we really going to start turning on him already? A guy who’s dream it’s been to play for Chelsea since he was a kid and now he’s getting his chance to be the main man? The guy has already deactivated his twitter partly because his own fans are slagging him off, is that the sort of fan base we really want to be? Declan Rice gets more love from Chelsea fans than Rom and he plays for bloody West Ham.

Where's this energy in the Saul Niguez thread?

38 minutes ago, coco said:

Predicting a Chelsea striker will be a flop is nearly always a safe bet. I think a lot of us have been fooled by the goal record in Serie eAsy.

I sincerely hope you can come back and quote me for doubting him over the coming months.

It is easy money

4 hours ago, timetowaste said:

Played what, 8 or 9 games for us before the injury? Scored 4 and then he’s been out for month so now he’s trying to get back to full fitness. Hardly enough time to start branding him a flop is it?

Also, let’s just say his first few months have been ‘a flop’ are we really going to start turning on him already? A guy who’s dream it’s been to play for Chelsea since he was a kid and now he’s getting his chance to be the main man? The guy has already deactivated his twitter partly because his own fans are slagging him off, is that the sort of fan base we really want to be? Declan Rice gets more love from Chelsea fans than Rom and he plays for bloody West Ham.

wow did not know that! 

Romelu wants to stop being used as a target man and be allowed to come deeper and be involved with play:

https://chelsea247.com/ive-never-played-that-way-and-i-hate-it-as-lukaku-already-tells-tuchel-the-best-way-to-play-him/?fbclid=IwAR399d6rCrEQPy9xyljc3gzGb_PVVudxTDBanV9UAprcJEYZVBD4t9L6tt4

10 hours ago, strider6004 said:

I think with Lukaku the players need to be told how we wants the ball and to which foot.

Also on crosses where will he run, to the near post, hog the middle, along the line etc.

We have seen it time and again, great crosses going between defenders and keeper with no-one to there to put it away, or a ball cut back with no-one waiting.

You would expect all this to come out in training and the approach of the other players will change to whoever the front man is whether that be Lukaku, Havertz or Werner.

Ideally when we concede corners Lukaku would be near the circle waiting for the counter attack yet you can bet instead he will be in the box defending because of his size. 

Nah,with Lukaku it is very2 simple. He want the ball to his feet straight away. So rather than Jorgi to rudiger,rudiger to mount, to alonso,back to mount then to alonso then cross to Lukaku. He wanted the ball from Jorgi straight to him.

 

10 minutes ago, Bob stark said:

Nah,with Lukaku it is very2 simple. He want the ball to his feet straight away. So rather than Jorgi to rudiger,rudiger to mount, to alonso,back to mount then to alonso then cross to Lukaku. He wanted the ball from Jorgi straight to him.

 

Like he had vs Arsenal. That Lukaku seems a distant memory.

53 minutes ago, axman2526 said:

Like he had vs Arsenal. That Lukaku seems a distant memory.

Yea something like that but Arsenal was just too easy. If we simply can't find him in the middle which is a big shame,move him to the right and play Havertz in the middle or play 3412.

 

 

This sound crazy but right now Morata will be an interesting option.

If we can't feed our forward directly and we prefer our forward to come short,move and be dangerous in the air. Morata is interesting

Edited December 8, 20214 yr by Bob stark

I find it hard to believe that there is a striker that doesn't want the ball to his feet, I mean in a perfect world Lukaku would get all the passes to him at all times but that's not the reality, every team needs to build up from somewhere.

We push higher up the pitch and press high in order to win the ball back, that alone gives the opposition a run for their money when they want to organize an attack which helps our defensive record a whole lot, but in turn what happens most of the time is that it doesn't catch the opposition off guard, their defense doesn't break because they don't get to move away from this prepared setup in which they need to be in order to defend in case they don't get the ball out of their half. We did score some goals due to high press last season but that's really not the majority of goals that we score.

The reality is that most teams won't play an open game against us by default regardless of how we play, we played with Conte defensively but against the majority of teams in the PL we still dominated possession, so in any case it's impossible to just be direct and give it to Lukaku.

But if we change our system and press a bit closer to the middle of the pitch, Lukaku can get on a break and Werner's pace suddenly becomes a real threat. This is how we scored in the CL final, we won the ball around the midfield and quickly opened up Man City's defense with Mount. Lukaku ran through Serie A like that and Werner Bundesliga, if Tuchel can trap the opposition into giving them more space to work with we will get a striker going, any of them including Havertz that can also miss clear-cut chances.

10 hours ago, Bob stark said:

Nah,with Lukaku it is very2 simple. He want the ball to his feet straight away. So rather than Jorgi to rudiger,rudiger to mount, to alonso,back to mount then to alonso then cross to Lukaku. He wanted the ball from Jorgi straight to him.

That will rarely work as the EPL is wise to that.

He could come deeper as long as he can spray a pass wide for a cross as he the runs forward.

Yet again when he plays we need to know where in the box he will wait, near post, along the  lineor wait for the cutback etc.

 

 

11 hours ago, Bob stark said:

This sound crazy but right now Morata will be an interesting option.

If we can't feed our forward directly and we prefer our forward to come short,move and be dangerous in the air. Morata is interesting

Morata has everything to be a complete forward. Decent pace, good in the air, good movement and good technique. Unfortunately he is just far too fragile mentally to furfill his potential.

Infact I'd say it's testament to just how naturally gifted he is that's he's managed to get as far as he has despite such an obvious mental block.  

13 hours ago, axman2526 said:

Romelu wants to stop being used as a target man and be allowed to come deeper and be involved with play:

https://chelsea247.com/ive-never-played-that-way-and-i-hate-it-as-lukaku-already-tells-tuchel-the-best-way-to-play-him/?fbclid=IwAR399d6rCrEQPy9xyljc3gzGb_PVVudxTDBanV9UAprcJEYZVBD4t9L6tt4

If the problem is he cant play the front man and needs to come deeper to be involved, then we made the wrong purchase.

1 hour ago, coco said:

If the problem is he cant play the front man and needs to come deeper to be involved, then we made the wrong purchase.

I wonder just how underrated Giroud is, because he could play as the target man but also he was a great defensive striker that could link up with anyone when he comes deeper.

9 minutes ago, Gol15 said:

I wonder just how underrated Giroud is, because he could play as the target man but also he was a great defensive striker that could link up with anyone when he comes deeper.